Warden Class Changes

Hutch679

Thanks for the nerfs while every other class gets a buff.

CatastrophicSuccess

They only nerfed the stam warden's utility in PvP. It'll be challanging to improve the classes PvE dps without increase its burst potential in PvP. Hopefully we'll see more changes as the PTS progresses.

Unfortunately this may won't be for a couple weeks since this first week is focused on their new player experience and psijic order leveling.

vendeatha

oh jeez so Stam Warden is a getting a beating!?

Hutch679

Was more in reference to mag warden

CatastrophicSuccess

Hutch679 wrote: »

Was more in reference to mag warden

What I said also applies to mag warden. Although I would like to see the mag warden developed in particular.

ThorinWolfgang

LoL!
Trial-period of warden has gone.
You may lvl a new rollerblade to fell ok in the next patch.
GG.

Spurius_Lucilius

Mag warden need more adjustments (or to put it more directly, BUFF), those adjustments in the patch notes are not enough. Getting rid of the Deep Fissure Stun is a lazy move. It nerfs PvP Mag Warden and doesn't help PVE Mag Warden damage output.

Toc de Malsvi

Looks like Warden, specifically mag Warden gained even more ult gain. 10 every 4 seconds, and an additional 3 with HoT.

Skander

vendeatha wrote: »

oh jeez so Stam Warden is a getting a beating!?

It's not. Magwarden lost his only stun btw

Skander

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

Looks like Warden, specifically mag Warden gained even more ult gain. 10 every 4 seconds, and an additional 3 with HoT.

The moprh that gives 10 ulti doesn't heal the warden. In pvp thus is useless


The other morph is a good change, but for using that skill you still need someone alive near you.

Waffennacht

Ugh and their reason Blows:

In the same vein that snare abilities should either be short and powerful or long and weak, abilities should be low damage and CC, or high damage and no CC.

Yet NB keeps fear (long CC and very strong) Incap (high damage + CC) and DK keeps Leap (high damage + CC)

Then they take the stun away completely and give this as the reason.... Ugh

MLGProPlayer

Magicka warden still useless in PvE. Thanks ZOS! Really great job balancing this class!

Nerf them into the ground in PvP and don't buff them in PvE!!! Amazing!!!

Tryxus

Waffennacht wrote: »

Ugh and their reason Blows:

In the same vein that snare abilities should either be short and powerful or long and weak, abilities should be low damage and CC, or high damage and no CC.

Yet NB keeps fear (long CC and very strong) Incap (high damage + CC) and DK keeps Leap (high damage + CC)

Then they take the stun away completely and give this as the reason.... Ugh

Not to mention that:

- The skill has several downsides alrdy that justify it having high damage + cc
- Is a key skill for a Warden's offense AND defense

If there's any way to gut a class, this is prob it

MLGProPlayer

Spurius_Lucilius wrote: »

Mag warden need more adjustments (or to put it more directly, BUFF), those adjustments in the patch notes are not enough. Getting rid of the Deep Fissure Stun is a lazy move. It nerfs PvP Mag Warden and doesn't help PVE Mag Warden damage output.

I've lost hope. ZOS just doesn't care. They got our money when they sold us the class with Morrowind. Why fix it now? We already got suckered into buying it. It's been 12 months of magicka warden being the worst class in the game without a SINGLE meaningful buff.

Hutch679

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Spurius_Lucilius wrote: »

Mag warden need more adjustments (or to put it more directly, BUFF), those adjustments in the patch notes are not enough. Getting rid of the Deep Fissure Stun is a lazy move. It nerfs PvP Mag Warden and doesn't help PVE Mag Warden damage output.

I've lost hope. ZOS just doesn't care. They got our money when they sold us the class with Morrowind. Why fix it now? We already got suckered into buying it. It's been 12 months of magicka warden being the worst class in the game without a SINGLE meaningful buff.

