Velidreth,Selene or Kra'gh?

EnemyOfDaState

Playing a stamina DK wearing 5 piece rage and 3 agility cant decide on which set would be best. I'm leaning towards Velidreth because I lack AOE but i'm not sure.

DPShiro

Don't wear HR.
Kragh is BiS most of the time, Velidreth second.

Ghettokid

None of them.

EnemyOfDaState

DPShiro wrote: »

Don't wear HR.
Kragh is BiS most of the time, Velidreth second.

What would you suggest for a stam build?

DRXHarbinger

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

DPShiro wrote: »

Don't wear HR.
Kragh is BiS most of the time, Velidreth second.

What would you suggest for a stam build?

NMG.

Leandor

DRXHarbinger wrote: »

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

DPShiro wrote: »

Don't wear HR.
Kragh is BiS most of the time, Velidreth second.

What would you suggest for a stam build?

NMG.

As long as you are running solo, spriggan will do more for yourself over nmg.

Enslaved

For solo play, Velidreth.
For solo PvP, Selene.
For group PvE, either Velidreth or Kra'gh, depending on boss you face.

Anyways, NMG is great choice for group play, it helps a ton if you PUG, since I rarely saw anyone in PUG using that.
For solo, spriggan is better, I guess. That way you can use either vMA weapons, or if you don't have them, a pair of leki's daggers or morag tong - pretty much any set that gives you more damage on 2pc. If by any chance you don't use DW, I guess you can use any random sharpened weapon, then.

DPShiro

EnemyOfDaState wrote: »

DPShiro wrote: »

Don't wear HR.
Kragh is BiS most of the time, Velidreth second.

What would you suggest for a stam build?

Solo NMG, 3x VO, 2x Kragh
Group TBS, 3x VO, 2 Kragh

Milvan

Solo and group dungeons: 5x Spriggans, 2x velidreth e 5xvo
Trials: 5xTBS; 2xvelidreth; 3xVO; Maelstroms weapons. (5 VO will also be great).

ArchMikem

I figure Velidreth's only good cause of the big burst damage. Everyone loves dat poison. Though I'm thinking if I'm to replace my Stamblade's Selene, it'll be the Kra'gh set. That, or I'd LOVE to get a hold of the Stormfist..

Izaki

DPShiro wrote: »

Don't wear HR.
Kragh is BiS most of the time, Velidreth second.

@DPShiro You're forgetting Stormfist. Its actually better than Velidreth, and if you have full penetration, Stormfist is also better than Kra'gh. Also TBS is only good if you have the support stamina sets (NMG, Sunderflame). If you only have 2 stamina builds and thus no place for any buff sets, Two-Fanged Serpent actually out-performs TBS (by quite a lot).

So technically the BiS trials set-up (with 2 or less stamina builds) = 5x Two-Fanged Serpent, 2x Stormfist, 3x Vicious Ophidian/Alkosh, vMA weapons.
In a situation with 3 or more stamina builds, where there's is a possibility of wearing buff sets, yes TBS (or even Leviathan if you have a good Warhorn uptime) would be BiS, but have you seen a serious group with more than 2 stamina builds in the current meta? A meta where Templars and Sorcs are insanely OP

And the Kra'gh 2 piece just sucks. Its maximum DPS potential isn't even close to Velidreth or Stormfist. When wearing Two-Fanged Serpent, you don't need to wear Kra'gh because you have a constant 15.5k penetration (Major Fracture, Two-Fanged 5 piece bonus, Sharpened weapons, base penetration), so Alkosh alone is enough to achieve full penetration. It might even be better to use 1 sharp and 1 precise weapon, that way when the Crusher Enchant and Minor Fracture are applied you're not over-penetrating the boss. Because Kra'gh is not needed in this situation, you can use Stormfist or Velidreth. IMO, Stormfist > Velidreth, because it can hit more than 3 enemies, it procs more often and it just does more damage per proc than Velidreth.

The only situation where Kra'gh would outperform Stormfist, is on a stamina sorc (IKR?! I was surprised too), because of the Implosion passive. Kra'gh, although doing less damage than Stormfist, has more hits per second, which gives it a higher chance to proc Implosion. However, for 85% of the fight, Stormfist still outperforms Kra'gh on a stamina sorc (and any other class for that matter).

I've got the maths for all this, both Two-Fanged Serpent vs TBS and Stormfist vs Kra'gh, somewhere. Will post it, I had help from a PC guy too.

Powerburrito20

But if your penetration is not max, how much does the Kra'gh help all around dps from the penetration bonus?

paulsimonps

IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »

DPShiro wrote: »

Don't wear HR.
Kragh is BiS most of the time, Velidreth second.

@DPShiro You're forgetting Stormfist. Its actually better than Velidreth, and if you have full penetration, Stormfist is also better than Kra'gh. Also TBS is only good if you have the support stamina sets (NMG, Sunderflame). If you only have 2 stamina builds and thus no place for any buff sets, Two-Fanged Serpent actually out-performs TBS (by quite a lot).

So technically the BiS trials set-up (with 2 or less stamina builds) = 5x Two-Fanged Serpent, 2x Stormfist, 3x Vicious Ophidian/Alkosh, vMA weapons.
In a situation with 3 or more stamina builds, where there's is a possibility of wearing buff sets, yes TBS (or even Leviathan if you have a good Warhorn uptime) would be BiS, but have you seen a serious group with more than 2 stamina builds in the current meta? A meta where Templars and Sorcs are insanely OP

And the Kra'gh 2 piece just sucks. Its maximum DPS potential isn't even close to Velidreth or Stormfist. When wearing Two-Fanged Serpent, you don't need to wear Kra'gh because you have a constant 15.5k penetration (Major Fracture, Two-Fanged 5 piece bonus, Sharpened weapons, base penetration), so Alkosh alone is enough to achieve full penetration. It might even be better to use 1 sharp and 1 precise weapon, that way when the Crusher Enchant and Minor Fracture are applied you're not over-penetrating the boss. Because Kra'gh is not needed in this situation, you can use Stormfist or Velidreth. IMO, Stormfist > Velidreth, because it can hit more than 3 enemies, it procs more often and it just does more damage per proc than Velidreth.

The only situation where Kra'gh would outperform Stormfist, is on a stamina sorc (IKR?! I was surprised too), because of the Implosion passive. Kra'gh, although doing less damage than Stormfist, has more hits per second, which gives it a higher chance to proc Implosion. However, for 85% of the fight, Stormfist still outperforms Kra'gh on a stamina sorc (and any other class for that matter).

