Warden class incoming?

Abeille

Artis wrote: »

Hopefully not and please stop mentioning that. It might seem to ZOS that that's what players want when instead a lot of us would rather have new skill lines available to everyone and/or the removal of all classes at all. I mean, without the class change of course I'm actively against new classes. What if I like the new class, then what? Not only I'm forced to delete one of my alts to even try the class, but I'll also have to grind out 22k achievement points until I stop feeling like I'm wasting time and not progressing because I"m just trying to catch up with the progress I have already made, but for some weird reason it's not displayed on my character and I can't use titles and can't craft motifs I already grinded, bought and learned.

In fact, I suggest ZOS implements and automoderator who will ban everyone using "warden" and "class" in one paragraph/post for breaking the forum rules.

''ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Conspiracy Theories and Misinformation: We do not tolerate the deliberate and malicious spreading of false info or conspiracy theories about ZeniMax Online Studios, its game(s), or its employees. This does not include honest mistakes; rather, this rule pertains to those who go out of their way to spread harmful or malicious rumors about ZeniMax Online Studios and its employees, or The Elder Scrolls Online.

A lot of players want more skill lines, a lot of players want classes to be removed, a lot of players want new classes.

Feel free to post suggestions for what you want, while the people who want something else post what they want. About what to do with your alts, there were suggestions like adding more character slots or adding class change (over the board or only to the new class).

Also this is not a conspiracy theory or false information (the only information being spread about the Warden is that its skills were datamined, which is true.) and it isn't harmful to ZOS, its employees or ESO. There is no basis for any Warden thread to be closed or for anyone to be banned on the paragraph you quoted. The only basis someone would have to close a Warden thread is the fact that there are other Warden threads. There is nothing in the rules that forbid speculation and theory crafting.

mvffins

I think Warden would be a good choice for the 5th class since it becomes the 2nd class with pets (besides sorcs), the 2nd class with a strong support skill line (besides temps), and gives a much need ice focused class. If they add Warden I don't see them ever needing to add another class though.

That being said after removing the Templar's last CC....I would prefer them to rush spellcrafting instead so we have more options for taunts/ccs/heals/invisi/aoes.

Ch4mpTW

Warden class incoming...? Hm... Good thing I still have my Winterborn set in all divines and all infused. Although, I don't have any Winterborn rings unfortunately enough.

lihentian

starkerealm wrote: »

lihentian wrote: »

i hope there will be a necromancy summon line~~

There already is... on the forums.

i mean the warden class, ice and necromancy tend to tie together more or less.. i mean like.. lich king? XD forstmourn hungers~~

Nerouyn

FYI Matt Firor saying - at the same time they put these skill lines back into the client - that new classes are a possibility. Also new skill lines.

http://wccftech.com/elder-scrolls-online-interview-looking-ahead-with-game-director-matt-firor/

Abeille wrote: »

A lot of players want more skill lines, a lot of players want classes to be removed, a lot of players want new classes.

And I reckon they haven't made up their mind how they'll add these yet.

ESO only has 4 classes. That's super weak compared to other MMOs. So another class would have value there. But for an IP which is synonymous with not having classes, there are already 4 too many classes for many fans.

ESO has long promised spellcrafting but not only is there no sign of it yet but we've been told (see link above) that if we ever get it it probably won't be as originally advertised. Adding these as new skill lines available to all classes might go some way towards appeasing the spellcrafting wannabes.

Add it as a new class and then they'd need to either up the max character slots per account or introduce paid class changes or allow some free class changes from anything to warden. Paid class changes could be problematic though for a class based game which cycles through each class with the nerf bat. If someone buys and uses a class change today and tomorrow major nerfs are announced for their new class tomorrow, you can bet they'll be peeved.

Add it as a new class and many wouldn't play it immediately. With the damned horse feeding business to begin again for new characters, they'd make and park the character and horse feed it for 6 months.

Personally I'd prefer them added as new skill lines. Less problematic and it would be taking the game in a more Elder Scrolls (i.e. not class based) direction.