Yeah now adding to the base game for free. Slap in the face to their fan base that paid for morrowind. Mag warden in pvp is very lackluster. You have to stack max magicka or you cannot shield and survive. They have no clue what mag wardens are supposed to be atm. A class with 0 cc is pretty much worthless in pvp. Not to mention the change made to deep fissure hardly buffs pve damage as that debuff won't stack with elemental drain. I just don't really get where they are going with the mag warden. But stamina warden can dizzyswing, sub assault, dawnbreaker combo all day. Hmmmmm.... where's the warden community representative?

MLGProPlayer

Hutch679 wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Spurius_Lucilius wrote: »

Mag warden need more adjustments (or to put it more directly, BUFF), those adjustments in the patch notes are not enough. Getting rid of the Deep Fissure Stun is a lazy move. It nerfs PvP Mag Warden and doesn't help PVE Mag Warden damage output.

I've lost hope. ZOS just doesn't care. They got our money when they sold us the class with Morrowind. Why fix it now? We already got suckered into buying it. It's been 12 months of magicka warden being the worst class in the game without a SINGLE meaningful buff.

Yeah now adding to the base game for free. Slap in the face to their fan base that paid for morrowind. Mag warden in pvp is very lackluster. You have to stack max magicka or you cannot shield and survive. They have no clue what mag wardens are supposed to be atm. A class with 0 cc is pretty much worthless in pvp. Not to mention the change made to deep fissure hardly buffs pve damage as that debuff won't stack with elemental drain. I just don't really get where they are going with the mag warden. But stamina warden can dizzyswing, sub assault, dawnbreaker combo all day. Hmmmmm.... where's the warden community representative?

Pathetic damage
Delayed damage
No CC

This has to be some sick joke by Wrobel. It's the only possible explanation for making such a useless class AND charging people money for it.

Hutch679

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Hutch679 wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Spurius_Lucilius wrote: »

Mag warden need more adjustments (or to put it more directly, BUFF), those adjustments in the patch notes are not enough. Getting rid of the Deep Fissure Stun is a lazy move. It nerfs PvP Mag Warden and doesn't help PVE Mag Warden damage output.

I've lost hope. ZOS just doesn't care. They got our money when they sold us the class with Morrowind. Why fix it now? We already got suckered into buying it. It's been 12 months of magicka warden being the worst class in the game without a SINGLE meaningful buff.

Yeah now adding to the base game for free. Slap in the face to their fan base that paid for morrowind. Mag warden in pvp is very lackluster. You have to stack max magicka or you cannot shield and survive. They have no clue what mag wardens are supposed to be atm. A class with 0 cc is pretty much worthless in pvp. Not to mention the change made to deep fissure hardly buffs pve damage as that debuff won't stack with elemental drain. I just don't really get where they are going with the mag warden. But stamina warden can dizzyswing, sub assault, dawnbreaker combo all day. Hmmmmm.... where's the warden community representative?

Pathetic damage
Delayed damage
No CC

This has to be some sick joke by Wrobel. It's the only possible explanation for making such a useless class AND charging people money for it.

Pretty crappy changes man. I kind of expected it. It's been nothing but nerfs for mag warden, yet stamina warden indirectly receives buffs. You thought stam wardens were strong before? Wait til that two hander counts as 2 set pieces....

Faulgor

We've been through this every PTS cycle since Morrowind.
They don't want Wardens to deal DPS. That's just what it comes down to.

arkansas_ESO

Waffennacht wrote: »

Ugh and their reason Blows:

In the same vein that snare abilities should either be short and powerful or long and weak, abilities should be low damage and CC, or high damage and no CC.

Yet NB keeps fear (long CC and very strong) Incap (high damage + CC) and DK keeps Leap (high damage + CC)

Then they take the stun away completely and give this as the reason.... Ugh

Don't forget Dizzying Swing! High damage with a CC attached.

zaria

CatastrophicSuccess wrote: »

They only nerfed the stam warden's utility in PvP. It'll be challanging to improve the classes PvE dps without increase its burst potential in PvP. Hopefully we'll see more changes as the PTS progresses.

