Morrowind and Warden in Crown Store

JD2013

Apache_Kid wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Juju_beans wrote: »

it's good business sense...roll the previous expansion into the base.
This way brand new players to the game only have to buy the base + current expansion to play.

This is how other MMO's do it.

Other MMO's didn't have a set system about how they classify and release DLC, make an exception to that system for a quick cash grab, and then re-integrate the exception back into the old system.

I've never seen anything like this.

WoW adds previous expansions to base package every time a new one comes, and people have to pay a mandatory sub.

That is still not the same thing that happened here. If WoW gave out all expansions with sub, then decided you had to buy one separately that wasn't with the sub, and then 1 year later, put that expansion back with the sub, then you could compare the two.

But that isn't what happened with WoW.

No, you are correct.

With WoW, you have to sub to play all new content and indeed all content at all, and you have to buy expansions separately to this.

Oh ... Like how you have to sub with ESO to play DLC's (or buy them with crowns) and buy chapters separately?

Geroken777

anadandy wrote: »

I bought Morrowind for a friend the day before the Summerset announcement. Then they gave it away with Summerset pre-order and now this. But I'm not going to cry over $20 - I just have to laugh, seriously. Even my RL RNG sucks!

Why don't you refund lol

Apache_Kid

JD2013 wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

JD2013 wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Juju_beans wrote: »

it's good business sense...roll the previous expansion into the base.
This way brand new players to the game only have to buy the base + current expansion to play.

This is how other MMO's do it.

Other MMO's didn't have a set system about how they classify and release DLC, make an exception to that system for a quick cash grab, and then re-integrate the exception back into the old system.

I've never seen anything like this.

WoW adds previous expansions to base package every time a new one comes, and people have to pay a mandatory sub.

That is still not the same thing that happened here. If WoW gave out all expansions with sub, then decided you had to buy one separately that wasn't with the sub, and then 1 year later, put that expansion back with the sub, then you could compare the two.

But that isn't what happened with WoW.

No, you are correct.

With WoW, you have to sub to play all new content and indeed all content at all, and you have to buy expansions separately to this.

Oh ... Like how you have to sub with ESO to play DLC's (or buy them with crowns) and buy chapters separately?

Yes WoW had a paid sub to play.

What didn't they have? Gamble boxes, $120 houses, etc.

You keep trying to compare the two when they aren't comparable. One uses a P2Play model, the other does not and chooses to grab for cash in other ways.


I found the way they did it with Morrowind to be in poor taste and this decision to put Morrowind where it should've been to begin with just reinforces my beliefs.

Zinaroth

So I guess none of you guys that are complaining about this are going to buy Summerset - you'll just wait a year until you can play it for free right?

Defilted

Korlian wrote: »

Defilted wrote: »

How is this a bad thing? I pre-ordered Morrowind and I am in no way concerned with this change. The older something gets the cheaper it is. This is true on all kinds of products.

It's not a bad thing. What's bad is how they do it. Like to put Morrowind on sale 1 week before announcing it's going to be included in the base game in 1 month, what would you call that?

I call that a company selling their product. There are no guarantees in life. If you think something is going to be cheaper later then wait. If it is at a price point you think is acceptable, buy it. To live your life always regretting you could have got something cheaper later is going to drive you to drink.

Case in point, now that you know this is going to happen with Summerset are you going to wait until it is in the crown store next April and part of ESO+ or do you want it now and you are going to buy it? I chose now and I pre-ordered it, but this works for me and I do not care if it is part of the base game 6 months from now.

Apache_Kid

Zinaroth wrote: »

So I guess none of you guys that are complaining about this are going to buy Summerset - you'll just wait a year until you can play it for free right?

We are not complaining about "this" new practice but rather still complaining about the original treatment of Morrowind. This is how it should've been from day 1.

VaranisArano

Zinaroth wrote: »

So I guess none of you guys that are complaining about this are going to buy Summerset - you'll just wait a year until you can play it for free right?

