Shall we relax dungeon roles during the dungeon event? A referendum on a moratorium

Jim_Pipp

Normally I think people who use the random dungeon finder should play the role they have chosen (tank, healer or damage dealer). With the dungeon event almost here there are two things that make me wonder if we would all be better off if we all choose all three roles.


You only get the crown store rewards if you kill every boss- so if you join a group later on you will have wasted time queuing. Kicking people out for not playing the role they pre-selected means that there replacement may not get the reward.

Queue times will be awful, especially for people who want to take multiple dps characters through. If everyone chooses all three roles then the time spent waiting will be the same for everyone and queue jumpers will not be rewarded.

Whatever the majority of people choose should be the rule we all agree to follow during the event.

vovus69

man, this is one crate per day per char - who cares.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Other

If you select multiple roles, you had better be able to perform multiple roles or you are a pretty worthless member of the community.

I have a better idea. Give double rewards to healers and tanks. That will speed up queue times, considering most good tanks and healers wont touch groupfinder with a 10 foot pole.

josiahva

Other

I have a toon that queues as all roles...the difference being that that toon can handle the requirements of any of the roles by swapping equipment and skills. DO NOT QUEUE AS A ROLE UNLESS YOU CAN COMPETENTLY FILL THE ROLE. There is nothing wrong with queuing as multiple roles if you can reasonably do the job, there is a huge problem if you can not.

Icy_Waffles

Question: does it matter if you do vet or normal dungeons? Is there a difference in reward?

Jim_Pipp

It is OK to choose three roles bit only in normal dungeons

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

If you select multiple roles, you had better be able to perform multiple roles or you are a pretty worthless member of the community.

I really wish I could edit the poll because I think this will be a popular opinion, and it would certainly be my preferred option

zaria

It is not OK to choose multiple roles in the random dungeon finder

If you can solo any normal dungeon comfortable go ahead.
If not select an rolle.
Any magic build can heal well enough, tanking require an taunt and surviving the boss. yes if you also debuff the boss the fight would be faster,

Note as healer and tank queues are shorter its no point selecting DD if you select healer or tank.
You just take up space for an DD, you get instant queue for a dungeon, you then get put in front of queue because some refuse (I think its rather is bugs as its far to common) now game build an new group and you go in as DD even if you could also heal or tank so some DD has to wait.

Loc2262

It is not OK to choose multiple roles in the random dungeon finder

You only choose the roles you can fulfill properly, otherwise you don't use the group finder. End of story.

jaws343

It is OK to choose three roles bit only in normal dungeons

For normal dungeons I really do not care. I won't be doing it personally, but I can self sustain on any of my DPS, so it won't bother me at all if others do. And if I get lucky and end up in a group of 4 true DPS, the dungeon will go a lot faster.

Alchemical

It is not OK to choose multiple roles in the random dungeon finder

NO. DO NOT MAKE ME CLEAN UP AFTER GROUPS WITH NO REAL TANK. THERE ARE ENOUGH ALREADY WHO CAN'T CLEAR BASIC DUNGEONS BECAUSE THEY WILL NOT CONTROL ADDS.

Dapper Dinosaur

It is OK to choose three roles bit only in normal dungeons

I could take my magicka Nightblade into literally any normal dungeon aside from maybe blackheart haven queued as a healer, and then just tell me tank to not bother taunting the bosses because I'm going to do it, mitigating all potential damage to anyone else, and keep my life bar capped off at full the whole time so both me and the other two dps can hammer the dungeon out in less than 15 minutes.

If someone has a problem with that, they're more than welcome to try initiating a kick for me, which will fail every time, because intelligent people will be appreciating the speed-carry through the event.

CyborgPlatypus

It is OK to choose three roles bit only in normal dungeons

In normal non-dlc I couldn't care less. I play a healer so my queue is quick. I don't usually bother doing dungeons on my dps.

Qbiken

It is OK to choose three roles bit only in normal dungeons

Loc2262 wrote: »

You only choose the roles you can fulfill properly, otherwise you don't use the group finder. End of story.

