The Elder Scrolls Online

Should Maintenance have ETAs?

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  • Slick_007
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    StackonClown wrote: »
    Belidos wrote: »
    Nope. A maintenance will end when it's ready to end. Anything could happen during a maintenance that could extend its time, and if that happened we would end up with tons of posts about ZoS lying to us about when it will be finished.

    ETA - is an estimate... its not lying, its planning and projecting downtime - its not hard - almost ALL IT departments need to do it - cmon guys - arent a lot of you or at least some faimiliar with this ?

    if you think you have a good point, why is your poll written in such a way to give you the answer you want to hear?
  • StackonClown
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    LadyDestiny wrote: »
    Yes.....most mmo's I have played give some kind of estimate and then update if it takes longer. Zos is good at being silent.........

    Hello and thank you! - another person who gets it.
  • LadyDestiny
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    Jim_Pipp wrote: »
    And my god please start putting a few more time zones in your maintenance announcements.

    I am an idiot and often manage to somehow get the wrong answer when I google "what is 6am edt in gmt." Today google told me 10am, but servers went down at 11am (and I am grumpy because I only realised at 11:15), and now I am being grumpy on the forums because I want to get online to feed my starving horses.

    Feed your horses. They are far more important than this game and they will love you unconditionally for it. :smiley:
  • RobDaCool
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    StackonClown wrote: »
    RobDaCool wrote: »
    No, because if it goes one minute over ETA people will complain.

    I'm no IT guy, I have no idea what they do during maintenance; they could work hard or they could simply take the servers down to save money.

    So then trains, buses, planes everything shouldnt have estimated arrival times - i.e. ETA, since people will complain if its not down to the minute or second... ?

    I did not say that did I? I checked and read over what I typed and nope, I not once mentioned public transportation.

    This is a game forum, I was talking about a game. Not a bus, plane, train, covered wagon etc.
    PS5 Pro NA - RobdacoolV2
  • Marto
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    If they can't give an ETA, they can't give an ETA.
    "According to the calculations of the sages of the Cult of the Ancestor Moth, the batam guar is the cutest creature in all Tamriel"
  • Epona222
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    StackonClown wrote: »
    Epona222 wrote: »
    I think what might be the thing that people want (although they say they want an ETA, I think after more than 3 years playing this game I think that is probably unrealistic), is just some soothing words from Zeni during the maintenance.

    Honestly, it doesnt really phase me how long they take - I said elsewhere 15 hours a week is fine for me. I find it a touch arrogant in principal they choose not to provice an ETA to the player base - and I find it laughable that people actually defend this approach and troll people like me for getting ready to make 'rabid rants' and 'demand compensation'.

    Honestly though, the server is down, people are bored, what else to expect other than a bit of a bunfight on the forums :D
    GM - Ghost Sea Trading Co - NA PC

    Epona was a Romano-Celtic goddess dating back to around 1800 to 2000 years before computer games were invented.
  • StackonClown
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    RobDaCool wrote: »
    StackonClown wrote: »
    RobDaCool wrote: »
    No, because if it goes one minute over ETA people will complain.

    I'm no IT guy, I have no idea what they do during maintenance; they could work hard or they could simply take the servers down to save money.

    So then trains, buses, planes everything shouldnt have estimated arrival times - i.e. ETA, since people will complain if its not down to the minute or second... ?

    I did not say that did I? I checked and read over what I typed and nope, I not once mentioned public transportation.

    This is a game forum, I was talking about a game. Not a bus, plane, train, covered wagon etc.

    Yes agreed, but I'm using transportation as a similar example of where ETAs are always provided but may not be on time down to the minute - but people deal with this
    Edited by StackonClown on July 17, 2017 11:33AM
  • Hippie4927
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    NO I'm happy to be underinformed and will happily tolerate the lack of information or updates as a paying customer
    LadyDestiny wrote: »
    Jim_Pipp wrote: »
    And my god please start putting a few more time zones in your maintenance announcements.

    I am an idiot and often manage to somehow get the wrong answer when I google "what is 6am edt in gmt." Today google told me 10am, but servers went down at 11am (and I am grumpy because I only realised at 11:15), and now I am being grumpy on the forums because I want to get online to feed my starving horses.

