Battlegrounds are a terrible experience.

Zvorgin

I gave no CP PvP a chance, CP PvP is just much more fun. The increased mitigation and extra stats from CP means that resource management matters. The sustain changes were good adjustments, the stripping of CP was not.

Durham

Zvorgin wrote: »

I gave no CP PvP a chance, CP PvP is just much more fun. The increased mitigation and extra stats from CP means that resource management matters. The sustain changes were good adjustments, the stripping of CP was not.

most people feel the same way you do ... non CP is minority and ZOS listened to them.... but I have a feeling they are seeing that people are not moving to this meta actually they are see a rejection of it .....

ChunkyCat

Waffennacht wrote: »

You gotta have some top tier PvP experience to have a chance in BGs. You will have top tier groups and top tier solo players.

You can't just roll in with a PvE build, you have to have a dedicated PvP build

Quote for the win.

Just like the first time we all entered Vet Maelstrom Arena and got face rolled out of nowhere, Battlegrounds are full of experienced PvP'ers. .

So yeah, the original poster is correct in assuming that most new players will probably have the same BG experience as him. Those of us who have been playing the game longer are just better geared and have more practice at smashing the right keyboard button combos.

That's just the nature of the beast.

Zvorgin

Durham wrote: »

Zvorgin wrote: »

I gave no CP PvP a chance, CP PvP is just much more fun. The increased mitigation and extra stats from CP means that resource management matters. The sustain changes were good adjustments, the stripping of CP was not.

most people feel the same way you do ... non CP is minority and ZOS listened to them.... but I have a feeling they are seeing that people are not moving to this meta actually they are see a rejection of it .....

If queues for BG's weren't so broken it may have had a chance, but when people couldn't even play that style I think it was over. It would be nice if no cp was at least a hybrid so you got your stats from cp.

Killset

LoLitsNeal wrote: »

Let me just start by saying I have been playing for about four months now and have enjoyed almost every moment of it. I have been looking forward to battlegrounds for some time now as I was an avid prior MMO Battlegrounder.

The battleground experience right now is absolutely terrible. Premade teams of highly tuned proc builds 1 shot anyone who is even remotely not an op meta one shot class. Time to kill is literally around 3 seconds in 1v1 and even lower 1vx.

This is incredibly elitest and not what i was expecting or hoping at all. My first 10 battlegrounds all resulted in getting completely facerolled with zero chance for any fun.

I get that I could roll one of like the 3 overpowered 1 shot classes that comprise 80% of the battlegrounds scene but this is just rediculous.
I doubt I will be returning to battlegrounds anytime soon and i am positive this has left a bad impression on most of the community who has tried with the exception of the 5% of the playerbase who knows how to take advantage of every non cp strategy possible.

Let the learn to plays roll in, but that doesnt change the fact it is an absoluttely terrible experience for 95% of the ESO population.
If Morrowind BGs were pitched as elitest stompfest where 2 builds will reign supreme without a single chance for a majority of the playerbase I would imagine this would make people cringe. But the fact is true.

This rant is in hopes that ZOS does something to tune down certain sets and dmg in non CP and fix this disappointment.

I have seen every class do extremely well in Battlegrounds. Do not quote percentages as if you have some insight into what 95% of the ESO population thinks. If you are less skilled and improperly geared Battlegrounds can be brutal.

I don't equip garbage then expect to be a rock star in vet trials. And I definitely wouldn't run to the forums complaining that my Trials experience was terrible and I feel like 95% of ESO players hate trials (though that may be true lol). Battlegrounds shouldn't be any different.

And just because someone has better gear, more skill, a pre-made group, etc., it is not some sort of definitive evidence they are elitist. You are not entitled to do well in BG's, you are only entitled to participate.

Killset

diplomatt wrote: »

experience how it is

I see you getting beat on by 3 players. You feel you should live?

Anethum

Killset wrote: »

diplomatt wrote: »

experience how it is

I see you getting beat on by 3 players. You feel you should live?

there were more than 3 on me:) and this was unnecessary, because i don't use any procsets)(i have them in bags on twinks, i tested them in prev summer and had found etremly powerfull even for cp pvp and same boring unfair ***) and now experimented with different alternative setups which are usefull only with right combos and actions, situations.
Procsets kills all experiments, they ruin the system because are not adequate scaled. And, this is the gift to players who like result and don't care how it reached.