Unfortunately this may won't be for a couple weeks since this first week is focused on their new player experience and psijic order leveling.

Ground based DoT is PvE so they could buff it while nerfing burst.

MLGProPlayer

Faulgor wrote: »

We've been through this every PTS cycle since Morrowind.
They don't want Wardens to deal DPS. That's just what it comes down to.

They need to make this *** clear up front when selling a class to people. It's false advertising otherwise.

Sky_WK

Wrobel's forced stam meta has reached meme level. What did we expect?

stileanima

First round of Mag Warden DPS testing:



Damage is looking alright I'd say lol. Granted it's still only the first PTS cycle and 3rd day of testing, so who knows where we will be by the end.

Kreshja

stileanima wrote: »

First round of Mag Warden DPS testing:



Damage is looking alright I'd say lol. Granted it's still only the first PTS cycle and 3rd day of testing, so who knows where we will be by the end.

Damage majorly from Light Attack, that every class can do? Still don’t see why bring a Warden DPS to PVE groups. Don’t find it interesting to play when light attack does the most.

Ludof

Keep on nerfing it!
Good job!

NoTimeToWait

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Spurius_Lucilius wrote: »

Mag warden need more adjustments (or to put it more directly, BUFF), those adjustments in the patch notes are not enough. Getting rid of the Deep Fissure Stun is a lazy move. It nerfs PvP Mag Warden and doesn't help PVE Mag Warden damage output.

I've lost hope. ZOS just doesn't care. They got our money when they sold us the class with Morrowind. Why fix it now? We already got suckered into buying it. It's been 12 months of magicka warden being the worst class in the game without a SINGLE meaningful buff.

Adding to that, wardens were nerfed every major update (3 times I think, with some buffs that were in no comparison with the nerfs)...

stileanima wrote: »

First round of Mag Warden DPS testing:

Damage is looking alright I'd say lol. Granted it's still only the first PTS cycle and 3rd day of testing, so who knows where we will be by the end.

With the parse consisting of only 2 Warden skills and bear ulti? Negate bear add some other ulti, 47k - 6k + 3k = ~44k dps, and we get two meaningful warden skills. This is just... pitiful (Edit: ok, missed the swarm)

stileanima

NoTimeToWait wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Spurius_Lucilius wrote: »

Mag warden need more adjustments (or to put it more directly, BUFF), those adjustments in the patch notes are not enough. Getting rid of the Deep Fissure Stun is a lazy move. It nerfs PvP Mag Warden and doesn't help PVE Mag Warden damage output.

I've lost hope. ZOS just doesn't care. They got our money when they sold us the class with Morrowind. Why fix it now? We already got suckered into buying it. It's been 12 months of magicka warden being the worst class in the game without a SINGLE meaningful buff.

Adding to that, wardens were nerfed every major update (3 times I think, with some buffs that were in no comparison with the nerfs)...

stileanima wrote: »

First round of Mag Warden DPS testing:

Damage is looking alright I'd say lol. Granted it's still only the first PTS cycle and 3rd day of testing, so who knows where we will be by the end.

With the parse consisting of only 2 Warden skills and bear ulti? Negate bear add some other ulti, 47k - 6k + 3k = ~44k dps, and we get two meaningful warden skills. This is just... pitiful (Edit: ok, missed the swarm)

Why would you remove the Eternal Guardian from the equation? On any boss fight where the ultimate doesn't die or otherwise attract dangerous mechanics, you'd use it for sure. Off the top of my head, the only fights where the Eternal Guardian as an ultimate would completely fail (ie, die or kill others) would be:

vAA
The Mage - HOWEVER, with a well-coordinated group and no additional melee pets, you CAN successfully use the Eternal Guardian without attracting Chain Lightning to the point that it is deadly for any teammates. (I really hope the combat team makes it so that pets do not attract mechanics like this.)