I've got the maths for all this, both Two-Fanged Serpent vs TBS and Stormfist vs Kra'gh, somewhere. Will post it, I had help from a PC guy too.

For single target boss fights in trials, the only part that truly matters for DPS checks, I would never recommend Twice-Fanged Serpent nor Spriggan or NMG. Lets go over the penetration buffs and resistance debuffs. Major Fracture 5280, Minor Fracture 1320, Alkosh 3010, Crushing Enchant 1622 and Sharpened weapons 2580 per weapon. With 2 Sharpened that would be a total of 16392 and we are left with 1808. Now up time on Chrushing and Alkosh goes up and down slightly but in a two tank situation like vMoL, vSO or vHRC HM then up time will be no issue. So the 1p bonus from Kra'gh is all you will need to get to max penetration. Of course having one person in the group run NMG for trash is still a valid argument if you have a lot of stamina users but I would say 3 or more for it to be worth it.

Now lets look at the 4 monster sets that have been mentioned in the thread:

• Kra'gh
  (1 items) Adds 1935 Physical Penetration
  (2 items) When you deal damage, you have a 10% chance to spawn dreugh limbs that create shockwaves in front of you dealing 1300 Physical Damage every 0.4 seconds for 1.2 seconds. This effect can occur once every 3 seconds.
• Selene
  (1 items) Adds 967 Max Stamina
  (2 items) When you deal direct melee damage, you have a 15% chance to call on a primal spirit that mauls the closest enemy in front of you for 12000 Physical Damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.
• Stormfist
  (1 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
  (2 items) When you deal damage, you have a 10% chance to create a thunderfist to crush the enemy, dealing 1500 Shock Damage every 1 second for 3 seconds to all enemies within 4 meters and a final 8000 Physical Damage when the fist closes. This effect can occur once every 8 seconds.
• Velidreth
  (1 items) Adds 129 Weapon Damage
  (2 items) When you deal damage, you have a 20% chance to spawn 3 disease spores in front of you that deal 10320 Disease Damage to the first enemy hit. This effect can occur once every 9 seconds.

Kra'gh has the strongest 1p with the Physical Penetration but lacks in 2p with only 10% chance to give 3900 DMG over 1.2 and 3s cooldown. So since it can only happen tops every 3s its just about a 1300 dps increase from the set alone, but since it will almost never proc straight after it will be less.

Selene has meh 1p but its 2p is strong 15% from melee attack to dealing 12000 DMG with a 4s cooldown. So IF it proced right after the cooldown it would give us about a 3000 DPS increase, but just like Kra'gh it won't proc right after its cooldown is done.

Stormfist has a nice regen bonus but IMO I would rather go with any of the other 3 1p bonuses. Then we have its 2p 10% to deal 4500 DMG over 3s in a 4m radius and then 8000 DMG when its over, it then has a 8s cooldown. Disregarding any passives or other bonuses that might effect it just like with the other sets it would account for a total of 12500 DMG over 8s which is 1562.5 DPS and again only IF it procs directly after each cooldown is done.

Velidreth has a strong 1p with that Weapon Damage increase, a solid buff. Its 2p is a crown favorite among gankers as well as for some in vMSA. 20% to deal 10320 DMG to the enemy hit first by the 3 orbs, with a 9s cooldown. That's a 1146 DPS increase looking at the set on its own and again it IF it procs right of the bat.

My opinion about these sets for a sustained Trial fight is this, don't use their 2p bonuses. As much as their visuals and stats might be tempting I am gonna recommend going 1p Kra'gh and either 1p Velidreth or actually 1p Kena since they both have Wpn DMG, of couse Kena has Spell DMG too but that is not important here. The idea here is to increase the damage of ALL of your abilities rather than having a proc set give you a slight DPS boost, their added DPS is not all that much to speak of and with the next update Proc sets will no longer be able to crit. Which gives another point in favor of boosting the damage of the things that can crit. Giving them a greater base damage will further increase their crit damage.

Lastly as a side note cause the set was mentioned, I would never recommend Leviathan, TBS out does it. The crit chance added by the 3 crit bonuses of Leviathan is 3019 or 13.78% while the Thief Bonus with 7 Legendary Divines is 16.7%. So unless you do Leviathan AND the Thief there is no reason to running it and even then I would not recommend it. Going high crit chance in exchange for a lower crit severity will actually cost you DPS not give more. Which means that if you go Leviathan and Shadow you will without a doubt be lowering your DPS. TBS gives more crit chance and lets you still have the Shadow for crit damage and it also comes with a Health buff for increased survivability. BTW same thing goes for Mother's Sorrow for Magicka users.

Hope that helps people out a bit, and remember never be afraid to test out some stuff as well. Maybe you will find something no one else has or disprove someones claim.

Vanthras79

A bit off topic, but I have to know. How many chins does Velidreth have?

Izaki

paulsimonps wrote: »

IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »

DPShiro wrote: »

Don't wear HR.
Kragh is BiS most of the time, Velidreth second.

@DPShiro You're forgetting Stormfist. Its actually better than Velidreth, and if you have full penetration, Stormfist is also better than Kra'gh. Also TBS is only good if you have the support stamina sets (NMG, Sunderflame). If you only have 2 stamina builds and thus no place for any buff sets, Two-Fanged Serpent actually out-performs TBS (by quite a lot).

So technically the BiS trials set-up (with 2 or less stamina builds) = 5x Two-Fanged Serpent, 2x Stormfist, 3x Vicious Ophidian/Alkosh, vMA weapons.
In a situation with 3 or more stamina builds, where there's is a possibility of wearing buff sets, yes TBS (or even Leviathan if you have a good Warhorn uptime) would be BiS, but have you seen a serious group with more than 2 stamina builds in the current meta? A meta where Templars and Sorcs are insanely OP

And the Kra'gh 2 piece just sucks. Its maximum DPS potential isn't even close to Velidreth or Stormfist. When wearing Two-Fanged Serpent, you don't need to wear Kra'gh because you have a constant 15.5k penetration (Major Fracture, Two-Fanged 5 piece bonus, Sharpened weapons, base penetration), so Alkosh alone is enough to achieve full penetration. It might even be better to use 1 sharp and 1 precise weapon, that way when the Crusher Enchant and Minor Fracture are applied you're not over-penetrating the boss. Because Kra'gh is not needed in this situation, you can use Stormfist or Velidreth. IMO, Stormfist > Velidreth, because it can hit more than 3 enemies, it procs more often and it just does more damage per proc than Velidreth.

