if you left YOUR full guild, would you ever consider insisting they change their name?

technohic

Let him keep it. Not much of a brand if it starts getting to be synonymous with being self serving to the guild leader who comes and goes and takes it with him as he pleases.

Lythandra

If you like the guild name, just make it once the existing one changes it then invite the nice people over. The old guild leader who left is irrelevant at this point.

idk

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Well, I used to lead a guild for two years. That is HARD WORK and required a lot of time.

But they were nice people and we were happy, so yeah.

Then over the course of time some people left (real life, other games, etc...), new people joined. A new "guild culture" emerged, which I felt increasingly uncomfortable with. (People more interested in builds, numbers, achievements than in other people as humans, to sum it up).

As things became more and more obvious, I chose to give the crown over to someone whom I felt was able to run it in the long-term, with its new "mentality", and left.

Now I regret it. I should have organized for them to create their new guild instead of giving them "mine". I do mind that they use a name and an envelope that *I* created and liked and cared about, for creating a thing that I don't like, that I don't want to be associated with. It doesn't feel right.

I agree that things are bound to change and that I wasn't there to "dictate" a mentality and I accepted that. But using the name (and everything related to it : image, vocal server, website) that I used to be proud of for something that I am not proud of isn't right.

OP, if you have the slightest respect and are even a little bit thankful for what your former Guild Master did for you and your guild, just change the name as he asks.

@anitajoneb17_ESO

The situation is very different. The previous guild leader left the game so the reasons are not that the guild changed. The previous guild leader does not even play the game or see the guild name being used.

The previous guild leader obviously created his guild which is an extremely poor way to lead a guild. Even as he was leaving the game he considered it his guild which is why he wanted the name changed.

Members get attached to a guild and the name is part of that attachment. Guild leaders who are so self centered they do not consider what it's members want should not be guild leaders to begin with.

seaef

Ojustaboo wrote: »

KaiVox22 wrote: »

First world problems right here

I think that's my second most hatred phrase

Except is does have the benefit of showing pampered special snowflakes how insignificant their pampered little problems are.

You know, the same people who have a life crisis over a badly crafted artisan latte.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

The situation is very different. The previous guild leader left the game so the reasons are not that the guild changed. The previous guild leader does not even play the game or see the guild name being used.

The previous guild leader obviously created his guild which is an extremely poor way to lead a guild. Even as he was leaving the game he considered it his guild which is why he wanted the name changed.

Members get attached to a guild and the name is part of that attachment. Guild leaders who are so self centered they do not consider what it's members want should not be guild leaders to begin with.

OK the situation is different, but I just wanted to give an example as to why a guild name could still matter to someone who has left it.

That being said... I have some questions :

- How, in your opinion, could the guild become a nice place to which people have become attached, if the leadership was so bad ?
- Even if the former GM was bad, he still is the one who created and managed the guild, so you should be thankful to him for existing as such
- What does it cost you to disband the guild and create a new one with the same people and a different name ? I understand you're "attached to the name" but is it such a big deal ?

I don't want to put some psychoanalytical stuff into this... but ... if you're happy that this guy's gone and you're attached to the guild, you should perhaps cut this ombilical cord once and for all - including changing the guild's name.

That being said, you're in the strong position anyway : if he's left the guild, he can't force you to change the name, by any means, and ZOS certainly won't interfere into something like that.

RoamingRiverElk

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

RoamingRiverElk wrote: »

I'd respect his wishes and change the guild name to something the community felt was good.

Guild names cannot be changed. Disbanding the guild and reforming is the only choice and with that one will always find some players who did not get the memo and think they got kicked and never come back including some who were out of game for a few days so the memo was deleted by the system before they got a chance to see it.

The bickering in this thead is pointless. OP clearly wanted peoples thoughts on the subject and nothing more.

Actually I've seen guild name get changed because the guild owner asked support to do so.

idk

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

The situation is very different. The previous guild leader left the game so the reasons are not that the guild changed. The previous guild leader does not even play the game or see the guild name being used.

The previous guild leader obviously created his guild which is an extremely poor way to lead a guild. Even as he was leaving the game he considered it his guild which is why he wanted the name changed.

Members get attached to a guild and the name is part of that attachment. Guild leaders who are so self centered they do not consider what it's members want should not be guild leaders to begin with.

