Maelstrom staff nirnhoned

Xenofex

Hello,
I got maelstrom lightning staff (nirnhoned).

My testing showed that this staff is worthless, since it is doing less damage than ordinary lightning staff (sharpened) in PvE. (I am wearing 5 piece light armor) I also tried allocate 50 champion points in spell penetration, it does not change anything.

Am I correct?

IronCrystal

Yes, that is correct. Sharp or nothing on front bar.

FerrumnCutem

Sharpened is the only way to deal damage atm.
Nirnhoned is practically useless except for research.

Turelus

FerrumnCutem wrote: »

Sharpened is the only way to deal damage atm.
Nirnhoned is practically useless except for research.

Using Maelstrom weapons for research. What an age of ESO to be playing in.

Iyas

Xenofex wrote: »

Hello,
I got maelstrom lightning staff (nirnhoned).

My testing showed that this staff is worthless, since it is doing less damage than ordinary lightning staff (sharpened) in PvE. (I am wearing 5 piece light armor) I also tried allocate 50 champion points in spell penetration, it does not change anything.

Am I correct?

Not rly correct. Use it with spinners and youll get good results. Or use the MSA staff only on backbar and a sharpened Staff on the mainbar. The buff from the MSA staff alone is a good dps increase

Izaki

You can still use it on the back bar if you don't linger there for too long.

Masel

Iyas wrote: »

Xenofex wrote: »

Hello,
I got maelstrom lightning staff (nirnhoned).

My testing showed that this staff is worthless, since it is doing less damage than ordinary lightning staff (sharpened) in PvE. (I am wearing 5 piece light armor) I also tried allocate 50 champion points in spell penetration, it does not change anything.

Am I correct?

Not rly correct. Use it with spinners and youll get good results. Or use the MSA staff only on backbar and a sharpened Staff on the mainbar. The buff from the MSA staff alone is a good dps increase

Thiiiiis

Flaminir

Save it... Do NOT use it for research/Decon...

What if they tweak a couple of traits in morrowind and nirn gets stronger? How annoyed would you be then!

Turelus

Flaminir wrote: »

Save it... Do NOT use it for research/Decon...

What if they tweak a couple of traits in morrowind and nirn gets stronger? How annoyed would you be then!

TBH I can see this happening eventually even if not with Morrowind, so as always Flaminir speaks sense.

The meta is going to shift again one day and traits will become viable again, the down side is all the junk we need to find somewhere to store.

Morgul667

Same here

Lose the nirn staff and keep it for later update if this traits gets a buff someday

Duiwel

Some people do argue that charged lightning is also good, but OP I am on the side of Sharpened or nothing. Simply because I am old school...

Last time I used nirnhoned items was around TG launch (for my sorc) he had x2 sharpened Julianos swords and x2 Nirnhoned Torug's Pact.

Xenofex

Iyas wrote: »

Xenofex wrote: »

Hello,
I got maelstrom lightning staff (nirnhoned).

My testing showed that this staff is worthless, since it is doing less damage than ordinary lightning staff (sharpened) in PvE. (I am wearing 5 piece light armor) I also tried allocate 50 champion points in spell penetration, it does not change anything.

Am I correct?

Not rly correct. Use it with spinners and youll get good results. Or use the MSA staff only on backbar and a sharpened Staff on the mainbar. The buff from the MSA staff alone is a good dps increase

Spinner is not an option, since Necropotence is better. I would use Spinner as second set, if there would be heavy and medium armor versions (for undaunted mettle passive), but there are none...

jakeedmundson

I want to say someone did testing on this .... random lightning sharpened staff vs. non sharpened/BIS traited maelstrom lightning staff...

For a heavy attack build the mal staff still came out on top as long as blockade is active 100%
For the usual frag/pet build on a sorc the sharpened staff will be better though.

If someone finds that post... please link it.

Vildebill

Turelus wrote: »

FerrumnCutem wrote: »

Sharpened is the only way to deal damage atm.
Nirnhoned is practically useless except for research.

Using Maelstrom weapons for research. What an age of ESO to be playing in.

That's how I got my last nirnhoned weapons researched Nirn ice staff, no thanks!

Masel

Save it. What you can do is for example on a magplar use 5 spinner on jewels and 2 body, 5 julianos with precise swords and that vMA staff on the back bar, or use it in a DK heavy attack build on the back bar. A lot of things you can do with it
And I agree, once nirn might become useful again, you never know...

jakeedmundson

Flaminir wrote: »

Save it... Do NOT use it for research/Decon...

What if they tweak a couple of traits in morrowind and nirn gets stronger? How annoyed would you be then!