And yeah, I'm sure I should live)

Darlgon

mr1sho wrote: »

LoLitsNeal wrote: »

Let me just start by saying I have been playing for about four months now and have enjoyed almost every moment of it. I have been looking forward to battlegrounds for some time now as I was an avid prior MMO Battlegrounder.

The battleground experience right now is absolutely terrible. Premade teams of highly tuned proc builds 1 shot anyone who is even remotely not an op meta one shot class. Time to kill is literally around 3 seconds in 1v1 and even lower 1vx.

This is incredibly elitest and not what i was expecting or hoping at all. My first 10 battlegrounds all resulted in getting completely facerolled with zero chance for any fun.

I get that I could roll one of like the 3 overpowered 1 shot classes that comprise 80% of the battlegrounds scene but this is just rediculous.
I doubt I will be returning to battlegrounds anytime soon and i am positive this has left a bad impression on most of the community who has tried with the exception of the 5% of the playerbase who knows how to take advantage of every non cp strategy possible.

Let the learn to plays roll in, but that doesnt change the fact it is an absoluttely terrible experience for 95% of the ESO population.
If Morrowind BGs were pitched as elitest stompfest where 2 builds will reign supreme without a single chance for a majority of the playerbase I would imagine this would make people cringe. But the fact is true.

This rant is in hopes that ZOS does something to tune down certain sets and dmg in non CP and fix this disappointment.

I'm sorry your experience with BGS hasn't been good but have you thought to yourself maybe just maybe it's your playing style or your build.
I'm no elitist I don't win every battle I fight, there's sometimes I get out out played or skilled I try to work on my build and work on my skill so I can more BGS

No.. sorry.. No random group of two is going to have a shot in hell of beating a fourman premade group of experienced AvA players with voice comms.

Sarato

bump

Sarato

BGs are expensive as ****

Venom4You

I do like the no CP combat inside BGs. Proc sets still need to be adressed so they don't keep breaking PVP by letting RNGesuz taking control of dmg output the player should be responsible for (especially in no CP BGs). In addition I believe there should be BGs for lvl 1-160 CP and BGs for players with 160 CP+. Having reached 160 CP the majority of players will work for BIS gear fit for end-game content and thereby more competitive with top tier players. There is just no way how the average lvl 30 guy in training lvl gear is supposed to do anything in BGs with 160 CP players other than being cannon fodder (Yes, I know some peps might craft pvp gear that gets battleleveled etc, but honestly: Still no way they outperform end-game dungeons sets on paper). To sum up I'd actually like to be able to chose the game mode I want to play. I can't stand capture the flag but love domination and TDM. So why force me to randomly play CtF?

But there is ONE thing, ONE thing that absolutely drives me crazy: 7/10 times I am queuing for BGs I can't join a bloody lobby in under 30mins. Especially bad it gets when queuing with friends in a group. It seems nearly impossible to get in at times. That is just unacceptable! I mainly bought Morrowind because of BGs and can't use them when trying to get in with friends. This is a NO GO. Do your job ZOS and fix the queue - FAST. And do not wait to implement it in some big patch in a few months from now... -.-

PS: Why not try to use matchmaking like in modern shooters? Put peps INSIDE the lobby and start filling it up instead of waiting until you got enough peps for a lobby and then require each one to accept the queue in addition? It just seems way to complicated to me. In addition you could introduce a quick start button. So when the lobby isn't filling fast enough peps can vote to start the round anyway and fight for example 2vs 2vs 3 if all in lobby are OK with it?
Idc if a round starts and some guys are afk. Simply put in a timer for autokick (15 secs) when not moving after game started and fill up lobby again.

Smackosynthesis

Yeah I've played a few matches and it's left a sour experience in my mouth. I will not be returning to it unless there are some huge fixes. I don't know much about the pvp, but I do know that it's not fun when I can't even hurt anyone no matter how hard I unload and they can kill me in a couple of seconds. Shouldn't be that way, no matter what skills or gear they have. I'll just go back to something more balanced.

timidobserver

If alliance rank was account bound, it would be fairly simple to deal with this issue. As it stands, there is no easy way for the code to retrieve a player's general PvP experience level.

