Stamina Heavy attacking for Magicka builds

NyassaV

Most Templar build use dual wield as a way for more spell damage and one more piece in an item set. If we are supposed to heavy attack more often to get resources back, then this idea for Magplars is more or less dead. Using a staff and heavy attacking on the back bar may just as well be more detrimental to damage. Can we get something like a bound sword or an enchantment that makes heavy attacks restore magicka?

@ZOS_RichLambert

DeadlyRecluse

Yep, magplars are going to need at least one staff equipped for PvP in Morrowind. Not the end of the world though, as it can be backbarred if you want to keep rocking dual wield frontbar.

flguy147ub17_ESO

Yeah i am curious on this too. I am leveling up a MagPlar now to make probably my main in PVP. But of course i still need to do undaunted for those passives. So i am curious what the best setup will now be for both PVP and PVE. I am going DPS as well. I am pretty sure for PVE it will still be dual swords and destro staff. But now in PVP, i might go dual wield and Resto, i really wanted to go sword and board on back bar, i guess i still can but i just gotta make sure i have a very good sustain setup.

Rex-Umbra

Yeah same problem for magicka sword and board users.

Merlin13KAGL

tbh, having stamina weapons equipped should never have boosted numbers on non-stamina skills anyway. This would have been a non-issue.

it's (been) broken that a weapon(s) you never intend to actually use would have any effect at all.

I get the reason why it's done, and that there are no arcane alternatives short of staves. I'm not complaining that you're utilizing it. I'm complaining that you've been pushed that direction from the start by ZoS.

I assume you aren't heavy attacking now for bonus regen, right?

t3hdubzy

I AGREE

Asmael

Use your backbar weapon to recover magicka.

DisgracefulMind

Asmael wrote: »

Use your backbar weapon to recover magicka.

This. Is. Too. Good.

idk

Most, if not all, top performing PvE magplar builds use a staff on one bar. BoE does to much damage to leave it out of a rotation.

Minno

Definitely need channeled focus. Backbar resto? So one heavy attack will get you back to using dual weld? 74 pts in arcanist, rest in heavy attack regen.

Though it would be difficult to replace 8% direct dmg boost of fire or 8% boost to AOE with lighting.

You'd still see dual swords in PvP where dmg would be needed for the burst.

DisgracefulMind

Minno wrote: »

Definitely need channeled focus. Backbar resto? So one heavy attack will get you back to using dual weld? 74 pts in arcanist, rest in heavy attack regen.

Though it would be difficult to replace 8% direct dmg boost of fire or 8% boost to AOE with lighting.

You'd still see dual swords in PvP where dmg would be needed for the burst.

I'll mostly likely use resto/dual wield in PvP still. I just find dual wield to be far more efficient as a Magicka Templar. Will be fairly easy to regen magicka, and you keep some tankiness with having resto on back bar. Only difference will be less blocking, but that's quite alright, and I'm okay with this. I actually missed resto/dual wield Templar, but felt pinned into running sword and shield backbar because of how efficient it was. Now that that is not going to be the case, There are a lot more options. I guess that's one positive to this patch.

#REVERTREPENTANCENERF

Minno

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

Definitely need channeled focus. Backbar resto? So one heavy attack will get you back to using dual weld? 74 pts in arcanist, rest in heavy attack regen.

Though it would be difficult to replace 8% direct dmg boost of fire or 8% boost to AOE with lighting.

You'd still see dual swords in PvP where dmg would be needed for the burst.

I'll mostly likely use resto/dual wield in PvP still. I just find dual wield to be far more efficient as a Magicka Templar. Will be fairly easy to regen magicka, and you keep some tankiness with having resto on back bar. Only difference will be less blocking, but that's quite alright, and I'm okay with this. I actually missed resto/dual wield Templar, but felt pinned into running sword and shield backbar because of how efficient it was. Now that that is not going to be the case, There are a lot more options. I guess that's one positive to this patch.

#REVERTREPENTANCENERF

I agree, Dual weld resto will be pretty clutch for PVP still. Resto staff let's to roll support or solo healing while dual weeld boost sources that are either AOE or single target for flexibility (the calling card of the Templar IMHO)

Vesper_BR

It's is the same issue with mag dks on pvp...

usmcjdking

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

Definitely need channeled focus. Backbar resto? So one heavy attack will get you back to using dual weld? 74 pts in arcanist, rest in heavy attack regen.

Though it would be difficult to replace 8% direct dmg boost of fire or 8% boost to AOE with lighting.

You'd still see dual swords in PvP where dmg would be needed for the burst.