Abeille

Nerouyn wrote: »

FYI Matt Firor saying - at the same time they put these skill lines back into the client - that new classes are a possibility. Also new skill lines.

http://wccftech.com/elder-scrolls-online-interview-looking-ahead-with-game-director-matt-firor/

Abeille wrote: »

A lot of players want more skill lines, a lot of players want classes to be removed, a lot of players want new classes.

And I reckon they haven't made up their mind how they'll add these yet.

ESO only has 4 classes. That's super weak compared to other MMOs. So another class would have value there. But for an IP which is synonymous with not having classes, there are already 4 too many classes for many fans.

ESO has long promised spellcrafting but not only is there no sign of it yet but we've been told (see link above) that if we ever get it it probably won't be as originally advertised. Adding these as new skill lines available to all classes might go some way towards appeasing the spellcrafting wannabes.

Add it as a new class and then they'd need to either up the max character slots per account or introduce paid class changes or allow some free class changes from anything to warden. Paid class changes could be problematic though for a class based game which cycles through each class with the nerf bat. If someone buys and uses a class change today and tomorrow major nerfs are announced for their new class tomorrow, you can bet they'll be peeved.

Add it as a new class and many wouldn't play it immediately. With the damned horse feeding business to begin again for new characters, they'd make and park the character and horse feed it for 6 months.

Personally I'd prefer them added as new skill lines. Less problematic and it would be taking the game in a more Elder Scrolls (i.e. not class based) direction.

We don't know how these skills will be added, yeah, we just know these are the skill lines the Warden had and that these skill lines recently made their way back to the game, which is odd. So yeah, they might have broken down the Warden class into its three skill lines and are planning to add it as World Skills. I think that would lead to some weird stuff. I mean, they have a Pet Taming skill line. Would ZOS make it a World Skill, allowing Sorcerers to use it too and run around with 3+ pets?

If they add the class, I think free class changes to anything but Warden, available only to existing characters at the time the update happens, is the best way to go. I would still have to reroll, but only one character instead of three (because I would be short one Sorcerer and have one extra Templar after converting two of my three Sorcerers to Wardens). Realistically, I think they would increase the character slots limit and that's it, maybe even make us buy these slots if all our existing slots are full already

I would still reroll on this case because Warden would be perfect for two of my characters, as much as it would pain me to do so. Especially my Argonian Pet Sorc. Ugh. All the fish...

I don't think many people will leave a sparkling new class just sitting there because their mount is slow. It's new, it's available, would people really leave it parked for six months before trying it out? I find it hard to believe that many people would do that. But hey, that's just me. I got ten characters to 50 way before maxing their riding skills because I just wanted to play them, so leaving a character of a new class you never had the opportunity to play before just sitting at a stable sounds crazy to me.

There are some things that I think that should be added as skill lines, if ever added at all. Say, Necromancy (I want a quest line to be required for it, one that explains why we are allowed to use it, preferably with Vanus Galerion scolding us for it before giving his permission) and maybe a Bards Guild skill line if we ever get the Bards Guild (when I think of "Bard skills", I think of Ragnarök's Bard/Dancer class, with buffs and debuffs).

Spellcrafting will be great for most of my characters, if it keeps more or less the same sort of spells that were datamined forever ago. I do not think, however, that Spellcrafting will look much like what was datamined back then. I suppose it is taking so long because it is being reworked completely.

starkerealm

Nerouyn wrote: »

But for an IP which is synonymous with not having classes...

Really? How many Elder Scrolls games lack classes? Oh, right, only one. Two if you get snarky and want to include Redguard. So far as it goes, the Sorcerer and Nightblade are classes from the single player games.

leothedino

This is my idea of a personal nightmare. I have poured all my hours into my achievements and progression of my magicka dps sorc... I honestly know that I don't and won't have it in me to do it all again on a new class. I have three alts, currently, and all of them are for when I fancy a different role for a change, stam dmg, healing or tanking etc. A new class, at this point, has 0 appeal to me until achievements can be made account bound. Forget new classes (a notion that has never existed in TES before) and bring on spellcrafting!

starkerealm

leothedino wrote: »

Forget new classes (a notion that has never existed in TES before) and bring on spellcrafting!

So, this would be a bad time to point out that the Agent, Crusader and Witchhunter were added in Morrowind.

