Can we stop nerfing pve because of pvp? asylum destro

Aliyavana

The vast majority of the complaints about asylum weapons were due to it being op in pvp. A pve weapon shouldn't be nerfed for pvp and a pvper shouldn't be compelled to farm bis from pve anyway. We should make the asylum destro completly disabled in pvp as a pvper shouldn't feel like he needs to do pve content to get the best pvp gear. A pvper can get for example monster sets in cyrodil but has no option for the asylum weapons. Let's not nerf pve for pvp anymore plz as how many times has pve nerfed pvp in comparison? We don't have threads of pvers complaining to change bosmers stealth dmg racial which is only useful in sacraments and pvp ganking into something that both pvers and pvpers find useful (poison or bow danage anyone?)

I'm not denying that things can overperform in pve and hope that one day all classes will be in a even playing field in pve tanking to dks or to healing as templars but it is clear that a pve weapon got nerfed for pvp.

So imo disable asylum destro in pvp, or make the staff work differently in pvp and start balancing the two differently

wazzz56

oh joy, another one of these threads.........

Aliyavana

wazzz56 wrote: »

oh joy, another one of these threads.........

Oh joy, another person that could have simply not have clicked the thread

Enslaved

You didnt even get this item yet. Please, stop whining lol.

wazzz56

SO you make threads for people to not read? And I will say for the 1000th time, if bosses and mobs could post on forums they would cry for nerfs etc...It just gets tiresome whenever a nerf happens people push all the blame onto pvpers....

RaddlemanNumber7

PVE does not need to be balanced, PvP does. As a PVE player I understand why PvP balancing needs to be prioritised.

Furthermore, I find end game PVE combat to be far too easy at the moment. Nerfs to end game PVE equipment can only help restore some element of challenge to that combat.

Defilted

I read these forums a lot. I really do not see PVE'ers coming onto the forums and stating this or that needs to be nerfed. I agree if mobs could post they would call for nerfs. The only exception to this rule would be competitive trial runners, but this is a small population.

PVP by its nature becasue it is competitive against another human will always have people complaining and calling for nerfs or buffs to a skill becasue they feel and have reasons.

I also believe any response to a thread is perfectly fine no matter what is said.



The only way to stop this whole conversations of PVE and PVP getting lumped together when it comes to nerfs or buffs is to separate it. When logging into a campaign you should play under a different set of balancing rules and skills. Go back to PVE and the skills and rules change. Even though this would require a skill to have a PVE and a PVP definition it would be far easier to balance.


just terrible sentence structure

dpencil1

I suggested that the original version should have a 50% chance to proc on player targets. That gives the same nerf to PvP as halfling the uptime while keeping it untouched in PvE.

Aliyavana

Enslaved wrote: »

You didnt even get this item yet. Please, stop whining lol.

That doesn't change the fact that during pts testing it was nice and pvp whining caused it to be nerfed. Just look at the Pts and see the doomsaying from pvpers.

wazzz56 wrote: »

SO you make threads for people to not read? And I will say for the 1000th time, if bosses and mobs could post on forums they would cry for nerfs etc...It just gets tiresome whenever a nerf happens people push all the blame onto pvpers....

I don't mind pve being needed for pve like if Zos decided something was overperforming in pve and nerfs pve for pve. It's very likely pvp got it nerfed. It's not like pvpers ask pve to be nerfed but zos refuses to balance seperately

TequilaFire

How do you nerf something that hasn't even been released yet?
It is being "tweaked".

Aliyavana

TequilaFire wrote: »

How do you nerf something that hasn't even been released yet?
It is being "tweaked".

Well yeah but it was tweaked with pvp in mind instead of it being balanced separately. Zos insists on balancing things together for "consistency".

GreenhaloX

aliyavana wrote: »

wazzz56 wrote: »

oh joy, another one of these threads.........

Oh joy, another person that could have simply not have clicked the thread

Ha ha!

Whether any agrees with me or not, I don't care. Nerfing just have to be eliminated completely.. period! Why keep pushing toons and skills backward. Buff all things for balance. It is the way of progressing forward. We all strive for forward progress. It doesn't matter what DLC, expansion or any new content the dev of Zen/Bethesda will continue to add to ESO, it will always be backward progress when things are nerfed. It doesn't make the gaming experience better. Wake up.. open your eyes.

Defilted

GreenhaloX wrote: »

aliyavana wrote: »

wazzz56 wrote: »

oh joy, another one of these threads.........

Oh joy, another person that could have simply not have clicked the thread

Ha ha!

Whether any agrees with me or not, I don't care. Nerfing just have to be eliminated completely.. period! Why keep pushing toons and skills backward. Buff all things for balance. It is the way of progressing forward. We all strive for forward progress. It doesn't matter what DLC, expansion or any new content the dev of Zen/Bethesda will continue to add to ESO, it will always be backward progress when things are nerfed. It doesn't make the gaming experience better. Wake up.. open your eyes.

