Graphics improvements for ESO

MopeyHat

This game has been released almost four years now, and I've been wondering...when will it get some of the graphics love it deserves?

Because obviously this game has some amazing places to visit. Great vistas, an amazing world that's (mostly) only ruined by one thing...

The god.
Awful.
Fog.

It's my understanding that ESO is more of a CPU hog than a GPU one, anyway. Let us crank it up and show off the amazing world you devs create. Especially with the next chapter coming up! I wanna be able to see the Crystal Tower the way it was meant to be

I've discovered only one third-party way to get rid of the fog thus far, and it requires a separate launcher, isn't well maintained (you can't use it while you have the PTS installed, for instance) and I'm not really comfortable running it. Can we please get a better way?

SisterGoat

They need to update the game engine and API, but that's actually really expensive and much harder to do than you think.

makreth

I like the graphics and the areas. I am using reshade though so it does look a bit different. It's an mmo after all it can't be that "heavy" can it?

MopeyHat

SisterGoat wrote: »

They need to update the game engine and API, but that's actually really expensive and much harder to do than you think.

I'm not sure how that's "expensive" other than the labor required. It's a custom engine afaik.

Tandor

Which platform are you playing on, and if PC what graphics card and settings are you using?

Ragnarok0130

MopeyHat wrote: »

SisterGoat wrote: »

They need to update the game engine and API, but that's actually really expensive and much harder to do than you think.

I'm not sure how that's "expensive" other than the labor required. It's a custom engine afaik.

It has to be budgeted for and resourced allocated so if it's not in their current build plan for the next year or two it's extra and hence expensive.

MopeyHat

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

MopeyHat wrote: »

SisterGoat wrote: »

They need to update the game engine and API, but that's actually really expensive and much harder to do than you think.

I'm not sure how that's "expensive" other than the labor required. It's a custom engine afaik.

It has to be budgeted for and resourced allocated so if it's not in their current build plan for the next year or two it's extra and hence expensive.

Just like every other change or feature anyone else has ever asked for. Wow. Shocker?

Iccotak

Its not just graphics, its also just the use of assets.

the vanilla base game zones need an overhaul.
The Dungeons and the DLC have more thought, effort, time, and resources put into them.

If you go back and watch advertisements for ESO from 2013-2014. They almost entirely show off the dungeons because they know that the dungeons were some of their best work.
So they need to take the amount of effort that they put into the dungeons, and DLCs, and put them into the vanilla zones.

The art direction that they shifted to should be applied to the base game.
Look at the vanilla motifs. IMO They are bland, generic, and uninspired.
Places like Falkreath Hold and Selene's Web actually feel like forests rather than empty plains with some trees spotting the landscape.
The rocks in Vvardenfel and other DLCs are far superior to the ones we see in the base game. The DLCs actually take environment and tone into account when world building and creating assets.

For example: why do almost all the zones, save for CWC, use the same skybox? The sky in Morrowind in comparison to Skyrim should look different. They have totally different climates.

Here is a shot from an early trailer showing a red sky. Have you ever seen that in the game?


here are vaious shots of base game zones.

Here are shots of DLCs and Dungeons

deano469

I think the game looks great, just the way it is.

Love the art direction in all the zones.

Venom4You

A little tip for all Nvidia users out there to make your game look much better without killing your fps:
Nvidia recently added „Nvidia Freestyle“ feature to their operating app „GeForce Experience“. It allows you to completely reshade eso (similiar to third party mod sweetfx). It is currently in beta stage (turn beta stage on in your GeForce Experience settings) but I already managed to achieve wonderful improvements to colors, contrast and depth of field - Its awesome and unlike using sweetfx I didn‘t see an impact on my fps!
Enjoy guys! You are welcome

Tasear

You can change a couple things in use setting for maximum look and get a reshader.

LordSemaj

MopeyHat wrote: »

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

MopeyHat wrote: »

SisterGoat wrote: »

They need to update the game engine and API, but that's actually really expensive and much harder to do than you think.

I'm not sure how that's "expensive" other than the labor required. It's a custom engine afaik.

It has to be budgeted for and resourced allocated so if it's not in their current build plan for the next year or two it's extra and hence expensive.

Just like every other change or feature anyone else has ever asked for. Wow. Shocker?