Rosveen

starkerealm wrote: »

Nerouyn wrote: »

But for an IP which is synonymous with not having classes...

Really? How many Elder Scrolls games lack classes? Oh, right, only one. Two if you get snarky and want to include Redguard. So far as it goes, the Sorcerer and Nightblade are classes from the single player games.

To be fair, it was an open system: we were never prevented from using skills of other classes before.

pieratsos

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Artemiisia wrote: »

Pixel_Zealot wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

Heck, they'd have me paying $100 a month if they hired Alcast, Fengrush, Sypher, Deltia, Yolowizard, and a lot of simply smart people to make changes. People who play the game.

This.

hell no no offense, after reading some of these players post, I would not recommend it, dont get me wrong they are amazing at what they do and great at sharing and helping people which I love.

But like one of them said in another post, he would rather have crafting for BiS gear, that would mean all dropped sets would be worthless. Another said they would make rng easier in vMal just to get sharpened traits, they would remove everything that gives abit of a grind.

Sure that seems great at first, but if we all had the best BiS always, what the heck would you play the game for, it would remove progression so fast and game would get borring

People think these guys are "smart" because they say things that resonate with the crowd they draw in to their streams and Youtube vids. "Some guy on the TV/Computer says the same things Im thinking....Hes totally right. Im going to follow him and sing his praises on the forums every chance I get!"

Most of the crap they talk about is selfcentered and would only benefit the types of players they are. While putting everyone else in a really ****y position.

Thats why you pick a lot of different types of players. And even if you didnt, they would still do a much better job than what wrobel is doing because of the simple fact that they are actually playing the game and they want it to be competitive.

1mirg

pieratsos wrote: »

Thats why you pick a lot of different types of players. And even if you didnt, they would still do a much better job than what wrobel is doing because of the simple fact that they are actually playing the game and they want it to be competitive.

Who is this "wrobel" person? If you don't mind me asking?

leothedino

starkerealm wrote: »

leothedino wrote: »

Forget new classes (a notion that has never existed in TES before) and bring on spellcrafting!

So, this would be a bad time to point out that the Agent, Crusader and Witchhunter were added in Morrowind.

Builds, for people who prefer not to think for themselves. I personally don't like somebody holding my hand, when I design a character. Guidelines and rules are different than set paths.

starkerealm

Rosveen wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Nerouyn wrote: »

But for an IP which is synonymous with not having classes...

Really? How many Elder Scrolls games lack classes? Oh, right, only one. Two if you get snarky and want to include Redguard. So far as it goes, the Sorcerer and Nightblade are classes from the single player games.

To be fair, it was an open system: we were never prevented from using skills of other classes before.

That's also not quite true. In Arena each class had unique abilities that were exclusive to them. Daggerfall (and Battlespire) had class modifiers which were selected at character creation, but were unique in their own right, and permanently affected how your class played.

Morrowind was the first to do away with that system, but the starting skill levels for off class abilities were crippling. Which Oblivion kept, while further enforced that by restricting some basic functionality to the various skill lines unless you had 25 points in them.

In Morrowind and Oblivion it was technically possible to go off class, but your XP gains were penalized, and your ability to actually use those skills was seriously impaired until you got to a basic level of proficiency with them (and your XP gains would always be penalized).

So, your class choice did affect how your character would play. It was more subtle than Arena's system, but a Nightblade and Warrior would have vastly different experiences.

Then, Skyrim bulldozed all of that. I get why. The differences weren't immediately apparent, so you'd end up spending five or ten hours on a character, then realize it didn't really mesh with your playstyle, and according to Todd Howard, most players weren't willing to take the time and suffering in order to off spec their characters into what they wanted.

Nerouyn

starkerealm wrote: »

Nerouyn wrote: »

But for an IP which is synonymous with not having classes...

Really? How many Elder Scrolls games lack classes? Oh, right, only one. Two if you get snarky and want to include Redguard. So far as it goes, the Sorcerer and Nightblade are classes from the single player games.

How can anyone be this wrong? Their three huge hits - Morrowind, Oblivion and Skyrim - are classless.