Changing a skills performance is changing the skills performance. Whether the result of the skill is more or less is not relevant. The goal is to achieve a semblance of balance between classes as a whole, not based on a individual skill or a small part of the game, but again as a whole. Some classes will just perform well in certain areas of the game better and the same class will perform poorly in others.

Rjizzle09

aliyavana wrote: »

wazzz56 wrote: »

oh joy, another one of these threads.........

Oh joy, another person that could have simply not have clicked the thread

lmao gottiXD

Rjizzle09

I have to agree with op tho EVERY SINGLE PVE NERF WAS BECAUSE OF PVP. Ill say this again like i have in the past if pvpers want a pvp game this isnt it.Eso USED to be a game that was going to be about pvp mostly but that got scrapped. Now its a pve game with pvp attached. Its mostly zenimax fault as theyre too lazy to separate the two. Evidence of this can be seen in one of the past live streams where they were specifically asked why they cant separate pve and pvp. They said it would require too much "WORK". You can pretty much bet that every single set thats taken into pvp will get the nerf hammer at some point. Vma vow hasnt gotten a nerf since it came out lmao why? Cause nobody is dumb enough to stand in a bow aoe for 10 seconds. The only things that get nerfed on pvp are things that prople die to. Look at destro ult, it was WAY USEFUL for pve until someone took it over there and started massacring plp then it got nerfed a few times. This will never be fixed in this game

Biro123

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

PVE does not need to be balanced,

Pff. what if that unbalanced thing was a class skill that means ONLY that one class gets a place in trial groups - in all roles. If it wasn't *your* class, you'd soon want PVE balance then, wouldn't you?

wazzz56

aliyavana wrote: »

Enslaved wrote: »

You didnt even get this item yet. Please, stop whining lol.

That doesn't change the fact that during pts testing it was nice and pvp whining caused it to be nerfed. Just look at the Pts and see the doomsaying from pvpers.

wazzz56 wrote: »

SO you make threads for people to not read? And I will say for the 1000th time, if bosses and mobs could post on forums they would cry for nerfs etc...It just gets tiresome whenever a nerf happens people push all the blame onto pvpers....

I don't mind pve being needed for pve like if Zos decided something was overperforming in pve and nerfs pve for pve. It's very likely pvp got it nerfed. It's not like pvpers ask pve to be nerfed but zos refuses to balance seperately

Rjizzle09 wrote: »

I have to agree with op tho EVERY SINGLE PVE NERF WAS BECAUSE OF PVP. Ill say this again like i have in the past if pvpers want a pvp game this isnt it.Eso USED to be a game that was going to be about pvp mostly but that got scrapped. Now its a pve game with pvp attached. Its mostly zenimax fault as theyre too lazy to separate the two. Evidence of this can be seen in one of the past live streams where they were specifically asked why they cant separate pve and pvp. They said it would require too much "WORK". You can pretty much bet that every single set thats taken into pvp will get the nerf hammer at some point. Vma vow hasnt gotten a nerf since it came out lmao why? Cause nobody is dumb enough to stand in a bow aoe for 10 seconds. The only things that get nerfed on pvp are things that prople die to. Look at destro ult, it was WAY USEFUL for pve until someone took it over there and started massacring plp then it got nerfed a few times. This will never be fixed in this game

yes because the sustain nerfs were completely pvp oriented? I am sorry you can no longer face melt mobs and bosses with static mechanics quite as quickly . Also I am glad to know that I met the person who decides who can play this game for the reasons they want. SOrry Pvpers, this guys says this game is not for you...well gg happy trails everyone..ps destro ult is still useful...

Biro123

Rjizzle09 wrote: »

I have to agree with op tho EVERY SINGLE PVE NERF WAS BECAUSE OF PVP. Ill say this again like i have in the past if pvpers want a pvp game this isnt it.Eso USED to be a game that was going to be about pvp mostly but that got scrapped. Now its a pve game with pvp attached. Its mostly zenimax fault as theyre too lazy to separate the two. Evidence of this can be seen in one of the past live streams where they were specifically asked why they cant separate pve and pvp. They said it would require too much "WORK". You can pretty much bet that every single set thats taken into pvp will get the nerf hammer at some point. Vma vow hasnt gotten a nerf since it came out lmao why? Cause nobody is dumb enough to stand in a bow aoe for 10 seconds. The only things that get nerfed on pvp are things that prople die to. Look at destro ult, it was WAY USEFUL for pve until someone took it over there and started massacring plp then it got nerfed a few times. This will never be fixed in this game

Hm, so your answer to a balancing tweak is that all PVPers should just quit the game?

People are just plain wrong with this all the time.. Yeah, PVPers may spot most of the imbalances, but ZOS always balances with both in mind.. I mean look at the proc set nerfs - and lets take one of the biggest culprits - viper..

Yeah, PVPers complained... Zos looked and their response was that they noticed it was ALSO doing way too much damage in PVE. Their fix? Remove crit - which affected PVE MORE than PVP. Why? because ZoS decided it needed a bigger hit in PVE Why ? because based on their stats it was overperforming MORE in PVE than it was in PVP.
Next round - they made it a 4-sec dot. I big nerf for PVP - did it affect PVE? No.
So they could have done the 2nd change first and so ONLY nerf it in PVP - but they didn't. Why? Because it needed nerfing in PVE too.

