Morning cap/crap, this is ***... *sigh*

Makato

Let's face it, the morning cap is *** and stupid ...
A big group PvDooring to flip the faction in the early morning against almost no defenders...

Just one thing here, to anyone who does it ... Cyrodiil is a PvP zone ... not a PvE zone... if u wanna do PvP you wouldn't flip the entire map since no one from another faction will even try to defend against a full raid... soooo this is PvE , if u thought you we're PvPing you're not,... Maybe do a Plege with the raid ur in i mean u prolly got 20 healers 20 tanks and a million dd's in there since none of u are actually PvP specced ...

Also remember the Bleakers flip during the double AP week ?
flipping keeps to gain ap over and over again.. So much chaos around that.. but in the meantime the morning cap goes on and it's basically the same but one difference ...
They are the only ones gaining whilst ppl who wanna do a little bit of PvP in the morning before they go to work get an awful PvP experience cuz of these morning crappers...
Others pay for this game aswell... if u take part in morning capping then consider that you are ruining others fun , and you are not PvP'ing at all.

PLES STAHP TEH MURNING CRAP !

React

Less QQ, more pew pew.

Master_Fluff

But I like defending the keeps in the afternoon and evening from the angry hordes of EP/DC players who want them back.






Well, my dragonknight is fooling around on Vvardenfell right now, though.

Dracindo

"Sorry, we're closed from 3:00am to 10:00am."

The early bird gets the worm. Deal with it.

Blame yourself for not joining them. They want to PvP, but if you find sleep more important, then don't blame them for passing time in Cyrodiil while waiting for other players.

Qbiken

Liam12548 wrote: »

Less QQ, more pew pew.

I like this guy ^

Turelus

So what's you solution to stopping it?

Note that it also has to allow people who are active at those times the chance to participate as well.
You can't say night/morning capping is ruining peoples fun and that people have to stop, if stopping means those people have nothing fun to do.

GreenSoup2HoT

The biggest issue is the time to get both front and inner doors down. The ram buffs made PvD even easier.

Merlin13KAGL

Why don't they change the mechanic so you actually have to hold the necessary resources for a period of time, not just capture them while at the top of the list?

Derra

Turelus wrote: »

So what's you solution to stopping it?

Note that it also has to allow people who are active at those times the chance to participate as well.
You can't say night/morning capping is ruining peoples fun and that people have to stop, if stopping means those people have nothing fun to do.

Either make scoring based on population (of enemy factions) - meaning you can morningcap but it won´t benefit you as much as it does -
or make population caps dynamic not allowing for campaigns to be completely imbalanced pop wise.

I´d go for the latter - this forces balanced pvp. People can always reroll to a different faction.

When you say they can´t have fun anymore: Well they currently prevent the other factions from having fun. It´s a case where players actively prevent others from having fun and that should be resolved at the cost of the players doing that (ofc with alternatives).

Another option could be to create a significant malus on AP gained for a faction that outnumbers both opponents (talking like 50 to 75% of the ap earned). This would make it less desireable to play an overly dominant faction.

GreenSoup2HoT

Derra wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

So what's you solution to stopping it?

Note that it also has to allow people who are active at those times the chance to participate as well.
You can't say night/morning capping is ruining peoples fun and that people have to stop, if stopping means those people have nothing fun to do.

Either make scoring based on population (of enemy factions) - meaning you can morningcap but it won´t benefit you as much as it does -
or make population caps dynamic not allowing for campaigns to be completely imbalanced pop wise.

I´d go for the latter - this forces balanced pvp. People can always reroll to a different faction.

When you say they can´t have fun anymore: Well they currently prevent the other factions from having fun. It´s a case where players actively prevent others from having fun and that should be resolved at the cost of the players doing that (ofc with alternatives).

Another option could be to create a significant malus on AP gained for a faction that outnumbers both opponents (talking like 50 to 75% of the ap earned).

Id also go far as to increase the level of the npcs and keeps. If you only have 1 bar in your faction, all resources and keeps should be lvl 5. Or even introduce even higher levels to make it hard for pop locked factions to take any keeps from low pop factions.

Derra

GreenSoup2HoT wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

So what's you solution to stopping it?

Note that it also has to allow people who are active at those times the chance to participate as well.
You can't say night/morning capping is ruining peoples fun and that people have to stop, if stopping means those people have nothing fun to do.

