ESO PvP is pay to win.

Nermy

What a load of w*nk!

Usually it's the ones who are on slow mounts who never die! Due to turning up to the fight about 30secs too late... still, who would we get to put up camps for us...

Khyras

...Who the hell are you people? Zombies? Do i have to draw you a picture?

Speed: You see keep under attack, how fast you can get there determines whether or not you can mount effective defense, so yeah speed = increased win chance for that campaign.

Horse stamina: you get attacked while on mount, high stamina means increased chance you wont be knocked off = increased win chance for that engagement.

You can get both in crown in 5 minutes or you can wait 4 MONTHS PER CHARACTER YOU MAKE TO BE ON PAR WITH CROWN STORE WARRIORS.How the f... is that not pay to win in your book?

White wabbit

Sorry don't see that this is p2win all it means to me is that I'm riding to a faster death

Turelus

Khyras wrote: »

...Who the hell are you people? Zombies? Do i have to draw you a picture?

Speed: You see keep under attack, how fast you can get there determines whether or not you can mount effective defense, so yeah speed = increased win chance for that campaign.

Horse stamina: you get attacked while on mount, high stamina means increased chance you wont be knocked off = increased win chance for that engagement.

You can get both in crown in 5 minutes or you can wait 4 MONTHS PER CHARACTER YOU MAKE TO BE ON PAR WITH CROWN STORE WARRIORS.How the f... is that not pay to win in your book?

Well this is kind of a late argument, like two years too late.

Also if this is considered pay to win for you then you're going to hate a lot of what's coming with Morrowind, you might want to consider looking at more balanced games now.

Qbiken

Well, a shared mount riding speed/invetory/stamina would actually be nice, instead of having to w8 9 months to fully upgrade a mount :P

Dracindo

Khyras wrote: »

...Who the hell are you people? Zombies? Do i have to draw you a picture?

Speed: You see keep under attack, how fast you can get there determines whether or not you can mount effective defense, so yeah speed = increased win chance for that campaign.

Horse stamina: you get attacked while on mount, high stamina means increased chance you wont be knocked off = increased win chance for that engagement.

You can get both in crown in 5 minutes or you can wait 4 MONTHS PER CHARACTER YOU MAKE TO BE ON PAR WITH CROWN STORE WARRIORS.How the f... is that not pay to win in your book?

Pay2Win in my books means that players can make themselves much stronger than others by paying actual money.
So as long as Meridia doesn't start selling Dawnbreakers in the Crown store, that can insta-kill undead and vampires (players as well), then I don't think it's Pay2Win.

Let's say every character has a max power level of 300. If ESO adds things that will exceed that power level limit, it's Pay2Win. But in this case, the limit won't be exceeded, it's just reached faster.

These crown store horse trainings are not Pay2Win, but Pay2Skip.

Feanor

@Turelus

More on topic please. It's the Imperial horse that came with the special edition we all should be most concerned about.

Merlin13KAGL

Juhasow wrote: »

Haha I knew that this thread will finally show when I've seen few months ago thread about craft bag beeing P2W

@Juhasow To be fair, the craft bag argument has some merit in Cyrodiil.

If you're setting up a gank or being pursued, nothing will slow and bewilder an opponent like rounding the corner and coming across a pile of a thousand assorted trait stones Bananas are also highly effective (plus there is the dismount factor.)

Saturnana

Khyras wrote: »

...Who the hell are you people? Zombies? Do i have to draw you a picture?

Speed: You see keep under attack, how fast you can get there determines whether or not you can mount effective defense, so yeah speed = increased win chance for that campaign.

Horse stamina: you get attacked while on mount, high stamina means increased chance you wont be knocked off = increased win chance for that engagement.

You can get both in crown in 5 minutes or you can wait 4 MONTHS PER CHARACTER YOU MAKE TO BE ON PAR WITH CROWN STORE WARRIORS.How the f... is that not pay to win in your book?

