Are ZOS doing enough to stop the BOTS?

SamboJ

I've made numerous posts on the growing concern of the sheer amount of bots farming vivecs antlers. Anybody who goes there can see them, they've been reported countless times by in-game players, I even took screenshots of them (with nameplates turned on) & released them as proof of the bot activity.

These bots (when dying) are resurrecting at the nearby wayshrine, returning to their 'programmed track' & continuing to farm 24/7.

These player accounts need permanent banning to conserve the integrity of the game, there is a daedric charge that kills dolmen bots, but it won't be long before the botting software used at vivec antlers bypasses the daedric charge (simply by moving on their programmed track)

I even linked @names of ZOS staff in the hopes that something would be done about it, but nothing has happened. The fact that the bots haven't been banned after 3 days is unreal! They're farming in one of the most public grinding spots in the game for all to see.

Regards,

Sad @SamboJ

Stovahkiin

ZOS ban people who use botting software.

Eh, fighting bots isn't as easy as a lot of people seem to think. There's a reason why MMOs have problems with bots so much, and it's not like Zeni can just go and ban every person who happens to run in a circle at a dolmen. And a ZOS GM taking time to actually watch and manually ban bots individually makes very little progress in the grand scheme of things.

Phinix1

ZOS aren't doing enough to ban people using botting software.

One online GM listening to a global chat channel and responding to bots in realtime would effectively eliminate the problem.

If you honestly think the game world is too big for one GM (it isn't) then have one per faction.

SamboJ

ZOS aren't doing enough to ban people using botting software.

Stovahkiin wrote: »

Eh, fighting bots isn't as easy as a lot of people seem to think. There's a reason why MMOs have problems with bots so much, and it's not like Zeni can just go and ban every person who happens to run in a circle at a dolmen. And a ZOS GM taking time to actually watch and manually ban bots individually makes very little progress in the grand scheme of things.

There's nuances in an actual players movement, with a bot; there is no nuance, the tracks are always the same because they're programmed. Very distinguishable even from pictures.

Anti-botting software does exist, it traces similarities in players movement & can recognize exact movement replicas. Removing a few bots per day keeps the bulk of them away. Right now the bulk are running wild with no consequences.

Tannus15

ZOS aren't doing enough to ban people using botting software.

Stovahkiin wrote: »

Eh, fighting bots isn't as easy as a lot of people seem to think. There's a reason why MMOs have problems with bots so much, and it's not like Zeni can just go and ban every person who happens to run in a circle at a dolmen. And a ZOS GM taking time to actually watch and manually ban bots individually makes very little progress in the grand scheme of things.

Ultima Online used to have volunteer players who would login a mod character with a special robe and had the ability to ban characters.

That worked just fine.

Caligamy_ESO

ZOS aren't doing enough to ban people using botting software.

Its pretty obvious they're not, last night I ran into a swarm of bots in Stonefalls that literally (not figuratively) dropped my FPS.

I made a very detailed post about it last November, tagged Gina in it, and to this day those locations are still heavily botted, all day.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/306005/botting-locations-pc-na#latest

Gorilla

They don't know how for proper surveillance, and they won't do more isolated bans because of resource allocation.

In order to ban someone for rubber-banding, they actually have to get in game and, as a gamemaster, observe the act. This requires a lot of time for one of the employees to do something that should be automated.

Sad, really, but it's their design so they either don't care, aren't capable and/or planned poorly.

Phinix1

ZOS aren't doing enough to ban people using botting software.

Gorilla wrote: »

They don't know how for proper surveillance, and they won't do more isolated bans because of resource allocation.

In order to ban someone for rubber-banding, they actually have to get in game and, as a gamemaster, observe the act. This requires a lot of time for one of the employees to do something that should be automated.

Sad, really, but it's their design so they either don't care, aren't capable and/or planned poorly.

1-3 guys making $14 an hour is all it would take. They could do the job from home.

idk

Both answers seem to be saying Zos needs to do more. If it is not the intent then at least one answer needs some serious clarification.