If you can´t complete a non-dlc normal dungeon without everyone doing their roles...don´t use the dungeon finder. end of story.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Other

Dapper Dinosaur wrote: »

I could take my magicka Nightblade into literally any normal dungeon aside from maybe blackheart haven queued as a healer, and then just tell me tank to not bother taunting the bosses because I'm going to do it, mitigating all potential damage to anyone else, and keep my life bar capped off at full the whole time so both me and the other two dps can hammer the dungeon out in less than 15 minutes.

If someone has a problem with that, they're more than welcome to try initiating a kick for me, which will fail every time, because intelligent people will be appreciating the speed-carry through the event.

If you plan to do the taunting, queue as a tank, simple enough. Believe me I get it. Normal dungeons are a cakewalk for any competent player to solo on just about any class. That said, soloing dungeons is not the purpose of group finder, event or not. It is a place for people to from groups to tackle the content together. The group you plan to "Carry" might consist of people running their first dungeon ever. The last thing they need is to have the dungeon completed for them before they know what happened.

We can leave the debate about the validity of the MMO trinity for another day, but for the most part it works really well:

If you queue as a healer, then you need to be keeping an eye on the health bar of your group members as a first priority, and yes, that includes the health bar of the breton stamblade spamming bow attacks in the corner. If you just stand there and solo boss and let your other DPS die because you ignore heals, well you failed at your role and it's unacceptable, regardless of how fast you clear.

If you queue as a tank, you better have a f'ing taunt on your bar. If someone gets one shot because you thought you could just burn the boss before anything happens, well that's on you, and it's not acceptable. If you dont queue as a tank, you really shouldnt be taunting anything. Sure you might say to the tank, hey Ill taunt, but it's honestly selfish. That tank might actually be built well for his role, which now means you have left him with very little to do. Nobody I know wants carried in that fashion.

If you plan to just self sustain and blow everything up before the other three people even knows what happened, you should probably queue as a DPS or run it solo.

Again, I have no issues with people queuing for multiple roles, but even in normal dungeons, you need to fulfill the basic requirements of said role. Normal dungeons are not a cakewalk for everyone.

Dapper Dinosaur

It is OK to choose three roles bit only in normal dungeons

But with the way Zenimax has structured the event to be completely dependent on the random activity finder, we are not only FORCED to run dungeons with other players, but we also have to deal with the RIDICULOUS number of problems the activity finder has. It's been in various levels and flavors of broken since launch, and right now it's in one of the worst states it's ever been, with ghost queues, jump failure (instance is full) errors, and sometimes requiring 6+ ready checks before the system works itself out.

That's just too much horse manure to put up with for those of us planning to go at this event hard with 4+ characters.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Other

Qbiken wrote: »

Loc2262 wrote: »

You only choose the roles you can fulfill properly, otherwise you don't use the group finder. End of story.

If you can´t complete a non-dlc normal dungeon without everyone doing their roles...don´t use the dungeon finder. end of story.

Actually, it's not the end of the story. If normal dungeons are so easy for you that you just solo bomb them or roles dont matter, then WTF are you doing in the the normal queue. There is a reason they have two queues. Yes normal dungeons are easy for most of us, group or not, but they are meant to be a stepping stone to vet. That generally works best when people practice their roles properly on easier content before making the leap to vet. This is why normal groupfinder exists in the first place.

If you want to just 4 DPS the crap out of them, then grab 3 buddies and queue any way you want.

Colecovision

Other

As is, people really need to be able to fulfill their role.

But I wish there was an option to select that I just want 3 other players and want to be with others who feel the same. So instead of allowing multiple role selection, you should get to select one formal role and then have a 1st available check box as well. Stick 4 first available people together as soon as they pop up. No more fake tanks, no more fake healers and no more long lines for dps players who are fine rolling as 4 dps. AND everyone who doesn't check the first available box will get into a situation with the proper roles.

jaws343

It is OK to choose three roles bit only in normal dungeons

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

Loc2262 wrote: »

You only choose the roles you can fulfill properly, otherwise you don't use the group finder. End of story.