Morrowind and Oblivion have something they label as classes but which absolutely aren't. Characters can learn all spells and max all skills. Without restriction. Skyrim launched with a perk system which imposed serious restrictions and effectively forced players to make their own class but that was very unpopular and done away with in the 1.9 patch.

Arena had classes.

Daggerfall had custom classes but from what I can tell in the wiki (I didn't play it), you could level all skills regardless. Your class affected the ease with which each skill could be levelled but all could be maxed.

So my point stands. The Elder Scrolls IP is synonymous with not having classes. ESO is the exception to the rule.

runagate

1mirg wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Thats why you pick a lot of different types of players. And even if you didnt, they would still do a much better job than what wrobel is doing because of the simple fact that they are actually playing the game and they want it to be competitive.

Who is this "wrobel" person? If you don't mind me asking?

Some of the mobs have classes that characters don't. Lots of Tempests out there, Order of the Hour peeps with crazy drop from the sky stuns, etc. There's certain templates to their skills, too. I imagine that what those tree things whose name I can't recall at 4 AM are sort of Warden-y. Summoning wolves and spiders. Lots of NPCs channel shields on their allies sort of like Guard from the AvA skills. Glad we don't have that useless "leap over your enemy to land behind them and expose myself to attacks needlessly" skill NPCs have. I do want the gap-close-to-multiple-enemies in a chain skill that some boss mobs have, though. Not sure I'd want the "summon ice barrier" thing NPCs use as you can simply move to the side of it.

starkerealm

Nerouyn wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Nerouyn wrote: »

But for an IP which is synonymous with not having classes...

Really? How many Elder Scrolls games lack classes? Oh, right, only one. Two if you get snarky and want to include Redguard. So far as it goes, the Sorcerer and Nightblade are classes from the single player games.

How can anyone be this wrong? Their three huge hits - Morrowind, Oblivion and Skyrim - are classless.

As someone who has actually played every numbered game in the series... no, I can honestly say, what I said was correct. No, I didn't need to look at the wiki, except to verify my recollection that Agent, Witchhunter, and Crusader got added with Morrowind and not Daggerfall.

Arena has hard classes. They control your To Hit rolls, your crit modifiers, what equipment you could use, and so on. I forget the full list, but Arena was pulling hard from D&D, right down to classifying the Bretons as Half-Elves, as I recall.

Daggerfall has classes. You can raise most skills, but it has this idiotic system where only certain skills can reach 100. In theory you can get off class skills maxed out, but in practice it's nearly impossible to do that without deliberately metagaming how the skills progress.

Daggerfall's classes also had a long list of potential modifiers which could alter how a class worked. Including things like providing increased resistances or vulnerabilities to certain elements, adding specific gear limitations, and so on.

Daggerfall also introduced the idea of creating custom classes, which allowed you to heavily customize how your character would advance. So, while low skill values could, theoretically, be raised given time, they would hit a hard cap before reaching 100 (again, barring some very specific exploits to break the advancement limits.)

Morrowind's classes were kinda subtle. Your major skills would advance fairly quickly, your minor ones would advance more slowly, and your non-class abilities would advance at a crawl. If your skill was under 20, attempting to use actions tied to that skill would be effectively worthless. The dice hated you. Attempting to pick an easy lock at security 5? You're going to burn an entire pick in the attempt, unless you get really lucky. Want to sneak with a score of 5? Yeah, that's not happening. Even just walking around was painfully slow on a low speed, low athletics character.

Want to do it anyway, and grind? Well... you can. It's entirely possible to do so. But, raising it will take much longer, or you'll have to take the time to go find a trainer, and learn how to fix your armor by paying a professional a lot of gold (over the course of a couple days) to teach you enough so that you're not breaking your tools more often than fixing your gear.

It is an interesting system. And given time you can trivialize your class choice, but the entire focus of the game is Apotheosis.

Oblivion has classes. Again, they're like Morrowind's but the game is heavier handed with them. For example, An Acrobat started with the ability to hold a bow armed, without draining stamina, a Barbarian did not. But both started with bonus damage when using standing power attacks with a blade. Something a healer or mage didn't get.

