Trait changes and how they affect pvp.

leepalmer95

This is all speculation and i posted this in a general forum thread but though't i'd post it here to see what other pvp'ers think.

So the actual difference between precise/ sharp/ nirn is around 1-1.5%? Dps wise? According to the tests people have done.

So unless your really going for that end game pve leaderboards its not worth regrinding and regolding?

I'm guessing pvp is a different story.

I'd say:

Nirn > Precise> Sharp for pvp.

Nirn - Only on crafted sets + msa weps, most pvp builds are based on dungeon sets and open world sets so thats it limitation, deals the most dmg by like 0.7% or something but affects heals and works on shields.

Precise - Still around the 1% mark dps wise, doesn't work on shields but still works on heals. I'd say give more possible burst dmg as crits is how you burst people even if they have shields, if you don't crit s shield users when you catch them without shields you won't kill them without proc sets.

Sharpened - Not the highest dps, coming behind nirn but higher than precise, but its more reliable damage when it works but doesn't with shields. No limitation and its available on all weapons. Most people will already have gold weapons of sharpened.

Any one of these seems viable in pvp.

I'm likely gonna go shadow/ precise though because the dps is around the same and i really want that heal boost, more crits heals and higher crit heals. My damage is fine to burst people usually, its healing that becomes a problem when i have several people on me. Rather give up 1~% dmg for better heals.

FloppyTouch

Infused oblivion enchant

Chilly-McFreeze

FloppyTouch wrote: »

Infused oblivion enchant

Argh, you beat me to it.

I've seen a combatlog where it procced every 1.5s for 2.9k

leepalmer95

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

FloppyTouch wrote: »

Infused oblivion enchant

Argh, you beat me to it.

I've seen a combatlog where it procced every 1.5s for 2.9k

Whats the base cooldown on that? If its that strong the cooldown will need increasing.

Chilly-McFreeze

I think 4 sec is the base cooldown. But with torug + infused it will basically proc every weave.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/358680/severe-balancing-issue-regarding-torugs-pact-changes-fixes-and-oblivion-damage/p1

Sylphie

I'm not a big fan of precise for non-cp. Unless I run something with 2 sets of crit bonus (julianos, hundings), my crit chance floats around the 40-45% range with major savagery/prophecy, which imo isn't worth running shadow.

While I have tested nirn vs sharpened on my magdk and finding nirn slightly better overall due to the points you made above, I haven't done a dps test on a stamina class, which won't have any penetration passive like light armor.

I think overall I'm still going to stick with sharpened due to its availability and ease to get.

leepalmer95

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

I think 4 sec is the base cooldown. But with torug + infused it will basically proc every weave.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/358680/severe-balancing-issue-regarding-torugs-pact-changes-fixes-and-oblivion-damage/p1

Yeah so 1.5s.

Yeah that'll need changing can't be bothered with basically a stronger viper that goes through shields/block.

I'd go that with a prismatic which reach 11.5k dmg tooltip with torugs/ infused. Also procs every 1.5s.

Takes-No-Prisoner

I have 2 Precise Viper Daggers. Wonder if I should switch to those once this patch hits?

Glamdring

Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »

I have 2 Precise Viper Daggers. Wonder if I should switch to those once this patch hits?

yes

Glamdring

As a stamnb i will drop defending on my bowbar and use an infused bow with either wepdamage enchant or oblivion enchant and a 2h nirn maelstromsword on front.

Takes-No-Prisoner

Glamdring wrote: »

Takes-No-Prisoner wrote: »

I have 2 Precise Viper Daggers. Wonder if I should switch to those once this patch hits?

yes

Any idea how high the crit will be? IIRC, Viper got 2 piece crit bonus', and on PS4 NA when my Redguard is sitting in stealth with these daggers equipped his crit rating was ~71%

Glamdring wrote: »

As a stamnb i will drop defending on my bowbar and use an infused bow with either wepdamage enchant or oblivion enchant

I was thinking of doing the same thing, granted I would have to drop my weap poison.

Glamdring

Use poison on your nirn 2h on frontbar

Trashs1

does infused actually work on poisons too?

scipionumatia

This patch is gonna be hard on mag sorcs and shield users. with many pple swapping sharpened for nirnhoned or infused with oblivion glyphs shields will be taking more damage or getting cut through with oblivion glyphs

Lord-Otto

I think Sharpened will still be BiS.


4880 from light passive + 4000 from Spinner + 2750 from new Sharpened is 12k mag pen. I have 11.5k spell res, so nothing really changes, Spinner used to overpenetrate, anyway.

Of course, Defending and res buffs are above that, but Def was nerfed in tandem, and a buff costs you a slot. Could slot Inner Light or Aegis or comparable instead. Fair tradeoff.

Nirn wasn't buffed much. It only increases base staff/sword damage. Since max mag set boni were buffed, this further loses relevance. It's just closer to Sharpened now.

Precise is not relevant at all. It's diminished by shields and impen. It's a killer buff for heals, though.


In conclusion, I'm expecting a renaissance of Spinner and Spriggan. What used to be a very useful set bonus is now an irreplacable one, unless you wanna invest heavily into CP or rely on purgable debuffs. Plus, everyone still has golden sharpened Spinnspriggs.

leepalmer95

Lord-Otto wrote: »

I think Sharpened will still be BiS.


4880 from light passive + 4000 from Spinner + 2750 from new Sharpened is 12k mag pen. I have 11.5k spell res, so nothing really changes, Spinner used to overpenetrate, anyway.

Of course, Defending and res buffs are above that, but Def was nerfed in tandem, and a buff costs you a slot. Could slot Inner Light or Aegis or comparable instead. Fair tradeoff.

Nirn wasn't buffed much. It only increases base staff/sword damage. Since max mag set boni were buffed, this further loses relevance. It's just closer to Sharpened now.