It doesn't matter that you can buy riding skill boosts in the crown store for real money BECAUSE you can also buy them with in-game currency. And buying them with real money does not give any real, long-lasting advantages over in-game currency since you're not able to train higher than 60% either way. So no, not pay to win. More like 'pay to have a slight advantage', since the only advantage you really have is being able to level up your riding skills faster. Not higher.

Turelus

Feanor wrote: »

Turelus

More on topic please. It's the Imperial horse that came with the special edition we all should be most concerned about.

Well let's be fair, at launch it was a 1g horse whilst everyone else had to pay 17k.

As the upgrade system was based on mount not character at the time it was clearly P2W for anyone who had those advantages.

Khyras

lnsane wrote: »

Khyras wrote: »

...Who the hell are you people? Zombies? Do i have to draw you a picture?

Speed: You see keep under attack, how fast you can get there determines whether or not you can mount effective defense, so yeah speed = increased win chance for that campaign.

Horse stamina: you get attacked while on mount, high stamina means increased chance you wont be knocked off = increased win chance for that engagement.

You can get both in crown in 5 minutes or you can wait 4 MONTHS PER CHARACTER YOU MAKE TO BE ON PAR WITH CROWN STORE WARRIORS.How the f... is that not pay to win in your book?

It doesn't matter that you can buy riding skill boosts in the crown store for real money BECAUSE you can also buy them with in-game currency. And buying them with real money does not give any real, long-lasting advantages over in-game currency since you're not able to train higher than 60% either way. So no, not pay to win. More like 'pay to have a slight advantage', since the only advantage you really have is being able to level up your riding skills faster. Not higher.

Ok, why not make it 2 years to fully upgrade your mount with gold ? Hey, it wouldnt be pay to win,you could still upgrade your horse with gold!!!! Point is, waiting 4 months to fully upgrade your mount with gold PER CHARACTER is absurd.

IxSTALKERxI

Yeah there are a lot of things that are per character in this game which make making alts frustrating at times.

Nermy

Find something else to be angry about because I assure you, this is not worth it.

Turelus

Nermy wrote: »

Find something else to be angry about because I assure you, this is not worth it.

Please what would a veteran PvP player like yourself know about this Nermy. We should most definitely take the word of a new forums power (and maybe new player) over that of a guy who's done PvP since launch.

antihero727

I have seen it all now. Nerf mounts 2017.

Hoked_on_ponix

@Khyras

Out of all the broken content in the game and huge class imbalance this is you rallying point? Mount upgrades is a convenience not a pay to win. My guess is that if you had a faster mount you would just be running to your death faster.

White wabbit

Hoked_on_ponix wrote: »

@Khyras

Out of all the broken content in the game and huge class imbalance this is you rallying point? Mount upgrades is a convenience not a pay to win. My guess is that if you had a faster mount you would just be running to your death faster.

Lol well said rather rock up later with allies then get there first and be out numbered so having a fast mount is no way a pay to win

Nermy

Turelus wrote: »

Nermy wrote: »

Find something else to be angry about because I assure you, this is not worth it.

Please what would a veteran PvP player like yourself know about this Nermy. We should most definitely take the word of a new forums power (and maybe new player) over that of a guy who's done PvP since launch.

I know Tarvy... Me and my slow horses. Tsk! I might have to add that to our recruitment criteria, "Must have a fast horse!"

Just slot Rapid Maneuver and away you go... Mind you, I usually arrive at a fight late because after 3 years in Cyro, I still get lost!

Nermy

Hmmm... maybe we've all been tricked by a cleverly master-minded troll! Though I doubt it...

Merlin13KAGL

Khyras wrote: »

...Who the hell are you people? Zombies? Do i have to draw you a picture?

Speed: You see keep under attack, how fast you can get there determines whether or not you can mount effective defense, so yeah speed = increased win chance for that campaign.

Horse stamina: you get attacked while on mount, high stamina means increased chance you wont be knocked off = increased win chance for that engagement.