Too late. Already bought the preorder. I'm also happy with that choice,

But it does reinforce for me what I already knew: "Chapters" are just DLC and upgrades combined into one package as part of a blatant money grab by ZOS.

That I am paying for it because I want to play now does not make it any less of a greedy tactic to combo stuff ZOS knows full well shoukd have been released as DLC for everyone for crowns and ESO+ members.

Caleb_Kadesh

VaranisArano wrote: »

Wow. Just. Wow.
I mean, yeah, I wasn't going to wait an entire year to play Morrowind and Battlegrounds, but this really shows the truth we already knew: that this "Chapter" stuff was just a blatant money grab.

I have always been confused by this attitude. Is it not clear that ZOS is running a business? If they can't make a profit then there is no reason to be in business.

How do you pay for rent/mortgage, food, transportation etc.? What "money grab" do you employ?

anadandy

Geroken777 wrote: »

anadandy wrote: »

I bought Morrowind for a friend the day before the Summerset announcement. Then they gave it away with Summerset pre-order and now this. But I'm not going to cry over $20 - I just have to laugh, seriously. Even my RL RNG sucks!

Why don't you refund lol

Eh - it's $20. It would have cost me that much to have beers with him. LOL

lygerseye

Caleb_Kadesh wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Wow. Just. Wow.
I mean, yeah, I wasn't going to wait an entire year to play Morrowind and Battlegrounds, but this really shows the truth we already knew: that this "Chapter" stuff was just a blatant money grab.

I have always been confused by this attitude. Is it not clear that ZOS is running a business? If they can't make a profit then there is no reason to be in business.

How do you pay for rent/mortgage, food, transportation etc.? What "money grab" do you employ?

My wife and I tell our kids that we will provide them with all their meals but then start charging them for desserts and snacks.

Noisivid

"Now how much you give is your own choice
But to me it is the difference between a Porsche and a Rolls Royce
I want you to make it hurt when you dig into your pocket
Cause it makes me feel so good to watch my profits rocket"
(chorus from Send me your money, Mike Muir, Suicidal Tendencies)

it's a good change and the way ZOS should have offered Morrowind from the start, but ZOS needs to pick a sales model... I do wonder how this is going to affect Summerset purchases, not that we'll ever know.

Merlin13KAGL

They could at least have the courtesy to indicate what the prices for these would be, since they

"want everybody to enjoy everything Tamriel has to offer in The Elder Scrolls Online, and we believe that these changes best reflect what our players want from the game."

Korlian

Defilted wrote: »

Korlian wrote: »

Defilted wrote: »

How is this a bad thing? I pre-ordered Morrowind and I am in no way concerned with this change. The older something gets the cheaper it is. This is true on all kinds of products.

It's not a bad thing. What's bad is how they do it. Like to put Morrowind on sale 1 week before announcing it's going to be included in the base game in 1 month, what would you call that?

I call that a company selling their product. There are no guarantees in life. If you think something is going to be cheaper later then wait. If it is at a price point you think is acceptable, buy it. To live your life always regretting you could have got something cheaper later is going to drive you to drink.

Case in point, now that you know this is going to happen with Summerset are you going to wait until it is in the crown store next April and part of ESO+ or do you want it now and you are going to buy it? I chose now and I pre-ordered it, but this works for me and I do not care if it is part of the base game 6 months from now.

A company selling their product? Yeah they do, and they're also making a reputation of being dishonest doing it this way. That timing was not at all good. And even without the timing, if they've changed their mind about something and realised what they did earlier was bad, then make a PR statement about it. People would accept if they proved it was honest.

Case in point: I'm definately on the fence now (I was already on the fence about the next expansion even before this). Not only because of this, but because of my experience with how they sell their content over the years in general. It won't be free free, it will be cut into pieces and might even become more expensive in the end. Point is, they're business model is about confusing people. Just look at the DLC's or store items in general right now. Depending on your knowledge about their business model, one might get some things really cheap, or very expensive, at any given day. Basically, there are multiple prices for the same items, always, depending on how you aquire crowns, and/or ESO+.