Again, as with Morrowind, learning skills that were not part of your class went much slower, and the ability to actually use those skills were seriously curtailed (though it lacks Morrowind's wonderful, "screw you, all your attacks miss," mechanic that made leveling combat skills off class really painful.)

It also introduced a system wide training cap per level. In Morrowind, if you wanted to train off class, you could find someone, pay them, and train 10 times in that skill, then find another and do it all over again with a different off class skill. In Oblivion, your training is capped per level to 10 times total. Which can make advancing off class skills much harder.

So, no, those are classes. Every game in the series included them. Skyrim got rid of them for accessibility. If you don't think they're classes, it's probably because you never played an Elder Scrolls game before 2011.

And yes, I understand how, from looking at a wiki, you could get the idea that these aren't classes in the traditional sense. They are, but I understand where that misunderstanding can come from. If you want a game where your class choice is really about prepping your build, I'd point at something like Bloodborne or Dark Souls. ESO's classes remained relevant as you played.

starkerealm

1mirg wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Thats why you pick a lot of different types of players. And even if you didnt, they would still do a much better job than what wrobel is doing because of the simple fact that they are actually playing the game and they want it to be competitive.

Who is this "wrobel" person? If you don't mind me asking?

@1mirg, it's @Wrobel, his job is to drive the PvP community utterly bonkers on a regular basis, and provide a steady stream of salt for the community. Or class balance. I'm unsure which.

runagate

starkerealm wrote: »

1mirg wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Thats why you pick a lot of different types of players. And even if you didnt, they would still do a much better job than what wrobel is doing because of the simple fact that they are actually playing the game and they want it to be competitive.

Who is this "wrobel" person? If you don't mind me asking?

@1mirg, it's @Wrobel, his job is to drive the PvP community utterly bonkers on a regular basis, and provide a steady stream of salt for the community. Or class balance. I'm unsure which.

I hear they ask him to do pumpkin latte spit takes while they watch streamers and the internal holiday play video. To anyone who has seen these videos the cringe factor is substantial.

[ edit ] "play" as in "dramatic performance"

Scallan

leothedino wrote: »

This is my idea of a personal nightmare. I have poured all my hours into my achievements and progression of my magicka dps sorc... I honestly know that I don't and won't have it in me to do it all again on a new class. I have three alts, currently, and all of them are for when I fancy a different role for a change, stam dmg, healing or tanking etc. A new class, at this point, has 0 appeal to me until achievements can be made account bound. Forget new classes (a notion that has never existed in TES before) and bring on spellcrafting!

While I agree they should make certain achievements account-bound, you're quite incorrect about classes.

The only Elder Scrolls game that hasn't featured classes is Skyrim. Arena, Daggerfall, Morrowind, and Oblivion have all featured classes within their games.

Artis

Scallan wrote: »

Artis wrote: »

Hopefully not and please stop mentioning that. It might seem to ZOS that that's what players want when instead a lot of us would rather have new skill lines available to everyone and/or the removal of all classes at all. I mean, without the class change of course I'm actively against new classes. What if I like the new class, then what? Not only I'm forced to delete one of my alts to even try the class, but I'll also have to grind out 22k achievement points until I stop feeling like I'm wasting time and not progressing because I"m just trying to catch up with the progress I have already made, but for some weird reason it's not displayed on my character and I can't use titles and can't craft motifs I already grinded, bought and learned.

In fact, I suggest ZOS implements and automoderator who will ban everyone using "warden" and "class" in one paragraph/post for breaking the forum rules.

''ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Conspiracy Theories and Misinformation: We do not tolerate the deliberate and malicious spreading of false info or conspiracy theories about ZeniMax Online Studios, its game(s), or its employees. This does not include honest mistakes; rather, this rule pertains to those who go out of their way to spread harmful or malicious rumors about ZeniMax Online Studios and its employees, or The Elder Scrolls Online.

I'm sorry, I didn't know you spoke for the community as a whole. Your arguments against a new class are irrelevant anyways, seeing as you have to grind out "22k achievement points" and work on progression for your alts as well.

This is a speculation post, this isn't a conspiracy thread. Ironically, your antagonistic reply, including calling for bans and whatnot, is more "harmful" than anything being posted here.