I'll mostly likely use resto/dual wield in PvP still. I just find dual wield to be far more efficient as a Magicka Templar. Will be fairly easy to regen magicka, and you keep some tankiness with having resto on back bar. Only difference will be less blocking, but that's quite alright, and I'm okay with this. I actually missed resto/dual wield Templar, but felt pinned into running sword and shield backbar because of how efficient it was. Now that that is not going to be the case, There are a lot more options. I guess that's one positive to this patch.

#REVERTREPENTANCENERF

DW/S&B magplar was born out of group play and was terrible solo or small man on magplar against players with strong pocket burst (which is just about everyone this patch). Magplar has, and will continue to suffer from front bar health sustain because you only typically have two things going -

Extended Ritual which ticks once every 2 seconds for a mediorce amount.
Sweeps which, if you're fighting something that roots, won't heal you for anything.

This is the equivalent of stam not running rally. Back barred rapid regen has always been the go to for solo magplar IMO - otherwise you just end up spending a majority of your time BOL spamming until your next bats.

timidobserver

Heavy attack into the bar swap back to your main bar. Not exactly a fun addition to our rotation but it will work.

DisgracefulMind

usmcjdking wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

Definitely need channeled focus. Backbar resto? So one heavy attack will get you back to using dual weld? 74 pts in arcanist, rest in heavy attack regen.

Though it would be difficult to replace 8% direct dmg boost of fire or 8% boost to AOE with lighting.

You'd still see dual swords in PvP where dmg would be needed for the burst.

I'll mostly likely use resto/dual wield in PvP still. I just find dual wield to be far more efficient as a Magicka Templar. Will be fairly easy to regen magicka, and you keep some tankiness with having resto on back bar. Only difference will be less blocking, but that's quite alright, and I'm okay with this. I actually missed resto/dual wield Templar, but felt pinned into running sword and shield backbar because of how efficient it was. Now that that is not going to be the case, There are a lot more options. I guess that's one positive to this patch.

#REVERTREPENTANCENERF

DW/S&B magplar was born out of group play and was terrible solo or small man on magplar against players with strong pocket burst (which is just about everyone this patch). Magplar has, and will continue to suffer from front bar health sustain because you only typically have two things going -

Extended Ritual which ticks once every 2 seconds for a mediorce amount.
Sweeps which, if you're fighting something that roots, won't heal you for anything.

This is the equivalent of stam not running rally. Back barred rapid regen has always been the go to for solo magplar IMO - otherwise you just end up spending a majority of your time BOL spamming until your next bats.

You don't need to tell me how to play a Magicka Templar, believe me, I know how.

It honestly just depends on what you build for on live currently. I play mostly alone or with 1-3 other people (when I do actual group play, I heal, so that's irrelevant to this conversation). I have no issues sustaining sword and board + dual wield and rather like the playstyle. However, I played resto/dual wield for a long time, and will be going back to it for Morrowind.

You're right, however, we do suffer when we need to go into heavy pressure because we're trapped by channels on almost every ability we use for damage. But honestly, how you play your Magplar is personal preference. I know plenty of excellent small scale Magplars who run snb/dw and plenty who run resto/dw or destro.

I won't be back-barring rapid regen next patch, either. I'd rather healing ward into my damage. But that's just me. Again, preference and playstyle.

Nazarousb14_ESO

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

tbh, having stamina weapons equipped should never have boosted numbers on non-stamina skills anyway. This would have been a non-issue.

it's (been) broken that a weapon(s) you never intend to actually use would have any effect at all.

I get the reason why it's done, and that there are no arcane alternatives short of staves. I'm not complaining that you're utilizing it. I'm complaining that you've been pushed that direction from the start by ZoS.

I assume you aren't heavy attacking now for bonus regen, right?

ZOS has come out again and again saying this is working as intended, "higher reward for higher risk builds"

And yes I am heavy attacking every 8 secs to apply IA debuff to the target.

Lore_lai

I'll probably try a combination of Destro/Resto or what I do now - Destro/S&B, switching to Lightning staff because I prefer the channel heavies.
I don't like weaving with DW (I get lots of desynchs weaving sweeps). I also think the passives from the destro line, coupled with the utility I can get from magicka restore, outweigh what DW can give me.

Depending on how my stam sustain will be, the choice will be between S&B and Resto. It's situational. I sometimes do fully charged heavies on my S&B for stam if need be, but it's not ideal.

JD - sweeps heal is meh at worst and situationally decent at best - yeah if you jab a grp of people then maybe you'll get decent heal. On my FTC I probably get more HPS from a Rapid Regen ticking on me than from Sweeps heal.