When I see a price of something I expect that price to be the only one right here, right now, but it isnt. It's basically the same as if you went to your local grocery store to buy milk, you see the price, buy it and you're happy. Then later you learn that elsewhere in the same store (not another store), the same product was for half the cost, and maybe even later you learned that it might have been availabe at a third shelf for even cheaper, all at the same time! Not a good feeling.

Edit:
Various spellings.

Zinaroth

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

So I guess none of you guys that are complaining about this are going to buy Summerset - you'll just wait a year until you can play it for free right?

We are not complaining about "this" new practice but rather still complaining about the original treatment of Morrowind. This is how it should've been from day 1.

Because all other MMORPGs have free expansions, right?

When an expansion launches in WoW people celebrate and gladly pay for it knowing that it's new content and a chance to grow their characters and progress by collecting new gear and doing new dungeons etc.

When a chapter launches in ESO people whine and complain about the cost and if there's anything in it that could possibly allow for character growth (case in point; jewelry crafting) they say it's pay to win or that it's gating content behind a paywall - imagine what would happen if we had to COLLECT NEW GEAR AND GROW OUR CHARACTERS. What a terrible thought right?

Games grows stagnant because of self-entitled freebies who whines every time a CP increase on gear is mentioned because they think they should play a character for a month and then everything stay the same forever. These people do not understand what fuels an MMORPG; constant character growth - and not just in the forms of economy, alternative gear options or cosmetics.

Kiyakotari

Anyone notice that the text about the free Morrowind copies that come with the Summerset preorders has changed?

"[...]plus get a bonus copy of the Morrowind® Chapter for a limited time."

I don't remember that "limited time" clause being in there, before. Does that mean that they're now going to yank the Morrowind access from the Summerset preorders after a certain point?

Defilted

Korlian wrote: »

Defilted wrote: »

Korlian wrote: »

Defilted wrote: »

How is this a bad thing? I pre-ordered Morrowind and I am in no way concerned with this change. The older something gets the cheaper it is. This is true on all kinds of products.

It's not a bad thing. What's bad is how they do it. Like to put Morrowind on sale 1 week before announcing it's going to be included in the base game in 1 month, what would you call that?

I call that a company selling their product. There are no guarantees in life. If you think something is going to be cheaper later then wait. If it is at a price point you think is acceptable, buy it. To live your life always regretting you could have got something cheaper later is going to drive you to drink.

Case in point, now that you know this is going to happen with Summerset are you going to wait until it is in the crown store next April and part of ESO+ or do you want it now and you are going to buy it? I chose now and I pre-ordered it, but this works for me and I do not care if it is part of the base game 6 months from now.

A company selling their product? Yeah they do, and they're also making a reputation of being dishonest doing it this way. That timing was not at all good. And even without the timing, if they've changed their mind about something and realised what they did earlier was bad, then make a PR statement about it. People would accept if they proved it was honest.

Case in point: I'm definately on the fence now (I was already on the fence about the next expansion even before this). Not only because of this, but because of my experience with how they sell their content over the years in general. It won't be free free, it will be cut into pieces and might even become more expensive in the end. Point is, they're business model is about confusing people. Just look at the DLC's or store items in general right now. Depending on your knowledge about their business model, one might get some things really cheap, or very expensive, at any given day. Basically, there are multiple prices for the same items, always, depending on how you aquire crowns, and/or ESO+.

When I see a price of something I expect that price to be the only one right here, right now, but it isnt. It's basically the same as if you went to your local grocery store to buy milk, you see the price, buy it and you're happy. Then later you learn that elsewhere in the same store (not another store), the same product was for half the cost, and maybe even later you learned that it might have been availabe at a third shelf for even cheaper, all at the same time! Not a good feeling.