Those other features are bringing in the money. They're spending money developing DLC or adding shop material because those are what bring in the income. Why do you think bugs take so long to fix? It's because any competent development team knows there is a functionally infinite number of bugs to fix. The bug list grows and grows, people report the same bug multiple times, a bug they reported was already fixed, something isn't actually a bug and someone was just being stupid, and new content breaks stuff all the time. The bug fixers already have enough work to functionally stay busy forever as more bugs will always be added to the pile. They'll never catch up to them. That's why they give bug fixes priorities and only work on the ones that are most important first while fixing bugs that barely affect the game when they are easy fixes, when they discover the solution fixing something else, or when they just finally get a free chance to look at the low priority list (which is always huge).

If you're willing to pay for a coder to update the game engine, send a check and letter to Zenimax Online. Otherwise they budget according to what they deem to be a priority fix and allocate their programmers to new stuff over bug fixing or engine swaps or anything that eats into the programming budget. Sometimes the fix is also beyond what some coding noob can handle and it has to be passed on to the master programmer. His time is valuable and can't be wasted, certainly not on swapping engines when we want him working on more important stuff. Look at every other MMO, most of them are still running the same archaic engines they launched on. A few updated and switched to a newer one but that was after many years of being out and milking tons of money from the fanbase first. ESO has only been around for almost four.

Heck, this is not even an original concept, updating engines has been talked about in MMOs for decades. Yet very few have ever done it, even the ones supposedly making more money than everyone else.

https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20752408150

SisterGoat

MopeyHat wrote: »

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

MopeyHat wrote: »

SisterGoat wrote: »

They need to update the game engine and API, but that's actually really expensive and much harder to do than you think.

I'm not sure how that's "expensive" other than the labor required. It's a custom engine afaik.

It has to be budgeted for and resourced allocated so if it's not in their current build plan for the next year or two it's extra and hence expensive.

Just like every other change or feature anyone else has ever asked for. Wow. Shocker?

Hence the statement "harder than you think". Because you just assume it should be easy, when you don't know anything about how they coded the engine, how many coders they have, how much they get paid, and how many hours it will take them to recode it.

LordSemaj

SisterGoat wrote: »

MopeyHat wrote: »

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

MopeyHat wrote: »

SisterGoat wrote: »

They need to update the game engine and API, but that's actually really expensive and much harder to do than you think.

I'm not sure how that's "expensive" other than the labor required. It's a custom engine afaik.

It has to be budgeted for and resourced allocated so if it's not in their current build plan for the next year or two it's extra and hence expensive.

Just like every other change or feature anyone else has ever asked for. Wow. Shocker?

Hence the statement "harder than you think". Because you just assume it should be easy, when you don't know anything about how they coded the engine, how many coders they have, how much they get paid, and how many hours it will take them to recode it.

Yeah. Often when people without knowledge talk about updating a game engine they really mean the graphics. They say it because they don't like how it looks or performs or both. It will sooner lead to MORE graphic anomalies and MORE performance issues than resolving the original complaint in the first place. The Repopulation is an MMO in development that was forced to switch engines when Hero engine bombed on them. It's taken over a year of the game being in complete offline mode with them working solely on getting the game back up and running again to where it was originally. And it still has bugs to iron out due to the new engine, which is Unreal and already a fine engine on its own.

MopeyHat

SisterGoat wrote: »

MopeyHat wrote: »

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

MopeyHat wrote: »

SisterGoat wrote: »

They need to update the game engine and API, but that's actually really expensive and much harder to do than you think.

I'm not sure how that's "expensive" other than the labor required. It's a custom engine afaik.

It has to be budgeted for and resourced allocated so if it's not in their current build plan for the next year or two it's extra and hence expensive.

Just like every other change or feature anyone else has ever asked for. Wow. Shocker?

Hence the statement "harder than you think". Because you just assume it should be easy, when you don't know anything about how they coded the engine, how many coders they have, how much they get paid, and how many hours it will take them to recode it.

I assume? Where did I say that? Can you point that out to me, please? Oh, wait, no, I didn't assume. You did.

I'm not saying it's easy. I'm saying I want it. I like this game, I pay my sub, and I'd love for the game to look better.

Just like the people I write code for want one feature this way, this feature that way, but they can't have everything because I only have so much time in my day and so many tools at my disposal. Yes, I know how that works.

The trick is, I also know how valuable feedback and customer opinion is. My opinion is I think the game would look way better without distant fog covering up the cool landmarks everywhere.

(You're really going to try to invalidate my opinion on a game's aesthetics? K.)

danno8

MopeyHat wrote: »

This game has been released almost four years now, and I've been wondering...when will it get some of the graphics love it deserves?

Because obviously this game has some amazing places to visit. Great vistas, an amazing world that's (mostly) only ruined by one thing...

