Anniversary Event & Motifs Prices

Kiralyn2000

Berenhir wrote: »

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Dapper Dinosaur wrote: »

Worth of an item is always based on how long does it take to aquire. In eso, u have a basevalue of 20k/hour netgain for crafting green food to sell to npc. Thus anything that takes less than an hour to aquire is not worth 20k gold. Farming and selling stuff for less than 20k that took longer than an hour to get is a bad idea likewise.

This formula falls flat when you consider that any remotely competent group can speedrun Cradle Hardmode in less than 30 minutes and walk away with 4 pages of a motif that sells for 40k+ per page.

Formula is wrong anyway. Login and doing all crafting dailies on a toon nets you 4k Gold in 5 minutes, no master writs or surveys considered as they add time. This means you can do twelve writs within an hour and puts effective farming to at least 48k gold per hour.

There are other activities in ESO which consistently bring ~200k gold per hour, but I'm obviously not gonna elaborate on those.

I believe he was talking about things that 1) can be done on a single player, and 2) generate new gold (selling crafted food to NPC/etc), not just recirculating gold between players. You can only do 12 sets of 4k writs if you have 12 lv50 characters, and I be surprised there's anything that generates 200k gold/hr.

(of course, for his 20k/hr formula to work, one has to assume an infinite supply of the right provisioning mats, otherwise farming them eats a big chunk of time. Or buying them off guild vendors eats most of the gold.)


...hmm, what was the gold/hr gain back when people could farm public dungeon Imperials with full Prosperous?


edit: what I'm wondering is when generic CP160 Intricate trash became 600-1500g/per. Saw a lot of that on guild vendors two days ago when I wanted to power a new crafter through the last few ranks of Blacksmith.

NoTimeToWait

Berenhir wrote: »

Formula is wrong anyway. Login and doing all crafting dailies on a toon nets you 4k Gold in 5 minutes, no master writs or surveys considered as they add time. This means you can do twelve writs within an hour and puts effective farming to at least 48k gold per hour.

There are other activities in ESO which consistently bring ~200k gold per hour, but I'm obviously not gonna elaborate on those.

yep, but you need characters trained in crafting to be able to do that. So you can't use it as a base line, because it has prerequisits to be met.

On the other hand you could get 20k per hour just gathering nodes with a single character (maybe even low level char when using an efficient route)

heaven13

Dapper Dinosaur wrote: »

I do wish the dungeon pages didn't drop in these. While I'm all for getting another way to earn motifs that any pleb with hands can earn eventually through repetition of simple tasks, I don't think people that lack the skill to acquire the dungeon pages should have any other way to get them. The pages are supposed to be an incentive for players to better themselves so they can clear the harder content, and events like this ruin that.

So you don't think the pages should be tradeable either? If you want only skilled players earning them through completing the dungeon, they'd have to be bound so no one could trade (unless the pages worked like other dungeon loot tradeable only for x amount of hours with players that did it with you) or sell.

Somehow, I doubt that's what you mean. Usually these kinds of posts are "I can't sell my pages for exorbitant prices to the plebs who are less awesome than me and it's really cutting into my profits"

Seriously, this event is awesome. I can't play everyday and definitely don't have the time (or when I do it's the wrong time of day) to run hard mode content. I barely have enough time to play at all during the week. This event lets me log in and do writs, which I try to do every day anyway, and earn motifs that my main crafter is still missing. I'm trading what I can to fill gaps. I've got a huge stockpile that I'm hoping to trade to complete some sets! I'm not worrying about cutting into anyone's profits.

Kybotica

heaven13 wrote: »

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Dapper Dinosaur wrote: »

I do wish the dungeon pages didn't drop in these. While I'm all for getting another way to earn motifs that any pleb with hands can earn eventually through repetition of simple tasks, I don't think people that lack the skill to acquire the dungeon pages should have any other way to get them. The pages are supposed to be an incentive for players to better themselves so they can clear the harder content, and events like this ruin that.

So you don't think the pages should be tradeable either? If you want only skilled players earning them through completing the dungeon, they'd have to be bound so no one could trade (unless the pages worked like other dungeon loot tradeable only for x amount of hours with players that did it with you) or sell.

Somehow, I doubt that's what you mean. Usually these kinds of posts are "I can't sell my pages for exorbitant prices to the plebs who are less awesome than me and it's really cutting into my profits"

Seriously, this event is awesome. I can't play everyday and definitely don't have the time (or when I do it's the wrong time of day) to run hard mode content. I barely have enough time to play at all during the week. This event lets me log in and do writs, which I try to do every day anyway, and earn motifs that my main crafter is still missing. I'm trading what I can to fill gaps. I've got a huge stockpile that I'm hoping to trade to complete some sets! I'm not worrying about cutting into anyone's profits.