Precise is not relevant at all. It's diminished by shields and impen. It's a killer buff for heals, though.


In conclusion, I'm expecting a renaissance of Spinner and Spriggan. What used to be a very useful set bonus is now an irreplacable one, unless you wanna invest heavily into CP or rely on purgable debuffs. Plus, everyone still has golden sharpened Spinnspriggs.

I'm still likely gonna go precise i think though. Unless nirn on msa 2h.

People get quite a bit of pen from cp as well it scales quite nicely. Most of my builds have 2-3k from cp.

Skinzz

Im sticking with sharpened. Might try out some precise here and there though.

Minno

I'd probably go either nirn or percise. Percise would mean I can gain back the nerfs from thief stone. Since defending was also cut in half, and I'm running a staff build, I can use elemental drain to get a huge penetration. So either nirn or percise will be BIS for my build.

Kas

tbh, i think infused is a very strong contender especially with - but even without - the oblivion damage glyph.
"normal" damage glyphs are also decent, especially given how well they proc status effects and that concussed is great already and burning will be buffed. spell/weapon damage boosts are also very significant and on 1h/s & dw, infused should outperform nirn w.r.t average increased damage.

i suspect that nirn will primarily be attractive when running poisons, on builds without light attacks (i hate them, but people still opalyer dw casters, ofc), probably on some 2hand weapons where the percentage increase is especially significant and maybe on one of two weapons in dw - next to an infused one.

leepalmer95

The oblivion glyph is gonna need a timer increase.

3k~ every 1-1.5s is stupid.

Waffennacht

Nirn would bump up DMG and heals but deal slightly less DMG than sharp
Precise bumps up heals and DMG but not as much (kinda the same as nirn)
Infused Oblivion deals DMG but no heals - circumvents shields and mitigation

I'll probably go infused for the versatility in damaging opponents. Plus anti Healing Ward

Alucardo

Considering Nirn and Sharpened are so close in terms of damage, I do feel like Nirn will be the winner just because it also increases your healing done. Having said that, if you still have gold sharpened weapons you want to keep, you don't have to worry about throwing them out because they're still good.
I do like all these new trait and mundus changes. I think we'll see an array of different builds. Though I do feel like Sharpened and Defensive took more of a hit than it should have. Still, it's not the end of the world.

Waffennacht

Alucardo wrote: »

Considering Nirn and Sharpened are so close in terms of damage, I do feel like Nirn will be the winner just because it also increases your healing done. Having said that, if you still have gold sharpened weapons you want to keep, you don't have to worry about throwing them out because they're still good.
I do like all these new trait and mundus changes. I think we'll see an array of different builds. Though I do feel like Sharpened and Defensive took more of a hit than it should have. Still, it's not the end of the world.

It's not lost on me we all had gold nirn a little over a year ago ...

Wishing I hadn't deconned them back then...

Just saying don't deconn anything gold for at least 2 years

KingJ

Sharpened is still so important I don't see it going anywhere your better off stacking pen against everything but Sorc.Which will cause the issue of people complaining about sorcs shields since they stack pen and crit.

A already know my setup for next patch just not sure if I should run spriggans Nirn 2h or spriggans infused 2h.With spriggans I'll have the same amount of Pen on my stamblade as this patch.

SodanTok

TBH the precise falls off from the pve calculations once you start lowering that crit damage. You wont be dealing bonus 70% crit damage like in pve. And that is in meta where impreg armor is not used much yet.

When your crits deal like 40% more damage because people run impen and you arent exactly nightblade with stacked CP to crit damage (or sets) nirn becomes better by 50% give or take
Tho it is still in realm of choices that are almost not impactful So you can go whatever you like.

Lord-Otto

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Lord-Otto wrote: »

I think Sharpened will still be BiS.


4880 from light passive + 4000 from Spinner + 2750 from new Sharpened is 12k mag pen. I have 11.5k spell res, so nothing really changes, Spinner used to overpenetrate, anyway.

Of course, Defending and res buffs are above that, but Def was nerfed in tandem, and a buff costs you a slot. Could slot Inner Light or Aegis or comparable instead. Fair tradeoff.

Nirn wasn't buffed much. It only increases base staff/sword damage. Since max mag set boni were buffed, this further loses relevance. It's just closer to Sharpened now.

Precise is not relevant at all. It's diminished by shields and impen. It's a killer buff for heals, though.


In conclusion, I'm expecting a renaissance of Spinner and Spriggan. What used to be a very useful set bonus is now an irreplacable one, unless you wanna invest heavily into CP or rely on purgable debuffs. Plus, everyone still has golden sharpened Spinnspriggs.

I'm still likely gonna go precise i think though. Unless nirn on msa 2h.

People get quite a bit of pen from cp as well it scales quite nicely. Most of my builds have 2-3k from cp.

Well, you could combine it with Shadow mundus for a neat burst once shields are down.

BlobESO has made a video, nirn and sharpened were pretty close, so you'll be fine there. However, I still think the more damage you get from sets and skills, the less nirn matters. Unlike sharpened, which scales.

CPs are well-balanced now. If I can, I rather avoid penetration stars, though. The other ones, like shield damage and crit damage are just harder to come by with gear.

Infused and Oblivion enchant is promising, but keep in mind light and heavy attacks can be dodged. A channel also eliminates the point. It's more anti-shield and anti-tank, imo.

rimmidimdim

scipionumatia wrote: »

This patch is gonna be hard on mag sorcs and shield users. with many pple swapping sharpened for nirnhoned or infused with oblivion glyphs shields will be taking more damage or getting cut through with oblivion glyphs

I think it will be mag sorc and shield users using the Oblivion glyphs and infused and torugs.