Guilds: Problems, Solutions, and what we need!

MissBizz

I'm sorry in advance if this is super long. Please feel free to comment what problems/solutions you have with guilds, along with items you feel would be very helpful. If you agree with some or all of these, feel free to comment below and use /feedback in game to emphasize what you feel is needed most!

I started a guild in May 2014. Social, friendly, casual. We have been going strong since then. Once One Tamriel was announced, we definitely saw an influx of players into the guild. Once it was released, we saw an even larger and constant influx. Morrowind announced? We are having to revisit out inactivity policy because we just can't get everyone in. With that said though, I feel we really do need some help with guilds. It was stated on the 2016 Road Ahead that guild QOL features were being worked on. Obviously things came push to shove, and we didn't get a chance to see that. I'd really love to see some changes to guilds sooner rather than later. These things are my thoughts and opinions, feel free to share yours.

Problem #1 - New Players don't even know guilds exist, or what they are.
Let's be real here folks, a LOT of players come to ESO from the single player TES games. Yes, many folks come from other MMO's so likely understand guilds, but a whole ton don't. I run into players fairly often that have no idea what a guild is. Once I get to explain that it's a community within the game, it's how you can sell stuff on the traders you see around etc. they instantly ask how to find one, or to join.

Bonus problem: People don't know guilds exist or how to use them.. to the point that when someone joins and everyone says welcome but there's no reply... we shortly thereafter put in chat that you need to type /g1 (or whichever number of guild) to talk in guild chat. 99% of the time, they say hello within seconds

Solution #1 - Optional quest in starter zone
Maybe they will skip the starter zone, sure. At least there would be something. Although.. once they know what a guild is and how many benefits they have.. you may run into...


Problem #2 - New Players can't find guilds.
Other than zone chat - there is 0 way for players to find a guild in ESO. Really. Now, let's see. The ESO subreddit has a weekly thread, I believe there is an ESO Guild subreddit, maybe Tamriel Foundry forums, and the ESO forums. ESO forums are already tough because many folks miss their invite, or don't receive one at all. Also, MANY players do not go outside of the game for game things.

Solution #2 - UI Search for guilds
It could be a board in town like crafting writs, or just a random option in your UI - a way to search for guilds! Search for type (PvP, PvE, Social, RP etc.), search for language (I'm on NA but I'm sure this would be even more useful on EU) etc.


Problem #3 - Relaying information to guild members
Alright, this one is tough. We DO have a message of the day, but guess what - it's not big enough! I'm guildmaster of a social guild that has regular weekly events. You're pretty much allowed a few words to explain your event because the MOTD is simply not big enough. When you are trying to state what the event is, day, time, any special concerns etc. and have (counting in my head here...) 6+ events per week.. it's just not enough.

I try to not spam the guild with mails (which can make social bans and lets just not go there) so I REALLY try to limit those to when something extremely important is happening - but it's just plain needed sometimes because you can't fit all the info in the MOTD!

Solution #3 - Events Calendar, Higher character limit on MOTD
Depending on your guild, different approaches could be taken. If you're a guild that their MOTD is full of events, and events calendar (bonus if guildees can RSVP for events) would darn near empty the MOTD - so it can be used for more "odd" things. Maybe this wouldn't help for guilds that are not event heavy though. Have a ton of raffles to put in the MOTD for your trading guild? Larger MOTD character limit! An events calendar would be HUGE I believe - even for trading guilds, you could be listing when your auctions/raffles are etc.


Problem #4 - Guild bank thieves, or a full bank since no one can be trusted
We've been robbed. Twice. That was way back. Once they took every little thing (even the bait that was so worthless pre-perfect roe), the second time - they only took the "good stuff". So now only officers, and some higher ranked members may access the guild bank. This is terrible. Tons of players deposit stuff they don't need (and that higher level players consider pretty much worthless), but the new players haven't earned the rank to grab it themselves and are too shy to ask. Now we have a full bank with stuff people could use, but don't have access to. On the flip side, we could open it up to all, and run the risk of being robbed (*ehem* or "people using the guild bank as intended by removing every single item since they can" for people who apparently don't consider it stealing).