Either make scoring based on population (of enemy factions) - meaning you can morningcap but it won´t benefit you as much as it does -
or make population caps dynamic not allowing for campaigns to be completely imbalanced pop wise.

I´d go for the latter - this forces balanced pvp. People can always reroll to a different faction.

When you say they can´t have fun anymore: Well they currently prevent the other factions from having fun. It´s a case where players actively prevent others from having fun and that should be resolved at the cost of the players doing that (ofc with alternatives).

Another option could be to create a significant malus on AP gained for a faction that outnumbers both opponents (talking like 50 to 75% of the ap earned).

Id also go far as to increase the level of the npcs and keeps. If you only have 1 bar in your faction, all resources and keeps should be lvl 5. Or even introduce even higher levels to make it hard for pop locked factions to take any keeps from low pop factions.

Also an option - but with the current situation on EU vivec - where DC and EP face situations of 2 to 10 players against 20 to 30 AD in a semi organised group accompanied by "solos" trying to "smallscale" it probably wouldn´t help as much.

The population is so unbalanced for vivec EU that ad can usually hold all 6 emp keeps from 6am to 6pm because they have enough numbers to dominate both factions at the same time (yesterday at 5pm we had 2bar DC + EP with poplocked + queue AD).

Turelus

Derra wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

So what's you solution to stopping it?

Note that it also has to allow people who are active at those times the chance to participate as well.
You can't say night/morning capping is ruining peoples fun and that people have to stop, if stopping means those people have nothing fun to do.

Either make scoring based on population (of enemy factions) - meaning you can morningcap but it won´t benefit you as much as it does -
or make population caps dynamic not allowing for campaigns to be completely imbalanced pop wise.

I´d go for the latter - this forces balanced pvp. People can always reroll to a different faction.

When you say they can´t have fun anymore: Well they currently prevent the other factions from having fun. It´s a case where players actively prevent others from having fun and that should be resolved at the cost of the players doing that (ofc with alternatives).

Whilst I don't fully agree with your solutions, I respect that you're willing to challenge the games system with ideas rather than just complain.

I don't think night/morning capping is a great thing either and would like it fixed, but I want a fix that makes sure everyone no matter their timezone/work hours can find something to do in Cyrodiil to help their faction win campaigns.

Makato

Derra wrote: »

Also an option - but with the current situation on EU vivec - where DC and EP face situations of 2 to 10 players against 20 to 30 AD in a semi organised group accompanied by "solos" trying to "smallscale" it probably wouldn´t help as much.

The population is so unbalanced for vivec EU that ad can usually hold all 6 emp keeps from 6am to 6pm because they have enough numbers to dominate both factions at the same time (yesterday at 5pm we had 2bar DC + EP with poplocked + queue AD).

made this thread cuz of the 3bars on ad and 1 bar for DC and EP this morning around 10:30 on vevic EU , tried to get some decent fights end up getting only 1v30ies ...

Nermy

There are a few people on Vivec [EU], and we all know who they are, who are constantly capping in the morning and they know they are destroying PvP in ESO but they don't care.

There is no point in appealing to them - they just don't care.

The onus is on ZoS to introduce some sort of mechanic to negate this action because in the end, PvP in Cyrodiil will die. I know it's a 24 hour game and I have no problem with that. It's just no one competes for the campaign anymore, there's no point. We tried. We really did but to no avail.

It's the same on Sotha Sil [EU].

@Turelus you know I talk from experience.

Darlgon

Personally, your post was at 5AM to me.. WAY too early.

That said.. that is prime time for Aussies and Kiwis.

Never forget this is a worldwide game, and your time =/= thiers.

Turelus

Nermy wrote: »

There are a few people on Vivec [EU], and we all know who they are, who are constantly capping in the morning and they know they are destroying PvP in ESO but they don't care.

There is no point in appealing to them - they just don't care.

The onus is on ZoS to introduce some sort of mechanic to negate this action because in the end, PvP in Cyrodiil will die. I know it's a 24 hour game and I have no problem with that. It's just no one competes for the campaign anymore, there's no point. We tried. We really did but to no avail.

It's the same on Sotha Sil [EU].

Turelus you know I talk from experience.