    Feed your horses. They are far more important than this game and they will love you unconditionally for it. :smiley:

    I have a feeling he was talking about his ingame horses. :)
    PC/NA/EP ✌️
  • StackonClown
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    Epona222 wrote: »
    StackonClown wrote: »
    Epona222 wrote: »
    I think what might be the thing that people want (although they say they want an ETA, I think after more than 3 years playing this game I think that is probably unrealistic), is just some soothing words from Zeni during the maintenance.

    Honestly, it doesnt really phase me how long they take - I said elsewhere 15 hours a week is fine for me. I find it a touch arrogant in principal they choose not to provice an ETA to the player base - and I find it laughable that people actually defend this approach and troll people like me for getting ready to make 'rabid rants' and 'demand compensation'.

    Honestly though, the server is down, people are bored, what else to expect other than a bit of a bunfight on the forums :D

    lol - bunfight exactly
  • StackonClown
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    Marto wrote: »
    If they can't give an ETA, they can't give an ETA.

    Who said they cant give an ETA? - they choose not to give an ETA
  • Nemesis7884
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    NO I'm happy to be underinformed and will happily tolerate the lack of information or updates as a paying customer
    What worth is an eta if you dont know you can stick to anyway?
  • StackonClown
    StackonClown
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    LadyDestiny wrote: »
    Jim_Pipp wrote: »
    And my god please start putting a few more time zones in your maintenance announcements.

    I am an idiot and often manage to somehow get the wrong answer when I google "what is 6am edt in gmt." Today google told me 10am, but servers went down at 11am (and I am grumpy because I only realised at 11:15), and now I am being grumpy on the forums because I want to get online to feed my starving horses.

    Feed your horses. They are far more important than this game and they will love you unconditionally for it. :smiley:

    lol - i think they mean horses ingame, not real ones
  • Belidos
    Belidos
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    NO I'm happy to be underinformed and will happily tolerate the lack of information or updates as a paying customer
    LadyDestiny wrote: »
    Yes.....most mmo's I have played give some kind of estimate and then update if it takes longer. Zos is good at being silent.........

    You'll find that most of them don't actually give an ETA (ETA refers to a time ie 1pm, 10am etc), they usually give a ELT (length of time ie 30 minutes, 4hrs, a week), and usually a lot larger time frame than it actually takes to compensate, ie it will take 2 to 8 hours, but ends up only taking an hour.
    Edited by Belidos on July 17, 2017 11:38AM
  • DeadlyRecluse
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    NO I'm happy to be underinformed and will happily tolerate the lack of information or updates as a paying customer
    Ideally, sure I'd love it.

    But I'd rather have no ETAs than inaccurate ETAs.
    Thrice Empress, Forever Scrub
  • StackonClown
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    Belidos wrote: »
    LadyDestiny wrote: »
    Yes.....most mmo's I have played give some kind of estimate and then update if it takes longer. Zos is good at being silent.........

    You'll find that most of them don't actually give an ETA (ETA refers to a time is 1pm, 10am etc), they usually give a ELT (length of time ir 30 minutes, 4hrs, a week), and usually a lot larger time frame than it actually takes to compensate, ie it will take 2 to 8 hours, but ends up only taking an hour.

    Ok but then you could extrapolate the ETA by taking the length and applying it to the start time.
    And noone with half an idea of planning IT outages would give 2-8 hours :)
    I'd say 7-8 hours or even 6-8 hours would work wouldn't it? I mean how often would they miss that?
  • Morgul667
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    At work, we do expect the IT team to give a planning for a regular maintenance...

    We should get an ETA but I dont see this happening.
  • Epona222
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    StackonClown wrote: »
    Epona222 wrote: »
    StackonClown wrote: »
    Epona222 wrote: »
    I think what might be the thing that people want (although they say they want an ETA, I think after more than 3 years playing this game I think that is probably unrealistic), is just some soothing words from Zeni during the maintenance.

    Honestly, it doesnt really phase me how long they take - I said elsewhere 15 hours a week is fine for me. I find it a touch arrogant in principal they choose not to provice an ETA to the player base - and I find it laughable that people actually defend this approach and troll people like me for getting ready to make 'rabid rants' and 'demand compensation'.