Anybody who thinks balance isn't needed in PVE obviously doesn't care about the game.

Insandros

@aliyavana

Yep, welcome to Elder PvPer Kindergarten Online... all nerfs we get are mostly due to pvp crying.... not to mention all, but one of them.... Monster Set crit, proc sets modified..... This will keep going on until ZoS uses their brains and come up with totaly PvP and PvE seperate gears.. the day PvP set wil be earned in PvP zone only and PvE in PvE only zone or when the day PvE gear o craftable gear won't have impen... like the good old days of WOw when Resilience came.... but, this will never happen in this game, they'll just nerf stuff to ease the most crying people, PvPers.

wazzz56

Insandros wrote: »

@aliyavana

Yep, welcome to Elder PvPer Kindergarten Online... all nerfs we get are mostly due to pvp crying.... not to mention all, but one of them.... Monster Set crit, proc sets modified..... This will keep going on until ZoS uses their brains and come up with totaly PvP and PvE seperate gears.. the day PvP set wil be earned in PvP zone only and PvE in PvE only zone or when the day PvE gear o craftable gear won't have impen... like the good old days of WOw when Resilience came.... but, this will never happen in this game, they'll just nerf stuff to ease the most crying people, PvPers.

another example of pve toxicity ; name calling and blame passing rather than accepting that pve had gotten too easy..

Publius_Scipio

You are entitled to your opinion of course, but I have to ask.... Do all these "nerfs from PvP" really affect PvE? Is it a change where the staff is unusable for some reason? PvE we kill NPCs that run a script over and over, never deviating from it. PvP you obviously have to deal with players that are looking for op cheese builds to run, and only the devs can stop that.

Whats the complaint regarding PvE and the staff? It will take a few seconds or minute more to kill because of the nerf? Would there even be a complaint if ZOS originally released the destro staff functioning as it does with the nerf? The only thing I can think of is that ZOS released the staff showing X stats, now ZOS tweaks X stats, and you are saying "o well that sucks".

altemriel

aliyavana wrote: »

The vast majority of the complaints about asylum weapons were due to it being op in pvp. A pve weapon shouldn't be nerfed for pvp and a pvper shouldn't be compelled to farm bis from pve anyway. We should make the asylum destro completly disabled in pvp as a pvper shouldn't feel like he needs to do pve content to get the best pvp gear. A pvper can get for example monster sets in cyrodil but has no option for the asylum weapons. Let's not nerf pve for pvp anymore plz as how many times has pve nerfed pvp in comparison? We don't have threads of pvers complaining to change bosmers stealth dmg racial which is only useful in sacraments and pvp ganking into something that both pvers and pvpers find useful (poison or bow danage anyone?)

I'm not denying that things can overperform in pve and hope that one day all classes will be in a even playing field in pve tanking to dks or to healing as templars but it is clear that a pve weapon got nerfed for pvp.

So imo disable asylum destro in pvp, or make the staff work differently in pvp and start balancing the two differently

I definitely agree!!!

wazzz56 wrote: »

oh joy, another one of these threads.........

well yes, because it is true!!

Camb0Sl1ce

The sustain changes are a good example, I continue to primarily pvpers say that you we were never meant to infinitely sustain in pve. Thing is in a trial for example good teamwork and skill helped you sustain. Pvpers even after morrowind can still sustain, while in pve we are forced to heavy attack all the the time.

wazzz56

How many of the people crying about Pvpers causing nerfs actually play both aspects of the game?

rhapsodious

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

PvE we kill NPCs that run a script over and over, never deviating from it.

Hey now, that isn't true! I will have you know that yesterday Rakkhat just decided he wasn't going to render for me for an entire pull. I think his stealth should be nerfed.

Entire weapons shouldn't be disabled in PVP. While I do think it's kind of unrealistic (though admirable) to try and balance things for both game modes at the same time, this didn't even make it to Live and it was therefore still in the feedback phase. They heard the feedback and tweaked it.

And actually you get PVErs complaining all the time about the Alliance War-locked skills and wanting a PVE instance of Cyrodiil to quest or whatever even though anything outside the emp ring is dead 70% of the time (and outside the path between keeps probably closer to 90), but c'est la vie. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Camb0Sl1ce

I primarily pve but I used to pvp quite often, made to about captain grade 2 think.

Jade1986

RaddlemanNumber7 wrote: »

PVE does not need to be balanced, PvP does. As a PVE player I understand why PvP balancing needs to be prioritised.

Furthermore, I find end game PVE combat to be far too easy at the moment. Nerfs to end game PVE equipment can only help restore some element of challenge to that combat.

This person gets it 100%

Camb0Sl1ce

I feel like I shouldn't be regressing just to make old content "challenging" though.

WillhelmBlack

Whining.

templesus

How can you nerf something that isn’t even in the live game yet? L2Understand

Chronicburn

Just stop with the nerfs