Solution #4 - Tiered Banks, Bank Withdrawal Limits
"All or nothing" of withdrawal needs to go. We need some tiers. Have a few epic or legendary motifs that are being held for the winner of a guild event? Top tier so only officers can touch. All those green recipes that at this point I'm sure are worth more to vendor? Free for all - anyone can have. Or if that's too much (although I believe would be a much better system) at least add withdrawal limits. Not flat across, limits that can be set per rank.

As the guildmaster of a 500 member guild which is now considering tightening up on it's inactivity policy just to be able to get players in so we can help them out... I plead for some help from you Zos. We really need some QoL features. Running a guild can be stressful, time-consuming, and not something everyone wants to do - so help us out here.

TLDR; Guildmasters need some serious QoL help here.

anadandy

I agree with a lot of this - and it's not just large guilds. Speaking as someone who co-runs a smallish guild (100 players), I would also find many of these suggestions helpful. Particular the tiered bank access - we have the same issue. You either open the bank up to everyone and hope for the best, or you lock it down and potentially miss new/needy players who are too shy to ask for things they need.

And yes to a higher character limit in the MotD - I edit myself SO HARD

kakarot482_ESO

Major props to you and all the other guild leaders out there @MissBizz! I was in the MoL trial run last night and had a great time! As someone who plays more casually, simply because RL doesn't leave me a lot of extra free time, I really appreciate active guilds that have the leadership and help to run multiple, varied events on different nights of the week.

I support all of these suggestions, especially for some kind of UI for guild searching. It would require a lot less searching outside of the game, which can eat up a lot of time, even for older players who are maybe looking for a new guild. I know that I have switched guilds from time to time, when an old one goes quiet or I get kicked out because I couldn't keep up with trading requirements *cough* >>;

jlboozer

These are some very good and well thought out ideas. I agree 100%...I hope ZoS listens, especially about the guild bank item limits.

MissBizz

kakarot482_ESO wrote: »

Major props to you and all the other guild leaders out there MissBizz! I was in the MoL trial run last night and had a great time! As someone who plays more casually, simply because RL doesn't leave me a lot of extra free time, I really appreciate active guilds that have the leadership and help to run multiple, varied events on different nights of the week.

I support all of these suggestions, especially for some kind of UI for guild searching. It would require a lot less searching outside of the game, which can eat up a lot of time, even for older players who are maybe looking for a new guild. I know that I have switched guilds from time to time, when an old one goes quiet or I get kicked out because I couldn't keep up with trading requirements *cough* >>;

As a guildmaster - you have no idea how much I appreciate the guild members. It's the guild members that generally run events, as well as guild members who join in on them and make them so much fun! Glad you had a good time! I wasn't able to make it as I'm catching up from being at Pax, but I'll be in next week's trial run

Cpt_Teemo

Server wide market auction house please, but instant buyouts

Turelus

Great post and a lot of the issues which people have being addressed.

I hope ZOS listen, the whole guild system is long overdue for an update. Also they need to fix the stacking in guild banks, I can't use Roomba any more because ESO+ craft bag.

Flaminir

I can't echo these sentiments nearly as much as I'd like... we're still operating on basically the exact same footing as when the game first launched, Guild stuff seems to have been totally ignored.

On top of the excellent ideas mentioned above....

• In addition to the events calendar I would like to see an event sign up feature. With a feature along similar lines to specifying your role type in group finder... No good when you have a trials event to find you have 12 DPS and no tanks/healers!
  
• Ability to set templates for, and send a welcome message/mail to all new members automatically upon joining. These would be SO useful to welcome people, give them basics like how to use guild chat, and the basics of what goes on in that particular guild, events, expectations etc.

runagate

Problem #1 - Lack of interview process to at least ascertain is a prospective guild member has an amenable personality.