    Honestly though, the server is down, people are bored, what else to expect other than a bit of a bunfight on the forums :D

    lol - bunfight exactly

    I'm actually worried now that I may have used a phrase that doesn't translate well - I'm English, and "bunfight" WITH AN N means a petty or personal spat, the term originates from Parliament here in England in the 1920s and is in common usage today, it is NOT to be confused with a US term of similar but different spelling that may refer to forcing or coercing homeless people to fight one another in a degrading and potentially harmful way in exchange for a small sum of cash.
    Edited by Epona222 on July 17, 2017 11:44AM
    GM - Ghost Sea Trading Co - NA PC

    Epona was a Romano-Celtic goddess dating back to around 1800 to 2000 years before computer games were invented.
  • dennissomb16_ESO
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    They should of course have ETAs. The down side is if they miss the ETA by even 1 minute (and they will) the forums rage will explode so it is kind of a no win situation
  • StackonClown
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    Epona222 wrote: »
    StackonClown wrote: »
    Epona222 wrote: »
    StackonClown wrote: »
    Epona222 wrote: »
    I think what might be the thing that people want (although they say they want an ETA, I think after more than 3 years playing this game I think that is probably unrealistic), is just some soothing words from Zeni during the maintenance.

    Honestly, it doesnt really phase me how long they take - I said elsewhere 15 hours a week is fine for me. I find it a touch arrogant in principal they choose not to provice an ETA to the player base - and I find it laughable that people actually defend this approach and troll people like me for getting ready to make 'rabid rants' and 'demand compensation'.

    Honestly though, the server is down, people are bored, what else to expect other than a bit of a bunfight on the forums :D

    lol - bunfight exactly

    I'm actually worried now that I may have used a phrase that doesn't translate well - I'm English, and "bunfight" WITH AN N means a petty or personal spat, the term originates from Parliament here in England the 1920s and is in common usage today, it is NOT to be confused with a US term of similar but different spelling that may refer to forcing or coercing homeless people to fight one another in a degrading and potentially harmful way in exchange for a small sum of cash.

    I got your meaning - same in OZ - but gud to point out that US meaning wasnt intended
  • Belidos
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    NO I'm happy to be underinformed and will happily tolerate the lack of information or updates as a paying customer
    Morgul667 wrote: »
    At work, we do expect the IT team to give a planning for a regular maintenance...

    We should get an ETA but I dont see this happening.


    Yes, but the difference is that in your work it's all professionals, there isn't a large portion of whiny trolls who desperately watch for something to complain about. It's not that they can't give a fairly accurate ETA, it's that they don't because they will get a far more negative and volatile response to a missed ETA then you would in your environment. It's a damned if you do, damned it you don't kind of thing.
  • StackonClown
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    dennissomb16_ESO wrote: »
    They should of course have ETAs. The down side is if they miss the ETA by even 1 minute (and they will) the forums rage will explode so it is kind of a no win situation

    Again this is an assumption that will likely not eventuate - I mean who is threatening to rage in the forums about a 1 minute delay - sryz cant agree with this
  • Mitrenga
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    NO I'm happy to be underinformed and will happily tolerate the lack of information or updates as a paying customer
    So you say, keep to the ETA and delay any problem if/that occurs during the maint. just to keep up with the ETA?

    I'll pass.
  • jaschacasadiob16_ESO
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    Your REAL life shouldn't be planned according to a video game. If that's the case, you are probably suffering addiction and should start considering getting help.

    Whit this being said, maintenance does not always go smoothly.
    I do prefer the guys to do it well, without the pressure of an ETA, than doing it quickly but bad just to be back online on time.
    "Yesterday while searching a barrel in vVoM I found a lemon. Best drop of the whole run."

    Protect the weak. Heal the sick.
    Treasure the gifts of friendship. Seek joy and inspiration in the mysteries of love.
    Honor the Earth, its creatures, and the spirits. Use Nature's gifts wisely. Respect her power. Fear her fury.
  • StackonClown
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    Belidos wrote: »
    Morgul667 wrote: »
    At work, we do expect the IT team to give a planning for a regular maintenance...

    We should get an ETA but I dont see this happening.


    Yes, but the difference is that in your work it's all professionals, there isn't a large portion of whiny trolls who desperately watch for something to complain about. It's not that they can't give a fairly accurate ETA, it's that they don't because they will get a far more negative and volatile response to a missed ETA then you would in your environment. It's a damned if you do, damned it you don't kind of thing.

    you mean people will even troll you if you dare to ask for an ETA ??
  • LadyDestiny
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    Hippie4927 wrote: »
    LadyDestiny wrote: »
    Jim_Pipp wrote: »
    And my god please start putting a few more time zones in your maintenance announcements.

