Next fotm-meta? (Update 13)

Pallio · January 2017

It will be even more stamNB, less mag temp, and the crying for anything that kills people will continue.

Kutsuu · January 2017

Pallio wrote: »

It will be even more stamNB, less mag temp, and the crying for anything that kills people will continue.

Less mag temp? Lmao. You are crazy if you think that. You're just going to see more frost destro ults to go with the lightning and fire ones.

Subversus · January 2017

Derra wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

Dunno about cyro but pet sorcs will absolutely dominate the 1v1 scene. Their single target pressure will be obscene with the new buffs to pets and destro passives.

For duels only.

A petsorc in cyrodiil is super vulnerable due to bad pet AI and pets basically not working in lag.

Edit: If you´re a sorc yourself - use mines.
The familiar instantly kills itself in mines every time when mages wrath is applied and you´re positioned correctly. You can watch this happen until the petsorc eventually grows tired of recasting that useless little talibanmonkey.

Nice one with the mines, should give it a try sometime

IxSTALKERxI · January 2017

I should've been a bit more clear. I was talking about group vs group since that's what I mainly do. Already fight groups that block with S&B and have destro back bar now - it won't be any different imo.

Solo, small groups, open world, dueling etc there will be a lot of strange setups.

OtarTheMad · January 2017

Derra wrote: »

Magsorcs are pretty overplayed atm.

Can we please make hardened ward + harness magica stop stacking?

Maybe I am alone in this but the shields don't last that long plus you also have the Shield Breaker set and also the CP passive that reduces shields... I don't see why shield stacking is still such a big deal. I just came back after a break but I haven't had any issues with sorcs and shields, maybe I need to be in PvP land more.

pcar944 · January 2017

I'll never surrender my Magblades

too OP

DisgracefulMind · January 2017

I think at the beginning of the patch we'll see a huge increase in magicka DKs because people will want to try out the changes. And then over time things will go back to how the are now.

Derra · January 2017

OtarTheMad wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Magsorcs are pretty overplayed atm.

Can we please make hardened ward + harness magica stop stacking?

Maybe I am alone in this but the shields don't last that long plus you also have the Shield Breaker set and also the CP passive that reduces shields... I don't see why shield stacking is still such a big deal. I just came back after a break but I haven't had any issues with sorcs and shields, maybe I need to be in PvP land more.

I play magsorc. I´m saying this as someone maining a magica sorc since beta. I do very much believe harness and hardened ward stacking is completely broken op and should not exist and the lengh of shields has no effect on that functionality when you´re pressured whatsoever.

The worst thing that i can come across solo is someone stacking harness + hardened and for the slight chance of them loosing HP also have healing ward on bar while making no real attempt to attack me once they realise they´re loosing the fight.

The amount of damage you can simply facetank with pushing two buttons is stupid and for magica builds allows for no counterplay. Every average player can become near invincible on a magica sorc when they decide to go full on defensive.

Biro123 · January 2017

The big problem with balancing damage shields as a defence though is that they simply do not scale with the size of the combat. 1v1 they are strong, yes - but many vs many - it only takes a couple of focused attackers and those stacked shields may as well not be there. In comparison, a defence based on heavy armour and blocking scales up much, much better.

Basically, the whole concept of damage shields makes them scale badly - and therefore hard to balance. I sometimes wonder if they would be easier to balance if they lasted a lot longer, absorbed a lot more damage before dropping, but always let a certain % of the damage through..

Derra · January 2017

Biro123 wrote: »

The big problem with balancing damage shields as a defence though is that they simply do not scale with the size of the combat. 1v1 they are strong, yes - but many vs many - it only takes a couple of focused attackers and those stacked shields may as well not be there. In comparison, a defence based on heavy armour and blocking scales up much, much better.

Sorc has out of all classes - the best tools to not get hit vs many opponents.

With your way of arguing templar, DK and Nightblade should have the possibility to stack hardened and harness - NOT the most mobile class in the game.

Edit: Mag NB, Templar and DK in light armor are NOT doing fine atm. This is mainly the reason of light armor being subpar compared to heavy and even medium. However magsorc is doing fine in light - largely due to the ability to stack hardened + harness. This is one of the reasons why i´m strongly against buffing light armor at the moment without adressing the problem of harness magica and hardened ward stacking on sorcs.
There is no reason for it to exist and in my opinion it´s holding back light armor builds for the other classes simply by being a thing.