The only situation where Kra'gh would outperform Stormfist, is on a stamina sorc (IKR?! I was surprised too), because of the Implosion passive. Kra'gh, although doing less damage than Stormfist, has more hits per second, which gives it a higher chance to proc Implosion. However, for 85% of the fight, Stormfist still outperforms Kra'gh on a stamina sorc (and any other class for that matter).

I've got the maths for all this, both Two-Fanged Serpent vs TBS and Stormfist vs Kra'gh, somewhere. Will post it, I had help from a PC guy too.

For single target boss fights in trials, the only part that truly matters for DPS checks, I would never recommend Twice-Fanged Serpent nor Spriggan or NMG. Lets go over the penetration buffs and resistance debuffs. Major Fracture 5280, Minor Fracture 1320, Alkosh 3010, Crushing Enchant 1622 and Sharpened weapons 2580 per weapon. With 2 Sharpened that would be a total of 16392 and we are left with 1808. Now up time on Chrushing and Alkosh goes up and down slightly but in a two tank situation like vMoL, vSO or vHRC HM then up time will be no issue. So the 1p bonus from Kra'gh is all you will need to get to max penetration. Of course having one person in the group run NMG for trash is still a valid argument if you have a lot of stamina users but I would say 3 or more for it to be worth it.

Now lets look at the 4 monster sets that have been mentioned in the thread:

• Kra'gh
  (1 items) Adds 1935 Physical Penetration
  (2 items) When you deal damage, you have a 10% chance to spawn dreugh limbs that create shockwaves in front of you dealing 1300 Physical Damage every 0.4 seconds for 1.2 seconds. This effect can occur once every 3 seconds.
• Selene
  (1 items) Adds 967 Max Stamina
  (2 items) When you deal direct melee damage, you have a 15% chance to call on a primal spirit that mauls the closest enemy in front of you for 12000 Physical Damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.
• Stormfist
  (1 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
  (2 items) When you deal damage, you have a 10% chance to create a thunderfist to crush the enemy, dealing 1500 Shock Damage every 1 second for 3 seconds to all enemies within 4 meters and a final 8000 Physical Damage when the fist closes. This effect can occur once every 8 seconds.
• Velidreth
  (1 items) Adds 129 Weapon Damage
  (2 items) When you deal damage, you have a 20% chance to spawn 3 disease spores in front of you that deal 10320 Disease Damage to the first enemy hit. This effect can occur once every 9 seconds.

Kra'gh has the strongest 1p with the Physical Penetration but lacks in 2p with only 10% chance to give 3900 DMG over 1.2 and 3s cooldown. So since it can only happen tops every 3s its just about a 1300 dps increase from the set alone, but since it will almost never proc straight after it will be less.

Selene has meh 1p but its 2p is strong 15% from melee attack to dealing 12000 DMG with a 4s cooldown. So IF it proced right after the cooldown it would give us about a 3000 DPS increase, but just like Kra'gh it won't proc right after its cooldown is done.

Stormfist has a nice regen bonus but IMO I would rather go with any of the other 3 1p bonuses. Then we have its 2p 10% to deal 4500 DMG over 3s in a 4m radius and then 8000 DMG when its over, it then has a 8s cooldown. Disregarding any passives or other bonuses that might effect it just like with the other sets it would account for a total of 12500 DMG over 8s which is 1562.5 DPS and again only IF it procs directly after each cooldown is done.

Velidreth has a strong 1p with that Weapon Damage increase, a solid buff. Its 2p is a crown favorite among gankers as well as for some in vMSA. 20% to deal 10320 DMG to the enemy hit first by the 3 orbs, with a 9s cooldown. That's a 1146 DPS increase looking at the set on its own and again it IF it procs right of the bat.

My opinion about these sets for a sustained Trial fight is this, don't use their 2p bonuses. As much as their visuals and stats might be tempting I am gonna recommend going 1p Kra'gh and either 1p Velidreth or actually 1p Kena since they both have Wpn DMG, of couse Kena has Spell DMG too but that is not important here. The idea here is to increase the damage of ALL of your abilities rather than having a proc set give you a slight DPS boost, their added DPS is not all that much to speak of and with the next update Proc sets will no longer be able to crit. Which gives another point in favor of boosting the damage of the things that can crit. Giving them a greater base damage will further increase their crit damage.

Lastly as a side note cause the set was mentioned, I would never recommend Leviathan, TBS out does it. The crit chance added by the 3 crit bonuses of Leviathan is 3019 or 13.78% while the Thief Bonus with 7 Legendary Divines is 16.7%. So unless you do Leviathan AND the Thief there is no reason to running it and even then I would not recommend it. Going high crit chance in exchange for a lower crit severity will actually cost you DPS not give more. Which means that if you go Leviathan and Shadow you will without a doubt be lowering your DPS. TBS gives more crit chance and lets you still have the Shadow for crit damage and it also comes with a Health buff for increased survivability. BTW same thing goes for Mother's Sorrow for Magicka users.

Hope that helps people out a bit, and remember never be afraid to test out some stuff as well. Maybe you will find something no one else has or disprove someones claim.

No... You can't count the buffs that don't have 100% uptime. Crushing has a max uptime of 50% IF the tank can put in a light attack. This is not always possible in intense situations, I'm sure you know that letting go of block in a HM could be a wipe if you get unlucky.
Minor Fracture requires a stamina Templar in the group, so essentially you're relying on another stamina DPS, and stamina templars are NEVER first choice in a group. Stam DK, Sorc or NB all pull higher DPS. If you want to replace a magicka templar or a magicka DK, you don't want to lose single target DPS, you want the exact opposite,something that stamina templars are unable to provide. So Minor Fracture is out of the picture.
Alkosh... The uptime isn't guaranteed either.
Even with 2 tanks you can't assume full uptime. The off-tank's crusher enchant simply refreshes the main tank's one, IF they are coordinated enough, and usually there's a lot more stuff to worry about. Alkosh depends on the avalable synergies. Usually you will be getting shards, orbs and liquid lightning, sometimes a radiate or a banner or nova right? Okay, what about all the situations where your offtank is separated from the main group? The off tank isn't always on the boss, he's usually taking care of important adds, etc. So Alkosh and Crusher are periodic and Minor Fracture is most likely inexistant.