OK the situation is different, but I just wanted to give an example as to why a guild name could still matter to someone who has left it.

That being said... I have some questions :

- How, in your opinion, could the guild become a nice place to which people have become attached, if the leadership was so bad ?
- Even if the former GM was bad, he still is the one who created and managed the guild, so you should be thankful to him for existing as such
- What does it cost you to disband the guild and create a new one with the same people and a different name ? I understand you're "attached to the name" but is it such a big deal ?

I don't want to put some psychoanalytical stuff into this... but ... if you're happy that this guy's gone and you're attached to the guild, you should perhaps cut this ombilical cord once and for all - including changing the guild's name.

That being said, you're in the strong position anyway : if he's left the guild, he can't force you to change the name, by any means, and ZOS certainly won't interfere into something like that.

People can enjoy the game with those in the guild even if the guild leader is self centered.

Did not suggest not be thankful for GM's work during his tenure. But the guild is everyone's guild, not just his so the name is not just his. I doubt he has hit copyrighted.

Disbanding the guild can cost members that may be offline for a few days so they did nto see the memo and hence think they just got kicked. Also, a lot of work for a guild the size OP claims.

Again, if the members are attached to the guild name they should keep it. Just because their guild leader abandoned the game does not warrant going through the work of reforming such a large guild. Really a petty move on the old GMs part.

Jemcrystal

I was a guild leader in FFXIV and it did feel icky giving my guild to people who might destroy it's rep and slander the name but I am a realist. This is just an mmo guild. Not a major corporation with copyright logos. Now I do have another name set aside for copyright but I would never use that as a guild name. You need perspective. And you need to know when to let go. Or maybe you need a life outside of gaming when you find yourself bossing around old guildmates. From previous games you've played. Yeah, probably need a life at that point.

Turelus

If it was really a name I cared about... I would be petty enough to give them a week to make a new one before I purged it.

That said I handed over one of the main EU EP PvP guilds without any fuss of owndership when I left, including a domain which had accrued some value due to traffic.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

People can enjoy the game with those in the guild even if the guild leader is self centered.

I doubt that very much. If the guild was big and nice, he must have done some if not many things right.

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

But the guild is everyone's guild, not just his so the name is not just his. I doubt he has hit copyrighted.

Maybe. But going through this one easy step of changing the guild's name would make everyone happy and peaceful. If you keep the name, you'll always have this "salty" background. I tend to like small things that have big nice effects, regardless of who's theoretically wrong or right.

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Disbanding the guild can cost members that may be offline for a few days so they did nto see the memo and hence think they just got kicked. Also, a lot of work for a guild the size OP claims.

Not really. I had to do it TWICE (had to change guild's name TWICE in the past for stupid technical reasons (accentuated character in the guild's name that conflicted after an update by ZOS).
- Keep members' @ID via screenshots
- Message everyone per ingame mail.

Done. Sure, it takes 3 hours. So what ? Still not much.

Where there's a will, there's a way. The problem here I think is that there's no will. For whatever reason. Not up to me to judge, really. I just feel for the former GM and the judgement he's facing now. So ungrateful - no matter how faulty or deserving he might be.

Ajaxduo

I personally understand the 'possession' of a guilds name, it's like your own brand in a way. However if you left your own baby so easily then you shouldn't deserve it imo, let it go and move on.

idk

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

People can enjoy the game with those in the guild even if the guild leader is self centered.

I doubt that very much. If the guild was big and nice, he must have done some if not many things right.

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

But the guild is everyone's guild, not just his so the name is not just his. I doubt he has hit copyrighted.

Maybe. But going through this one easy step of changing the guild's name would make everyone happy and peaceful. If you keep the name, you'll always have this "salty" background. I tend to like small things that have big nice effects, regardless of who's theoretically wrong or right.

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

Disbanding the guild can cost members that may be offline for a few days so they did nto see the memo and hence think they just got kicked. Also, a lot of work for a guild the size OP claims.

Not really. I had to do it TWICE (had to change guild's name TWICE in the past for stupid technical reasons (accentuated character in the guild's name that conflicted after an update by ZOS).
- Keep members' @ID via screenshots
- Message everyone per ingame mail.

Done. Sure, it takes 3 hours. So what ? Still not much.