vSO
The Serpent - The ultimate will die to the Serpent's World Shaper mechanic. While I have found that you CAN control it so that it follows you from the AOE and does not get hit by it, unfortunately, this results in a massive DPS loss as the ultimate is sitting passively at your side for a good chunk of the fight. (Again, I really hope the combat team makes it so that the ultimate does not die to mechanics like this.)

vAS
The bear attracts Storm the Heavens and if it is mobile when the mechanic is active, it can easily run over and kill your teammates. To work around this, I have tried to leave it sitting on the main boss, but it will eventually die in Llothis' ground AOE, or to Llothis' Defiled Blast. (Combat team please! lol)

In all other boss fights, you can and in my opinion should use the Eternal Guardian; however, there are moments in all of these fights where it CAN die, in some instances quite easily, if there are no heals on it, or it can otherwise be stunned, knocked back, etc. My hope is that for PvE encounters, this ultimate can be made much sturdier so that the Mag Warden can use it with success in ALL fights. Right now, if it dies even once, it results in a huge DPS loss as your character becomes stuck in the resummoning animation which you may wind up having to cancel in order to perform another mechanic properly. A prime example of this that I have experienced is in vMoL during the first boss fight: usually, the bear will die some time just before or just after shield phase. At this point I normally get immediately thrown into the resummoning animation, and sometimes will then be targeted by a pillar and need to block cancel the animation so I don't get knocked back/potentially killed. I then need to spend at least another 2.5 seconds resummoning it, IF nothing else happens during that time that takes priority, in which case I might need to spend even more time attempting to reactivate it.

All that being said, again, I would not discount the Eternal Guardian as a part of the Mag Warden's kit at all. I see a lot of posts around the forums saying things along the lines of "you would never use the Eternal Guardian in any trial, it's just for dummy cheese" which, in my opinion, is very silly and untrue.

Use it on boss fights where you can-- there are many where it is possible to do so. For trash pulls, one option is to use Destro Ult in combination with Deep Fissure. With that combo, and even just with Deep Fissure and ground dots + spammable alone, you will see the Mag Warden dealing some MASSIVE AOE damage.

MLGProPlayer

stileanima wrote: »

NoTimeToWait wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Spurius_Lucilius wrote: »

Mag warden need more adjustments (or to put it more directly, BUFF), those adjustments in the patch notes are not enough. Getting rid of the Deep Fissure Stun is a lazy move. It nerfs PvP Mag Warden and doesn't help PVE Mag Warden damage output.

I've lost hope. ZOS just doesn't care. They got our money when they sold us the class with Morrowind. Why fix it now? We already got suckered into buying it. It's been 12 months of magicka warden being the worst class in the game without a SINGLE meaningful buff.

Adding to that, wardens were nerfed every major update (3 times I think, with some buffs that were in no comparison with the nerfs)...

stileanima wrote: »

First round of Mag Warden DPS testing:

Damage is looking alright I'd say lol. Granted it's still only the first PTS cycle and 3rd day of testing, so who knows where we will be by the end.

With the parse consisting of only 2 Warden skills and bear ulti? Negate bear add some other ulti, 47k - 6k + 3k = ~44k dps, and we get two meaningful warden skills. This is just... pitiful (Edit: ok, missed the swarm)

Why would you remove the Eternal Guardian from the equation? On any boss fight where the ultimate doesn't die or otherwise attract dangerous mechanics, you'd use it for sure. Off the top of my head, the only fights where the Eternal Guardian as an ultimate would completely fail (ie, die or kill others) would be:

vAA
The Mage - HOWEVER, with a well-coordinated group and no additional melee pets, you CAN successfully use the Eternal Guardian without attracting Chain Lightning to the point that it is deadly for any teammates. (I really hope the combat team makes it so that pets do not attract mechanics like this.)