You can get both in crown in 5 minutes or you can wait 4 MONTHS PER CHARACTER YOU MAKE TO BE ON PAR WITH CROWN STORE WARRIORS.How the f... is that not pay to win in your book?

How long (how many days) have you been playing ESO? If you've grinded to 50, you've no room to complain.

If you've done it the long way (quested, etc), you've likely had time to level up your horse a bit - you've no room to complain.

Horse stam: stay with group, don't sprint, use Rapids (available on day one in Cyrodiil - they even give you the skillpoint to put in it)

It's not 4 months per character - you can train each character's horse each day, so it's 4 months flat. If you're having difficulty financing the 250g per day per character, well...

There's an easily obtainable, generally dirt-cheap 3 piece set that increases your mount speed (translate that to less points in speed right away, more points in stam, finish points in speed later) This set + rapids = fast enough horse for most content.

What exactly is you think you would do once you arrive so much faster? If horse training is your chief complaint, I'm guessing on the "whether or not you can mount effective defense." portion of things, the answer is likely "no."

Many a new character spent the first several days in Cyro without a mount, having to slow travel and often sneak from location to location.

This is neither pay to win, nor and issue of any kind.

Turelus

Nermy wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Nermy wrote: »

Find something else to be angry about because I assure you, this is not worth it.

Please what would a veteran PvP player like yourself know about this Nermy. We should most definitely take the word of a new forums power (and maybe new player) over that of a guy who's done PvP since launch.

I know Tarvy... Me and my slow horses. Tsk! I might have to add that to our recruitment criteria, "Must have a fast horse!"

Just slot Rapid Maneuver and away you go... Mind you, I usually arrive at a fight late because after 3 years in Cyro, I still get lost!

I wanted to start a horse subsidy program for the guild. We would pay for your horse and the full upgrades. No one liked my idea.

Jitterbug

It's not pay to win.
It's pay to get zerged down a little sooner.

Rianai

It is not pay to win, because you can get to the same result without using the crown store, it just takes longer. However i disagree that mount speed and stamina are not important in PvP. I mean, would it be still ok, if there were crown store only mounts, that had significantly higher base speed?

Sigtric

Khyras wrote: »

...Who the hell are you people? Zombies? Do i have to draw you a picture?

Speed: You see keep under attack, how fast you can get there determines whether or not you can mount effective defense, so yeah speed = increased win chance for that campaign.

Horse stamina: you get attacked while on mount, high stamina means increased chance you wont be knocked off = increased win chance for that engagement.

You can get both in crown in 5 minutes or you can wait 4 MONTHS PER CHARACTER YOU MAKE TO BE ON PAR WITH CROWN STORE WARRIORS.How the f... is that not pay to win in your book?

We understand what you are saying. We also think you are wrong.

Getting to a fight sooner does not equal a win, winning the fight equals a win

Not getting knocked off a horse and escaping is not a win, it's escaping. Getting knocked off and winning the fight is a win, regardless whether you were knocked off immediately or 10 seconds later.

It's all futile anyway - let me mspaint you a picture.

OtarTheMad

You can have all the horse speed, stamina and carry space all you want that DOES NOT mean your group/guild will take or defend a keep. It also does not have any say in whether you win a 1v1 or 1vX so your point isn't valid. Something tells me that some guilds (Haxus, VE etc) could run to a keep on foot and still save it more than lose it. Does it help? Yeah, but you still have to actually defeat the enemy.

Sandman929

I wish I could crash through groups while mounted and get a knock down...then maybe it'd be P2W.

The Uninvited

I have 6 maxed-out mounts, why am I not at the top of the leaderboards?????

Takes-No-Prisoner

NightbladeMechanics wrote: »

I've had zerglings mount up to chase me, and I was able to mount and run away from them.

I have purchased crown riding lessons in the past.

Did I p2w?

Did you remember to wave to them as you sped off?



If not then its p2w

vortexman11

Its true, mount speed is an essential part of my DK mobility when running from a zerg.

Sallington

If you had a faster mount, you'd get into a fight and get wrecked faster, and die more often.

In reality it's P2L