Killset

Smackosynthesis wrote: »

Yeah I've played a few matches and it's left a sour experience in my mouth. I will not be returning to it unless there are some huge fixes. I don't know much about the pvp, but I do know that it's not fun when I can't even hurt anyone no matter how hard I unload and they can kill me in a couple of seconds. Shouldn't be that way, no matter what skills or gear they have. I'll just go back to something more balanced.

You are wrong on almost every level. I agree, you should stay out.

Ahzek

timidobserver wrote: »

If alliance rank was account bound, it would be fairly simple to deal with this issue. As it stands, there is no easy way for the code to retrieve a player's general PvP experience level.

Alliance rank has nothing to do with PvP experience level though.

BNOC

Killset wrote: »

I have seen every class do extremely well in Battlegrounds. Do not quote percentages as if you have some insight into what 95% of the ESO population thinks. If you are less skilled and improperly geared Battlegrounds can be brutal.

I don't equip garbage then expect to be a rock star in vet trials. And I definitely wouldn't run to the forums complaining that my Trials experience was terrible and I feel like 95% of ESO players hate trials (though that may be true lol). Battlegrounds shouldn't be any different.

And just because someone has better gear, more skill, a pre-made group, etc., it is not some sort of definitive evidence they are elitist. You are not entitled to do well in BG's, you are only entitled to participate.

You've seen every class do well?

You realise he's talking about 1 shot builds where the actual player is dictating about 30% of their damage and the computer is doing the other 70% - This isn't an issue tied only to BGS but it is a massive problem.
Basically, in a BG where the players are of equal skill level you would not see every class do extremely well you would see select classes perform.

The only time you might now see all classes do extremely well is when there's a strong player on one of them against a bunch of noobs - Poor matchmaking allows for that right now, but don't expect everyone to compete if they start doing ranked matchmaking.

"I don't equip garbage then expect to be a rock star in vet trials. And I definitely wouldn't run to the forums complaining that my Trials experience was terrible " - No, maybe you wouldn't, but you'd be here if you went into a trial on your X class and were only doing 40k DPS (Perfect) compared to Y class who was doing 60k DPS (Perfect) and 50k (Half arsed, messing up) because of something out of their control.

There's the issue you're apparently missing. Nobody is going in to BGs wearing non set gear, but they're getting out performed time and time again by players that are using sets out of their control - The problem isn't anyone elses gear, it's the Meta sets that are.

I sort of agree with your last point but, good players without proc sets are under-performing good players with proc sets.

Killset wrote: »

diplomatt wrote: »

experience how it is

I see you getting beat on by 3 players. You feel you should live?

I don't think he should live, but just analyze the recap for a second - 3 of the 5 are % procs.
Sure there was more attacks done to him (probably 2 selenes and a tremorscale) and maybe a couple minor things but that alone is 10k damage on his recap, without the other procs that almost certainly went off at the same time and let's not even mention Incap.

Nobody should be getting 1 banged by someone who is doing 30% of their total damage.


PS: You're a NB?

Killset

BNOC wrote: »

Killset wrote: »

I have seen every class do extremely well in Battlegrounds. Do not quote percentages as if you have some insight into what 95% of the ESO population thinks. If you are less skilled and improperly geared Battlegrounds can be brutal.

I don't equip garbage then expect to be a rock star in vet trials. And I definitely wouldn't run to the forums complaining that my Trials experience was terrible and I feel like 95% of ESO players hate trials (though that may be true lol). Battlegrounds shouldn't be any different.

And just because someone has better gear, more skill, a pre-made group, etc., it is not some sort of definitive evidence they are elitist. You are not entitled to do well in BG's, you are only entitled to participate.

You've seen every class do well?

You realise he's talking about 1 shot builds where the actual player is dictating about 30% of their damage and the computer is doing the other 70% - This isn't an issue tied only to BGS but it is a massive problem.
Basically, in a BG where the players are of equal skill level you would not see every class do extremely well you would see select classes perform.

The only time you might now see all classes do extremely well is when there's a strong player on one of them against a bunch of noobs - Poor matchmaking allows for that right now, but don't expect everyone to compete if they start doing ranked matchmaking.