Indeed. I am fine with a solution but it would suck for those who play late into the night to have no way of contributing.

Maybe it's possible to have some keeps cycle vulnerability timers, or only outposts/towns/resources vulnerable during night hours.

Something which means a bunch of players can go in a troll enemies (and get content) by removing transit lines, but not actually taking away a whole nights progress in keeps.

Derra

Turelus wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

So what's you solution to stopping it?

Note that it also has to allow people who are active at those times the chance to participate as well.
You can't say night/morning capping is ruining peoples fun and that people have to stop, if stopping means those people have nothing fun to do.

Either make scoring based on population (of enemy factions) - meaning you can morningcap but it won´t benefit you as much as it does -
or make population caps dynamic not allowing for campaigns to be completely imbalanced pop wise.

I´d go for the latter - this forces balanced pvp. People can always reroll to a different faction.

When you say they can´t have fun anymore: Well they currently prevent the other factions from having fun. It´s a case where players actively prevent others from having fun and that should be resolved at the cost of the players doing that (ofc with alternatives).

Whilst I don't fully agree with your solutions, I respect that you're willing to challenge the games system with ideas rather than just complain.

I don't think night/morning capping is a great thing either and would like it fixed, but I want a fix that makes sure everyone no matter their timezone/work hours can find something to do in Cyrodiil to help their faction win campaigns.

The issue with faction imbalance is basically it can´t be easily adressed in positive ways.

ZOS could try to give incentive to play in a weak realm - but ultimately people won´t want to play there (even if they do get a 50% ap bonus for example) if the situation they get confronted with during the off hours is 2 vs 20.
The problem is a buff to weak factions will ultimately not change the situation because the dominant faction is under no pressure to change their succesful behavior. They still get rewarded for what they´re doing - they´re winning and the others loose but get a cookie as compensation.

I honestly believe the only solution is to make playing on an extremely dominant faction not desireable. That means you either prevent the situation of one realm having enough players to dominate both other in the first place - or you take away the reward for doing it.

Nermy

Turelus wrote: »

Nermy wrote: »

There are a few people on Vivec [EU], and we all know who they are, who are constantly capping in the morning and they know they are destroying PvP in ESO but they don't care.

There is no point in appealing to them - they just don't care.

The onus is on ZoS to introduce some sort of mechanic to negate this action because in the end, PvP in Cyrodiil will die. I know it's a 24 hour game and I have no problem with that. It's just no one competes for the campaign anymore, there's no point. We tried. We really did but to no avail.

It's the same on Sotha Sil [EU].

Turelus you know I talk from experience.

Indeed. I am fine with a solution but it would suck for those who play late into the night to have no way of contributing.

Maybe it's possible to have some keeps cycle vulnerability timers, or only outposts/towns/resources vulnerable during night hours.

Something which means a bunch of players can go in a troll enemies (and get content) by removing transit lines, but not actually taking away a whole nights progress in keeps.

Something needs to be done mate, it sucks for a lot of us. Oh and Aussies and Pacific rim players, I understand your time zones and don't wish to handicap you guys but the players who do this are European.

There has to be some intelligent solution to this. I haven't looked at our campaign score for weeks, no point. WJ just plays for fun now.

Makato

Darlgon wrote: »

Personally, your post was at 5AM to me.. WAY too early.

That said.. that is prime time for Aussies and Kiwis.

Never forget this is a worldwide game, and your time =/= thiers.

My post was too early for me aswell ... since why i posted it

Turelus

Nermy wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Nermy wrote: »

There are a few people on Vivec [EU], and we all know who they are, who are constantly capping in the morning and they know they are destroying PvP in ESO but they don't care.

There is no point in appealing to them - they just don't care.

The onus is on ZoS to introduce some sort of mechanic to negate this action because in the end, PvP in Cyrodiil will die. I know it's a 24 hour game and I have no problem with that. It's just no one competes for the campaign anymore, there's no point. We tried. We really did but to no avail.

It's the same on Sotha Sil [EU].

Turelus you know I talk from experience.

Indeed. I am fine with a solution but it would suck for those who play late into the night to have no way of contributing.

Maybe it's possible to have some keeps cycle vulnerability timers, or only outposts/towns/resources vulnerable during night hours.

Something which means a bunch of players can go in a troll enemies (and get content) by removing transit lines, but not actually taking away a whole nights progress in keeps.