About the monster sets... It sounds as if you had no clue... AlthoughI'm surethat itsquite the opposite. If you aren't running a monster set, you should be running VO or Alkosh 5 piece! They are much stronger boni than two mismatched monster sets. And you're very wrong about the fact that monster sets aren't a huge boost in DPS. Stormfist precisely counters what stamina builds lack most: AOE damage. So do Velidreth and Kra'gh to a lesser extent. Now about your DPS calculations. You're not taking into account CP, big mistake as it would change your results significantly for Stormfist and Kra'gh asboth double dip in Thaumaturge and Mighty (the final hit of Stormfist is still a tick of a DoT). Obviously it all depends on the distribution. You're also missing critical hits in your calculations. Even if they get removed in update 13, its irrelevant for the current patch. Plus we don't know about the other changes yet. Stormfist's (or Kra'gh or Velidreth for that matter) proc outperforms some raw stats by quite a margin. 129 weapon damage is a small tooltip increase, which I'm sure you canfigure out for youself. That is no where near even a non critting 2pc monster set.
About Leviathan and Mother's Sorrow. You're NEVER meant to run the Shadow mundus by itself in PvE as it gets outperformed by the thief in pretty much any situation. Leviathan with the Thief and a good uptime on Major Force (50%+ I believe, easy enough to achieve in a well set up horn rotation every ~20sec) TBS gets outparsed by quite a lot. The health bonus... Sure its great. But not mandatory for anyone who knows what he's doing.

So once again, Two-Fanged Serpent is the most powerful set for stamina DPS before full penetration is achieved. Sadly its what magicka users get passively. So your argument is flawed from the beginning actually, because with Two-Fanged you achieve the base penetration of a magicka build...

I entirely agree with your final statement. And I don't mean to come off as a jerk, I just don't quite agree with your analysis of these things

Izaki

Powerburrito20 wrote: »

But if your penetration is not max, how much does the Kra'gh help all around dps from the penetration bonus?

I belive its around 3.X % can't recall the exact number.

paulsimonps

IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »

DPShiro wrote: »

Don't wear HR.
Kragh is BiS most of the time, Velidreth second.

@DPShiro You're forgetting Stormfist. Its actually better than Velidreth, and if you have full penetration, Stormfist is also better than Kra'gh. Also TBS is only good if you have the support stamina sets (NMG, Sunderflame). If you only have 2 stamina builds and thus no place for any buff sets, Two-Fanged Serpent actually out-performs TBS (by quite a lot).

So technically the BiS trials set-up (with 2 or less stamina builds) = 5x Two-Fanged Serpent, 2x Stormfist, 3x Vicious Ophidian/Alkosh, vMA weapons.
In a situation with 3 or more stamina builds, where there's is a possibility of wearing buff sets, yes TBS (or even Leviathan if you have a good Warhorn uptime) would be BiS, but have you seen a serious group with more than 2 stamina builds in the current meta? A meta where Templars and Sorcs are insanely OP

And the Kra'gh 2 piece just sucks. Its maximum DPS potential isn't even close to Velidreth or Stormfist. When wearing Two-Fanged Serpent, you don't need to wear Kra'gh because you have a constant 15.5k penetration (Major Fracture, Two-Fanged 5 piece bonus, Sharpened weapons, base penetration), so Alkosh alone is enough to achieve full penetration. It might even be better to use 1 sharp and 1 precise weapon, that way when the Crusher Enchant and Minor Fracture are applied you're not over-penetrating the boss. Because Kra'gh is not needed in this situation, you can use Stormfist or Velidreth. IMO, Stormfist > Velidreth, because it can hit more than 3 enemies, it procs more often and it just does more damage per proc than Velidreth.

The only situation where Kra'gh would outperform Stormfist, is on a stamina sorc (IKR?! I was surprised too), because of the Implosion passive. Kra'gh, although doing less damage than Stormfist, has more hits per second, which gives it a higher chance to proc Implosion. However, for 85% of the fight, Stormfist still outperforms Kra'gh on a stamina sorc (and any other class for that matter).

I've got the maths for all this, both Two-Fanged Serpent vs TBS and Stormfist vs Kra'gh, somewhere. Will post it, I had help from a PC guy too.

For single target boss fights in trials, the only part that truly matters for DPS checks, I would never recommend Twice-Fanged Serpent nor Spriggan or NMG. Lets go over the penetration buffs and resistance debuffs. Major Fracture 5280, Minor Fracture 1320, Alkosh 3010, Crushing Enchant 1622 and Sharpened weapons 2580 per weapon. With 2 Sharpened that would be a total of 16392 and we are left with 1808. Now up time on Chrushing and Alkosh goes up and down slightly but in a two tank situation like vMoL, vSO or vHRC HM then up time will be no issue. So the 1p bonus from Kra'gh is all you will need to get to max penetration. Of course having one person in the group run NMG for trash is still a valid argument if you have a lot of stamina users but I would say 3 or more for it to be worth it.

Now lets look at the 4 monster sets that have been mentioned in the thread:

• Kra'gh
  (1 items) Adds 1935 Physical Penetration
  (2 items) When you deal damage, you have a 10% chance to spawn dreugh limbs that create shockwaves in front of you dealing 1300 Physical Damage every 0.4 seconds for 1.2 seconds. This effect can occur once every 3 seconds.
• Selene
  (1 items) Adds 967 Max Stamina
  (2 items) When you deal direct melee damage, you have a 15% chance to call on a primal spirit that mauls the closest enemy in front of you for 12000 Physical Damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.
• Stormfist
  (1 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
  (2 items) When you deal damage, you have a 10% chance to create a thunderfist to crush the enemy, dealing 1500 Shock Damage every 1 second for 3 seconds to all enemies within 4 meters and a final 8000 Physical Damage when the fist closes. This effect can occur once every 8 seconds.
• Velidreth
  (1 items) Adds 129 Weapon Damage
  (2 items) When you deal damage, you have a 20% chance to spawn 3 disease spores in front of you that deal 10320 Disease Damage to the first enemy hit. This effect can occur once every 9 seconds.

Kra'gh has the strongest 1p with the Physical Penetration but lacks in 2p with only 10% chance to give 3900 DMG over 1.2 and 3s cooldown. So since it can only happen tops every 3s its just about a 1300 dps increase from the set alone, but since it will almost never proc straight after it will be less.

Selene has meh 1p but its 2p is strong 15% from melee attack to dealing 12000 DMG with a 4s cooldown. So IF it proced right after the cooldown it would give us about a 3000 DPS increase, but just like Kra'gh it won't proc right after its cooldown is done.

Stormfist has a nice regen bonus but IMO I would rather go with any of the other 3 1p bonuses. Then we have its 2p 10% to deal 4500 DMG over 3s in a 4m radius and then 8000 DMG when its over, it then has a 8s cooldown. Disregarding any passives or other bonuses that might effect it just like with the other sets it would account for a total of 12500 DMG over 8s which is 1562.5 DPS and again only IF it procs directly after each cooldown is done.