Biro123 · January 2017

Derra wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

The big problem with balancing damage shields as a defence though is that they simply do not scale with the size of the combat. 1v1 they are strong, yes - but many vs many - it only takes a couple of focused attackers and those stacked shields may as well not be there. In comparison, a defence based on heavy armour and blocking scales up much, much better.

Sorc has out of all classes - the best tools to not get hit vs many opponents.

With your way of arguing templar, DK and Nightblade should have the possibility to stack hardened and harness - NOT the most mobile class in the game.

Edit: Mag NB, Templar and DK in light armor are NOT doing fine atm. This is mainly the reason of light armor being subpar compared to heavy and even medium. However magsorc is doing fine in light - largely due to the ability to stack hardened + harness. This is one of the reasons why i´m strongly against buffing light armor at the moment without adressing the problem of harness magica and hardened ward stacking on sorcs.
There is no reason for it to exist and in my opinion it´s holding back light armor builds for the other classes simply by being a thing.

Fair point.

Kutsuu · January 2017

I think the heavy armor non-shield using mageblades got a pretty good boost with this patch due to frost staff. You can now run frost + resto with a heavy armor setup and be quite tanky with very good magicka sustain due to siphon attacks and minor magicka steal (from either bar). I don't think many people were running the Kenapk setup (staff/staff with heavy armor), but we'll see a lot more of it with U13.

As far as light armor mageblades... well you at least have less 1-shot burst to deal with with proc sets not critting. People keep claiming that impen makes this change pointless, but these are the same players who I hit for 11k selene crits through their precious 2500 crit resist. It's going to make a big difference when it comes to fight-ending proc burst.

Lucky28 · January 2017

Kutsuu wrote: »

I think the heavy armor non-shield using mageblades got a pretty good boost with this patch due to frost staff. You can now run frost + resto with a heavy armor setup and be quite tanky with very good magicka sustain due to siphon attacks and minor magicka steal (from either bar). I don't think many people were running the Kenapk setup (staff/staff with heavy armor), but we'll see a lot more of it with U13.

As far as light armor mageblades... well you at least have less 1-shot burst to deal with with proc sets not critting. People keep claiming that impen makes this change pointless, but these are the same players who I hit for 11k selene crits through their precious 2500 crit resist. It's going to make a big difference when it comes to fight-ending proc burst.

most heavy magblades aren't "tanks" so the forst staff isn't really useful. tanks might like it i dunno.

light armor magblades typically run rather high crit with Skoria or Grothdar. that change hurts them probably more than the ganker stacking proc sets.

i had said that i would prefer ZoS did nothing to proc sets at this stage. shame the main thing i was looking forward to in this patch was a fix to stacking proc sets... they did not do that, instead they come out with a blanket nerf further gimping people who are not stacking proc sets. it's asinine, you'd think they would have learned there lesson about blanket nerfs.

Kutsuu · January 2017

Lucky28 wrote: »

Kutsuu wrote: »

I think the heavy armor non-shield using mageblades got a pretty good boost with this patch due to frost staff. You can now run frost + resto with a heavy armor setup and be quite tanky with very good magicka sustain due to siphon attacks and minor magicka steal (from either bar). I don't think many people were running the Kenapk setup (staff/staff with heavy armor), but we'll see a lot more of it with U13.

As far as light armor mageblades... well you at least have less 1-shot burst to deal with with proc sets not critting. People keep claiming that impen makes this change pointless, but these are the same players who I hit for 11k selene crits through their precious 2500 crit resist. It's going to make a big difference when it comes to fight-ending proc burst.

most heavy magblades aren't "tanks" so the forst staff isn't really useful. tanks might like it i dunno.

light armor magblades typically run rather high crit with Skoria or Grothdar. that change hurts them probably more than the ganker stacking proc sets.

i had said that i would prefer ZoS did nothing to proc sets at this stage. shame the main thing i was looking forward to in this patch was a fix to stacking proc sets... they did not do that, instead they come out with a blanket nerf further gimping people who are not stacking proc sets. it's asinine, you'd think they would have learned there lesson about blanket nerfs.

Why do they have to be tanks? It simply makes blocking stuff like frags, incaps, soul assault, and meteor much more efficient while saving your stamina for CC breaks and dodge rolls.

Ishammael · January 2017

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

I think at the beginning of the patch we'll see a huge increase in magicka DKs because people will want to try out the changes. And then over time things will go back to how the are now.

Completely agree here. I don't see anything in the notes yet that will change the meta too much.