Something needs to be done mate, it sucks for a lot of us. Oh and Aussies and Pacific rim players, I understand your time zones and don't wish to handicap you guys but the players who do this are European.

There has to be some intelligent solution to this. I haven't looked at our campaign score for weeks, no point. WJ just plays for fun now.

The only solutions in my mind are

• Push more campaigns together, so rather than see a three campaigns all go one colour every night they're actually forced to battle one another to achieve it.
• Disable points scoring from 00:00 to XX:XX GMT (this still allows capping, just no points gains until active times).
• Have assets which offer points be invulnerable at night hours, allow players to fight over resources/outposts/towns.
• Cycle keeps to be vulnerable at different hours, thus creating different focuses for different times.

Baconlad

Cyrodil needs its own "DLC" update so to speak. It needs to have all of cyrodil and imperial city completely and utterly reimagined. Bring us to the other large swathes of land throughout the map that we only see maybe once a week. Give us a REAL reason to do delves, or to go into uncapturable towns.

I agree its *** to cap the entire map, not fun to wake up, log on and be introduced to back keeps flagged and scrolls gone. They need to figure out a way to keep cyrodil entertaining throughout the day, so that them poor aussies and kiwis can accually fight rather than just PVDoor.

Avaglaor

Turelus wrote: »

makes sure everyone no matter their timezone/work hours can find something to do in Cyrodiil to help their faction win campaigns.

Honestly, do you thing that in EU anyone cares about winning the campaign?
There is zero interest about winning a campaign in ESO, no rewards, no Alliance pride (everyone is changing sides in the same campaign), no mechanics to help for a healthy competitive campaign.

The situation in all EU campaigns is a joke, the dominant faction is using the buffs from the morning capping as advantage in the prime time.
Its all about farming AP...

AD is winning every single TF/Vivec EU campaign for the last year, there are many comments like "stop qqing and make something to spot them".
Has anyone realized that it is just one group of people that causing this mess? You just need a 15man group at 6-7am, thats all. It just happens AD have 15-20 people playing that time every day, thats all.

Or do you think that its easy to form a group of players that can play at 6-7am every morning to stop them? And lets say that you can do it, why to do it? to win gold items with useless traits in the end of the month?

Solutions? many, here in PvP forums and in other games with RvR campaigns. But is seems that ZoS devs are checking only the NA campaigns, that if I understand correct according the to forums the things are way different.

Juli'St

Avaglaor wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

makes sure everyone no matter their timezone/work hours can find something to do in Cyrodiil to help their faction win campaigns.

Honestly, do you thing that in EU anyone cares about winning the campaign?
There is zero interest about winning a campaign in ESO, no rewards, no Alliance pride (everyone is changing sides in the same campaign), no mechanics to help for a healthy competitive campaign.

The situation in all EU campaigns is a joke, the dominant faction is using the buffs from the morning capping as advantage in the prime time.
Its all about farming AP...

AD is winning every single TF/Vivec EU campaign for the last year, there are many comments like "stop qqing and make something to spot them".
Has anyone realized that it is just one group of people that causing this mess? You just need a 15man group at 6-7am, thats all. It just happens AD have 15-20 people playing that time every day, thats all.

Or do you think that its easy to form a group of players that can play at 6-7am every morning to stop them? And lets say that you can do it, why to do it? to win gold items with useless traits in the end of the month?

Solutions? many, here in PvP forums and in other games with RvR campaigns. But is seems that ZoS devs are checking only the NA campaigns, that if I understand correct according the to forums the things are way different.

U can resume: 'people dont care about campaign in a campaign'.

Make a favor to me? Leave server guys, if u dont care about campaign in a server campaign.

TY

Nermy

Juli'St wrote: »

U can resume: 'people dont care about campaign in a campaign'.

Make a favor to me? Leave server guys, if u dont care about campaign in a server campaign.

TY

If we all did that, it would be an empty campaign. Would you prefer that? Maybe you do, then AD can PvDoor all they want.

Sandman929

Baconlad wrote: »

Cyrodil needs its own "DLC" update so to speak. It needs to have all of cyrodil and imperial city completely and utterly reimagined. Bring us to the other large swathes of land throughout the map that we only see maybe once a week. Give us a REAL reason to do delves, or to go into uncapturable towns.

