Siphoning attacks

Arrchangell

So how about changing this skill again, cause right now it's useless. It's trying to be 2 things at the same time while being bad at both. The sustain is gone, 400 stamina/magicka on light/heavy attack is worthless, and the heal ain't gonna save u. Nb's get 1 shot in end game content no amount of healing is gonna keep u alive.

idk

Seems your on PC. Go and test it. Play with it and provide your feedback from that. Just a suggestion.

Autolycus

It is basically useless now, yeah.

That 400 stamina/magicka return is next to nothing for most people who need it. Tanking will probably be okay, but I have more testing to do on this before I can say for certain.

One major fundamental flaw with this as it is currently, is that it requires the resource it returns in order to cast. So... if I'm using the stamina morph, I need stamina to cast it in order to get my stam back. This is a pretty big oversight, considering that during the Warden showcase on ESO Live they explicitly mentioned that the Netch was free so that needing a resource in order to obtain a resource was not an issue. Well, thanks for not extending that consideration to NBs, who are currently in last place for almost everything, with sustain being the only real highlight of the class currently.

Nightblades don't need any more healing. What in Oblivion gave ZOS the idea that our healing was insufficient to begin with? It's the second easiest class to both complete vMA and obtain Flawless Conqueror. It's the easiest open-world solo class specifically because of it's sustain and self-healing potential, and maybe burst damage too.

idk

Autolycus wrote: »

It is basically useless now, yeah.

That 400 stamina/magicka return is next to nothing for most people who need it. Tanking will probably be okay, but I have more testing to do on this before I can say for certain.

One major fundamental flaw with this as it is currently, is that it requires the resource it returns in order to cast. So... if I'm using the stamina morph, I need stamina to cast it in order to get my stam back. This is a pretty big oversight, considering that during the Warden showcase on ESO Live they explicitly mentioned that the Netch was free so that needing a resource in order to obtain a resource was not an issue. Well, thanks for not extending that consideration to NBs, who are currently in last place for almost everything, with sustain being the only real highlight of the class currently.

Nightblades don't need any more healing. What in Oblivion gave ZOS the idea that our healing was insufficient to begin with? It's the second easiest class to both complete vMA and obtain Flawless Conqueror. It's the easiest open-world solo class specifically because of it's sustain and self-healing potential, and maybe burst damage too.

I don't see this feedback as very accurate in its description.

Iirc heavy and light attacks still prod the skill and return resources. For free and doesn't require time to cast the buff.

Further, Zos toned down the netch when making it free and seems to be fairly in line with the Templar channeled focus. But requires a cash time.

Synozeer

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Autolycus wrote: »

It is basically useless now, yeah.

That 400 stamina/magicka return is next to nothing for most people who need it. Tanking will probably be okay, but I have more testing to do on this before I can say for certain.

One major fundamental flaw with this as it is currently, is that it requires the resource it returns in order to cast. So... if I'm using the stamina morph, I need stamina to cast it in order to get my stam back. This is a pretty big oversight, considering that during the Warden showcase on ESO Live they explicitly mentioned that the Netch was free so that needing a resource in order to obtain a resource was not an issue. Well, thanks for not extending that consideration to NBs, who are currently in last place for almost everything, with sustain being the only real highlight of the class currently.

Nightblades don't need any more healing. What in Oblivion gave ZOS the idea that our healing was insufficient to begin with? It's the second easiest class to both complete vMA and obtain Flawless Conqueror. It's the easiest open-world solo class specifically because of it's sustain and self-healing potential, and maybe burst damage too.

I don't see this feedback as very accurate in its description.

Iirc heavy and light attacks still prod the skill and return resources. For free and doesn't require time to cast the buff.

Further, Zos toned down the netch when making it free and seems to be fairly in line with the Templar channeled focus. But requires a cash time.

I think what he means is that Siphoning Strikes has a casting cost of X stamina or magicka, and it takes Y amount of light attacks before you break even and can begin to actually gain resources.

In PVP it's not so easy landing light attacks consistently, and the buff is only active for 20 seconds, so there's a good chance you won't be able to regain your resources or break even, and if you do, the net return will be so small that it's not worth using. And even with a net gain in resources, you have to wait for most likely 12-20 seconds before you reach that point (and being active the entire time light attacking with your attacks and hitting).

If you're a tank wearing heavy armor, the skill is even worse because you won't have the cost reduction passives of medium armor, and it will take even more light attacks before you can start gaining resources.

Oh, and the healing is also pretty bad, especially in PvP. Most HoTs outperform this by a wide margin.

Arrchangell

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Seems your on PC. Go and test it. Play with it and provide your feedback from that. Just a suggestion.