That's conspiracy for sure. And it's not just this thread. Especially with all these affirmative titles.

And how are the arguments irrelevant if I have all slots taken and invested so much time in my main? What did I do to zos to screw me like that? There was no 5th class when I started playing. Now I can't main it? I will be punished for being with the game since pre-release without taking any breaks? How is this fair?

Abeille

Artis wrote: »

Scallan wrote: »

Artis wrote: »

Hopefully not and please stop mentioning that. It might seem to ZOS that that's what players want when instead a lot of us would rather have new skill lines available to everyone and/or the removal of all classes at all. I mean, without the class change of course I'm actively against new classes. What if I like the new class, then what? Not only I'm forced to delete one of my alts to even try the class, but I'll also have to grind out 22k achievement points until I stop feeling like I'm wasting time and not progressing because I"m just trying to catch up with the progress I have already made, but for some weird reason it's not displayed on my character and I can't use titles and can't craft motifs I already grinded, bought and learned.

In fact, I suggest ZOS implements and automoderator who will ban everyone using "warden" and "class" in one paragraph/post for breaking the forum rules.

''ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Conspiracy Theories and Misinformation: We do not tolerate the deliberate and malicious spreading of false info or conspiracy theories about ZeniMax Online Studios, its game(s), or its employees. This does not include honest mistakes; rather, this rule pertains to those who go out of their way to spread harmful or malicious rumors about ZeniMax Online Studios and its employees, or The Elder Scrolls Online.

I'm sorry, I didn't know you spoke for the community as a whole. Your arguments against a new class are irrelevant anyways, seeing as you have to grind out "22k achievement points" and work on progression for your alts as well.

This is a speculation post, this isn't a conspiracy thread. Ironically, your antagonistic reply, including calling for bans and whatnot, is more "harmful" than anything being posted here.

That's conspiracy for sure. And it's not just this thread. Especially with all these affirmative titles.

And how are the arguments irrelevant if I have all slots taken and invested so much time in my main? What did I do to zos to screw me like that? There was no 5th class when I started playing. Now I can't main it? I will be punished for being with the game since pre-release without taking any breaks? How is this fair?

I don't know any definition of conspiracy that can fit the speculations regarding the addition of the Warden in any way, but feel free to point one to me and to explain how this case fits it if you wish, as I am not a native speaker and maybe something is being lost in the translation.

It is very common for MMOs to add classes and races after release. They can always offer class change if they think this is too big of an issue, although I wouldn't count on that.

Btw, I'm in the game since pre-release too. I would be very happy with the addition of a 5th class. I played many MMOs in the past that added new classes down the road, some much earlier than 3 years in. MMOs are always changing and evolving, it's a characteristic of the genre.

Scallan

Artis wrote: »

Scallan wrote: »

Artis wrote: »

Hopefully not and please stop mentioning that. It might seem to ZOS that that's what players want when instead a lot of us would rather have new skill lines available to everyone and/or the removal of all classes at all. I mean, without the class change of course I'm actively against new classes. What if I like the new class, then what? Not only I'm forced to delete one of my alts to even try the class, but I'll also have to grind out 22k achievement points until I stop feeling like I'm wasting time and not progressing because I"m just trying to catch up with the progress I have already made, but for some weird reason it's not displayed on my character and I can't use titles and can't craft motifs I already grinded, bought and learned.

In fact, I suggest ZOS implements and automoderator who will ban everyone using "warden" and "class" in one paragraph/post for breaking the forum rules.

''ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Conspiracy Theories and Misinformation: We do not tolerate the deliberate and malicious spreading of false info or conspiracy theories about ZeniMax Online Studios, its game(s), or its employees. This does not include honest mistakes; rather, this rule pertains to those who go out of their way to spread harmful or malicious rumors about ZeniMax Online Studios and its employees, or The Elder Scrolls Online.

I'm sorry, I didn't know you spoke for the community as a whole. Your arguments against a new class are irrelevant anyways, seeing as you have to grind out "22k achievement points" and work on progression for your alts as well.