Where there's a will, there's a way. The problem here I think is that there's no will. For whatever reason. Not up to me to judge, really. I just feel for the former GM and the judgement he's facing now. So ungrateful - no matter how faulty or deserving he might be.

It is really quite simple with no reason to be made complicated. If the members like the name or do not have an issue with it there is zero reason to change it. The former GM has left the game so he no longer gets a vote.

No reason to consider it further. The members speak for what they want and it seems from OP that it was only the former GM that wanted the name to change because of a disillusion feeling that it was his "brand" which is lol.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

It is really quite simple with no reason to be made complicated. If the members like the name or do not have an issue with it there is zero reason to change it. The former GM has left the game so he no longer gets a vote.

Yes, what a stupid idea to even consider taking someone into consideration that isn't there any more, and has technically no power. Absents are always wrong.
He built the house and devoted himself to it for two years - but that doesn't count, right ?

t3hdubzy

Create a new guild and name it eerily similar. Ive left games on purpose and by force in the past and thought it was great that my guild name lived on.


To me i find it selfish that hes trying to take it with him.

xboxNA corin6

Aeladiir wrote: »

Jitterbug wrote: »

Ojustaboo wrote: »

Jitterbug wrote: »

I don't mean to be rude, but if it's his name let him keep it. The rest of you will get over it.
To you (the ones who want to keep it) it's just a name. To him it's important.

Thing is, some people heavily invest into a guild, and to them, the guild name is part of their online identity. Something they've been a part of since the game started etc.

For some it's a meaningless name, but for others, they feel the name is just as important as the ex guild leader does.

And I can totally appreciate that. It's still his though.
The best solution for all would be if he could trust the new guild leader to run his baby in a proper way and the guild could have 2 chapters; one in ESO and one in Star Citizen or BDO or whatever

It's not his. He left the guild.

Yep. Agreed. It's his guild until he leaves, and he has the choice to change it himself. As soon as he's not guild master, it's no longer his property, and therefore who ever is the next master should make the choice. Whether the next master would consider his opinion or not, it would be in his hands for the decision to be made and nothing else matter unless he didn't have an opinion and went for the guild member's general opinion. TLDR Who cares not his anymore.

idk

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

It is really quite simple with no reason to be made complicated. If the members like the name or do not have an issue with it there is zero reason to change it. The former GM has left the game so he no longer gets a vote.

Yes, what a stupid idea to even consider taking someone into consideration that isn't there any more, and has technically no power. Absents are always wrong.
He built the house and devoted himself to it for two years - but that doesn't count, right ?

This argument has developed into the absurd.

You either just want to argue or miss the most obvious point. He build a guild, people liked it, not he wants the guild to be something different than the one he built.

It is not about him which both you and the former GM miss. Please never lead a guild if you cannot get this simple point.

Acrolas

There's no need to have an emotional debate over this. It's fairly clear in the TOS.

"By creating an Account, You agree that You do not own the Account, any user names created on the Account, any Content stored or associated with an Account (such as digital and/or virtual assets, achievements, virtual currency, and other Downloadable Content), or related data associated with the Account."

Regardless if you consider guilds to function as a collective user or as other content, by agreeing to the ESO TOS, you agree to not claim ownership on anything within or associated with your account. So there's no legal ground to request a name change, and no legal obligation to honor one.

Branding is a commercial process. Not every game or site establishes anti-commercial language in their terms, but a lot of them do. So it's wise to know what you're agreeing to if you have any semblance of a longer-term plan.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Acrolas wrote: »

There's no need to have an emotional debate over this. It's fairly clear in the TOS.

But the question is asked in "emotional" terms, not legal or technical ones. Legally, of course there's no debate. The one with the crown does what he/she wants. But in human/emotional terms, it's different - and that's what being asked and discussed here.

rustic_potato

So the egoistic idiot didn't change the guild name when he knew he was going to leave to another game. I see no reason for you guys to change it. It'a a game and gamers need to realize that.

He might have spend every hour of his day building the guild, if he left he has no right to make claims for anything related to the guild. He doesn't own anything and the guild doesn't owe him anything.

I think the idea of having 5 guilds you can be in was designed to make this kind of bull *** go away. It is something that should be buried in the past of MMO gaming..

rustic_potato

Slammer99uk wrote: »

I am not looking to bash any individual here, just posting a point of view......