Velidreth has a strong 1p with that Weapon Damage increase, a solid buff. Its 2p is a crown favorite among gankers as well as for some in vMSA. 20% to deal 10320 DMG to the enemy hit first by the 3 orbs, with a 9s cooldown. That's a 1146 DPS increase looking at the set on its own and again it IF it procs right of the bat.

My opinion about these sets for a sustained Trial fight is this, don't use their 2p bonuses. As much as their visuals and stats might be tempting I am gonna recommend going 1p Kra'gh and either 1p Velidreth or actually 1p Kena since they both have Wpn DMG, of couse Kena has Spell DMG too but that is not important here. The idea here is to increase the damage of ALL of your abilities rather than having a proc set give you a slight DPS boost, their added DPS is not all that much to speak of and with the next update Proc sets will no longer be able to crit. Which gives another point in favor of boosting the damage of the things that can crit. Giving them a greater base damage will further increase their crit damage.

Lastly as a side note cause the set was mentioned, I would never recommend Leviathan, TBS out does it. The crit chance added by the 3 crit bonuses of Leviathan is 3019 or 13.78% while the Thief Bonus with 7 Legendary Divines is 16.7%. So unless you do Leviathan AND the Thief there is no reason to running it and even then I would not recommend it. Going high crit chance in exchange for a lower crit severity will actually cost you DPS not give more. Which means that if you go Leviathan and Shadow you will without a doubt be lowering your DPS. TBS gives more crit chance and lets you still have the Shadow for crit damage and it also comes with a Health buff for increased survivability. BTW same thing goes for Mother's Sorrow for Magicka users.

Hope that helps people out a bit, and remember never be afraid to test out some stuff as well. Maybe you will find something no one else has or disprove someones claim.

No... You can't count the buffs that don't have 100% uptime. Crushing has a max uptime of 50% IF the tank can put in a light attack. This is not always possible in intense situations, I'm sure you know that letting go of block in a HM could be a wipe if you get unlucky.
Minor Fracture requires a stamina Templar in the group, so essentially you're relying on another stamina DPS, and stamina templars are NEVER first choice in a group. Stam DK, Sorc or NB all pull higher DPS. If you want to replace a magicka templar or a magicka DK, you don't want to lose single target DPS, you want the exact opposite,something that stamina templars are unable to provide. So Minor Fracture is out of the picture.
Alkosh... The uptime isn't guaranteed either.
Even with 2 tanks you can't assume full uptime. The off-tank's crusher enchant simply refreshes the main tank's one, IF they are coordinated enough, and usually there's a lot more stuff to worry about. Alkosh depends on the avalable synergies. Usually you will be getting shards, orbs and liquid lightning, sometimes a radiate or a banner or nova right? Okay, what about all the situations where your offtank is separated from the main group? The off tank isn't always on the boss, he's usually taking care of important adds, etc. So Alkosh and Crusher are periodic and Minor Fracture is most likely inexistant.

About the monster sets... It sounds as if you had no clue... AlthoughI'm surethat itsquite the opposite. If you aren't running a monster set, you should be running VO or Alkosh 5 piece! They are much stronger boni than two mismatched monster sets. And you're very wrong about the fact that monster sets aren't a huge boost in DPS. Stormfist precisely counters what stamina builds lack most: AOE damage. So do Velidreth and Kra'gh to a lesser extent. Now about your DPS calculations. You're not taking into account CP, big mistake as it would change your results significantly for Stormfist and Kra'gh asboth double dip in Thaumaturge and Mighty (the final hit of Stormfist is still a tick of a DoT). Obviously it all depends on the distribution. You're also missing critical hits in your calculations. Even if they get removed in update 13, its irrelevant for the current patch. Plus we don't know about the other changes yet. Stormfist's (or Kra'gh or Velidreth for that matter) proc outperforms some raw stats by quite a margin. 129 weapon damage is a small tooltip increase, which I'm sure you canfigure out for youself. That is no where near even a non critting 2pc monster set.
About Leviathan and Mother's Sorrow. You're NEVER meant to run the Shadow mundus by itself in PvE as it gets outperformed by the thief in pretty much any situation. Leviathan with the Thief and a good uptime on Major Force (50%+ I believe, easy enough to achieve in a well set up horn rotation every ~20sec) TBS gets outparsed by quite a lot. The health bonus... Sure its great. But not mandatory for anyone who knows what he's doing.

So once again, Two-Fanged Serpent is the most powerful set for stamina DPS before full penetration is achieved. Sadly its what magicka users get passively. So your argument is flawed from the beginning actually, because with Two-Fanged you achieve the base penetration of a magicka build...

I entirely agree with your final statement. And I don't mean to come off as a jerk, I just don't quite agree with your analysis of these things

No, it is you that are wrong. I can count those buffs. If you have never heard of a healer running Power of the Light then I feel sorry for the groups that you have run with. The healers I run with keep it up constantly, its not that hard really. And any tank and group worth their weight gives out and uses synergies in the way alkosh is meant to be used. I don't use a synergy out of Alkosh rotation unless I need a shard. Orbs, Shards, Purify, Overload, Standards, these are all essential to a great group. Sure in a pug you can't expect it but I don't theorycraft for pugs but progression groups. 4-5 possible synergies is more than enough to keep an Alkosh going. And the crusher enchant can be proced from your Pierce Armor and Heroic Slash, so a Main tank would never have to drop block to keep it up, they don't just proc of Light or Heavy attacks. And with Infused its up almost all the time. So the first bit is way off.

And no the base damage increase form 129 weapon damage is more than you think, combine it over time with ALL of your abilities and it adds up to a lot of damage, and that is damage that can crit. And Major Force is only 30% not sure where you got 50% from, and TBS with Shadow and Thief is better than Leviathan and Thief. Sure you get really high crit but there is such a things as too much crit if your base damage or critical severity is too low. Lowering your crit chance slightly to get the 18% extra crit damage from shadow is worth it and does a lot more damage in the long run. Good up time on Major Force and Minor Force puts your crit severity up at 60% and that is not counting any CP that might add even more. I would much rather have that extra 18% crit severity than the 13% crit chance from Leviathan, if you are having your crit at around 70-75% you don't need more, and exchanging crit severity for crit chance in the high 80s to 90+% is foolish. And the extra health means a lot in Hardmode trials like Maw or AA where everyone is gonna get hit.