I, for one, would be EXTREMELY annoyed if sharpened gets moved to be the weaker trait.... you know how many times i've done vma?? Only things i'm missing are a sharpened inferno, and any sharpened 2-hander (plus some random nirnhoned items i need for research just to save some gold)

However... if they just bumped a couple other traits up to compete with sharpened.... absolutely all for it.

inf.toniceb17_ESO

Slot spinner's set and you won't need sharp weps ever again. Ninhoned, precise, infused, charged all of these will work great.

psychotic13

inf.toniceb17_ESO wrote: »

Slot spinner's set and you won't need sharp weps ever again. Ninhoned, precise, infused, charged all of these will work great.

Don't listen to this guy, a sharpened trait gives like 5000 something pen? While spinners 5pc gives 4000. Nirnhoned weapon gives an extra like 100 spell damage? a 5pc of BSW gives like 650?

Masel

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Flaminir wrote: »

Save it... Do NOT use it for research/Decon...

What if they tweak a couple of traits in morrowind and nirn gets stronger? How annoyed would you be then!

I, for one, would be EXTREMELY annoyed if sharpened gets moved to be the weaker trait.... you know how many times i've done vma?? Only things i'm missing are a sharpened inferno, and any sharpened 2-hander (plus some random nirnhoned items i need for research just to save some gold)

However... if they just bumped a couple other traits up to compete with sharpened.... absolutely all for it.

All it needs to make traits useful is tweaking numbers. Precise up to 12-13% (more would make it too strong in heavy crit damage modifier builds), nirnhoned to 33% (would give ~600 SD with major sorcery) ... This way you can stack either crit or weapon damage with them and the increase somewhat matches sharpened.

Charged can stay as it is (maybe double the damage from status effects while equipped), has its uses. Infused is too weak right now (just doubles enchantment strength with 40% less CD and 20% more strength) make it 50% reduction and 50% more strength.

Powered can stay (and maybe increase damage form light and heavy attacks by a % margin), decisive should just be 34% more ultimate. Sounds strong, but it is just a 34% increase on damage from your ultimate and would make ulti gen builds a lot more interesting.

starkerealm

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Flaminir wrote: »

Save it... Do NOT use it for research/Decon...

What if they tweak a couple of traits in morrowind and nirn gets stronger? How annoyed would you be then!

I, for one, would be EXTREMELY annoyed if sharpened gets moved to be the weaker trait.... you know how many times i've done vma?? Only things i'm missing are a sharpened inferno, and any sharpened 2-hander (plus some random nirnhoned items i need for research just to save some gold)

However... if they just bumped a couple other traits up to compete with sharpened.... absolutely all for it.

What do you suppose the odds are, after all these years, that any tweak won't result in a different BiS?

inf.toniceb17_ESO

psychotic13 wrote: »

inf.toniceb17_ESO wrote: »

Slot spinner's set and you won't need sharp weps ever again. Ninhoned, precise, infused, charged all of these will work great.

Don't listen to this guy, a sharpened trait gives like 5000 something pen? While spinners 5pc gives 4000. Nirnhoned weapon gives an extra like 100 spell damage? a 5pc of BSW gives like 650?

Well ideally you should run charged weps with spinner but it desnt matter that much in my expirience.
Here's some food for thought: http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/shining-force-magicka-templar-ranged-vmadd-build/

Masel

psychotic13 wrote: »

inf.toniceb17_ESO wrote: »

Slot spinner's set and you won't need sharp weps ever again. Ninhoned, precise, infused, charged all of these will work great.

Don't listen to this guy, a sharpened trait gives like 5000 something pen? While spinners 5pc gives 4000. Nirnhoned weapon gives an extra like 100 spell damage? a 5pc of BSW gives like 650?

OK a few things:

Armor pen: 100 Base+ 5280 Major Breach+ 5160 Sharpened+4884 LA Passive+ 3000 Alkosh+ 1994 Infused Crusher=20268 Pen

At 18200 resistance your over top for all times when alkosh and crusher are active. So the 1k less pen from spinner will not affect your dps at all.

Nirnhoned gives 175 spell damage with major sorcery.

BSW gives 480 spell damage at full uptime with sorcery, but you will mostly have an uptime of ~60% on non DKs. So the difference would be around 250-300 spell damage, BUT with spinner you keep the pen at the back bar which compensates for that. Then having infused/charged/precise on the front bar with get you an additional benefit. So yes, you don't need sharpened.

jakeedmundson

Masel92 wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Flaminir wrote: »

Save it... Do NOT use it for research/Decon...

What if they tweak a couple of traits in morrowind and nirn gets stronger? How annoyed would you be then!

I, for one, would be EXTREMELY annoyed if sharpened gets moved to be the weaker trait.... you know how many times i've done vma?? Only things i'm missing are a sharpened inferno, and any sharpened 2-hander (plus some random nirnhoned items i need for research just to save some gold)

However... if they just bumped a couple other traits up to compete with sharpened.... absolutely all for it.