If you can´t complete a non-dlc normal dungeon without everyone doing their roles...don´t use the dungeon finder. end of story.

Actually, it's not the end of the story. If normal dungeons are so easy for you that you just solo bomb them or roles dont matter, then WTF are you doing in the the normal queue. There is a reason they have two queues. Yes normal dungeons are easy for most of us, group or not, but they are meant to be a stepping stone to vet. That generally works best when people practice their roles properly on easier content before making the leap to vet. This is why normal groupfinder exists in the first place.

If you want to just 4 DPS the crap out of them, then grab 3 buddies and queue any way you want.

The reason people will be doing normal dungeons during this event is time. I don't have time to run random vet dungeons on 11 characters every day, especially if the DLC dungeons pop in the queue. I will barely have time to run that many on normal, but at least it will be more times than running it on vet.

For an event that rewards queuing through multiple characters regardless of the difficulty level, running vet dungeons is stupid.

Giraffon

It is not OK to choose multiple roles in the random dungeon finder

I will initiate a vote to kick to all fake tanks and healers that have a negative impact on the run. If you are a DPS Beast and you can plow through everything in your path, then you are most welcome in the group. If you are a low level DPS pretending to be a tank...you gotta' go.

Dapper Dinosaur

It is OK to choose three roles bit only in normal dungeons

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

Loc2262 wrote: »

You only choose the roles you can fulfill properly, otherwise you don't use the group finder. End of story.

If you can´t complete a non-dlc normal dungeon without everyone doing their roles...don´t use the dungeon finder. end of story.

Actually, it's not the end of the story. If normal dungeons are so easy for you that you just solo bomb them or roles dont matter, then WTF are you doing in the the normal queue. There is a reason they have two queues. Yes normal dungeons are easy for most of us, group or not, but they are meant to be a stepping stone to vet. That generally works best when people practice their roles properly on easier content before making the leap to vet. This is why normal groupfinder exists in the first place.

If you want to just 4 DPS the crap out of them, then grab 3 buddies and queue any way you want.

Is there something you don't understand about this event? NORMAL DUNGEONS ARE MUCH FASTER THAN VET DUNGEONS.

MercTheMage

Yeah no, if I get queued into ruins of marzipan and the healer cant heal, he's getting kicked.

MehrunesFlagon

It is not OK to choose multiple roles in the random dungeon finder

Giraffon wrote: »

I will initiate a vote to kick to all fake tanks and healers that have a negative impact on the run. If you are a DPS Beast and you can plow through everything in your path, then you are most welcome in the group. If you are a low level DPS pretending to be a tank...you gotta' go.

can't forget about that ice staff.

tommalmm

Other

It is ok to choose multiple roles in normal dungeons if you can perform at least basics of these roles with gear/skill change.

It is ok to choose multiple roles in veteran dungeons if you can perform these roles with gear/skill change.

Tasear

It is not OK to choose multiple roles in the random dungeon finder

And really it's not going to be bad as you think.

I have 5 healers and 2 tanks... might make a sorc tank next for event. I just don't randoms as much because it's well not as fun as it used to be

There's going to be plenty of people in queue, so I would not worry. In fact I imagine you might run into some of best players in game. In nothing else it's pretty hard to mess up a random normal and I see so many lazy max level champions in normal over vet.

Tasear

It is not OK to choose multiple roles in the random dungeon finder

Dapper Dinosaur wrote: »

But with the way Zenimax has structured the event to be completely dependent on the random activity finder, we are not only FORCED to run dungeons with other players, but we also have to deal with the RIDICULOUS number of problems the activity finder has. It's been in various levels and flavors of broken since launch, and right now it's in one of the worst states it's ever been, with ghost queues, jump failure (instance is full) errors, and sometimes requiring 6+ ready checks before the system works itself out.

That's just too much horse manure to put up with for those of us planning to go at this event hard with 4+ characters.