Edit:
Various spellings.

I have to disagree with the confusing price point statement. I have never had any issues personally. I also disagree that ZOS is doing something wrong. Consumer beware is a thing that my parents told me a long time ago. Always do your research before buying something and make sure you are OK with what it is you are getting for your money.

The price will always change. Just because it is a short window means nothing to me. You have to do what is best for you and I wish you all the luck in the future.

Turelus

Also let's be honest, it wouldn't be ZOS if they didn't alter the business model in some way each year.

(Sorry ZOS but it's kind of true).

Apache_Kid

Zinaroth wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

So I guess none of you guys that are complaining about this are going to buy Summerset - you'll just wait a year until you can play it for free right?

We are not complaining about "this" new practice but rather still complaining about the original treatment of Morrowind. This is how it should've been from day 1.

Because all other MMORPGs have free expansions, right?

When an expansion launches in WoW people celebrate and gladly pay for it knowing that it's new content and a chance to grow their characters and progress by collecting new gear and doing new dungeons etc.

When a chapter launches in ESO people whine and complain about the cost and if there's anything in it that could possibly allow for character growth (case in point; jewelry crafting) they say it's pay to win or that it's gating content behind a paywall - imagine what would happen if we had to COLLECT NEW GEAR AND GROW OUR CHARACTERS. What a terrible thought right?

Games grows stagnant because of self-entitled freebies who whines every time a CP increase on gear is mentioned because they think they should play a character for a month and then everything stay the same forever. These people do not understand what fuels an MMORPG; constant character growth - and not just in the forms of economy, alternative gear options or cosmetics.

First off the Morrowind chapter did the exact opposite of growing our characters. The sustain changes for morrowind nerfed every single character dramatically. Pretty much every single patch overall group DPS gets lowered. So until i see growth in my DPS instead of reductions after a patch we can't bring this up.

Secondly, a CP gear increase would be the worst possible change for this game. Because of the way the game scales enemies to the player, any stat increase in gear based on CP would be dirctly nullified by scaling. essentially, our characters would get instantly weaker overnight until we spent time repeating content we have already beaten 1000 times, 1000 more times, just to get new CP gear and be at the exact same level of strength we were before. This would be a terrible idea and would cause myself and many others to quit the game. Farming gear is the WORST part of ESO and I will not repeat it again for 13 characters now way no how.

Now, finally, on to what the thread is actually about, I'm not complaining about having to pay for content. I'm complaining that they decided on a system to distribute DLC, and then design one DLC that is an EXCEPTION to the system they have had for a long time. It was dishonest. What they are doing now is a good thing but it still highlights that the original practice of these chapters is not what we were promised in terms of distribution of DLC as ESO plus subscribers.

Korlian

Defilted wrote: »

Korlian wrote: »

Defilted wrote: »

Korlian wrote: »

Defilted wrote: »

How is this a bad thing? I pre-ordered Morrowind and I am in no way concerned with this change. The older something gets the cheaper it is. This is true on all kinds of products.

It's not a bad thing. What's bad is how they do it. Like to put Morrowind on sale 1 week before announcing it's going to be included in the base game in 1 month, what would you call that?

I call that a company selling their product. There are no guarantees in life. If you think something is going to be cheaper later then wait. If it is at a price point you think is acceptable, buy it. To live your life always regretting you could have got something cheaper later is going to drive you to drink.

Case in point, now that you know this is going to happen with Summerset are you going to wait until it is in the crown store next April and part of ESO+ or do you want it now and you are going to buy it? I chose now and I pre-ordered it, but this works for me and I do not care if it is part of the base game 6 months from now.

A company selling their product? Yeah they do, and they're also making a reputation of being dishonest doing it this way. That timing was not at all good. And even without the timing, if they've changed their mind about something and realised what they did earlier was bad, then make a PR statement about it. People would accept if they proved it was honest.