I did test it, that's why im saying hope they will change something. The heal is around 1600 hp on light attack, ok seems nice, but it's not gonna save u in vet trials. The stamina gain is super low, especially cause u have to light attack every time, and ofc u need to be good at weaving to finally get some "good" sustain. The skill cost 2k stamina to cast, so just to regain the spent stamina u need to light attack 7 times, and the buff lasts 20 sec. Even if u're good player u're barely gonna do 10 attack. So in the end u get like a 1000 stamina + hp.

Now this skill is useless, and it was unique for them.

olsborg

It is useless, you have to light atk ppl quite alot to just break even, the heal is trivial at best, its not worth a slot, it became the new power extraction, aka collecting dust not being used by anyone.

Autolycus

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Autolycus wrote: »

It is basically useless now, yeah.

That 400 stamina/magicka return is next to nothing for most people who need it. Tanking will probably be okay, but I have more testing to do on this before I can say for certain.

One major fundamental flaw with this as it is currently, is that it requires the resource it returns in order to cast. So... if I'm using the stamina morph, I need stamina to cast it in order to get my stam back. This is a pretty big oversight, considering that during the Warden showcase on ESO Live they explicitly mentioned that the Netch was free so that needing a resource in order to obtain a resource was not an issue. Well, thanks for not extending that consideration to NBs, who are currently in last place for almost everything, with sustain being the only real highlight of the class currently.

Nightblades don't need any more healing. What in Oblivion gave ZOS the idea that our healing was insufficient to begin with? It's the second easiest class to both complete vMA and obtain Flawless Conqueror. It's the easiest open-world solo class specifically because of it's sustain and self-healing potential, and maybe burst damage too.

I don't see this feedback as very accurate in its description.

Iirc heavy and light attacks still prod the skill and return resources. For free and doesn't require time to cast the buff.

Further, Zos toned down the netch when making it free and seems to be fairly in line with the Templar channeled focus. But requires a cash time.

Siphoning
Leeching Strikes (Siphoning Strikes morph): This morph now converts the ability into a Stamina ability and causes your Light and Heavy Attacks to restore Stamina based on your character level.
Siphoning Attacks (Siphoning Strikes morph): This morph now causes your Light and Heavy Attacks to also restore Magicka based on your character level.
Siphoning Strikes:
This ability now causes your Light and Heavy Attacks to restore Health instead of Magicka or Stamina.
Increased the duration of this ability and its morphs to 20 seconds from 15 seconds.

"This morph now converts to a stamina ability." In other words, it costs stamina. If I'm out of stamina, how do I cast this buff to get stamina back? This is the opposite of what they stated in the ESO Live stream with respect to the Netch. Anything specific about the Netch itself is currently under NDA and cannot be discussed. The same applies to the magicka morph; it costs magicka to cast (to be fair, it always did, but it restored enough resources to make it worthwhile to cast).

It lasts 20s now instead of 15s. Nowhere does it say that we no longer have to cast the skill. It costs resources to use, and has to be reapplied every 20s. That means it still requires us to dedicate one global cooldown every 20s in order to keep this buff active, something that could be dedicated to popping a synergy, or using some other skill.

If I pop a Mystic or Energy Orb, not only do I get back an instant 4% of all resources (which for a magicka build is more than 1600 magicka, for a stamina build is probably closer to 1450), but I also get a steady return of those resources at approximately 2000 up-front, and another 1000 over 10s (feel free to double-check my values, I'm not looking at tooltips). I can do this once every 15s, and (using magicka as an example) the total restored is approximately 4600 magicka and can be stacked with the other morph. If both are used (it is common in trials to use both morphs and have them running at all times if possible) we get a total potential return of approximately 9000 magicka. These can be synergized by the same individual or anyone; it doesn't matter who pops it, as long as we are close enough, but I get more back if I'm the one who pops it. This also assumes a number of mobs are surrounding the group for Mystic Orb. Energy Orb is based on allies in proximity, not enemies.

In 15s I will do approximately 15 light attacks, assuming I miss none and my rotation is perfect, and I do not substitute any of these with bar-swap cancelling or block cancelling (which is very common, the real # of light attacks comes in around 12 per 15s). 400 magicka per light attack x 15s = 6000 magicka restored. Remember to deduct the up-front cost, so it's less than 6k.

With 12 people in group and at least half of them popping these orbs, Undaunted passives drastically out-pace SA now. Sad part is, we were already taking advantage of these passives to afford us the necessary sustain, so this update is a net loss, and a pretty bad one imho.

Personally, I was sustaining in trials without using SA most of the time. With Ele Drain and constant Orbs, it wasn't necessary. So at face value it might seem like, "why is this a big deal, then?" And that would be a fair point. The real issue comes into play when we start factoring 25% higher costs on all of our skills (assuming you put everything into Warlord/Magician) and 10% reduced regen (also on the high end).