The god.
Awful.
Fog.

It's my understanding that ESO is more of a CPU hog than a GPU one, anyway. Let us crank it up and show off the amazing world you devs create. Especially with the next chapter coming up! I wanna be able to see the Crystal Tower the way it was meant to be

I've discovered only one third-party way to get rid of the fog thus far, and it requires a separate launcher, isn't well maintained (you can't use it while you have the PTS installed, for instance) and I'm not really comfortable running it. Can we please get a better way?

If you are talking about Hook64, it is very well maintained. Sorien updates it after every major release and it is usually only outdated for a couple of days tops.

Also, it works fine with the PTS installed. It might not work on the PTS but the live version will still work just fine even if the PTS is installed.

edit: I forgot, yes I agree. The fog should be pushed back much further than it currently is. Like several hundred meters.

SisterGoat

MopeyHat wrote: »

SisterGoat wrote: »

MopeyHat wrote: »

Ragnarok0130 wrote: »

MopeyHat wrote: »

SisterGoat wrote: »

They need to update the game engine and API, but that's actually really expensive and much harder to do than you think.

I'm not sure how that's "expensive" other than the labor required. It's a custom engine afaik.

It has to be budgeted for and resourced allocated so if it's not in their current build plan for the next year or two it's extra and hence expensive.

Just like every other change or feature anyone else has ever asked for. Wow. Shocker?

Hence the statement "harder than you think". Because you just assume it should be easy, when you don't know anything about how they coded the engine, how many coders they have, how much they get paid, and how many hours it will take them to recode it.

I assume? Where did I say that? Can you point that out to me, please? Oh, wait, no, I didn't assume. You did.

I'm not saying it's easy. I'm saying I want it. I like this game, I pay my sub, and I'd love for the game to look better.

Just like the people I write code for want one feature this way, this feature that way, but they can't have everything because I only have so much time in my day and so many tools at my disposal. Yes, I know how that works.

The trick is, I also know how valuable feedback and customer opinion is. My opinion is I think the game would look way better without distant fog covering up the cool landmarks everywhere.

(You're really going to try to invalidate my opinion on a game's aesthetics? K.)

You're actually just being really defensive now.

MopeyHat

danno8 wrote: »

MopeyHat wrote: »

This game has been released almost four years now, and I've been wondering...when will it get some of the graphics love it deserves?

Because obviously this game has some amazing places to visit. Great vistas, an amazing world that's (mostly) only ruined by one thing...

The god.
Awful.
Fog.

It's my understanding that ESO is more of a CPU hog than a GPU one, anyway. Let us crank it up and show off the amazing world you devs create. Especially with the next chapter coming up! I wanna be able to see the Crystal Tower the way it was meant to be

I've discovered only one third-party way to get rid of the fog thus far, and it requires a separate launcher, isn't well maintained (you can't use it while you have the PTS installed, for instance) and I'm not really comfortable running it. Can we please get a better way?

If you are talking about Hook64, it is very well maintained. Sorien updates it after every major release and it is usually only outdated for a couple of days tops.

Also, it works fine with the PTS installed. It might not work on the PTS but the live version will still work just fine even if the PTS is installed.

edit: I forgot, yes I agree. The fog should be pushed back much further than it currently is. Like several hundred meters.

Thanks for the note. I was inspired to write this because I tried it yesterday and it auto selected the PTS directory with no option to change it that I could discern. I'm also not really comfortable using something that's used to exploit, even if it doesn't have any for ESO.

danno8

MopeyHat wrote: »

danno8 wrote: »

MopeyHat wrote: »

This game has been released almost four years now, and I've been wondering...when will it get some of the graphics love it deserves?

Because obviously this game has some amazing places to visit. Great vistas, an amazing world that's (mostly) only ruined by one thing...

The god.
Awful.
Fog.

It's my understanding that ESO is more of a CPU hog than a GPU one, anyway. Let us crank it up and show off the amazing world you devs create. Especially with the next chapter coming up! I wanna be able to see the Crystal Tower the way it was meant to be

I've discovered only one third-party way to get rid of the fog thus far, and it requires a separate launcher, isn't well maintained (you can't use it while you have the PTS installed, for instance) and I'm not really comfortable running it. Can we please get a better way?

If you are talking about Hook64, it is very well maintained. Sorien updates it after every major release and it is usually only outdated for a couple of days tops.

Also, it works fine with the PTS installed. It might not work on the PTS but the live version will still work just fine even if the PTS is installed.

edit: I forgot, yes I agree. The fog should be pushed back much further than it currently is. Like several hundred meters.