Magicka Templar will remain the most played class, followed closely by Sorcs of both flavors.

Publius_Scipio · January 2017

A lot of people are already leveling up those sticks that shoot ice balls.

I expect many of those that jumped on the stam sorc bandwagon last year to jump off.

Templars b[snip] about radiant destruction nerf and no spear cc.

A lot of DK whip spam. More than dominatrix.

That's pretty much all I can think about at this moment.

Satiar · January 2017

I think we'll see a ton of negates and EoTS. Just a guess.

Sugaroverdose · January 2017

OtarTheMad wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Magsorcs are pretty overplayed atm.

Can we please make hardened ward + harness magica stop stacking?

Maybe I am alone in this but the shields don't last that long plus you also have the Shield Breaker set and also the CP passive that reduces shields... I don't see why shield stacking is still such a big deal. I just came back after a break but I haven't had any issues with sorcs and shields, maybe I need to be in PvP land more.

Problem is that sorc don't need to sacrifice damage to make he's shields stronger, also in case of dots there's no difference how much damage you deal to shields whatever you decide to invest Thaurmaturge or Shattering Blows (but in second one you loose a lot of damage over non-shielded targets, also CP passives in Atronach are just useless trash). Anyway, how magicka builds should use Shield Breaker?

OtarTheMad · January 2017

Sugaroverdose wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Magsorcs are pretty overplayed atm.

Can we please make hardened ward + harness magica stop stacking?

Maybe I am alone in this but the shields don't last that long plus you also have the Shield Breaker set and also the CP passive that reduces shields... I don't see why shield stacking is still such a big deal. I just came back after a break but I haven't had any issues with sorcs and shields, maybe I need to be in PvP land more.

Problem is that sorc don't need to sacrifice damage to make he's shields stronger, also in case of dots there's no difference how much damage you deal to shields whatever you decide to invest Thaurmaturge or Shattering Blows (but in second one you loose a lot of damage over non-shielded targets, also CP passives in Atronach are just useless trash). Anyway, how magicka builds should use Shield Breaker?

That is a good point, especially about magicka builds and Shield Breaker set. My counter to that would be slot Elemental Susceptibility and also use some poisons that reduce enemies Physical and Spell Resists.

I am not saying shield stacking isn't borderline broken but I am saying that we might have some nice work arounds vs. waiting for ZOS' nerf train to run over shields and render them useless. I do not have faith in ZOS when it comes to nerfs (examples- streak, surge, GDB, cloak, clouding swarm etc.)

Would also note that I have been Pvping more and still don't have much of an issue against magicka sorcs and shields unless it's a well-known veteran sorc. Most sorcs forget about the "new" time on shields and don't cast them as much, plus usually by the time you cast the second shield to create the stack the first one is almost over so it drains magicka quick to keep casting them.

Abob · January 2017

Stamplar will be OP, as always.

Drummerx04 · January 2017

Derra wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Magsorcs are pretty overplayed atm.

Can we please make hardened ward + harness magica stop stacking?

Maybe I am alone in this but the shields don't last that long plus you also have the Shield Breaker set and also the CP passive that reduces shields... I don't see why shield stacking is still such a big deal. I just came back after a break but I haven't had any issues with sorcs and shields, maybe I need to be in PvP land more.

I play magsorc. I´m saying this as someone maining a magica sorc since beta. I do very much believe harness and hardened ward stacking is completely broken op and should not exist and the lengh of shields has no effect on that functionality when you´re pressured whatsoever.

The worst thing that i can come across solo is someone stacking harness + hardened and for the slight chance of them loosing HP also have healing ward on bar while making no real attempt to attack me once they realise they´re loosing the fight.

The amount of damage you can simply facetank with pushing two buttons is stupid and for magica builds allows for no counterplay. Every average player can become near invincible on a magica sorc when they decide to go full on defensive.

I have run across templars with 30k health and unlimited sustain that I just can't kill as a magsorc. They weren't even good. Just run around without even blocking and spam BoL and occasionally CC me with a javelin.

Valkyn skoria mageblades stacking harness/healing also give me a lot of grief if they play well... mostly due to valkyn hitting so damn hard on vamps.

mDK loves wings, stonefist, and f**king fossilize. The counterplay to fossilize while outnumbered to to already be immune to fossilize.

I've fought stam anything players that always seem to have the option to burst themselves to full health and then turn around and deal absurd damage and run faster than I can streak to LoS.