And my suggestion for two different one piece bonus was with No maelstrom in mind cause not everyone has it. Obviously if they have Maelstrom weapons then 1 Kra'gh would be the preferred one piece and going 5p TBS and 4p of either Alkosh or VO. But really if you go 3p of any of them and 1p Kena or Velidreth then it won't make a difference except with 4p VO that has Wpn Crit 4p unlike Alkosh's 4p Wpn DMG, all depends on what you have available. My stam sorc set up for Trials while not using Maelstrom is 5p VO 5p TBS 1p Kena and 1p Kra'gh and I know many others that run similarly that do very well. Oh and obviously its just 4p VO on the back bar.

IronCrystal

As @IzakiBrotheSs said, the argument of leviathan vs TBS comes from depending on major force from warhorn to boost your crit damage in a trial. For the most part, you can't conpare single player pve sets to what's best in a trial environment because there are lots of buffs going around.

HatchetHaro

So many arguments here about what is best and what is not. I'll just say that you'll eventually work it out, but for now everything you have there are just as viable as the other pieces.

Slot 1pc Kra'gh's and 1pc Velidreth/Kena, make sure they're both med divines; this way you get more raw damage rather than proc damage. However, I'm not going to dismiss Selene's or Stormfist as viable options.

Oh, and, don't swap out HR with NMG just yet; HR is always a reliable no-compromises set that is good no matter what loadout your team is. NMG may be better but if more than one person wears it (and pretty much everybody wears it) you're gonna lose out in damage.

TBS is great as well, but it is reliant on your tank running Aggressive Warhorn.

In the end, your damage does not fully depend on your gear; you're a stam DK, which is the hardest class/role to do damage with, but is also one of the most effective. Work on your rotations, make sure to focus on applying your DoTs quickly and efficiently, and you'll still deal respectable damage regardless of which gear is BiS.

EnemyOfDaState

HatchetHaro wrote: »

So many arguments here about what is best and what is not. I'll just say that you'll eventually work it out, but for now everything you have there are just as viable as the othet pieces.

Slot 1pc Kra'gh's and 1pc Velidreth/Kena, make sure they're both med divines; this way you get more raw damage rather than proc damage. However, I'm not going to dismiss Selene's or Stormfist as viable options.

Oh, and, don't swap out HR with NMG just yet; HR is always a reliable no-compromises set that is good no matter what loadout your team is. NMG may be better but if more than one person wears it (and pretty much everybody wears it) you're gonna lose out in damage.

TBS is great as well, but it is reliant on your tank running Aggressive Warhorn.

In the end, your damage does not fully depend on your gear; you're a stam DK, which is the hardest class/role to do damage with, but is also one of the most effective. Work on your rotations, make sure to focus on applying your DoTs quickly and efficiently, and you'll still deal respectable damage regardless of which gear is BiS.

I hadn't thought of this. Yeah I am mainly looking for a decent build for group dungeons and trials so that is an important factor, I pug so I can't really know what the other person is bringing to the table.

Izaki

paulsimonps wrote: »

IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »

paulsimonps wrote: »

IzakiBrotheSs wrote: »

DPShiro wrote: »

Don't wear HR.
Kragh is BiS most of the time, Velidreth second.

@DPShiro You're forgetting Stormfist. Its actually better than Velidreth, and if you have full penetration, Stormfist is also better than Kra'gh. Also TBS is only good if you have the support stamina sets (NMG, Sunderflame). If you only have 2 stamina builds and thus no place for any buff sets, Two-Fanged Serpent actually out-performs TBS (by quite a lot).

So technically the BiS trials set-up (with 2 or less stamina builds) = 5x Two-Fanged Serpent, 2x Stormfist, 3x Vicious Ophidian/Alkosh, vMA weapons.
In a situation with 3 or more stamina builds, where there's is a possibility of wearing buff sets, yes TBS (or even Leviathan if you have a good Warhorn uptime) would be BiS, but have you seen a serious group with more than 2 stamina builds in the current meta? A meta where Templars and Sorcs are insanely OP

And the Kra'gh 2 piece just sucks. Its maximum DPS potential isn't even close to Velidreth or Stormfist. When wearing Two-Fanged Serpent, you don't need to wear Kra'gh because you have a constant 15.5k penetration (Major Fracture, Two-Fanged 5 piece bonus, Sharpened weapons, base penetration), so Alkosh alone is enough to achieve full penetration. It might even be better to use 1 sharp and 1 precise weapon, that way when the Crusher Enchant and Minor Fracture are applied you're not over-penetrating the boss. Because Kra'gh is not needed in this situation, you can use Stormfist or Velidreth. IMO, Stormfist > Velidreth, because it can hit more than 3 enemies, it procs more often and it just does more damage per proc than Velidreth.

The only situation where Kra'gh would outperform Stormfist, is on a stamina sorc (IKR?! I was surprised too), because of the Implosion passive. Kra'gh, although doing less damage than Stormfist, has more hits per second, which gives it a higher chance to proc Implosion. However, for 85% of the fight, Stormfist still outperforms Kra'gh on a stamina sorc (and any other class for that matter).

I've got the maths for all this, both Two-Fanged Serpent vs TBS and Stormfist vs Kra'gh, somewhere. Will post it, I had help from a PC guy too.

For single target boss fights in trials, the only part that truly matters for DPS checks, I would never recommend Twice-Fanged Serpent nor Spriggan or NMG. Lets go over the penetration buffs and resistance debuffs. Major Fracture 5280, Minor Fracture 1320, Alkosh 3010, Crushing Enchant 1622 and Sharpened weapons 2580 per weapon. With 2 Sharpened that would be a total of 16392 and we are left with 1808. Now up time on Chrushing and Alkosh goes up and down slightly but in a two tank situation like vMoL, vSO or vHRC HM then up time will be no issue. So the 1p bonus from Kra'gh is all you will need to get to max penetration. Of course having one person in the group run NMG for trash is still a valid argument if you have a lot of stamina users but I would say 3 or more for it to be worth it.

Now lets look at the 4 monster sets that have been mentioned in the thread:

• Kra'gh
  (1 items) Adds 1935 Physical Penetration
  (2 items) When you deal damage, you have a 10% chance to spawn dreugh limbs that create shockwaves in front of you dealing 1300 Physical Damage every 0.4 seconds for 1.2 seconds. This effect can occur once every 3 seconds.
• Selene
  (1 items) Adds 967 Max Stamina
  (2 items) When you deal direct melee damage, you have a 15% chance to call on a primal spirit that mauls the closest enemy in front of you for 12000 Physical Damage. This effect can occur once every 4 seconds.
• Stormfist
  (1 items) Adds 129 Stamina Recovery
  (2 items) When you deal damage, you have a 10% chance to create a thunderfist to crush the enemy, dealing 1500 Shock Damage every 1 second for 3 seconds to all enemies within 4 meters and a final 8000 Physical Damage when the fist closes. This effect can occur once every 8 seconds.
• Velidreth
  (1 items) Adds 129 Weapon Damage
  (2 items) When you deal damage, you have a 20% chance to spawn 3 disease spores in front of you that deal 10320 Disease Damage to the first enemy hit. This effect can occur once every 9 seconds.