Zos is very slow to react and deal with bots. Even when they get a clear demonstration of botting that cannot be even remotely considered anything but botting.

Funny thing is, most of those bots are gold sellers and well, they are probably not buying the game. They were certainly not buying the game when it first came out.

There was a time 3 years ago where Zos did get active in curbing bots. Seems as though that is not even a moderate priority now.

Magıc

ZOS aren't doing enough to ban people using botting software.

Well one trading guild on PC EU has recruited all the bots so their sales have shot up to ridiculous levels for their location.

I have nothing against the guild, I'm in it myself to trade, but it's still stupid.

mewcatus

ZoS, just needs to create Bot Honey Traps in game. For example, on looting items, there is a chance the player gets teleported to a phantom zone. In the phantom zone, there is a simple pattern recognition puzzle, which is easily done by humans. If the player completes it, the player gets a bonus reward pertaining to that zone (Say a set piece item from that zone.)

The simple puzzle is easy to human players, but would be a havoc to Bots and AI. I have seen such traps in other mmos, and they are effective. To add to the complexity, the layout and elements of the puzzle changes alot.

idk

mewcatus wrote: »

ZoS, just needs to create Bot Honey Traps in game. For example, on looting items, there is a chance the player gets teleported to a phantom zone. In the phantom zone, there is a simple pattern recognition puzzle, which is easily done by humans. If the player completes it, the player gets a bonus reward pertaining to that zone (Say a set piece item from that zone.)

The simple puzzle is easy to human players, but would be a havoc to Bots and AI. I have seen such traps in other mmos, and they are effective. To add to the complexity, the layout and elements of the puzzle changes alot.

And of course there would be no bugs in that puzzle that could trap a real player.

Hempyre

It's blatantly obvious, and I mean BLATANTLY...

This isn't some guy standing by a dolman with a light attack macro going, or a rubber band on the controller. There are large bot trains upwards of 5-10 toons running loops together with the EXACT same movements, stops, and attack, etc... They're not even trying to hide it...

Any player, or fabled GM if there was such a thing would know it in a heartbeat just watching them loop.

Is Zos doing enough? I think the real question is, Are they doing anything at all?

Phinix1

ZOS aren't doing enough to ban people using botting software.

Hempyre wrote: »

Is Zos doing enough? I think the real question is, Are they doing anything at all?

ZOS: "Maybe those bots will all buy portable vendors to sell all that junk they loot!" $$$

Stovahkiin

ZOS ban people who use botting software.

mewcatus wrote: »

ZoS, just needs to create Bot Honey Traps in game. For example, on looting items, there is a chance the player gets teleported to a phantom zone. In the phantom zone, there is a simple pattern recognition puzzle, which is easily done by humans. If the player completes it, the player gets a bonus reward pertaining to that zone (Say a set piece item from that zone.)

The simple puzzle is easy to human players, but would be a havoc to Bots and AI. I have seen such traps in other mmos, and they are effective. To add to the complexity, the layout and elements of the puzzle changes alot.

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

mewcatus wrote: »

ZoS, just needs to create Bot Honey Traps in game. For example, on looting items, there is a chance the player gets teleported to a phantom zone. In the phantom zone, there is a simple pattern recognition puzzle, which is easily done by humans. If the player completes it, the player gets a bonus reward pertaining to that zone (Say a set piece item from that zone.)

The simple puzzle is easy to human players, but would be a havoc to Bots and AI. I have seen such traps in other mmos, and they are effective. To add to the complexity, the layout and elements of the puzzle changes alot.

And of course there would be no bugs in that puzzle that could trap a real player.

Runescape used to have that exact kind of thing. They made it so that players who completed these events were rewarded, and the events themselves were actually just fun little mini games. They got removed from that game though because people whined that it interrupted their skilling..

uzbachchi

Phinix1 wrote: »

1-3 guys making $14 an hour is all it would take. They could do the job from home.

I volunteer.

Vipstaakki

This poll is biased.