The first guild that I joined that was actually good did this. It was a pvp guild so perhaps it was a little more important than a casual pve guild but it was nonetheless the only guild that didn't set itself up for future conflict.


Problem #2 - Guild officers that are grandfathered in who do nothing and give bad advice

Just because someone is a casual player does not justify giving everyone bad, biased and incorrect information about this strangely opaque game.

Problem #3 - Absentee Guildmasters who do not pay attention to their own houses

Not even paying a minimum attention to one's own guild, culling those who exhibit exploitative, selfish behavior or those who cause others to not want to participate, or even chat or use voice communications, end with a sterile, inactive guild roster while the purpose of the guild withers.

lolo_01b16_ESO

Ever heard of Guild Events Improved?
Or do you do that many events that you manage to need more characters that can be fit into the message of the day?

But would be nice if zos would try to solve your first 2 issues.

Cpt_Teemo

I don't really see why an 'Invterview' is really needed to join a guild, just takes a step way to far imo, just invite anyone and if they mess up then boot em no need for this whole 'interviewing' bs tbh.

kakarot482_ESO

MissBizz wrote: »

As a guildmaster - you have no idea how much I appreciate the guild members. It's the guild members that generally run events, as well as guild members who join in on them and make them so much fun! Glad you had a good time! I wasn't able to make it as I'm catching up from being at Pax, but I'll be in next week's trial run

From what I've seen, it seems like having great officers and help is the magic ingredient that really makes a guild active and lasting! It's got to be way too much for one person. All the helpful people in LWH are the best! Although I could be biased.

@runagate Those three things you listed are definitely problems, but I don't see how there should be an expectation that ZoS should provide a mechanic to fix them? Especially numbers 2 and 3...probably just on the player to recognize that the guild isn't for them and leave to find another.

MissBizz

anadandy wrote: »

I agree with a lot of this - and it's not just large guilds. Speaking as someone who co-runs a smallish guild (100 players), I would also find many of these suggestions helpful. Particular the tiered bank access - we have the same issue. You either open the bank up to everyone and hope for the best, or you lock it down and potentially miss new/needy players who are too shy to ask for things they need.

And yes to a higher character limit in the MotD - I edit myself SO HARD

Yes, I imagine these would be just as helpful and well received in a smaller guilds too!

Turelus wrote: »

Great post and a lot of the issues which people have being addressed.

I hope ZOS listen, the whole guild system is long overdue for an update. Also they need to fix the stacking in guild banks, I can't use Roomba any more because ESO+ craft bag.

@Turelus there was an update to Roomba so it works even if you have a craft bag

Flaminir wrote: »

I can't echo these sentiments nearly as much as I'd like... we're still operating on basically the exact same footing as when the game first launched, Guild stuff seems to have been totally ignored.

On top of the excellent ideas mentioned above....

• In addition to the events calendar I would like to see an event sign up feature. With a feature along similar lines to specifying your role type in group finder... No good when you have a trials event to find you have 12 DPS and no tanks/healers!
  
• Ability to set templates for, and send a welcome message/mail to all new members automatically upon joining. These would be SO useful to welcome people, give them basics like how to use guild chat, and the basics of what goes on in that particular guild, events, expectations etc.

Definitely Agree on the signup feature @Flaminir ! That's what I had meant by adding an RSVP portion to it. That would be FANTASTIC! I never even thought of the welcome mail, but that actually sounds super helpful!

runagate wrote: »

Problem #1 - Lack of interview process to at least ascertain is a prospective guild member has an amenable personality.

The first guild that I joined that was actually good did this. It was a pvp guild so perhaps it was a little more important than a casual pve guild but it was nonetheless the only guild that didn't set itself up for future conflict.


Problem #2 - Guild officers that are grandfathered in who do nothing and give bad advice

Just because someone is a casual player does not justify giving everyone bad, biased and incorrect information about this strangely opaque game.