Case in point: I'm definately on the fence now (I was already on the fence about the next expansion even before this). Not only because of this, but because of my experience with how they sell their content over the years in general. It won't be free free, it will be cut into pieces and might even become more expensive in the end. Point is, they're business model is about confusing people. Just look at the DLC's or store items in general right now. Depending on your knowledge about their business model, one might get some things really cheap, or very expensive, at any given day. Basically, there are multiple prices for the same items, always, depending on how you aquire crowns, and/or ESO+.

When I see a price of something I expect that price to be the only one right here, right now, but it isnt. It's basically the same as if you went to your local grocery store to buy milk, you see the price, buy it and you're happy. Then later you learn that elsewhere in the same store (not another store), the same product was for half the cost, and maybe even later you learned that it might have been availabe at a third shelf for even cheaper, all at the same time! Not a good feeling.

Edit:
Various spellings.

I have to disagree with the confusing price point statement. I have never had any issues personally. I also disagree that ZOS is doing something wrong. Consumer beware is a thing that my parents told me a long time ago. Always do your research before buying something and make sure you are OK with what it is you are getting for your money.

The price will always change. Just because it is a short window means nothing to me. You have to do what is best for you and I wish you all the luck in the future.

Nothing wrong in prices changing, that's not what this is about.

NoTimeToWait

Kiyakotari wrote: »

Anyone notice that the text about the free Morrowind copies that come with the Summerset preorders has changed?

"[...]plus get a bonus copy of the Morrowind® Chapter for a limited time."

I don't remember that "limited time" clause being in there, before. Does that mean that they're now going to yank the Morrowind access from the Summerset preorders after a certain point?

It was there from the beginning. And it was discussed in a thread (can't find the link). The consensus was that the offer itself is limited in time and after a certain point ZOS won't provide Summerset buyers with a free copy

Zinaroth

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

So I guess none of you guys that are complaining about this are going to buy Summerset - you'll just wait a year until you can play it for free right?

We are not complaining about "this" new practice but rather still complaining about the original treatment of Morrowind. This is how it should've been from day 1.

Because all other MMORPGs have free expansions, right?

When an expansion launches in WoW people celebrate and gladly pay for it knowing that it's new content and a chance to grow their characters and progress by collecting new gear and doing new dungeons etc.

When a chapter launches in ESO people whine and complain about the cost and if there's anything in it that could possibly allow for character growth (case in point; jewelry crafting) they say it's pay to win or that it's gating content behind a paywall - imagine what would happen if we had to COLLECT NEW GEAR AND GROW OUR CHARACTERS. What a terrible thought right?

Games grows stagnant because of self-entitled freebies who whines every time a CP increase on gear is mentioned because they think they should play a character for a month and then everything stay the same forever. These people do not understand what fuels an MMORPG; constant character growth - and not just in the forms of economy, alternative gear options or cosmetics.

Farming gear is the WORST part of ESO and I will not repeat it again for 13 characters now way no how.

Enemies scale with player level btw. and are balanced around the player having 300 CP - they don't scale with the power level on gear.

Imagine if people said that in WoW and that they would never again increase level cap or introduce new raid tiers with gear with higher item level? This is pretty much what is happening in ESO now because of people who QQ every time there's a little bit of work tied to character growth.

It's a self-entitled freebie mentality and it is hurting the game.

VaranisArano

Caleb_Kadesh wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Wow. Just. Wow.
I mean, yeah, I wasn't going to wait an entire year to play Morrowind and Battlegrounds, but this really shows the truth we already knew: that this "Chapter" stuff was just a blatant money grab.

I have always been confused by this attitude. Is it not clear that ZOS is running a business? If they can't make a profit then there is no reason to be in business.

How do you pay for rent/mortgage, food, transportation etc.? What "money grab" do you employ?

The money grab is that they should have released these as DLC from the beginning. Morrowind was always several DLC bundled together. But that would have meant giving the content to ESO+ members for free. Instead ZOS bundled it as a "Chapter" and charged real money.