    I am an idiot and often manage to somehow get the wrong answer when I google "what is 6am edt in gmt." Today google told me 10am, but servers went down at 11am (and I am grumpy because I only realised at 11:15), and now I am being grumpy on the forums because I want to get online to feed my starving horses.

    Feed your horses. They are far more important than this game and they will love you unconditionally for it. :smiley:

    I have a feeling he was talking about his ingame horses. :)

    I just now realized he said online....lol
  • StackonClown
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    jaschacasadiob16_ESO wrote: »
    Your REAL life shouldn't be planned according to a video game. If that's the case, you are probably suffering addiction and should start considering getting help.

    Whit this being said, maintenance does not always go smoothly.
    I do prefer the guys to do it well, without the pressure of an ETA, than doing it quickly but bad just to be back online on time.

    But video games are part of real life - some people here spent MANY portions of days of their real lives playing video games - way way way more than me - lets not distort reality.

    How do you think guilds organise trials? - its called planning your life around a video game.
    How do you think people get on top of leaderboards?

    Further, please dont attempt to indicate a diagnosis of a medical condition - nor suggesting if people should get help. Saying someone is 'probably suffering addiction' is a serious matter, and is almost making a diagnosis - are you trained to do that ?
    Edited by StackonClown on July 17, 2017 11:55AM
  • bebynnag
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    ETA doesn't mean what i think you all think it means!
  • StackonClown
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    YES of course maintenance should have ETA's! - even if it is lengthy, I can plan around it
    Mitrenga wrote: »
    So you say, keep to the ETA and delay any problem if/that occurs during the maint. just to keep up with the ETA?

    I'll pass.

    not sure what you're referring to.
    MY approach would be:

    provide ETA
    perform maintenance
    stick to ETA
    if within ETA all gud
    if going overtime - deal with it - fix problem
    keep playerbase regularly informed - e.g. every 30 minutes is enough
    finish maintenance
    thanks for coming!
  • Bobby_V_Rockit
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    NO I'm happy to be underinformed and will happily tolerate the lack of information or updates as a paying customer
    But I'm bored now. I deserve a sharpened vMA greatsword as compensation (PS EU)...
  • JKorr
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    StackonClown wrote: »
    JKorr wrote: »
    ETA, sometime the same day the maintenance starts.

    Just looking at your post shows why they would be totally insane to even think about giving more exact information than that. Just the slightest touch of opinionated bias in that poll, no? Divines forbid they go 5 minutes over any eta they give; rabid rants about compensation, refunds, free stuff, and all the other stuff that's been posted with every single longer than the poster thinks is appropriate downtime would show up.

    This thread is a case in point.

    By the way, you really should specify; "paying customer".....is that someone who subbed, or someone who paid once for the game? How long does the cost of the game without a sub cover the right to rant that a "paying customer" isn't getting the value they paid for? Even though that paying customer agreed to the ToS?
    {edit; spelling}

    You're making baseless assumptions about my reaction - you havent read my posts at all.. Who wants compensations? just keep us informed if you're running late.. Dont assume my reaction and enforce that on me... Why should it matter, people paid for the game and/or subbed - i did both -

    You haven't been on the forums for long? Maintenance taking "too long", unexpected maintenance....About 21 pages worth.... https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/search?adv=&search=compensation+downtime&title=&author=&cat=all&tags=&discussion_d=1&discussion_question=1&discussion_poll=1&comment_c=1&comment_answer=1&within=1+day&date=

    Ongoing service; someone worked out how much an hour of ESO costs, once upon a time, in one of those "I demand compensation because I can't play" threads. So if someone isn't subbed, how many hours of the gameplay did they "pay" for? Someone who subs continues to pay, so might have a slight edge claiming they aren't getting the service they're paying for. However anyone who plays accepted the ToS, and access to the game isn't really guaranteed. {Yes, I'm still subbed, and have a second account. Guess I should really be demanding information as a paying customer.]

    ZeniMax does not guarantee that any Services will be available at all times, in all countries and/or all geographic locations, at any given time, or that ZeniMax will continue to offer any particular Services for any particular length of time.

    Things happen; they have in the past, where something went wrong and the maintenance took a lot longer than they hoped. If Gina and company had to keep posting "Not yet but we're working on it" if something glitched in the patch, they'd deserve combat pay for the abuse they'd get.

    For the record, the way you phrased the second "option" is why I said compensation. Bringing up "paying customer" usually leads to some kind of demand. Or were you simply baiting anyone who doesn't agree with your first poll option?
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