Problem #3 - Absentee Guildmasters who do not pay attention to their own houses

Not even paying a minimum attention to one's own guild, culling those who exhibit exploitative, selfish behavior or those who cause others to not want to participate, or even chat or use voice communications, end with a sterile, inactive guild roster while the purpose of the guild withers.

@runagate do you really feel these are issues that Zos could help with? If so, how?

Turelus

MissBizz wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Great post and a lot of the issues which people have being addressed.

I hope ZOS listen, the whole guild system is long overdue for an update. Also they need to fix the stacking in guild banks, I can't use Roomba any more because ESO+ craft bag.

@Turelus there was an update to Roomba so it works even if you have a craft bag

I live in a bubble apparently. Thanks, I uninstalled it before I left last year and just never checked it again since.
Will download when I get home tonight, +1 insightful.

MissBizz

lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »

Ever heard of Guild Events Improved?
Or do you do that many events that you manage to need more characters that can be fit into the message of the day?

But would be nice if zos would try to solve your first 2 issues.

Missed this one, sorry! Specifically in LWHs case, we do just plain have too many events to fit in the MoTD. I imagine this add-on could work well for smaller guilds, but attempting to have a large amount of people install an add-on could be quite tricky.

Elloa

Wonderful post @MissBizz

I agree very much on some of the specific points presented here, and I'd like to underline what I like (and maybe add my little touch)
As for my background i've been guild leader OR officers in many games, starting in WOW vanilla. I've lead RP guild, social guild, PVP guild (Yes!!! i did that!) and semi-hardcore raiding guild

Solution #1 - Optional quest in starter zone
Maybe they will skip the starter zone, sure. At least there would be something. Although.. once they know what a guild is and how many benefits they have.. you may run into...

A tutorial quest in the line of the Housing quest is a brillant idea! It could be something pretty simple, a bit humorous, that even end up by the guild leader to kick the player that just finish it. Something that would introduce the players, roleplaying-wise to the guild system, and good social behaviour, like for example "not stealing the bank"
This quest would introduce to: social aspect, function as guild bank and guild store, tabard, chat etc...

Solution #2 - UI Search for guilds
It could be a board in town like crafting writs, or just a random option in your UI - a way to search for guilds! Search for type (PvP, PvE, Social, RP etc.), search for language (I'm on NA but I'm sure this would be even more useful on EU) etc.

That may be tricky, but it could be a great addition, especially for Console players, I suppose. But this really need to avoid the problem that WOW does have where unguilded players are being spammed to recieve an invite, and are "ninja invited". Especially as we have the possibility of being part of 5 guilds in ESO, if a player choose to be part of only few, he can still be the target of spamm invites.

I think that guilds could have the possibility to "register" their announce, with a max of characters ofc (maybe Twitter size), and players could consult them, and then apply for the guild if interested. Maybe a optionel system of application in game that could be set up by the GM with few questions (The guild master fill up 5 questions that the applicant will have to fill up. The the GM can revise application before to accept or decline them)
Obviously I think that Guild that prefer a traditionel system of applications via forums, or whatever way they choose, should be encouraged aswell.



As for the Guild Bank, it is very needed to have bank tabs and permissions, like in World of Warcraft (which is a good example of functionning guild Bank imho)

Elloa

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

I don't really see why an 'Invterview' is really needed to join a guild, just takes a step way to far imo, just invite anyone and if they mess up then boot em no need for this whole 'interviewing' bs tbh.

This is up to each guild to organise themselves the way they wish so. Some guild might prefer to invite anyone and then kick troublemakers, other guild have a very restricted recruitment for whatever reasons they might choose. And this is great because that's what guild are all about. it's communities, tribes, clans, and not all guilds should function the same way.

In my community, I choose a very restricted recruitment, not because we are elitist and what not, but because I want to keep a small guild where everyone feel good and at ease.The strict recruitment is a way to discourage players that are not serious about joining and just poke the first guild they heard about.This allow me to not have to kick players, which I prefer. But this is not a better or a worst system, it's just the system that suit the community I try to build. Other guilds will have other needs and other recruitment strategies.