Basically, every class has something that's kinda OP, as long as every other class has access to their kinda broken stuff, I take no issue with shield stacking.

thankyourat · January 2017

Drummerx04 wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Magsorcs are pretty overplayed atm.

Can we please make hardened ward + harness magica stop stacking?

Maybe I am alone in this but the shields don't last that long plus you also have the Shield Breaker set and also the CP passive that reduces shields... I don't see why shield stacking is still such a big deal. I just came back after a break but I haven't had any issues with sorcs and shields, maybe I need to be in PvP land more.

I play magsorc. I´m saying this as someone maining a magica sorc since beta. I do very much believe harness and hardened ward stacking is completely broken op and should not exist and the lengh of shields has no effect on that functionality when you´re pressured whatsoever.

The worst thing that i can come across solo is someone stacking harness + hardened and for the slight chance of them loosing HP also have healing ward on bar while making no real attempt to attack me once they realise they´re loosing the fight.

The amount of damage you can simply facetank with pushing two buttons is stupid and for magica builds allows for no counterplay. Every average player can become near invincible on a magica sorc when they decide to go full on defensive.

I have run across templars with 30k health and unlimited sustain that I just can't kill as a magsorc. They weren't even good. Just run around without even blocking and spam BoL and occasionally CC me with a javelin.

Valkyn skoria mageblades stacking harness/healing also give me a lot of grief if they play well... mostly due to valkyn hitting so damn hard on vamps.

mDK loves wings, stonefist, and f**king fossilize. The counterplay to fossilize while outnumbered to to already be immune to fossilize.

I've fought stam anything players that always seem to have the option to burst themselves to full health and then turn around and deal absurd damage and run faster than I can streak to LoS.

Basically, every class has something that's kinda OP, as long as every other class has access to their kinda broken stuff, I take no issue with shield stacking.

Magicka classes are op in Xv1 situations. Mag sorc shield stacking and Templar bol are both equally broken and unmatched in terms of survivability. It's just annoying to see people go into panic mode and be rewarded with staying alive because of broken mechanics like stacking shields and spamming BoL

Stratforge · January 2017

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

The worst thing zos could do balance wise in PTS 3 would be make it so destro ult can be blocked. They do that, then yeah ice staff will be what most people run and there would be no counter, and knowing zos they'll probably do it.

The best thing they could do is take it out of the game entirely. The second best thing they could do is make it blockable.

kadar · January 2017

Pallio wrote: »

It will be even more stamNB, less mag temp, and the crying for anything that kills people will continue.

Y more Stam NB?

Cloak may be semi-functional?

Biro123 · January 2017

thankyourat wrote: »

Drummerx04 wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Magsorcs are pretty overplayed atm.

Can we please make hardened ward + harness magica stop stacking?

Maybe I am alone in this but the shields don't last that long plus you also have the Shield Breaker set and also the CP passive that reduces shields... I don't see why shield stacking is still such a big deal. I just came back after a break but I haven't had any issues with sorcs and shields, maybe I need to be in PvP land more.

I play magsorc. I´m saying this as someone maining a magica sorc since beta. I do very much believe harness and hardened ward stacking is completely broken op and should not exist and the lengh of shields has no effect on that functionality when you´re pressured whatsoever.

The worst thing that i can come across solo is someone stacking harness + hardened and for the slight chance of them loosing HP also have healing ward on bar while making no real attempt to attack me once they realise they´re loosing the fight.

The amount of damage you can simply facetank with pushing two buttons is stupid and for magica builds allows for no counterplay. Every average player can become near invincible on a magica sorc when they decide to go full on defensive.

I have run across templars with 30k health and unlimited sustain that I just can't kill as a magsorc. They weren't even good. Just run around without even blocking and spam BoL and occasionally CC me with a javelin.

Valkyn skoria mageblades stacking harness/healing also give me a lot of grief if they play well... mostly due to valkyn hitting so damn hard on vamps.

mDK loves wings, stonefist, and f**king fossilize. The counterplay to fossilize while outnumbered to to already be immune to fossilize.

I've fought stam anything players that always seem to have the option to burst themselves to full health and then turn around and deal absurd damage and run faster than I can streak to LoS.

Basically, every class has something that's kinda OP, as long as every other class has access to their kinda broken stuff, I take no issue with shield stacking.