All it needs to make traits useful is tweaking numbers. Precise up to 12-13% (more would make it too strong in heavy crit damage modifier builds), nirnhoned to 33% (would give ~600 SD with major sorcery) ... This way you can stack either crit or weapon damage with them and the increase somewhat matches sharpened.

Charged can stay as it is (maybe double the damage from status effects while equipped), has its uses. Infused is too weak right now (just doubles enchantment strength with 40% less CD and 20% more strength) make it 50% reduction and 50% more strength.

Powered can stay (and maybe increase damage form light and heavy attacks by a % margin), decisive should just be 34% more ultimate. Sounds strong, but it is just a 34% increase on damage from your ultimate and would make ulti gen builds a lot more interesting.

I agree with most of that... but for nirnhoned (the hardest trait to find/craft) SHOULD truly be the best trait... As much as i don't want to have to re-farm stuff... it would make sense.

Maybe make nirnhoned add small amounts of multiple things...
ex.

---

4% crit chance + 5% weapon damage + 2500 penetration (on a 2-h)

Not exactly those values, but you know what i mean.... Make nirnhoned worth using!

EDIT: Also... i'm not trying to be biased towards making nirnhoned stronger just because i have 3 or 4 nirnhoned maelstrom infernos

Brrrofski

I double bar destro.


Use my nirn Maelstrom on back bar with wall of elements there with mostly buffs and dots. Stick them down, swap to from bar with sharpened staff and use spammable, most dot ticks from back bar tick with sharpened weapon out.

Masel

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Masel92 wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Flaminir wrote: »

Save it... Do NOT use it for research/Decon...

What if they tweak a couple of traits in morrowind and nirn gets stronger? How annoyed would you be then!

I, for one, would be EXTREMELY annoyed if sharpened gets moved to be the weaker trait.... you know how many times i've done vma?? Only things i'm missing are a sharpened inferno, and any sharpened 2-hander (plus some random nirnhoned items i need for research just to save some gold)

However... if they just bumped a couple other traits up to compete with sharpened.... absolutely all for it.

All it needs to make traits useful is tweaking numbers. Precise up to 12-13% (more would make it too strong in heavy crit damage modifier builds), nirnhoned to 33% (would give ~600 SD with major sorcery) ... This way you can stack either crit or weapon damage with them and the increase somewhat matches sharpened.

Charged can stay as it is (maybe double the damage from status effects while equipped), has its uses. Infused is too weak right now (just doubles enchantment strength with 40% less CD and 20% more strength) make it 50% reduction and 50% more strength.

Powered can stay (and maybe increase damage form light and heavy attacks by a % margin), decisive should just be 34% more ultimate. Sounds strong, but it is just a 34% increase on damage from your ultimate and would make ulti gen builds a lot more interesting.

I agree with most of that... but for nirnhoned (the hardest trait to find/craft) SHOULD truly be the best trait... As much as i don't want to have to re-farm stuff... it would make sense.

Maybe make nirnhoned add small amounts of multiple things...
ex.

---

4% crit chance + 5% weapon damage + 2500 penetration (on a 2-h)

Not exactly those values, but you know what i mean.... Make nirnhoned worth using!

EDIT: Also... i'm not trying to be biased towards making nirnhoned stronger just because i have 3 or 4 nirnhoned maelstrom infernos

This wouldn't solve the rng issue if nirn becomes significantly better than the rest. A trait can be best,but not by that significant amount. I like the current trait design in general, the numbers are just way off. I agree that nirn should be a lot better than now, maybe best by a small margin (1% maybe), but not significant.

And to all people saying sharpened or nothing, if you want to put yourself to the mindless grind you do that, but you could also settle for something that is within 5% damage of that and have a fun life in ESO.

IronCrystal

Masel92 wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Masel92 wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Flaminir wrote: »

Save it... Do NOT use it for research/Decon...

What if they tweak a couple of traits in morrowind and nirn gets stronger? How annoyed would you be then!

I, for one, would be EXTREMELY annoyed if sharpened gets moved to be the weaker trait.... you know how many times i've done vma?? Only things i'm missing are a sharpened inferno, and any sharpened 2-hander (plus some random nirnhoned items i need for research just to save some gold)

However... if they just bumped a couple other traits up to compete with sharpened.... absolutely all for it.

All it needs to make traits useful is tweaking numbers. Precise up to 12-13% (more would make it too strong in heavy crit damage modifier builds), nirnhoned to 33% (would give ~600 SD with major sorcery) ... This way you can stack either crit or weapon damage with them and the increase somewhat matches sharpened.

Charged can stay as it is (maybe double the damage from status effects while equipped), has its uses. Infused is too weak right now (just doubles enchantment strength with 40% less CD and 20% more strength) make it 50% reduction and 50% more strength.