MissBizz

Elloa wrote: »

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

I don't really see why an 'Invterview' is really needed to join a guild, just takes a step way to far imo, just invite anyone and if they mess up then boot em no need for this whole 'interviewing' bs tbh.

This is up to each guild to organise themselves the way they wish so. Some guild might prefer to invite anyone and then kick troublemakers, other guild have a very restricted recruitment for whatever reasons they might choose. And this is great because that's what guild are all about. it's communities, tribes, clans, and not all guilds should function the same way.

In my community, I choose a very restricted recruitment, not because we are elitist and what not, but because I want to keep a small guild where everyone feel good and at ease.The strict recruitment is a way to discourage players that are not serious about joining and just poke the first guild they heard about.This allow me to not have to kick players, which I prefer. But this is not a better or a worst system, it's just the system that suit the community I try to build. Other guilds will have other needs and other recruitment strategies.

Yes I believe it's up to the guild. I can imagine tight-knit, trials etc. guilds definitely having an interview process. On the other hand, the reason I created LWH was due to not being able to find a guild, being new so I didn't meet "requirements" for some guilds I saw, and was generally very intimidated by an interview process. I would have just... never joined a guild. So we have a more open policy.

Elloa wrote: »

<Snip so it's not so long>
That may be tricky, but it could be a great addition, especially for Console players, I suppose. But this really need to avoid the problem that WOW does have where unguilded players are being spammed to recieve an invite, and are "ninja invited". Especially as we have the possibility of being part of 5 guilds in ESO, if a player choose to be part of only few, he can still be the target of spamm invites.

I think that guilds could have the possibility to "register" their announce, with a max of characters ofc (maybe Twitter size), and players could consult them, and then apply for the guild if interested. Maybe a optionel system of application in game that could be set up by the GM with few questions (The guild master fill up 5 questions that the applicant will have to fill up. The the GM can revise application before to accept or decline them)
Obviously I think that Guild that prefer a traditionel system of applications via forums, or whatever way they choose, should be encouraged aswell.



As for the Guild Bank, it is very needed to have bank tabs and permissions, like in World of Warcraft (which is a good example of functionning guild Bank imho)

@Elloa Yes, the way I imagine is that the guild can fill out what they are, have some specific picks (like language etc.) and then a spot for "About us" kind of thing. Players could then view this and if they would like more info or to join, they could put in a request or just mail the guildmaster or whatever contact was put there. It wouldn't auto-invite anyone. I think part of the reason you get the invite-spam sometimes seen is because there is not an easy way to let people know about your guild in game.

ComboBreaker88

There have been dozens of threads about this. I've made one or two of them. They always go unanswered.

Potenza

My suggestion to - Problem #4 - Guild bank thieves, or a full bank since no one can be trusted

Instead of having a limit on withdrawals - have separate bank tabs where you can offer full access to new people in a certain tab and no access to other tabs. This will also enable "Sorting" - a novel idea for ZoS - wish I could do my own sorting in my own bank.

MissBizz

ComboBreaker88 wrote: »

There have been dozens of threads about this. I've made one or two of them. They always go unanswered.

Yes, yes there have. I don't want Zos to think that we gave up and are okay with how things currently are though. I think we have a better chance of getting a response or seeing action if we keep it in front of their eyes.

j.murro2ub17_ESO wrote: »

My suggestion to - Problem #4 - Guild bank thieves, or a full bank since no one can be trusted

Instead of having a limit on withdrawals - have separate bank tabs where you can offer full access to new people in a certain tab and no access to other tabs. This will also enable "Sorting" - a novel idea for ZoS - wish I could do my own sorting in my own bank.

Yes, that's what I attempted to explain by using "tiers". Highly preferred over a withdrawal limit, but at this point I'd take almost anything.