Would you have prefered it if he (yes I know the guild master you are referring to) just disbanded it? It is his guild to do with as he wishes, he accepted you into his guild under his conditions which you were happy to do, no? He gave fair warning and his reasoning behind the changes.

Besides a guild is about the people in it not the name. It's ok for you to be upset about it, what is not ok is to come here soliciting opinions which will not change the outcome. Any discussion should be confined to the guild chat or what ever method they use for communication.

Just saying....

It would have made more sense if he disbanded the guild.. Again this whole concept of guild loyalty and stuff is absolute bul****..

He left the guild and he is out and I see no reason to cater to the demands of someone not in the guild..

idk

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Acrolas wrote: »

There's no need to have an emotional debate over this. It's fairly clear in the TOS.

But the question is asked in "emotional" terms, not legal or technical ones. Legally, of course there's no debate. The one with the crown does what he/she wants. But in human/emotional terms, it's different - and that's what being asked and discussed here.

The only thing emotional about this is the former GMs request that the guild change it's name because of some emotional reason.

You are right that it is emotional in the human sense. Selfish behavior over something as petty as the guild name is his trademark is certainly emotional.

Really childish behavior he is demonstrating.

Therwind

How do you go about changing a guilds name?

kyle.wilson

Any good company or guild should be able to carry-on even after the founder leaves. It says that the founder was able to establish the culture to keep the standard high.

To suggest that the guild should change its name, show how little he thought of the rest of his guildies. They should be proud that the guild has the tools to continue, instead of acting like a spoiled brat.

idk

Therwind wrote: »

How do you go about changing a guilds name?

Guilds cannot be renamed. To have a guild with a different name the leader must kick everyone out of the guild then form a new one. Not a benign activity.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Therwind wrote: »

How do you go about changing a guilds name?

Directly, you can't.
You can, however, work around it by creating a new guild and have everyone leaving the old guild and join the new one.
Once everyone has joined, disband the old guild.
Technically, you have the same guild (i.e. the same group of people) as before, with a different name - even though for the computing system, it will be a new guild.

ArchMikem

Last I checked you don't own a name. It's like saying the new guy can't be named Michael cause I was already Michael and even though I'm moving to Canada I made a reputation with my name here.

You see how I agree with the OP about it being a bit silly?

anitajoneb17_ESO

ArchMikem wrote: »

You see how I agree with the OP about it being a bit silly?

It's not necessarily silly.

In my case, even though leaving 'my' guild (for the reasons I explained earlier) was three months ago. Until now, I still come across people in the game who tell me "I went raiding with your guild last night, there were many rude elitists, that was really unpleasant, what happened ?" and I have to explain once again that it isn't my guild anymore, that I gave the crown and left because the majority of members wanted to play elitist and leaderboards and that was not what I wanted nor what I was able to provide.

So yes that's annoying, not silly. I know it's too late now but if I could go backwards, I would tell them to gather in a different guild and a different name. The sky isn't falling, but it's unpleasant.

That's my case though, which is different from OP's case, I suppose.

idk

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

ArchMikem wrote: »

You see how I agree with the OP about it being a bit silly?

It's not necessarily silly.

In my case, even though leaving 'my' guild (for the reasons I explained earlier) was three months ago. Until now, I still come across people in the game who tell me "I went raiding with your guild last night, there were many rude elitists, that was really unpleasant, what happened ?" and I have to explain once again that it isn't my guild anymore, that I gave the crown and left because the majority of members wanted to play elitist and leaderboards and that was not what I wanted nor what I was able to provide.

So yes that's annoying, not silly. I know it's too late now but if I could go backwards, I would tell them to gather in a different guild and a different name. The sky isn't falling, but it's unpleasant.

That's my case though, which is different from OP's case, I suppose.

I understand but this is a completely different situation. The guy wants the name change merely because he left the game and for very petty reasons. Not because the guild was divided, because he thinks only he is entitled to the name of the guild.

Shardaxx

Should have changed it before he left as others have said, but once he has left, its no longer any of his concern. 'Insisting' isn't going to get him anywhere. Really the guild belongs to all its current members, not some guy who created it then left.

Nyghthowler

I could understand wanting to keep the name if guild tags were visible over the character; but since that isn't the case, just let it go and come up with a name that suites everyone still in the guild.

JMO