I REALLY disagree with the first post here. Elitist mentality for something like crafting motifs is not appropriate in my opinion. I get not wanting people to have certain polymorphs, titles, and costumes attached to high-tier content, but motifs seems a bit excessive. Seems like people want to have a monopoly on a lucrative market due to the costume system, which is just selfish. You can make your profits during the other 11 months of the year, or really the other 50 weeks.

What does a few "scrubs" (here meaning any person who doesn't play top-tier PvE content, regardless of the reason) getting a motif do to harm anybody?

badmojo

NoTimeToWait wrote: »

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Berenhir wrote: »

Formula is wrong anyway. Login and doing all crafting dailies on a toon nets you 4k Gold in 5 minutes, no master writs or surveys considered as they add time. This means you can do twelve writs within an hour and puts effective farming to at least 48k gold per hour.

There are other activities in ESO which consistently bring ~200k gold per hour, but I'm obviously not gonna elaborate on those.

yep, but you need characters trained in crafting to be able to do that. So you can't use it as a base line, because it has prerequisits to be met.

On the other hand you could get 20k per hour just gathering nodes with a single character (maybe even low level char when using an efficient route)

This is false, you can do 6 tier1 crafting writs on any level50 and get 4k per day. The most you need to do is the certification quest to get them going, you dont even need to put any skill points towards the crafts.

It is true that doing max level writs will give you better item rewards, but it comes with a big investment in leveling, skill points and materials. I personally only do max level equipment writs on about 3 or 4 characters despite having max level and extra skill points on most of my 15 characters. I do mostly tier1 equip writs because ancestor silk is expensive, master writs arent anything to write home about, you still get tempers and surveys which can be given to max level crafter to harvest ancestor silk. I do writs to make gold, using expensive materials to do writs seemed counter productive.

Jute, maple and iron are dirt cheap, so if anyone has any characters who are over level 6 and not doing writs, thats a lot of wasted potential, especially during this event.

ANGEL_BtVS

Bonzodog01 wrote: »

Worth noting that prices for tempers and wax are now dropping due to the increased number of people doing the crafting dailies, and the market is getting flooded with them.

Good

NoTimeToWait

badmojo wrote: »

This is false, you can do 6 tier1 crafting writs on any level50 and get 4k per day. The most you need to do is the certification quest to get them going, you dont even need to put any skill points towards the crafts.

It is true that doing max level writs will give you better item rewards, but it comes with a big investment in leveling, skill points and materials. I personally only do max level equipment writs on about 3 or 4 characters despite having max level and extra skill points on most of my 15 characters. I do mostly tier1 equip writs because ancestor silk is expensive, master writs arent anything to write home about, you still get tempers and surveys which can be given to max level crafter to harvest ancestor silk. I do writs to make gold, using expensive materials to do writs seemed counter productive.

Jute, maple and iron are dirt cheap, so if anyone has any characters who are over level 6 and not doing writs, thats a lot of wasted potential, especially during this event.

That was not the point. We were discussing the baseline measurement. And while you can do low lever writs with one character, it doesn't make much sense, because that will be below baseline. And having more than one 50 lvl char is a prerequisite. We could assume that any player can have 1 50 lvl char and 7 6th lvl chars (which is not much of a prerequisite). You would get around 1.3k gold per low level char and 4k for high lvl, so it would be around 13k gold which is a candidate for a baseline. So among all farming candidates that any player could do without any initial effort (like doing dolmens which nets you around 15k gold per hour), gathering mats is probably the best.

So, the point is that you could make on average 20k gold per hour having only one 50 lvl(or even less) character by gathering mats. (Sure, one could get as much as 40-50k gold per hour gathering mats with gear/skills for speed or by knowing good routes but it is a prerequisite)

Loralai_907

Before this event I only needed Morag Tong, Bloodforge and Dreadhorn pages. Now, I only need WC pages. Part of that was due to drops, but a lot of it was due to selling pages I already knew and just buying the pages I needed because I lack patience. I'm really happy I'm finally caught up again, even if I'm not seeing WC pages drop. That one I'm not going to have finished, and I'm fine with that at this point. I'm opening a minimum of 66 boxes a day, and getting maybe 20 pages a day to sell. Yeah the prices are dropping, but I'm spending an hour a day farming boxes, so I'm not complaining.

badmojo

NoTimeToWait wrote: »

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badmojo wrote: »

This is false, you can do 6 tier1 crafting writs on any level50 and get 4k per day. The most you need to do is the certification quest to get them going, you dont even need to put any skill points towards the crafts.