Apache_Kid

Zinaroth wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Zinaroth wrote: »

So I guess none of you guys that are complaining about this are going to buy Summerset - you'll just wait a year until you can play it for free right?

We are not complaining about "this" new practice but rather still complaining about the original treatment of Morrowind. This is how it should've been from day 1.

Because all other MMORPGs have free expansions, right?

When an expansion launches in WoW people celebrate and gladly pay for it knowing that it's new content and a chance to grow their characters and progress by collecting new gear and doing new dungeons etc.

When a chapter launches in ESO people whine and complain about the cost and if there's anything in it that could possibly allow for character growth (case in point; jewelry crafting) they say it's pay to win or that it's gating content behind a paywall - imagine what would happen if we had to COLLECT NEW GEAR AND GROW OUR CHARACTERS. What a terrible thought right?

Games grows stagnant because of self-entitled freebies who whines every time a CP increase on gear is mentioned because they think they should play a character for a month and then everything stay the same forever. These people do not understand what fuels an MMORPG; constant character growth - and not just in the forms of economy, alternative gear options or cosmetics.

Farming gear is the WORST part of ESO and I will not repeat it again for 13 characters now way no how.

Enemies scale with player level btw. and are balanced around the player having 300 CP - they don't scale with the power level on gear.

Imagine if people said that in WoW and that they would never again increase level cap or introduce new raid tiers with gear with higher item level? This is pretty much what is happening in ESO now because of people who QQ every time there's a little bit of work tied to character growth.

It's a self-entitled freebie mentality and it is hurting the game.

If gear cap was raised to 200 then the enemies would get stronger and scale with us. It has been like this since One Tam and has been discussed to death on here 1001 times idk how you missed it.

Furthermore more this game allows for anything but a freebie mentality. I spend an unbelievable amount of time every week doing busy work on this game, Crafting, surveys, master writs, switching through characters for horse training, getting undaunted and mages guild maxed out, FARMING GEAR, etc.

There is still content in this game I have not been able to beat. Still need skin and personality from new dungeon and some vet trial completions. This will all take lots and lots of time.

Know what I don't have time for? Re-farming the same gear I already have that will only bring be back to the level I was at before they would've made the moronic decision to increase the cap.

That's literally the worst idea anyone has ever had for this game, to increase the gear cap. Keep that nonsense out of here.

QuebraRegra

WARDEN needs some work (MAG in particular) IMHO.

Kiyakotari

NoTimeToWait wrote: »

Kiyakotari wrote: »

Anyone notice that the text about the free Morrowind copies that come with the Summerset preorders has changed?

"[...]plus get a bonus copy of the Morrowind® Chapter for a limited time."

I don't remember that "limited time" clause being in there, before. Does that mean that they're now going to yank the Morrowind access from the Summerset preorders after a certain point?

It was there from the beginning. And it was discussed in a thread (can't find the link). The consensus was that the offer itself is limited in time and after a certain point ZOS won't provide Summerset buyers with a free copy

Thank you for the clarification, I must have just skipped over it. Since I already have Morrowind, it doesn't really apply to me, anyhow.

Juju_beans

VaranisArano wrote: »

Juju_beans wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Juju_beans wrote: »

it's good business sense...roll the previous expansion into the base.
This way brand new players to the game only have to buy the base + current expansion to play.

This is how other MMO's do it.

Other MMO's didn't have a set system about how they classify and release DLC, make an exception to that system for a quick cash grab, and then re-integrate the exception back into the old system.

I've never seen anything like this.

If you think you are being cheated then don't buy new chapters. Within a year they'll get integrated into the base and then you'll have your "free game".

Example: Wow is 14 years old. How much do you think it would cost you if you wanted to play today and they hadn't put all their expansions into the base ?

Base + current expansion keeps the game cost down to attract new players.

I'm not concerned with being cheated, because I would have bought the pre-order anyway.