I agree its *** to cap the entire map, not fun to wake up, log on and be introduced to back keeps flagged and scrolls gone. They need to figure out a way to keep cyrodil entertaining throughout the day, so that them poor aussies and kiwis can accually fight rather than just PVDoor.

Sigh....if only we'd get a full PvP DLC. More interesting siege weapons, a connection between IC and Cyrodiil (personally I'd like to see those bridges fixed so we could ride right into IC), but I just don't see it happening.

Avaglaor

Juli'St wrote: »

U can resume: 'people dont care about campaign in a campaign'.

Winning*

Juli'St wrote: »

Make a favor to me? Leave server guys, if u dont care about campaign in a server campaign.

TY

I did as soon as BG queues started working (50-50 at least).

And it seems I'm not the only one, have fun PvDooring/Zerg AP farming.

EDIT: Or do you want me to join Sotha Sil to help EP win the campaign?

AhPook_Is_Here

Liam12548 wrote: »

Less QQ, more pew pew.

More Woo Woo please.

WanderingBeithe

This is silly. I play Vivec in the mornings with AD. Am I not suppose to play if we are ahead? What about in the evenings when DC is ahead? Y'all going to stop so AD can catch up again? Shall we propose that the purple alliance be banned outright and all caught participating be banned as it could be considered unsportsmanlike? Or how DC and EP camp out in our que (supposedly) and swing the population over to their favor at prime time? Most mornings yes AD wipes the map and then we get wiped in the evenings. I thought that was kinda the point of the game?

I find it hard to believe that 10-15 players in the early hours of the European mornings can be the *only* thing that continually beats the great purple alliance AND population manipulation during prime time... over and over again.


They gave us Battlegrounds for the ultimate fair numbers fight.

Master_Kas

WanderingBeithe wrote: »

This is silly. I play Vivec in the mornings with AD. Am I not suppose to play if we are ahead? What about in the evenings when DC is ahead? Y'all going to stop so AD can catch up again? Shall we propose that the purple alliance be banned outright and all caught participating be banned as it could be considered unsportsmanlike? Or how DC and EP camp out in our que (supposedly) and swing the population over to their favor at prime time? Most mornings yes AD wipes the map and then we get wiped in the evenings. I thought that was kinda the point of the game?

I find it hard to believe that 10-15 players in the early hours of the European mornings can be the *only* thing that continually beats the great purple alliance AND population manipulation during prime time... over and over again.


They gave us Battlegrounds for the ultimate fair numbers fight.

Population manipulation? Lulz

Purple alliance is a no brainer because you take both factions gatekeeps and try to camp them aswell. Ontop of having all their scrolls + having emperor and usually the highest population when the other factions log on. What do you expect?

Edit: No salt, just trying to make you see why the horrible team purple happens.

WanderingBeithe

yeah people were talking about it the other week with the group ques. As I said, supposedly.

I understand why the purple alliance happens. I understand why Zerg Squad flipped sides. I'm sure having played so long with the AD players helps you mow them down when you show up. I also understand why people don't like seeing the map all one color. That's why they take their stuff back later and flip the map over.

The point still stands though. The object of the game is to win, take it all and win. We win.

Avaglaor

What purple alliance are u referring at?

DC zerg attacking Chalman everyday, or maybe its not DC?, maybe its ADs on their DC chars, I cant know that but it could be, this is exactly how much broken Cyrodiil's mechanics are.

So AD have all the DC/EP scrolls and emperor every morning, DC and EP ofc will try to take their scrolls back and depose the Emp and you call that purple alliance?

And yes, 15 players painting an empty map every single morning can win the campaign, I can explain you how...

They log at 6am and taking all the keeps until 7am, at that moment AD have ~100 potential points/hour while DC/EP have 0-10/hour.
DC/EP players will start joining the campaign after a few hours and they will start slowly taking back their home keeps, until then AD have made ~200-300 points more than the other alliances.

In prime time, even when your alliance is fighting well and controlling 2-3 of the enemy keeps for a few hours can only get ~10-20 points per hour more than the rest Alliances. Its impossible to close the gap from the morning capping.

I'm not blaming AD...., EP is doing the same at Sotha Sil campaign.
I'm just saying that its broken and there is no interest trying to win the campaign.