Magicka classes are op in Xv1 situations. Mag sorc shield stacking and Templar bol are both equally broken and unmatched in terms of survivability. It's just annoying to see people go into panic mode and be rewarded with staying alive because of broken mechanics like stacking shields and spamming BoL

I'd agree on magsorc if you were talking 1v1 - but Xv1? That's more due to mobility/ being able to spread them out/burst them down than shield stacking. More and more now, I find on a 2v1 against competent opponents, shields drop faster than they can be re-cast. Honestly for my U13, rebuild, I'm starting to look at things that will preserve the life of the shields (which WILL mean a damage loss). Shields do NOT scale well as more attackers are involved. Now I look at the 'tanks that do damage' thread - to see how blocking/heavy armour/ stam heals /heal buffs scale with more attackers. There is NO way shield stacking can do anything like that currently. So imho, any nerf to shield stacking MUST come with some kind of change to their mechanics to make them stronger than they currently are vs multiple opponents... But that then starts to make every playstyle the same - which is bad..... Simply put, shields in their current incarnation are difficult to balance as numbers scale.

Bislobo · January 2017

You will see more magsorcs and magplars. They were already popular classes, but we will see more of that. Hope the buff to pets and ice block don't ruin pvp even more. Azura's is still playable atm but with those changes... i dunno... i dunno...

cschwingeb14_ESO · January 2017

Satiar wrote: »

I think we'll see a ton of negates and EoTS. Just a guess.

Negate is fairly useless against perma block with good resists

Am I the only one who sees a lot of magicka NB buffs in this patch? Destro/Resto perma block, siphon, sap, funnel, lotus fan-to-get-in, shades-to-get-out. Sure, mag DK gets better resource management, but NB deals a lot more damage while perma blocking

thankyourat · January 2017

Biro123 wrote: »

thankyourat wrote: »

Drummerx04 wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Magsorcs are pretty overplayed atm.

Can we please make hardened ward + harness magica stop stacking?

Maybe I am alone in this but the shields don't last that long plus you also have the Shield Breaker set and also the CP passive that reduces shields... I don't see why shield stacking is still such a big deal. I just came back after a break but I haven't had any issues with sorcs and shields, maybe I need to be in PvP land more.

I play magsorc. I´m saying this as someone maining a magica sorc since beta. I do very much believe harness and hardened ward stacking is completely broken op and should not exist and the lengh of shields has no effect on that functionality when you´re pressured whatsoever.

The worst thing that i can come across solo is someone stacking harness + hardened and for the slight chance of them loosing HP also have healing ward on bar while making no real attempt to attack me once they realise they´re loosing the fight.

The amount of damage you can simply facetank with pushing two buttons is stupid and for magica builds allows for no counterplay. Every average player can become near invincible on a magica sorc when they decide to go full on defensive.

I have run across templars with 30k health and unlimited sustain that I just can't kill as a magsorc. They weren't even good. Just run around without even blocking and spam BoL and occasionally CC me with a javelin.

Valkyn skoria mageblades stacking harness/healing also give me a lot of grief if they play well... mostly due to valkyn hitting so damn hard on vamps.

mDK loves wings, stonefist, and f**king fossilize. The counterplay to fossilize while outnumbered to to already be immune to fossilize.

I've fought stam anything players that always seem to have the option to burst themselves to full health and then turn around and deal absurd damage and run faster than I can streak to LoS.

Basically, every class has something that's kinda OP, as long as every other class has access to their kinda broken stuff, I take no issue with shield stacking.

Magicka classes are op in Xv1 situations. Mag sorc shield stacking and Templar bol are both equally broken and unmatched in terms of survivability. It's just annoying to see people go into panic mode and be rewarded with staying alive because of broken mechanics like stacking shields and spamming BoL

I'd agree on magsorc if you were talking 1v1 - but Xv1? That's more due to mobility/ being able to spread them out/burst them down than shield stacking. More and more now, I find on a 2v1 against competent opponents, shields drop faster than they can be re-cast. Honestly for my U13, rebuild, I'm starting to look at things that will preserve the life of the shields (which WILL mean a damage loss). Shields do NOT scale well as more attackers are involved. Now I look at the 'tanks that do damage' thread - to see how blocking/heavy armour/ stam heals /heal buffs scale with more attackers. There is NO way shield stacking can do anything like that currently. So imho, any nerf to shield stacking MUST come with some kind of change to their mechanics to make them stronger than they currently are vs multiple opponents... But that then starts to make every playstyle the same - which is bad..... Simply put, shields in their current incarnation are difficult to balance as numbers scale.