Kra'gh has the strongest 1p with the Physical Penetration but lacks in 2p with only 10% chance to give 3900 DMG over 1.2 and 3s cooldown. So since it can only happen tops every 3s its just about a 1300 dps increase from the set alone, but since it will almost never proc straight after it will be less.

Selene has meh 1p but its 2p is strong 15% from melee attack to dealing 12000 DMG with a 4s cooldown. So IF it proced right after the cooldown it would give us about a 3000 DPS increase, but just like Kra'gh it won't proc right after its cooldown is done.

Stormfist has a nice regen bonus but IMO I would rather go with any of the other 3 1p bonuses. Then we have its 2p 10% to deal 4500 DMG over 3s in a 4m radius and then 8000 DMG when its over, it then has a 8s cooldown. Disregarding any passives or other bonuses that might effect it just like with the other sets it would account for a total of 12500 DMG over 8s which is 1562.5 DPS and again only IF it procs directly after each cooldown is done.

Velidreth has a strong 1p with that Weapon Damage increase, a solid buff. Its 2p is a crown favorite among gankers as well as for some in vMSA. 20% to deal 10320 DMG to the enemy hit first by the 3 orbs, with a 9s cooldown. That's a 1146 DPS increase looking at the set on its own and again it IF it procs right of the bat.

My opinion about these sets for a sustained Trial fight is this, don't use their 2p bonuses. As much as their visuals and stats might be tempting I am gonna recommend going 1p Kra'gh and either 1p Velidreth or actually 1p Kena since they both have Wpn DMG, of couse Kena has Spell DMG too but that is not important here. The idea here is to increase the damage of ALL of your abilities rather than having a proc set give you a slight DPS boost, their added DPS is not all that much to speak of and with the next update Proc sets will no longer be able to crit. Which gives another point in favor of boosting the damage of the things that can crit. Giving them a greater base damage will further increase their crit damage.

Lastly as a side note cause the set was mentioned, I would never recommend Leviathan, TBS out does it. The crit chance added by the 3 crit bonuses of Leviathan is 3019 or 13.78% while the Thief Bonus with 7 Legendary Divines is 16.7%. So unless you do Leviathan AND the Thief there is no reason to running it and even then I would not recommend it. Going high crit chance in exchange for a lower crit severity will actually cost you DPS not give more. Which means that if you go Leviathan and Shadow you will without a doubt be lowering your DPS. TBS gives more crit chance and lets you still have the Shadow for crit damage and it also comes with a Health buff for increased survivability. BTW same thing goes for Mother's Sorrow for Magicka users.

Hope that helps people out a bit, and remember never be afraid to test out some stuff as well. Maybe you will find something no one else has or disprove someones claim.

No... You can't count the buffs that don't have 100% uptime. Crushing has a max uptime of 50% IF the tank can put in a light attack. This is not always possible in intense situations, I'm sure you know that letting go of block in a HM could be a wipe if you get unlucky.
Minor Fracture requires a stamina Templar in the group, so essentially you're relying on another stamina DPS, and stamina templars are NEVER first choice in a group. Stam DK, Sorc or NB all pull higher DPS. If you want to replace a magicka templar or a magicka DK, you don't want to lose single target DPS, you want the exact opposite,something that stamina templars are unable to provide. So Minor Fracture is out of the picture.
Alkosh... The uptime isn't guaranteed either.
Even with 2 tanks you can't assume full uptime. The off-tank's crusher enchant simply refreshes the main tank's one, IF they are coordinated enough, and usually there's a lot more stuff to worry about. Alkosh depends on the avalable synergies. Usually you will be getting shards, orbs and liquid lightning, sometimes a radiate or a banner or nova right? Okay, what about all the situations where your offtank is separated from the main group? The off tank isn't always on the boss, he's usually taking care of important adds, etc. So Alkosh and Crusher are periodic and Minor Fracture is most likely inexistant.

About the monster sets... It sounds as if you had no clue... AlthoughI'm surethat itsquite the opposite. If you aren't running a monster set, you should be running VO or Alkosh 5 piece! They are much stronger boni than two mismatched monster sets. And you're very wrong about the fact that monster sets aren't a huge boost in DPS. Stormfist precisely counters what stamina builds lack most: AOE damage. So do Velidreth and Kra'gh to a lesser extent. Now about your DPS calculations. You're not taking into account CP, big mistake as it would change your results significantly for Stormfist and Kra'gh asboth double dip in Thaumaturge and Mighty (the final hit of Stormfist is still a tick of a DoT). Obviously it all depends on the distribution. You're also missing critical hits in your calculations. Even if they get removed in update 13, its irrelevant for the current patch. Plus we don't know about the other changes yet. Stormfist's (or Kra'gh or Velidreth for that matter) proc outperforms some raw stats by quite a margin. 129 weapon damage is a small tooltip increase, which I'm sure you canfigure out for youself. That is no where near even a non critting 2pc monster set.
About Leviathan and Mother's Sorrow. You're NEVER meant to run the Shadow mundus by itself in PvE as it gets outperformed by the thief in pretty much any situation. Leviathan with the Thief and a good uptime on Major Force (50%+ I believe, easy enough to achieve in a well set up horn rotation every ~20sec) TBS gets outparsed by quite a lot. The health bonus... Sure its great. But not mandatory for anyone who knows what he's doing.

So once again, Two-Fanged Serpent is the most powerful set for stamina DPS before full penetration is achieved. Sadly its what magicka users get passively. So your argument is flawed from the beginning actually, because with Two-Fanged you achieve the base penetration of a magicka build...

I entirely agree with your final statement. And I don't mean to come off as a jerk, I just don't quite agree with your analysis of these things

No, it is you that are wrong. I can count those buffs. If you have never heard of a healer running Power of the Light then I feel sorry for the groups that you have run with. The healers I run with keep it up constantly, its not that hard really. And any tank and group worth their weight gives out and uses synergies in the way alkosh is meant to be used. I don't use a synergy out of Alkosh rotation unless I need a shard. Orbs, Shards, Purify, Overload, Standards, these are all essential to a great group. Sure in a pug you can't expect it but I don't theorycraft for pugs but progression groups. 4-5 possible synergies is more than enough to keep an Alkosh going. And the crusher enchant can be proced from your Pierce Armor and Heroic Slash, so a Main tank would never have to drop block to keep it up, they don't just proc of Light or Heavy attacks. And with Infused its up almost all the time. So the first bit is way off.