It is true that doing max level writs will give you better item rewards, but it comes with a big investment in leveling, skill points and materials. I personally only do max level equipment writs on about 3 or 4 characters despite having max level and extra skill points on most of my 15 characters. I do mostly tier1 equip writs because ancestor silk is expensive, master writs arent anything to write home about, you still get tempers and surveys which can be given to max level crafter to harvest ancestor silk. I do writs to make gold, using expensive materials to do writs seemed counter productive.

Jute, maple and iron are dirt cheap, so if anyone has any characters who are over level 6 and not doing writs, thats a lot of wasted potential, especially during this event.

That was not the point. We were discussing the baseline measurement. And while you can do low lever writs with one character, it doesn't make much sense, because that will be below baseline. And having more than one 50 lvl char is a prerequisite. We could assume that any player can have 1 50 lvl char and 7 6th lvl chars (which is not much of a prerequisite). You would get around 1.3k gold per low level char and 4k for high lvl, so it would be around 13k gold which is a candidate for a baseline. So among all farming candidates that any player could do without any initial effort (like doing dolmens which nets you around 15k gold per hour), gathering mats is probably the best.

So, the point is that you could make on average 20k gold per hour having only one 50 lvl(or even less) character by gathering mats. (Sure, one could get as much as 40-50k gold per hour gathering mats with gear/skills for speed or by knowing good routes but it is a prerequisite)

That 1.3k number doesnt seem accurate.

Also, there is prerequisite to farming materials just like writs. Go farm on a level 50 cp160 with no points into crafting, half the stuff you farm will be tier1 cheap stuff. So you are going to want max level crafter to maximize that farmimg time.

If a player started today and wanted to choose between writs or mat farming to make money I would recommend the writs because the money is good right off the bat.

Starting fresh farming mats would leave you picking nirnroot and other flowers until you can level your character to CP160 and also leveling up your ctafts and putting points towards them. Then you also have to join a trade guild or spam zone to move the product, and research prices to know what to ask for it.

On the other hand you can quickly create 8 characters and level them to 6 in the first couple days. Do the writ certifications and be making consistent gold everyday. Without the need for a trade guild or zone spamming. You also get intricate items to help level you master crafter, and tempers for when you join a trade guild and need extra money.

To each their own, but if I farmed mats for gold I would still do my writs first everday. Farming mats does have the one advantage of not being time restricted.

NoTimeToWait

badmojo wrote: »

That 1.3k number doesnt seem accurate.

Also, there is prerequisite to farming materials just like writs. Go farm on a level 50 cp160 with no points into crafting, half the stuff you farm will be tier1 cheap stuff. So you are going to want max level crafter to maximize that farmimg time.

If a player started today and wanted to choose between writs or mat farming to make money I would recommend the writs because the money is good right off the bat.

Starting fresh farming mats would leave you picking nirnroot and other flowers until you can level your character to CP160 and also leveling up your ctafts and putting points towards them. Then you also have to join a trade guild or spam zone to move the product, and research prices to know what to ask for it.

On the other hand you can quickly create 8 characters and level them to 6 in the first couple days. Do the writ certifications and be making consistent gold everyday. Without the need for a trade guild or zone spamming. You also get intricate items to help level you master crafter, and tempers for when you join a trade guild and need extra money.

To each their own, but if I farmed mats for gold I would still do my writs first everday. Farming mats does have the one advantage of not being time restricted.

I wasn't trying to be accurate and I wasn't saying that your way of making gold somehow wrong, because it wasn't relevant. Low level writ crafting is a candidate for baseline measure. There are other candidates. Among them is mat farming (you would get 20k with half low level mats gathered, like I said, no prerequisites). It looks like a number of low-effort farming techniques oscillate around 15-20k gold per hour value, thats why it seems reasonable to choose this value as some starting point.

I didn't say that this is the only correct way to measure gold farming effectiveness. The purpose is to establish some verifiable way that would aid anyone who wants to farm gold effectively

While you are making valid points, they are a bit tangential to the problem I was trying to discuss

So far I saw that someone called this methodology faulty (which is highly possible), but provided no alternatives

driosketch

Mannix1958 wrote: »

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driosketch wrote: »

We have already seen this from the prior year. Glass motif never recovered from its crash. Easy to farm motif pages like Dwemer will sell for less. Dungeon and hard to farm motifs may recover somewhat, remember ZOS tweaked drop rates with the outfit system. Also newer motifs will take the place of the old money makers, just like BA did.

Wrong killer of glass...glass was killed because of all the free fragments as writ rewards for so long. I often sold extras and saw those drop over time...one reason they no longer drop and now must be purchased.

Glass had a floor because you needed to spend 10k to combine fragments even if you got them for free. With RNG, you might see less desired duplicates sell for just under 9000 just to recoup the cost. After the event you had a bunch of free pages flood the market.