I am concerned that ZOS thinks its acceptable to label content as a "Chapter", charge money for it, then re-release at as the DLC they obviously were, as if we can't see what they are doing.

The lack of transparency and the blatancy of the cash grab are a bad look for ZOS.

Morrowind is becoming part of the base, not a separate DLC.

WOW is also pre-releasing their next expansion. And their current expansion (Legion) is becoming part of the base.
And with wow you must subscribe just to access the servers.

MMO's do this.

Danikat

I am SO glad I don't subscribe to this game right now.

I pre-ordered the collectors edition of Morrowind and I have no regrets. I wanted Vvardenfell and the warden class and since I don't subscribe I have to buy all the DLC anyway so it didn't matter to me that they were bundling it together under a different name.

But even at the time I thought it was a bad deal for subscribers and this just makes it worse. Yes ok, everyone who bought Morrowind got a year (or however long) extra to play it and for some people that might be a fair deal, but paying the full price of an expansion (about the same as a full game) for essentially a year of 'early access' to something you'd eventually get included in your subscription doesn't seem like a good deal to me.

I have to admit I do think opening Battlegrounds up to everyone is a sensible decision. It probably should have been a base-game addition right from the beginning. The main complaint I've heard from people who play it is that there's not enough people playing and it needs to be available to more people.

And as I said for me, and probably a lot of other people, it doesn't make much difference that you can now buy Vvardenfell and the Warden class separately because I'd have bought both anyway.

But yeah, sucks if you're a subscriber. You all need to stop telling people the craft bag on it's own justifies the cost of the subscription and once you've gotten used to having it you won't stop subbing regardless of the other benefits (or lack thereof) - ZOS are taking you at your word.

VaranisArano

Juju_beans wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Juju_beans wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Juju_beans wrote: »

it's good business sense...roll the previous expansion into the base.
This way brand new players to the game only have to buy the base + current expansion to play.

This is how other MMO's do it.

Other MMO's didn't have a set system about how they classify and release DLC, make an exception to that system for a quick cash grab, and then re-integrate the exception back into the old system.

I've never seen anything like this.

If you think you are being cheated then don't buy new chapters. Within a year they'll get integrated into the base and then you'll have your "free game".

Example: Wow is 14 years old. How much do you think it would cost you if you wanted to play today and they hadn't put all their expansions into the base ?

Base + current expansion keeps the game cost down to attract new players.

I'm not concerned with being cheated, because I would have bought the pre-order anyway.

I am concerned that ZOS thinks its acceptable to label content as a "Chapter", charge money for it, then re-release at as the DLC they obviously were, as if we can't see what they are doing.

The lack of transparency and the blatancy of the cash grab are a bad look for ZOS.

Morrowind is becoming part of the base, not a separate DLC.

WOW is also pre-releasing their next expansion. And their current expansion (Legion) is becoming part of the base.
And with wow you must subscribe just to access the servers.

MMO's do this.

I think you misunderstood the article. As I read it, Morrowind is becoming available for Crowns or accessible to ESO+. AKA its becoming a DLC

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/26355?Coming-Soon:-Battlegrounds-for-All-&-Morrowind-Moving-to-Crown-Store-&-ESO-Plus!

Juju_beans

VaranisArano wrote: »

Juju_beans wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Juju_beans wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Juju_beans wrote: »

it's good business sense...roll the previous expansion into the base.
This way brand new players to the game only have to buy the base + current expansion to play.

This is how other MMO's do it.

Other MMO's didn't have a set system about how they classify and release DLC, make an exception to that system for a quick cash grab, and then re-integrate the exception back into the old system.

I've never seen anything like this.

If you think you are being cheated then don't buy new chapters. Within a year they'll get integrated into the base and then you'll have your "free game".

Example: Wow is 14 years old. How much do you think it would cost you if you wanted to play today and they hadn't put all their expansions into the base ?