Hempyre

You wouldn't have to pay them anything. People would volunteer, or at most a free basic account.

LordSarevok

ZOS aren't doing enough to ban people using botting software.

This needs addressed.

Cyn_v84

ZOS aren't doing enough to ban people using botting software.

And I like the minigame idea, without bugs

Emothic

ZOS ban people who use botting software.

I don't know how many of you have played other MMOs before: World of Warcraft, Runescape, League of Legdends. Botting is a serious problem that is very difficult to get rid of. It's not easy, not like "Oh I see a bot... I'll report them and they will be banned in a day or two". No it's not like that. Each game has proticols and procedures it must follow when it comes to bots. Typically when a account is reported for botting it is put into a review list. Of which can sit there for a few days untill a Employee of the gaming company gets to it to review it. Once they do they will check, re-check, and check again over the course of a few days to be 100% sure that the account is botting. This is to prevent legitment accounts from being banned for not botting. This can happen if players file false reports for whatever reason.

Now an employee won't just check one account at a time, they will be doing multiple accounts. However, due to the number of reports they get and the limited staff designated to work on it, it takes a long time for them to do. Even more so when accounts have been banned they can easily make another account and start botting again. 0

Some of you has made the usualy suggestions such as: Make mini games to stop the bots. Runescape has done this before, and for a time it did work in preventing to bots from running correctly. However, bot programmers are not stupid, and many of them find it an exciting challenge to test their coding skills. One person said that Runescape removed their mini-games because players complained about them. This is incorrect. Runescape removed their mini-games because it was no longer effective agianst bots. About 90% of bot programs could preform the mini-game correctly and accuratly.

Other usualy suggestions people say is to go after the websites or the creators of the bot programs. This is not an easy thing to do because this requires the National and International Courts of law to determind if the developers have a right to shutdown the website or creator. This becomes even more difficult across nations as each nations laws are slightly different. Doing something like this takes a lot of time and money, and even if the website is shut down another one can be created to do the same thing.


Like I've said it's not easy fighting against bot.

SamboJ

ZOS aren't doing enough to ban people using botting software.

Emothic wrote: »

I don't know how many of you have played other MMOs before: World of Warcraft, Runescape, League of Legdends. Botting is a serious problem that is very difficult to get rid of. It's not easy, not like "Oh I see a bot... I'll report them and they will be banned in a day or two". No it's not like that. Each game has proticols and procedures it must follow when it comes to bots. Typically when a account is reported for botting it is put into a review list. Of which can sit there for a few days untill a Employee of the gaming company gets to it to review it. Once they do they will check, re-check, and check again over the course of a few days to be 100% sure that the account is botting. This is to prevent legitment accounts from being banned for not botting. This can happen if players file false reports for whatever reason.

Now an employee won't just check one account at a time, they will be doing multiple accounts. However, due to the number of reports they get and the limited staff designated to work on it, it takes a long time for them to do. Even more so when accounts have been banned they can easily make another account and start botting again. 0

Some of you has made the usualy suggestions such as: Make mini games to stop the bots. Runescape has done this before, and for a time it did work in preventing to bots from running correctly. However, bot programmers are not stupid, and many of them find it an exciting challenge to test their coding skills. One person said that Runescape removed their mini-games because players complained about them. This is incorrect. Runescape removed their mini-games because it was no longer effective agianst bots. About 90% of bot programs could preform the mini-game correctly and accuratly.

Other usualy suggestions people say is to go after the websites or the creators of the bot programs. This is not an easy thing to do because this requires the National and International Courts of law to determind if the developers have a right to shutdown the website or creator. This becomes even more difficult across nations as each nations laws are slightly different. Doing something like this takes a lot of time and money, and even if the website is shut down another one can be created to do the same thing.


Like I've said it's not easy fighting against bot.

I personally believe the ban should be based on the account & the connecting devices MAC address (eg red-flagging the connecting device PC/xbox/all).