DisgracefulMind

Lore_lai wrote: »

I'll probably try a combination of Destro/Resto or what I do now - Destro/S&B, switching to Lightning staff because I prefer the channel heavies.
I don't like weaving with DW (I get lots of desynchs weaving sweeps). I also think the passives from the destro line, coupled with the utility I can get from magicka restore, outweigh what DW can give me.

Depending on how my stam sustain will be, the choice will be between S&B and Resto. It's situational. I sometimes do fully charged heavies on my S&B for stam if need be, but it's not ideal.

JD - sweeps heal is meh at worst and situationally decent at best - yeah if you jab a grp of people then maybe you'll get decent heal. On my FTC I probably get more HPS from a Rapid Regen ticking on me than from Sweeps heal.

Sweeps heal is terrible, I agree. And it's going to be worse this patch, that's the best part xD

I was considering lightning/snb, but I really hate lightning staff with sweeps, but who knows, it might end up being something to get used to. I was considering destro/resto as well, I can see that being incredibly powerful. I just want this on live already so I can find what I like and don't like at this point /:

Minno

Lore_lai wrote: »

I'll probably try a combination of Destro/Resto or what I do now - Destro/S&B, switching to Lightning staff because I prefer the channel heavies.
I don't like weaving with DW (I get lots of desynchs weaving sweeps). I also think the passives from the destro line, coupled with the utility I can get from magicka restore, outweigh what DW can give me.

Depending on how my stam sustain will be, the choice will be between S&B and Resto. It's situational. I sometimes do fully charged heavies on my S&B for stam if need be, but it's not ideal.

JD - sweeps heal is meh at worst and situationally decent at best - yeah if you jab a grp of people then maybe you'll get decent heal. On my FTC I probably get more HPS from a Rapid Regen ticking on me than from Sweeps heal.

I've had success using restoring rune +jabs with another hot source. But only if locked in a corner, otherwise another heal is better.

Beardimus

They have been killing DW off patch by patch for Magika builds, its no surprise really. Unsure why the hate, its an interesting playstyle.

The whole rune & 1H skill line rumour sounded like the reason but that died a death just some fancy marketing..

Lore_lai

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Sweeps heal is terrible, I agree. And it's going to be worse this patch, that's the best part xD

I was considering lightning/snb, but I really hate lightning staff with sweeps, but who knows, it might end up being something to get used to. I was considering destro/resto as well, I can see that being incredibly powerful. I just want this on live already so I can find what I like and don't like at this point /:

Oh yeah lol - I remember they nerfed the heal on it because we got Major Mending. Hah! The irony...
And yup! I want the patch to be out already too! Like - I want to test so much stuff open-world and it just won't work in a PTS environment :c

DisgracefulMind

Lore_lai wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Sweeps heal is terrible, I agree. And it's going to be worse this patch, that's the best part xD

I was considering lightning/snb, but I really hate lightning staff with sweeps, but who knows, it might end up being something to get used to. I was considering destro/resto as well, I can see that being incredibly powerful. I just want this on live already so I can find what I like and don't like at this point /:

Oh yeah lol - I remember they nerfed the heal on it because we got Major Mending. Hah! The irony...
And yup! I want the patch to be out already too! Like - I want to test so much stuff open-world and it just won't work in a PTS environment :c

Yep! We lose Major Mending and there's no compensation to the sweeps heal for it when it had been nerfed to make room for Major Mending in the first place. I wish ZoS would think some of these things through.
And yeah, I did a few duels on PTS in a few different setups, but duels are nothing compared to open world, so there's no point in testing right now. I just want to get it over with so I can go back to PvPing and enjoying it. q.q

Feanor

It's not just about the damage. The possibility to have 2 5 piece bonuses is really valuable too. Staffs have the short end on this as well.

Emma_Overload

Merlin13KAGL wrote: »

tbh, having stamina weapons equipped should never have boosted numbers on non-stamina skills anyway. This would have been a non-issue.

it's (been) broken that a weapon(s) you never intend to actually use would have any effect at all.

I get the reason why it's done, and that there are no arcane alternatives short of staves. I'm not complaining that you're utilizing it. I'm complaining that you've been pushed that direction from the start by ZoS.

I assume you aren't heavy attacking now for bonus regen, right?

Agree with this 100%! Stamina weapons on magicka builds was always an abomination, so I'm not sorry to see it go.

Valkysas154

Yea i been sending feedback on pts since the 2ed day about my solo magplar that uses s/b i don't think they care.

Olupajmibanan

Moondancer 5pc bonus makes up for that

Other mag DPS don't have the nasty Moondancer buff.

In these terms, having possibility to go DW is a blessing.