This is a speculation post, this isn't a conspiracy thread. Ironically, your antagonistic reply, including calling for bans and whatnot, is more "harmful" than anything being posted here.

That's conspiracy for sure. And it's not just this thread. Especially with all these affirmative titles.

And how are the arguments irrelevant if I have all slots taken and invested so much time in my main? What did I do to zos to screw me like that? There was no 5th class when I started playing. Now I can't main it? I will be punished for being with the game since pre-release without taking any breaks? How is this fair?

It's a question posed, not an affirmative title. So no, it's not a conspiracy thread.

If you're viewing new content, whether it be a new class, new dungeon, new zone, etc. as an affront to yourself and all the work you've put into the game, that is your own problem.

Adding new classes is something many MMO's do, some of the biggest games in the genre like GW2 and WoW have done it. If you can't handle changes and additions to this game you're playing the wrong game genre.

starkerealm

Scallan wrote: »

It's a question posed, not an affirmative title. So no, it's not a conspiracy thread.

Punctuation aside, grammatically the title is a statement, not a question.

Rosveen

starkerealm wrote: »

Scallan wrote: »

It's a question posed, not an affirmative title. So no, it's not a conspiracy thread.

Punctuation aside, grammatically the title is a statement, not a question.

The question mark conveys uncertainty.

dodgehopper_ESO

Abeille wrote: »

Artis wrote: »

Hopefully not and please stop mentioning that. It might seem to ZOS that that's what players want when instead a lot of us would rather have new skill lines available to everyone and/or the removal of all classes at all. I mean, without the class change of course I'm actively against new classes. What if I like the new class, then what? Not only I'm forced to delete one of my alts to even try the class, but I'll also have to grind out 22k achievement points until I stop feeling like I'm wasting time and not progressing because I"m just trying to catch up with the progress I have already made, but for some weird reason it's not displayed on my character and I can't use titles and can't craft motifs I already grinded, bought and learned.

In fact, I suggest ZOS implements and automoderator who will ban everyone using "warden" and "class" in one paragraph/post for breaking the forum rules.

''ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Conspiracy Theories and Misinformation: We do not tolerate the deliberate and malicious spreading of false info or conspiracy theories about ZeniMax Online Studios, its game(s), or its employees. This does not include honest mistakes; rather, this rule pertains to those who go out of their way to spread harmful or malicious rumors about ZeniMax Online Studios and its employees, or The Elder Scrolls Online.

A lot of players want more skill lines, a lot of players want classes to be removed, a lot of players want new classes.

Feel free to post suggestions for what you want, while the people who want something else post what they want. About what to do with your alts, there were suggestions like adding more character slots or adding class change (over the board or only to the new class).

Also this is not a conspiracy theory or false information (the only information being spread about the Warden is that its skills were datamined, which is true.) and it isn't harmful to ZOS, its employees or ESO. There is no basis for any Warden thread to be closed or for anyone to be banned on the paragraph you quoted. The only basis someone would have to close a Warden thread is the fact that there are other Warden threads. There is nothing in the rules that forbid speculation and theory crafting.

You said what I was going to say. I can understand an acerbic response for rhetorical reasons as much as the next guy, but there is a point where the argument comes off as over the top. I'd say this is one such case where an over the top response was written. I can understand the notion that one prefers there not to be classes, I'm actually a proponent of that view. The reality of this game though is that it is a class based game. No matter how much we would prefer it not to be, that is just how it is designed. I agree that it would be nice to have more out of class skill lines as well. I think if those are your views state them, but please @Artis, there really is no need for that much vitriol.

dodgehopper_ESO

lihentian wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

lihentian wrote: »

i hope there will be a necromancy summon line~~

There already is... on the forums.

i mean the warden class, ice and necromancy tend to tie together more or less.. i mean like.. lich king? XD forstmourn hungers~~

I think Warden is based thematically more upon ancient Nord magic, like the people of Solstheim would use, and not so much on the Lich King from WoW - Call me crazy.

Abeille

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

lihentian wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

lihentian wrote: »

i hope there will be a necromancy summon line~~

There already is... on the forums.

i mean the warden class, ice and necromancy tend to tie together more or less.. i mean like.. lich king? XD forstmourn hungers~~

I think Warden is based thematically more upon ancient Nord magic, like the people of Solstheim would use, and not so much on the Lich King from WoW - Call me crazy.