I'm talking Xv1 in terms of it's multiple magicka players against you. Magicka players are just really strong in groups with shields and roots and heals even throwing healing ward to another player can be op when you are outnumbered. I've been noticing that alot of MagSorcs will just stack shields without even attempting to attack you, it's very difficult to deal with that playing solo sometimes

Biro123 · January 2017

thankyourat wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

thankyourat wrote: »

Drummerx04 wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Magsorcs are pretty overplayed atm.

Can we please make hardened ward + harness magica stop stacking?

Maybe I am alone in this but the shields don't last that long plus you also have the Shield Breaker set and also the CP passive that reduces shields... I don't see why shield stacking is still such a big deal. I just came back after a break but I haven't had any issues with sorcs and shields, maybe I need to be in PvP land more.

I play magsorc. I´m saying this as someone maining a magica sorc since beta. I do very much believe harness and hardened ward stacking is completely broken op and should not exist and the lengh of shields has no effect on that functionality when you´re pressured whatsoever.

The worst thing that i can come across solo is someone stacking harness + hardened and for the slight chance of them loosing HP also have healing ward on bar while making no real attempt to attack me once they realise they´re loosing the fight.

The amount of damage you can simply facetank with pushing two buttons is stupid and for magica builds allows for no counterplay. Every average player can become near invincible on a magica sorc when they decide to go full on defensive.

I have run across templars with 30k health and unlimited sustain that I just can't kill as a magsorc. They weren't even good. Just run around without even blocking and spam BoL and occasionally CC me with a javelin.

Valkyn skoria mageblades stacking harness/healing also give me a lot of grief if they play well... mostly due to valkyn hitting so damn hard on vamps.

mDK loves wings, stonefist, and f**king fossilize. The counterplay to fossilize while outnumbered to to already be immune to fossilize.

I've fought stam anything players that always seem to have the option to burst themselves to full health and then turn around and deal absurd damage and run faster than I can streak to LoS.

Basically, every class has something that's kinda OP, as long as every other class has access to their kinda broken stuff, I take no issue with shield stacking.

Magicka classes are op in Xv1 situations. Mag sorc shield stacking and Templar bol are both equally broken and unmatched in terms of survivability. It's just annoying to see people go into panic mode and be rewarded with staying alive because of broken mechanics like stacking shields and spamming BoL

I'd agree on magsorc if you were talking 1v1 - but Xv1? That's more due to mobility/ being able to spread them out/burst them down than shield stacking. More and more now, I find on a 2v1 against competent opponents, shields drop faster than they can be re-cast. Honestly for my U13, rebuild, I'm starting to look at things that will preserve the life of the shields (which WILL mean a damage loss). Shields do NOT scale well as more attackers are involved. Now I look at the 'tanks that do damage' thread - to see how blocking/heavy armour/ stam heals /heal buffs scale with more attackers. There is NO way shield stacking can do anything like that currently. So imho, any nerf to shield stacking MUST come with some kind of change to their mechanics to make them stronger than they currently are vs multiple opponents... But that then starts to make every playstyle the same - which is bad..... Simply put, shields in their current incarnation are difficult to balance as numbers scale.

I'm talking Xv1 in terms of it's multiple magicka players against you. Magicka players are just really strong in groups with shields and roots and heals even throwing healing ward to another player can be op when you are outnumbered. I've been noticing that alot of MagSorcs will just stack shields without even attempting to attack you, it's very difficult to deal with that playing solo sometimes

Ah - I see what you mean.. I guess it just reinforces my view on scaling with shields even further. Mind I'd be surprised people were shield stacking in an xv1 - its a waste of magicka - and hardened on its own is more than enough there (But I do keep that up constantly - but then with light armour and no impen, I have to :-p)

Kas · January 2017

i don't see any reason the meta should change:

organized groups that exceed small-scale numbers will be dominant forces (eye of the noob will be their primary tool of choice, accompanied by other magicka builds (healing, roots), ultimates (negate still strong, remembrance too) and one or a select few stamina builds for RM and some single target mischief).

meanwhile newer players will still engage in respawn fests, preferably around the outposts and bridge/gates. gankers (stamina based, mostly nbs) will farm them, small-scale groups (stamina bias, though not exclusively, magicka dk's numbers will increase while stamsorc numbers decrease) will farm them hard (and detest the larger grps of 8+++ if they ruin their spots).

duels will feature super strong petsorcs unless they have to get used to their new keyboard+mouse because they took their build to open-world cyrodiil and ate their last keyboard in frustration about pet AI.