"I don't equip garbage then expect to be a rock star in vet trials. And I definitely wouldn't run to the forums complaining that my Trials experience was terrible " - No, maybe you wouldn't, but you'd be here if you went into a trial on your X class and were only doing 40k DPS (Perfect) compared to Y class who was doing 60k DPS (Perfect) and 50k (Half arsed, messing up) because of something out of their control.

There's the issue you're apparently missing. Nobody is going in to BGs wearing non set gear, but they're getting out performed time and time again by players that are using sets out of their control - The problem isn't anyone elses gear, it's the Meta sets that are.

I sort of agree with your last point but, good players without proc sets are under-performing good players with proc sets.

Killset wrote: »

diplomatt wrote: »

experience how it is

I see you getting beat on by 3 players. You feel you should live?

I don't think he should live, but just analyze the recap for a second - 3 of the 5 are % procs.
Sure there was more attacks done to him (probably 2 selenes and a tremorscale) and maybe a couple minor things but that alone is 10k damage on his recap, without the other procs that almost certainly went off at the same time and let's not even mention Incap.

Nobody should be getting 1 banged by someone who is doing 30% of their total damage.


PS: You're a NB?

Yes. I have seen every class do extremely well in BG's. MagDK's, stam DK's, magplars, Stamplars, mag warden, stam warden, and stamblades. The only class I don't see much of is magblade. Every class I just listed has an over tuned build capable of doing some crazy things. Take procs away, I don't care, but ZOS better look at everything else in this game that will catapult to the forefront when they are gone i.e., Soul Assault, Perma Blockers, PoTL, destro ulti, hardened ward, endless fury, dark deal, and the list goes on.

As for diplomatt's recap? There is about 12.5k of damage shown. So either he has very low health or he was hit buy a lot of other things. You can theorize the rest of the damage came from procs, incap, or whatever else you want to make up to support your argument but the fact is you can't go by the recap.

And finally, you are crazy if you think people aren't going into battlegrounds with little to no PvP experience and bad gear. I see it nearly every game. If and when procs get addressed, ZOS needs to be very careful with what fills the void.

Hankrabbit

I can understand your frustration in BG, when you are not an elitist. I often have pity when I have killed a casual to the 8 times in a row. The gap between elitists and casuals is very big in ESO, especially on console.

Anethum

Hankrabbit wrote: »

I can understand your frustration in BG, when you are not an elitist. I often have pity when I have killed a casual to the 8 times in a row. The gap between elitists and casuals is very big in ESO, especially on console.

And this gap tends to infinity when elitist wear procsets vs average or newby.
Today and yeasterday in BG i've met many times one russian player who made highest results in Maelstrom arena (very skilled person) on all classes. Guess, which sets he used on stamina nightblade...with cost poisons:) (right answer ofc: viper+selene's web+eternal hunt)... Yeah, now he's on first place in Deathmatches on EU (220k points...). Wtf?

Procsets ruin variety of builds in pvp. Heavy armor instead of medium or light, no interesting complicated ones to use, because they all loose to simplest lazy procsets in hard situations...

All this situation looks like a knight's competition, in which those people who made a rules, gave a possibility to some knights to get and use machine gun instead sword vs another knights. Beautiful competition. Use it or try to win with a sword

Zordrage

i played enough Cyrodiil to know this gonna happen the momment i heard about battlegrounds....

why you people are suprised is the real question...

this game is literaly TAILORED for cheesy builds..... you either the user of one of these realy uncomfortable to play builds and end up as a winner.... or you can play ANY OTHER build you actualy like and fits you and be 100% useless againts them....

Zer0oo

Ahzek wrote: »

timidobserver wrote: »

If alliance rank was account bound, it would be fairly simple to deal with this issue. As it stands, there is no easy way for the code to retrieve a player's general PvP experience level.

Alliance rank has nothing to do with PvP experience level though.

It does, every high rank pvp player was quite long in cyro to have enough experience to be good at pvp(doesn't really mean that he/she i good at it). At the moment it is extrem random with whom you get in group and who is in the other groups, which sometimes leads to very boring pvp or quite frustrating depends if you got lucky with your group.

If it would select it at least after pvp rank you at least would know that they have exp in pvp and that hopefully leads to more balanced teams. Don't think it is the best solution but it would be a start. Low pvp( global pvp rank 1-20?) ranks would get in one bg and higher ranks(global pvp rank 20+?) in the other bgs.

Psiion

Greetings,

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