Okay, Crazy.

I agree with you.

dodgehopper_ESO

starkerealm wrote: »

Rosveen wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Nerouyn wrote: »

But for an IP which is synonymous with not having classes...

Really? How many Elder Scrolls games lack classes? Oh, right, only one. Two if you get snarky and want to include Redguard. So far as it goes, the Sorcerer and Nightblade are classes from the single player games.

To be fair, it was an open system: we were never prevented from using skills of other classes before.

That's also not quite true. In Arena each class had unique abilities that were exclusive to them. Daggerfall (and Battlespire) had class modifiers which were selected at character creation, but were unique in their own right, and permanently affected how your class played.

Morrowind was the first to do away with that system, but the starting skill levels for off class abilities were crippling. Which Oblivion kept, while further enforced that by restricting some basic functionality to the various skill lines unless you had 25 points in them.

In Morrowind and Oblivion it was technically possible to go off class, but your XP gains were penalized, and your ability to actually use those skills was seriously impaired until you got to a basic level of proficiency with them (and your XP gains would always be penalized).

So, your class choice did affect how your character would play. It was more subtle than Arena's system, but a Nightblade and Warrior would have vastly different experiences.

Then, Skyrim bulldozed all of that. I get why. The differences weren't immediately apparent, so you'd end up spending five or ten hours on a character, then realize it didn't really mesh with your playstyle, and according to Todd Howard, most players weren't willing to take the time and suffering in order to off spec their characters into what they wanted.

I actually tended to use out of class skills in Morrowind because it allowed me to control the pace of my leveling experience. Classes were ironically a roadblock in that game, and I actually leveled my characters in Morrowind based upon 'doing the opposite' of what was in the class.

dodgehopper_ESO

Artis wrote: »

Scallan wrote: »

Artis wrote: »

Hopefully not and please stop mentioning that. It might seem to ZOS that that's what players want when instead a lot of us would rather have new skill lines available to everyone and/or the removal of all classes at all. I mean, without the class change of course I'm actively against new classes. What if I like the new class, then what? Not only I'm forced to delete one of my alts to even try the class, but I'll also have to grind out 22k achievement points until I stop feeling like I'm wasting time and not progressing because I"m just trying to catch up with the progress I have already made, but for some weird reason it's not displayed on my character and I can't use titles and can't craft motifs I already grinded, bought and learned.

In fact, I suggest ZOS implements and automoderator who will ban everyone using "warden" and "class" in one paragraph/post for breaking the forum rules.

''ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Conspiracy Theories and Misinformation: We do not tolerate the deliberate and malicious spreading of false info or conspiracy theories about ZeniMax Online Studios, its game(s), or its employees. This does not include honest mistakes; rather, this rule pertains to those who go out of their way to spread harmful or malicious rumors about ZeniMax Online Studios and its employees, or The Elder Scrolls Online.

I'm sorry, I didn't know you spoke for the community as a whole. Your arguments against a new class are irrelevant anyways, seeing as you have to grind out "22k achievement points" and work on progression for your alts as well.

This is a speculation post, this isn't a conspiracy thread. Ironically, your antagonistic reply, including calling for bans and whatnot, is more "harmful" than anything being posted here.

That's conspiracy for sure. And it's not just this thread. Especially with all these affirmative titles.

And how are the arguments irrelevant if I have all slots taken and invested so much time in my main? What did I do to zos to screw me like that? There was no 5th class when I started playing. Now I can't main it? I will be punished for being with the game since pre-release without taking any breaks? How is this fair?

I'm not sure what is so punishing about the possibility of having a new class. As a longstanding player you will be at great advantage over any new player building a Warden (or whatever). The new player will not only have to build his Warden, but he will also have to build CP, crafting, etc. Meanwhile you will have capped CP and mow through content with ease compared to the new guy. If you want to go through and get achievements on every character I realize that will take some time, but that would not be any different than the situation you had already. I do feel however if they were to add a new class, they really need to offer more character slots.