No... when is the last time you actually used it?

WuffyCerulei

It is OK to choose three roles bit only in normal dungeons

Strictly normal. If I group with 1 or 2 other people who are max CP, we could easily carry a third in normal dungeons. I've soloed most of the normal dungeons that could be soloed. Vet dungeons tho, it's a big no no.

Ozstryker

Other

It's not ok to inflict this in group finder!!
If u can solo, then go solo...
If u wanna play self sustaining chars, then form your own groups with like minded people... or better yet go play GW2!
The game would need fundamental changes to allow this, in its present state, pugs would be a mess! Heck, folk struggle to perform the roles as they have now, imagine if they were required to perform 3 (or 4) roles!!

I really hope ZOS dismiss these sort of threads

LadyNalcarya

It is OK to choose three roles bit only in normal dungeons

But only if you can perform those roles at least to some degree.
For example, equip some kind of heal (vigor, healing pet, anything), avoid running around with a boss (one of the biggest problems with fake tanks is that they run like headless chicken which greatly reduces everyones dps) etc.

Dapper Dinosaur

It is OK to choose three roles bit only in normal dungeons

Tasear wrote: »

Dapper Dinosaur wrote: »

But with the way Zenimax has structured the event to be completely dependent on the random activity finder, we are not only FORCED to run dungeons with other players, but we also have to deal with the RIDICULOUS number of problems the activity finder has. It's been in various levels and flavors of broken since launch, and right now it's in one of the worst states it's ever been, with ghost queues, jump failure (instance is full) errors, and sometimes requiring 6+ ready checks before the system works itself out.

That's just too much horse manure to put up with for those of us planning to go at this event hard with 4+ characters.

No... when is the last time you actually used it?

Literally every day. Maybe it's broken for console and not PC?

jaws343

It is OK to choose three roles bit only in normal dungeons

Ozstryker wrote: »

It's not ok to inflict this in group finder!!
If u can solo, then go solo...
If u wanna play self sustaining chars, then form your own groups with like minded people... or better yet go play GW2!
The game would need fundamental changes to allow this, in its present state, pugs would be a mess! Heck, folk struggle to perform the roles as they have now, imagine if they were required to perform 3 (or 4) roles!!

I really hope ZOS dismiss these sort of threads

I think you are missing the point of the thread. The discussion is about this particular event that requires using the random dungeon finder to earn rewards, not using the dungeon finder in general. You cannot solo and get the rewards. And with the influx of people into the group finder for the event, plus the urge to run many characters through a random, running DPS in the event is going to be a nightmare of waiting.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

Other

Dapper Dinosaur wrote: »

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Qbiken wrote: »

Loc2262 wrote: »

You only choose the roles you can fulfill properly, otherwise you don't use the group finder. End of story.

If you can´t complete a non-dlc normal dungeon without everyone doing their roles...don´t use the dungeon finder. end of story.

Actually, it's not the end of the story. If normal dungeons are so easy for you that you just solo bomb them or roles dont matter, then WTF are you doing in the the normal queue. There is a reason they have two queues. Yes normal dungeons are easy for most of us, group or not, but they are meant to be a stepping stone to vet. That generally works best when people practice their roles properly on easier content before making the leap to vet. This is why normal groupfinder exists in the first place.

If you want to just 4 DPS the crap out of them, then grab 3 buddies and queue any way you want.

Is there something you don't understand about this event? NORMAL DUNGEONS ARE MUCH FASTER THAN VET DUNGEONS.

So because there is an ESO event, we should simply throw edict and courtesy out the window. Got it. Also, if your DPS is high, vet really doesnt take that much longer. Every dungeon in this game can be done in 20 minutes give or take a few, even the DLCs.

Better idea: Go to your guild (or zone chat if you dont have any friends), type "LF3M DPS for speed run of random normal." Then group up and queue any way you want. If you dont go that route, it's my belief that if you queue individually for group finder then you should be able to properly satisfy the role that you queued for. Pretty simply really.