vSO
The Serpent - The ultimate will die to the Serpent's World Shaper mechanic. While I have found that you CAN control it so that it follows you from the AOE and does not get hit by it, unfortunately, this results in a massive DPS loss as the ultimate is sitting passively at your side for a good chunk of the fight. (Again, I really hope the combat team makes it so that the ultimate does not die to mechanics like this.)

vAS
The bear attracts Storm the Heavens and if it is mobile when the mechanic is active, it can easily run over and kill your teammates. To work around this, I have tried to leave it sitting on the main boss, but it will eventually die in Llothis' ground AOE, or to Llothis poison cleave. (Combat team please! lol)

In all other boss fights, you can and in my opinion should use the Eternal Guardian; however, there are moments in all of these fights where it CAN die, in some instances quite easily, if there are no heals on it, or it can otherwise be stunned, knocked back, etc. My hope is that for PvE encounters, this ultimate can be made much sturdier so that the Mag Warden can use it with success in ALL fights. Right now, if it dies even once, it results in a huge DPS loss as your character becomes stuck in the resummoning animation which you may wind up having to cancel in order to perform another mechanic properly. A prime example of this that I have experienced is in vMoL during the first boss fight: usually, the bear will die some time just before or just after shield phase. At this point I normally get immediately thrown into the resummoning animation, and sometimes will then be targeted by a pillar and need to block cancel the animation so I don't get knocked back/potentially killed. I then need to spend at least another 2.5 seconds resummoning it, IF nothing else happens during that time that takes priority, in which case I might need to spend even more time attempting to reactivate it.

All that being said, again, I would not discount the Eternal Guardian as a part of the Mag Warden's kit at all. I see a lot of posts around the forums saying things along the lines of "you would never use the Eternal Guardian in any trial, it's just for dummy cheese" which, in my opinion, is very silly and untrue.

Use it on boss fights where you can-- there are many where it is possible to do so. For trash pulls, one option is to use Destro Ult in combination with Deep Fissure. With that combo, and even just with Deep Fissure and ground dots + spammable alone, you will see the Mag Warden dealing some MASSIVE AOE damage.

It's a single target skill. Why wouldn't you bring a stamina warden, or any stamina class, instead? The whole point of magicka DPS is to maximize AOE damage.

One fix I've been suggesting since day 1 is to make it a single bar ability. That way, magicka warden would still have access to destro ult, while not losing the DPS of the bear (which it desperately needs in order to stay within range of the other classes).

LeHarrt91

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

stileanima wrote: »

NoTimeToWait wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Spurius_Lucilius wrote: »

Mag warden need more adjustments (or to put it more directly, BUFF), those adjustments in the patch notes are not enough. Getting rid of the Deep Fissure Stun is a lazy move. It nerfs PvP Mag Warden and doesn't help PVE Mag Warden damage output.

I've lost hope. ZOS just doesn't care. They got our money when they sold us the class with Morrowind. Why fix it now? We already got suckered into buying it. It's been 12 months of magicka warden being the worst class in the game without a SINGLE meaningful buff.

Adding to that, wardens were nerfed every major update (3 times I think, with some buffs that were in no comparison with the nerfs)...

stileanima wrote: »

First round of Mag Warden DPS testing:

Damage is looking alright I'd say lol. Granted it's still only the first PTS cycle and 3rd day of testing, so who knows where we will be by the end.

With the parse consisting of only 2 Warden skills and bear ulti? Negate bear add some other ulti, 47k - 6k + 3k = ~44k dps, and we get two meaningful warden skills. This is just... pitiful (Edit: ok, missed the swarm)

Why would you remove the Eternal Guardian from the equation? On any boss fight where the ultimate doesn't die or otherwise attract dangerous mechanics, you'd use it for sure. Off the top of my head, the only fights where the Eternal Guardian as an ultimate would completely fail (ie, die or kill others) would be:

vAA
The Mage - HOWEVER, with a well-coordinated group and no additional melee pets, you CAN successfully use the Eternal Guardian without attracting Chain Lightning to the point that it is deadly for any teammates. (I really hope the combat team makes it so that pets do not attract mechanics like this.)