And no the base damage increase form 129 weapon damage is more than you think, combine it over time with ALL of your abilities and it adds up to a lot of damage, and that is damage that can crit. And Major Force is only 30% not sure where you got 50% from, and TBS with Shadow and Thief is better than Leviathan and Thief. Sure you get really high crit but there is such a things as too much crit if your base damage or critical severity is too low. Lowering your crit chance slightly to get the 18% extra crit damage from shadow is worth it and does a lot more damage in the long run. Good up time on Major Force and Minor Force puts your crit severity up at 60% and that is not counting any CP that might add even more. I would much rather have that extra 18% crit severity than the 13% crit chance from Leviathan, if you are having your crit at around 70-75% you don't need more, and exchanging crit severity for crit chance in the high 80s to 90+% is foolish. And the extra health means a lot in Hardmode trials like Maw or AA where everyone is gonna get hit.

And my suggestion for two different one piece bonus was with No maelstrom in mind cause not everyone has it. Obviously if they have Maelstrom weapons then 1 Kra'gh would be the preferred one piece and going 5p TBS and 4p of either Alkosh or VO. But really if you go 3p of any of them and 1p Kena or Velidreth then it won't make a difference except with 4p VO that has Wpn Crit 4p unlike Alkosh's 4p Wpn DMG, all depends on what you have available. My stam sorc set up for Trials while not using Maelstrom is 5p VO 5p TBS 1p Kena and 1p Kra'gh and I know many others that run similarly that do very well. Oh and obviously its just 4p VO on the back bar.

Crusher just like the weapon damage enchant procs of only light and heavy attacks.... You will maybe get all those buffs stacked once or ttwice in a fight. Most of the time however, you're not going to get all the debuffs at the same time so its stupid to assume that. Now don't start on the "your group is trash" talk because it is just fine. Power of the light on a healer though, sure you could do that, but you do know that that infallible aether is already a pain to keep up 100% of the time right? Recasting a 6 second buff constantly is totally doable, but it is 1 second where you aren't healing or throwing out a shard or an orb or buffing with Combat prayer. Sure its doable yeah. But don't tell me that 100% uptime on Alkosh is possible even with 2 players. Like I said, the off-tank isn't always with the group. In AA, in HRC, in SO hardmodes the offtank is nowhere near the main tank to keep up the Alkosh buff. So basically you were counting abuff that is at max up 50℅ of the time (Crusher), a buff that is usually in good group up around 70% of the time (Alkosh) and a buff that may or may not be in the group at all (even if it was i doubt a 100% uptime). The only way to achieve full penetration with close to 100% uptime is with Twice-fanged serpent.

The 129 weapon damage, when buffed by all passives and buffs is equal to 177 dmg. That is just below 2% of a tooltip damage increase. Its not close to 1.5k DPS from a non critting monster set. No there's just no benefit of running mismatched monster sets over a 5 piece bonus. Considering that the 5 piece bonus of VO adds 129 weapon damage too anyway as well as monster sustain and mobility which is pretty important for a stamina build in a trial.l

Read what I wrote again. I never said that Major Force was 50%. I said that the uptime on Major Force has to be at over 50% for Leviathan to be better than TBS. What do you mean by crit severity? Crit damage? You lose 18.3% crit damage but you gain 13.7% crit chance. Your base crit damage = 50%. A common enough distribution of CP puts around 46 points into precise strikes. 14.5%. Minor Force sits at 12%. Your crit hit damage without the Shadow would be 76.5%. Major Force is multiplicative not additive btw. The crit hit modifier = crit chance x crit damage. Go on calculate the crit modifier with TBS and then Leviathan while putting the Major Force uptime at different levels. The more uptime you have the better Leviathan becomes.

So you're theorycrafting for a perfect trial team with unhumanly syncronized buffs, but you're taking into account the absence of vMA weapons (BiS gear). Stamina builds don't have a place in trials without vMA weapons, their DPS is just too subpar compared to magicka (around 8-12k difference).

Izaki

HatchetHaro wrote: »

So many arguments here about what is best and what is not. I'll just say that you'll eventually work it out, but for now everything you have there are just as viable as the other pieces.

Slot 1pc Kra'gh's and 1pc Velidreth/Kena, make sure they're both med divines; this way you get more raw damage rather than proc damage. However, I'm not going to dismiss Selene's or Stormfist as viable options.

Oh, and, don't swap out HR with NMG just yet; HR is always a reliable no-compromises set that is good no matter what loadout your team is. NMG may be better but if more than one person wears it (and pretty much everybody wears it) you're gonna lose out in damage.

TBS is great as well, but it is reliant on your tank running Aggressive Warhorn.

In the end, your damage does not fully depend on your gear; you're a stam DK, which is the hardest class/role to do damage with, but is also one of the most effective. Work on your rotations, make sure to focus on applying your DoTs quickly and efficiently, and you'll still deal respectable damage regardless of which gear is BiS.

Stam DK rotation is fairly easy compared to say stam NB where you have to time your the assassin's scourge. But yeah stam sorc is the easiest by far. All of them get easy once you get the hang of basic rapid strikes rotation. But it takes a lot of pratice.

itehache

I use Selene's set (I'm also stamina based, but a NB). The only reason why I don't use Velidreth is because I haven't been able to complete Cos in veteran T_T But I think Veli is the best option.

WalksonGraves

itehache wrote: »

I use Selene's set (I'm also stamina based, but a NB). The only reason why I don't use Velidreth is because I haven't been able to complete Cos in veteran T_T But I think Veli is the best option.

You'd think so but even giant hitboxes are too nimble for veli. You basically have to be using a channel skill that points your body towards the target to have any kind of accuracy since it fires in straight lines. Good against stationary/huge targets but you miss anything moving and the side shot blobs almost never hit. It's one of those looks great on paper sets.

Izaki

^ For what? PvE or PvP? IMHO Selene >Velidreth in PvP. In PvE Stormfist just does more damage than Velidreth with a bigger AoE potential. Obe of the reasons for why Stormfist>Velidreth is because the final hit double dips into Thaumaturge and Mighty. Its also just does more damage in with a smaller cooldown.