Thanks for the note. I was inspired to write this because I tried it yesterday and it auto selected the PTS directory with no option to change it that I could discern. I'm also not really comfortable using something that's used to exploit, even if it doesn't have any for ESO.

Oh yah, I would far rather just have a fog slider along with better distant detail (the main reason why the fog is so darn thick is to cover up really low quality distant texture assets).

I can see why they would lock that down on consoles, but on PC it should exist.

xenowarrior92eb17_ESO

would love if they change engine and API so pretty sure the game would work much smoother...but at this point I just wish they increase the view range by removing that damn fog which blocks view farther than 50 meters forward...we are loosing awesome sightseeing cuz of it and no don't give me the hook64 thing that's bad for ur eyes since if u remove it u get low res textures that on short/long term will damage ur eyes.

FleetwoodSmack

I just wish they'd just fix the game. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

fosokles

More like fix the lag maybe. Graphics are okay there are better games out there.

Azphira

I'd like to get more than 45fps because the game is only using 4% cpu, 2% gpu1, 40% gpu2.

Sav72

They need to Fix Lag first....

Mettaricana

Id be happy if the older armors would get an update theres still shields and hip plates on heavy made of paper.

And shields still not being held in hand

Lackluster dead facial expressions for npcs no matter how dire the situation

Tone back like 90% of all skill effects so trials dont look like a light show on 4th of july.

Update zones and fauna etc to atleast look like grass rather than pixels floating above ground.

More weather variety would be nice.

Vampires

Weapon and skill contradictions like vanishing weapons to use biting jabs

LordSemaj

Azphira wrote: »

I'd like to get more than 45fps because the game is only using 4% cpu, 2% gpu1, 40% gpu2.

If you're not even using your cpu or gpu and you're getting low frames, you're probably texture swapping from virtual memory. Check your windows settings, upgrade your hard drive to faster SSD, or check your drivers. It's possible to get 100 fps with everything on ultra.

Stinkyremy

MopeyHat wrote: »

SisterGoat wrote: »

They need to update the game engine and API, but that's actually really expensive and much harder to do than you think.

I'm not sure how that's "expensive" other than the labor required. It's a custom engine afaik.

It's havok engine, it says so as you boot up the game

Faulgor

I'm fine with the fog. I think in most places it actually adds to the atmosphere. But Morrowind's my favourite TES game, so ...

They will also most likely never redo the old zones, sadly. It's just not worth the effort if they could do new content instead which they can sell as DLC or a chapter.

But if there's one zone that should be overhauled it's Cyrodiil. It's pretty obvious that it was the first one they did, as it looks pretty terrible even in comparison to the PvE base zones, and it is basically an end-game zone where people spend a lot of time. Just compare Bruma, Chorrol and Cheydinhal to Anvil or Kvatch.

Another thing they could address feasibly is to improve the skybox. More weather effects and better sky/cloud textures would go a long way to improve the base zones without drastically altering them.

The third thing they could work on, and they occasionally did this, is to update assets in older zones once new zones improved upon them. For example, they could replace the Ordinator armors in Deshaan with the Militant Ordinator style from Vvardenfell.

Rohamad_Ali

SisterGoat wrote: »

They need to update the game engine and API, but that's actually really expensive and much harder to do than you think.

Like super bowl ad video expensive ?

Azphira

LordSemaj wrote: »

Azphira wrote: »

I'd like to get more than 45fps because the game is only using 4% cpu, 2% gpu1, 40% gpu2.

If you're not even using your cpu or gpu and you're getting low frames, you're probably texture swapping from virtual memory. Check your windows settings, upgrade your hard drive to faster SSD, or check your drivers. It's possible to get 100 fps with everything on ultra.

7960x, 32gb, 2tb nvme, 1080 sli. The other 3000 games says it's an ESO issue.

xenowarrior92eb17_ESO

Azphira wrote: »

LordSemaj wrote: »

Azphira wrote: »

I'd like to get more than 45fps because the game is only using 4% cpu, 2% gpu1, 40% gpu2.

If you're not even using your cpu or gpu and you're getting low frames, you're probably texture swapping from virtual memory. Check your windows settings, upgrade your hard drive to faster SSD, or check your drivers. It's possible to get 100 fps with everything on ultra.

7960x, 32gb, 2tb nvme, 1080 sli. The other 3000 games says it's an ESO issue.

I am so sick of people who fail to comprehend that this game should be ran on nuclear reactors without an issue yet they come in and give stupid comments like "update ur drivers or get an ssd"...