vSO
The Serpent - The ultimate will die to the Serpent's World Shaper mechanic. While I have found that you CAN control it so that it follows you from the AOE and does not get hit by it, unfortunately, this results in a massive DPS loss as the ultimate is sitting passively at your side for a good chunk of the fight. (Again, I really hope the combat team makes it so that the ultimate does not die to mechanics like this.)

vAS
The bear attracts Storm the Heavens and if it is mobile when the mechanic is active, it can easily run over and kill your teammates. To work around this, I have tried to leave it sitting on the main boss, but it will eventually die in Llothis' ground AOE, or to Llothis poison cleave. (Combat team please! lol)

In all other boss fights, you can and in my opinion should use the Eternal Guardian; however, there are moments in all of these fights where it CAN die, in some instances quite easily, if there are no heals on it, or it can otherwise be stunned, knocked back, etc. My hope is that for PvE encounters, this ultimate can be made much sturdier so that the Mag Warden can use it with success in ALL fights. Right now, if it dies even once, it results in a huge DPS loss as your character becomes stuck in the resummoning animation which you may wind up having to cancel in order to perform another mechanic properly. A prime example of this that I have experienced is in vMoL during the first boss fight: usually, the bear will die some time just before or just after shield phase. At this point I normally get immediately thrown into the resummoning animation, and sometimes will then be targeted by a pillar and need to block cancel the animation so I don't get knocked back/potentially killed. I then need to spend at least another 2.5 seconds resummoning it, IF nothing else happens during that time that takes priority, in which case I might need to spend even more time attempting to reactivate it.

All that being said, again, I would not discount the Eternal Guardian as a part of the Mag Warden's kit at all. I see a lot of posts around the forums saying things along the lines of "you would never use the Eternal Guardian in any trial, it's just for dummy cheese" which, in my opinion, is very silly and untrue.

Use it on boss fights where you can-- there are many where it is possible to do so. For trash pulls, one option is to use Destro Ult in combination with Deep Fissure. With that combo, and even just with Deep Fissure and ground dots + spammable alone, you will see the Mag Warden dealing some MASSIVE AOE damage.

It's a single target skill. Why wouldn't you bring a stamina warden, or any stamina class, instead? The whole point of magicka DPS is to maximize AOE damage.

One fix I've been suggesting since day 1 is to make it a single bar ability. That way, magicka warden would still have access to destro ult, while not losing the DPS of the bear (which it desperately needs in order to stay within range of the other classes).

While i agree with both of you that the bear can be taken into trials (tho out performed in a lot of cases). I dont want to have to use the bear to get comparable numbers to other classes.

stileanima

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

stileanima wrote: »

NoTimeToWait wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Spurius_Lucilius wrote: »

Mag warden need more adjustments (or to put it more directly, BUFF), those adjustments in the patch notes are not enough. Getting rid of the Deep Fissure Stun is a lazy move. It nerfs PvP Mag Warden and doesn't help PVE Mag Warden damage output.

I've lost hope. ZOS just doesn't care. They got our money when they sold us the class with Morrowind. Why fix it now? We already got suckered into buying it. It's been 12 months of magicka warden being the worst class in the game without a SINGLE meaningful buff.

Adding to that, wardens were nerfed every major update (3 times I think, with some buffs that were in no comparison with the nerfs)...

stileanima wrote: »

First round of Mag Warden DPS testing:

Damage is looking alright I'd say lol. Granted it's still only the first PTS cycle and 3rd day of testing, so who knows where we will be by the end.