Restricting accounts & the hardware that connects to the mega-servers could work everywhere in the world with almost no negative repercussions. This would stop bots from 'coming back' even if they buy a new UserID, & make it a very expensive endeavor to run bots on ESO.

If a Gamemaster is able to remove bots in live-play I will certainly mail my resume to Zenimax. I'll work for free because I only play elder scrolls games & I don't need money.

Regards,

@SamboJ
(property developer, consultant engineer, hardware technician, software programmer, graphic designer & audio technician)

kunquatb16_ESO

ZOS aren't doing enough to ban people using botting software.

They need to use better detection methods to automatically find bots. Taking player reports is slow, has inconsistency in how people report it, and should be a supplement to detection, not the sole means.

Bot behave differently to humans, even farming humans, so detection should be possible.

Dracofyre

bots are in every known MMO games that existed, it is epic global problems with cheaters and gold farmers with selling to players and created inflated prices, they sells currencies to other players, and in return they raise prices on other looted items, that is endless cycle to get back the currencies they sells.

Nemesis7884

ZOS aren't doing enough to ban people using botting software.

there are still bots so obvioulsy no....what im wondering is, the botting problem has been around before eso for a long time...why didn't they implement an easier way to detect bots and ban them from the start?

ola.wilhelmssonb16_ESO

ZOS aren't doing enough to ban people using botting software.

Nemesis7884 wrote: »

there are still bots so obvioulsy no....what im wondering is, the botting problem has been around before eso for a long time...why didn't they implement an easier way to detect bots and ban them from the start?

Because ZOS initial setup was a naive "Trust-the-client-build", which led to the whole CE-debacle and this rampant botting phenomenon. Whatever anti-cheating mechanisms they have in place now, is probably mostly focused on preventing blatant use of CE, z-hacks and speedhacks, but that's just speculation and conjecture, on my part.

Fang_of_Lorkhaj

Bots and then I saw someone in craglorn for the first time ever post a repeat message for buying gold on a website.

Juli'St

Seems like: ZOS dont care.

Another exemple?

We have some addons with exploits too. This ll change WHEN ZOS finally prohibit addon in the game.

Mrs_Malaka

ZOS aren't doing enough to ban people using botting software.

I remember playing when the game had launched. I was with my husband in Khenarthi's Roost and I believe it was a Saturday night (NA, west coast) and they had GMs speaking in zone chat, live, asking for people to message them if they see any bots, or strange player behavior. It was really great back then because the level of them being involved was really impressive, and gave me a lot of hope for the game. Now, I still have hope but I have this feeling in the back of my head that they are not struggling business-wise and therefore don't have a need to keep up appearances, if you get my drift. :'(

Sakiri

Bots used to be worse.

I had videos up on YouTube of them for years, think I took most down.

necronomniconb14_ESO

ZOS ban people who use botting software.

SamboJ wrote: »

I've made numerous posts on the growing concern of the sheer amount of bots farming vivecs antlers. Anybody who goes there can see them, they've been reported countless times by in-game players, I even took screenshots of them (with nameplates turned on) & released them as proof of the bot activity.

These bots (when dying) are resurrecting at the nearby wayshrine, returning to their 'programmed track' & continuing to farm 24/7.

These player accounts need permanent banning to conserve the integrity of the game, there is a daedric charge that kills dolmen bots, but it won't be long before the botting software used at vivec antlers bypasses the daedric charge (simply by moving on their programmed track)

I even linked @names of ZOS staff in the hopes that something would be done about it, but nothing has happened. The fact that the bots haven't been banned after 3 days is unreal! They're farming in one of the most public grinding spots in the game for all to see.

Regards,

Sad @SamboJ

maybe they're just people that put you on the blacklist, or see your tells but couldn't care less about humoring you? if they're playing, and rezzing, even in a farming rotation that is still stuff that people (myself included in some games) do while watching tv and we are not going to bow down to some nerdy stranger that demands we respond to them or 'else they narc'. that's the easy way to get yourself reported for harassment and put on a blacklist if you did it to me