Base + current expansion keeps the game cost down to attract new players.

I'm not concerned with being cheated, because I would have bought the pre-order anyway.

I am concerned that ZOS thinks its acceptable to label content as a "Chapter", charge money for it, then re-release at as the DLC they obviously were, as if we can't see what they are doing.

The lack of transparency and the blatancy of the cash grab are a bad look for ZOS.

Morrowind is becoming part of the base, not a separate DLC.

WOW is also pre-releasing their next expansion. And their current expansion (Legion) is becoming part of the base.
And with wow you must subscribe just to access the servers.

MMO's do this.

I think you misunderstood the article. As I read it, Morrowind is becoming available for Crowns or accessible to ESO+. AKA its becoming a DLC

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/26355?Coming-Soon:-Battlegrounds-for-All-&-Morrowind-Moving-to-Crown-Store-&-ESO-Plus!

Morrowind is becoming part of the base. If you are ESO+ and didn't get Morrowind then you get if for free via it becoming an DLC. That means ESO+ subscribers that didn't buy Morrowind don't have to buy any upgrades.
New players that buy the new "Elder Scrolls Online" game will get Morrowind as part of the base game.
Existing players that don't have Morrowind get it for free (ESO+) or can buy with crowns (no ESO+).

From the news announcement:

https://www.elderscrollsonline.com/en-us/news/post/26355
This means that moving forward, if you purchase this new base game—The Elder Scrolls Online, not The Elder Scrolls Online: Tamriel Unlimited—it will include the Morrowind Chapter.
..
Soon, the Morrowind zone and story content will be available for purchase in the Crown Store and be accessible to all ESO Plus members

VaranisArano

Maybe I'm misunderstanding that but it still soubds to me like new players have to buy it for crowns. If it were becoming part of the base, why would ZOS need to give it as part of ESO+ or have a crown option?

Is that just for players who have the game but didn't own Morrowind, so they have to pay for it like a DLC but new players don't?


Edited: I guess, upon re-reading:
New Players who buy the game will get Morrowind as part of the whole package.
Players who have the base game but not Morrowind Chapter will get Battlegrounds as a base game update, the option to buy Morrowind (zone) as a DLC for Crowns, and the option to buy the Warden class as an Upgrade.
ESO+ Players who have the base game but not Morrowind will get Battlegrounds as a base game update, the option to buy the Warden class as an Upgrade, and Morrowind (zone) as a DLC.

So to my way of thinking, ZOS made ESO+ members who bought Morrowind Chapter pay for a DLC Morrowind (zone) by bundling it with Battlegrounds and Wardens. If Morrowind (zone) is a DLC now, it was a DLC then. ZOS knew that and bundled it with Battlegrounds and Wardens to make ESO+ members pay for it instead of giving it to ESO+ members free like the subscription benefits should have allowed.

If ZOS had just changed the terms then or explained this "hey, we're going to bundle it now and make it a DLC a year later so you are paying for early access" plan then, nobody would complain about it now. Its obviously a healthy move for the game. Instead, ZOS pulled a "pray we don't alter the deal any further" a year later, after they'd soaked ESO+ members for the price of Morrowind (zone) DLC by bundling it. That's my problem with it: its a healthy move for the game, but changing whether or not a zone counts as a "DLC" when its not bundled with others in a "Chapter" is a transparent way to get around the agreement to give ESO+ subscribers free access to DLC.

Or as simply as I can put it, if Morrowind (zone) is a DLC for the purposes of ESO+ subscribers who already own the game now, then Morrowind (zone) was always a DLC for ESO+ subscribers who already own the game. ZOS should have given them free access to the Morrowind (zone) DLC from the beginning. Or ZOS should have been upfront that Morrowind Chapter was eventually going to be broken up and sold as separate components, allowing ESO+ subscribers to accurately decide whether they wanted to wait or buy in order to receive the Morrowind (zone) DLC their subscription benefits entitle them to.