With the parse consisting of only 2 Warden skills and bear ulti? Negate bear add some other ulti, 47k - 6k + 3k = ~44k dps, and we get two meaningful warden skills. This is just... pitiful (Edit: ok, missed the swarm)

Why would you remove the Eternal Guardian from the equation? On any boss fight where the ultimate doesn't die or otherwise attract dangerous mechanics, you'd use it for sure. Off the top of my head, the only fights where the Eternal Guardian as an ultimate would completely fail (ie, die or kill others) would be:

vAA
The Mage - HOWEVER, with a well-coordinated group and no additional melee pets, you CAN successfully use the Eternal Guardian without attracting Chain Lightning to the point that it is deadly for any teammates. (I really hope the combat team makes it so that pets do not attract mechanics like this.)

vSO
The Serpent - The ultimate will die to the Serpent's World Shaper mechanic. While I have found that you CAN control it so that it follows you from the AOE and does not get hit by it, unfortunately, this results in a massive DPS loss as the ultimate is sitting passively at your side for a good chunk of the fight. (Again, I really hope the combat team makes it so that the ultimate does not die to mechanics like this.)

vAS
The bear attracts Storm the Heavens and if it is mobile when the mechanic is active, it can easily run over and kill your teammates. To work around this, I have tried to leave it sitting on the main boss, but it will eventually die in Llothis' ground AOE, or to Llothis poison cleave. (Combat team please! lol)

In all other boss fights, you can and in my opinion should use the Eternal Guardian; however, there are moments in all of these fights where it CAN die, in some instances quite easily, if there are no heals on it, or it can otherwise be stunned, knocked back, etc. My hope is that for PvE encounters, this ultimate can be made much sturdier so that the Mag Warden can use it with success in ALL fights. Right now, if it dies even once, it results in a huge DPS loss as your character becomes stuck in the resummoning animation which you may wind up having to cancel in order to perform another mechanic properly. A prime example of this that I have experienced is in vMoL during the first boss fight: usually, the bear will die some time just before or just after shield phase. At this point I normally get immediately thrown into the resummoning animation, and sometimes will then be targeted by a pillar and need to block cancel the animation so I don't get knocked back/potentially killed. I then need to spend at least another 2.5 seconds resummoning it, IF nothing else happens during that time that takes priority, in which case I might need to spend even more time attempting to reactivate it.

All that being said, again, I would not discount the Eternal Guardian as a part of the Mag Warden's kit at all. I see a lot of posts around the forums saying things along the lines of "you would never use the Eternal Guardian in any trial, it's just for dummy cheese" which, in my opinion, is very silly and untrue.

Use it on boss fights where you can-- there are many where it is possible to do so. For trash pulls, one option is to use Destro Ult in combination with Deep Fissure. With that combo, and even just with Deep Fissure and ground dots + spammable alone, you will see the Mag Warden dealing some MASSIVE AOE damage.

It's a single target skill. Why wouldn't you bring a stamina warden, or any stamina class, instead? The whole point of magicka DPS is to maximize AOE damage.

One fix I've been suggesting since day 1 is to make it a single bar ability. That way, magicka warden would still have access to destro ult, while not losing the DPS of the bear (which it desperately needs in order to stay within range of the other classes).

I use Destro Ult + Deep Fissure in trash fights, and for boss fights, I use Eternal Guardian. I cannot think of any trial boss fight where a Magicka Warden would NEED to slot a Destro Ult, unless the Eternal Guardian would just die or kill other people, which IMO is a whole other issue in and of itself lol.

Magicka Wardens DO provide incredible AOE damage for trash fights (Deep Fissure is really, really strong for AOE).

I do still think that Mag Warden PvE DPS could use some TLC, but again, they don't NEED to use Destro Ult for bosses in trials.

stileanima

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

stileanima wrote: »

NoTimeToWait wrote: »

MLGProPlayer wrote: »

Spurius_Lucilius wrote: »

Mag warden need more adjustments (or to put it more directly, BUFF), those adjustments in the patch notes are not enough. Getting rid of the Deep Fissure Stun is a lazy move. It nerfs PvP Mag Warden and doesn't help PVE Mag Warden damage output.

I've lost hope. ZOS just doesn't care. They got our money when they sold us the class with Morrowind. Why fix it now? We already got suckered into buying it. It's been 12 months of magicka warden being the worst class in the game without a SINGLE meaningful buff.