Powered can stay (and maybe increase damage form light and heavy attacks by a % margin), decisive should just be 34% more ultimate. Sounds strong, but it is just a 34% increase on damage from your ultimate and would make ulti gen builds a lot more interesting.

I agree with most of that... but for nirnhoned (the hardest trait to find/craft) SHOULD truly be the best trait... As much as i don't want to have to re-farm stuff... it would make sense.

Maybe make nirnhoned add small amounts of multiple things...
ex.

---

4% crit chance + 5% weapon damage + 2500 penetration (on a 2-h)

Not exactly those values, but you know what i mean.... Make nirnhoned worth using!

EDIT: Also... i'm not trying to be biased towards making nirnhoned stronger just because i have 3 or 4 nirnhoned maelstrom infernos

This wouldn't solve the rng issue if nirn becomes significantly better than the rest. A trait can be best,but not by that significant amount. I like the current trait design in general, the numbers are just way off. I agree that nirn should be a lot better than now, maybe best by a small margin (1% maybe), but not significant.

And to all people saying sharpened or nothing, if you want to put yourself to the mindless grind you do that, but you could also settle for something that is within 5% damage of that and have a fun life in ESO.

For min-maxers as myself, the best possible weapons are necessary to perform to the maximum. Even as a healer I grinded for specific resto and lightning staves to get the best performance possible, and I still play around with my ratio of divines to infused pieces.

Masel

IronCrystal wrote: »

Masel92 wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Masel92 wrote: »

jakeedmundson wrote: »

Flaminir wrote: »

Save it... Do NOT use it for research/Decon...

What if they tweak a couple of traits in morrowind and nirn gets stronger? How annoyed would you be then!

I, for one, would be EXTREMELY annoyed if sharpened gets moved to be the weaker trait.... you know how many times i've done vma?? Only things i'm missing are a sharpened inferno, and any sharpened 2-hander (plus some random nirnhoned items i need for research just to save some gold)

However... if they just bumped a couple other traits up to compete with sharpened.... absolutely all for it.

All it needs to make traits useful is tweaking numbers. Precise up to 12-13% (more would make it too strong in heavy crit damage modifier builds), nirnhoned to 33% (would give ~600 SD with major sorcery) ... This way you can stack either crit or weapon damage with them and the increase somewhat matches sharpened.

Charged can stay as it is (maybe double the damage from status effects while equipped), has its uses. Infused is too weak right now (just doubles enchantment strength with 40% less CD and 20% more strength) make it 50% reduction and 50% more strength.

Powered can stay (and maybe increase damage form light and heavy attacks by a % margin), decisive should just be 34% more ultimate. Sounds strong, but it is just a 34% increase on damage from your ultimate and would make ulti gen builds a lot more interesting.

I agree with most of that... but for nirnhoned (the hardest trait to find/craft) SHOULD truly be the best trait... As much as i don't want to have to re-farm stuff... it would make sense.

Maybe make nirnhoned add small amounts of multiple things...
ex.

---

4% crit chance + 5% weapon damage + 2500 penetration (on a 2-h)

Not exactly those values, but you know what i mean.... Make nirnhoned worth using!

EDIT: Also... i'm not trying to be biased towards making nirnhoned stronger just because i have 3 or 4 nirnhoned maelstrom infernos

This wouldn't solve the rng issue if nirn becomes significantly better than the rest. A trait can be best,but not by that significant amount. I like the current trait design in general, the numbers are just way off. I agree that nirn should be a lot better than now, maybe best by a small margin (1% maybe), but not significant.

And to all people saying sharpened or nothing, if you want to put yourself to the mindless grind you do that, but you could also settle for something that is within 5% damage of that and have a fun life in ESO.

For min-maxers as myself, the best possible weapons are necessary to perform to the maximum. Even as a healer I grinded for specific resto and lightning staves to get the best performance possible, and I still play around with my ratio of divines to infused pieces.

Of course, I get that, I have the BiS setups for stamp and mag (and tank/heal too) myself, but I don't actively grind for anything, I just take it when I get it and prefer using different setups to test stuff all I'm saying is that it is not necessary to put yourself through the grind and that there are things our there that perform close to BiS. Telling people that everything else is trash (as a lot of people on these forums do) is just nonsense and can be falsified by easy ingame math and parses.

QuebraRegra

FerrumnCutem wrote: »

Sharpened is the only way to deal damage atm.
Nirnhoned is practically useless except for research.

Can we get this shouted to the Heavens above!?!?!? (ie ZOS)

Seriously, it's crap now, yet we still have the ridiculous rarity barring normal research progress. Nirn crap should drop everywhere like the rest. Remove the blockade.