ComboBreaker88

Being able to adjust the sales tax would be huge too. Also adding the ability to see what each member had for sale in the guild via their member notes. Also making it so if a player looses the ability to sell their items are not shown in the store until that privilege has been restored.

Messaging an entire rank of people would be awesome.

Being able to charge for trader selling access via the guild store would be amazing.

Having prizes chest and guild lotteries done through the actual game would be nice too.

kargen27

Kyle1983b14_ESO wrote: »

Server wide market auction house please, but instant buyouts

No.

Kaymorolis

It would be nice, given the new housing system, for guilds to have an actual guild hall.

Sure, many guilds tell people that some persons home (like the GM) is the guild hall, but that doesn't feel right. For one, the entire guild can't meet there.

So here are some specific suggestions:
1. Allow one home to be purchased by guild funds, and is tied to the existence of the guild. If the guild is disbanded, the home goes away. Perhaps the one home could be upgraded later on with additional guild funds (like going from an apartment to a manor or something)
2. Increase the number of people allowed in the guild home at the same time. A lot. At least 2 or 3x the current max. Note that although I know people complain about the number allowed in personal homes, this suggestion is specific for guild homes.
3. Give everyone in the guild an option to teleport directly to the guild home. Kind of like how you can port to your own default home.
4. Let anyone in the guild deposit items in the home. Again, perhaps we can bump the number of items allowed in guild homes.

RebornV3x

I agree with the whole guild thing I ran a guild early on got robbed twice and it pretty much killed the guild I've never played an mmo where the guild bank didn't have withdrawal limits based on guild rank so pretty much me and my friend were the only people allowed to withdraw.

MissBizz

Just so everyone knows, if you have posted a problem along with suggestions for the solution I'll try to add them to the OP soon.

SunnyBunny

I'm going to try not to ramble here but here are some suggestions of things I've seen in other games or thought of

1) Guild halls - in order to get one you had to literally fight for it. The options of places was limited but it gives you a sort of pride knowing you fought for it.

2) having a guild registry building, where you could go and find out about guilds and who was recruiting. It would be nice and maybe in a starter zone. So no matter what lvl you are when you feel it's time you can join one. Maybe even put it in the banks.

3) a formated welcome message to new members would be nice, before I invite someone to any of the guilds I'm a member of I usually talk to them for a bit, let them know how to talk in chat, how to change chat color, etc

4) something I have heard about while reading the forum is when a guild leader steps away from the game you can't "hand the guild ownership" to a new person. This seems like something that would be good to do.

5) different teared player with guild bank access. Maybe like a treasure trove for low lvl guilded and like a hoard for higher levels. Everyone would be able to see what was in there and would be able to ask a higher lvl person if they could have it.

6) Maybe an option of when a guild hits the limit then they have a sort of slush guild? Or something. I don't know about that just an idea...

SunnyBunny

Oh and guild banners for housing would be nice

Rohamad_Ali

ZoS said they were looking into more options to manage guilds for the last three years . It seems everything was put on the back burner for other stuff . Guilds are a huge part of making things great for players and the nails holding the trade system in place . ZoS needs to prioritize this and not pass it up for new proc sets or shiney costumes .

A limit to the amount of withdrawling from guild banks option .

A guild recruitment vendor .

More guild tabard options . It's so hard to tell guilds apart because how limited those are . Everyone has skull and swords .

Fix the double guild duping for store vendors . Disbanding a bogus guild should not undercut other active guilds .

Make a 60 or 90 guild leader inactive vote available for new leadership .

@ZOS_JessicaFolsom and @ZOS_GinaBruno please give us some honest time to when guilds will get the attention they've needed for years .

Shadow-Fighter

Guild tabbards (symbol) on costumes. I hope you understand what i mean

MissBizz

Shadow-Fighter wrote: »

Guild tabbards (symbol) on costumes. I hope you understand what i mean

Yes. You mean you want tabards to show over costumes?