Adding to that, wardens were nerfed every major update (3 times I think, with some buffs that were in no comparison with the nerfs)...

stileanima wrote: »

First round of Mag Warden DPS testing:

Damage is looking alright I'd say lol. Granted it's still only the first PTS cycle and 3rd day of testing, so who knows where we will be by the end.

With the parse consisting of only 2 Warden skills and bear ulti? Negate bear add some other ulti, 47k - 6k + 3k = ~44k dps, and we get two meaningful warden skills. This is just... pitiful (Edit: ok, missed the swarm)

Why would you remove the Eternal Guardian from the equation? On any boss fight where the ultimate doesn't die or otherwise attract dangerous mechanics, you'd use it for sure. Off the top of my head, the only fights where the Eternal Guardian as an ultimate would completely fail (ie, die or kill others) would be:

vAA
The Mage - HOWEVER, with a well-coordinated group and no additional melee pets, you CAN successfully use the Eternal Guardian without attracting Chain Lightning to the point that it is deadly for any teammates. (I really hope the combat team makes it so that pets do not attract mechanics like this.)

vSO
The Serpent - The ultimate will die to the Serpent's World Shaper mechanic. While I have found that you CAN control it so that it follows you from the AOE and does not get hit by it, unfortunately, this results in a massive DPS loss as the ultimate is sitting passively at your side for a good chunk of the fight. (Again, I really hope the combat team makes it so that the ultimate does not die to mechanics like this.)

vAS
The bear attracts Storm the Heavens and if it is mobile when the mechanic is active, it can easily run over and kill your teammates. To work around this, I have tried to leave it sitting on the main boss, but it will eventually die in Llothis' ground AOE, or to Llothis poison cleave. (Combat team please! lol)

In all other boss fights, you can and in my opinion should use the Eternal Guardian; however, there are moments in all of these fights where it CAN die, in some instances quite easily, if there are no heals on it, or it can otherwise be stunned, knocked back, etc. My hope is that for PvE encounters, this ultimate can be made much sturdier so that the Mag Warden can use it with success in ALL fights. Right now, if it dies even once, it results in a huge DPS loss as your character becomes stuck in the resummoning animation which you may wind up having to cancel in order to perform another mechanic properly. A prime example of this that I have experienced is in vMoL during the first boss fight: usually, the bear will die some time just before or just after shield phase. At this point I normally get immediately thrown into the resummoning animation, and sometimes will then be targeted by a pillar and need to block cancel the animation so I don't get knocked back/potentially killed. I then need to spend at least another 2.5 seconds resummoning it, IF nothing else happens during that time that takes priority, in which case I might need to spend even more time attempting to reactivate it.

All that being said, again, I would not discount the Eternal Guardian as a part of the Mag Warden's kit at all. I see a lot of posts around the forums saying things along the lines of "you would never use the Eternal Guardian in any trial, it's just for dummy cheese" which, in my opinion, is very silly and untrue.

Use it on boss fights where you can-- there are many where it is possible to do so. For trash pulls, one option is to use Destro Ult in combination with Deep Fissure. With that combo, and even just with Deep Fissure and ground dots + spammable alone, you will see the Mag Warden dealing some MASSIVE AOE damage.

It's a single target skill. Why wouldn't you bring a stamina warden, or any stamina class, instead? The whole point of magicka DPS is to maximize AOE damage.

One fix I've been suggesting since day 1 is to make it a single bar ability. That way, magicka warden would still have access to destro ult, while not losing the DPS of the bear (which it desperately needs in order to stay within range of the other classes).

While i agree with both of you that the bear can be taken into trials (tho out performed in a lot of cases). I dont want to have to use the bear to get comparable numbers to other classes.

Yeah I'm on the same page here. It'd be nice for the Mag Warden to be able to pull comparable numbers both with and without Eternal Guardian.