DW Sorcs, are they even a thing anymore?

psychotic13

As above basically, been playing my sorc with a Destro for a while and always wondered about going back to DW for PvP but not sure how viable it is, I don't really see many of them?

Any links to builds ect? Thanks

Juhasow

They're are playable unless You meet dk. Maybe with soul assault changes something will change here also.

RebornV3x

currently DW on a Sorc specifically for PvP is not viable due to the lack of a magicka spammable ability like (2.3)Trapping Webs.

Minalan

Plenty of people make it work. DW is the highest Sorc burst spec that we have. One guy even makes it work with dawnbreaker.

However you're going to run into reactive Malu-tard Templars and block spec stam DK's and you just can't hurt them easily. You have to carefully time your burst and CC.

...and next update they get a super cheap six seconds of free blocking ultimate with sword and board.

Thelon

RebornV3x wrote: »

currently DW on a Sorc specifically for PvP is not viable due to the lack of a magicka spammable ability like (2.3)Trapping Webs.

that's like your opinion man

psychotic13

May give it a go see what what I come up with, I'd ideally like to run x2 5pc sets with infernal guardian. (How good is infernal guardian, could the mortors put out enough damage to keep pressure on if going DW and losing the crushing shock weave?)

Another question about infernal guardian, are they reflectable by wings? I don't imagine casting shields and getting mortors shot back at you would be very wise if that's the case?

ClockworkArc

psychotic13 wrote: »

May give it a go see what what I come up with, I'd ideally like to run x2 5pc sets with infernal guardian. (How good is infernal guardian, could the mortors put out enough damage to keep pressure on if going DW and losing the crushing shock weave?)

Another question about infernal guardian, are they reflectable by wings? I don't imagine casting shields and getting mortors shot back at you would be very wise if that's the case?

Pretty sure they aren't reflectable as they are ground targeted aoes.

I've been messing with a dw build just recently and putting streak on the front bar is super fun...even if it doesn't do tonnes of damage.

I am also interested to see frost staff / infernal guardian builds haha.

psychotic13

ClockworkArc wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

May give it a go see what what I come up with, I'd ideally like to run x2 5pc sets with infernal guardian. (How good is infernal guardian, could the mortors put out enough damage to keep pressure on if going DW and losing the crushing shock weave?)

Another question about infernal guardian, are they reflectable by wings? I don't imagine casting shields and getting mortors shot back at you would be very wise if that's the case?

Pretty sure they aren't reflectable as they are ground targeted aoes.

I've been messing with a dw build just recently and putting streak on the front bar is super fun...even if it doesn't do tonnes of damage.

I am also interested to see frost staff / infernal guardian builds haha.

I believe you're right about the mortors, although until I play with it myself I don't really know how reliable/accurate they are.

Asgari

Currently in PVP my sorc uses DW / Destro and i use my clanfear to heal me along with crit surge and dark exchange (not dark deal) .. It works very well and in most small scale situations i come out victorious. Id say more than 70% of the time.

psychotic13

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

Currently in PVP my sorc uses DW / Destro and i use my clanfear to heal me along with crit surge and dark exchange (not dark deal) .. It works very well and in most small scale situations i come out victorious. Id say more than 70% of the time.

I did try the clanfear before, I though because it had more health than the Matriach it would be a good choice, but the 7k cost to use it is ridiculous.

Minalan

The infernal guardian mortars target the FURTHEST thing from you. While that probably works great in open Zerg PVP, it's going to be complete swampy a** in imperial city. You'll just end up aggroing every freaking boss and flag carrier while trying to hit someone.

How do you fit streak on the DW front bar? Most people put wrath there instead of crushing shock to proc frags.. if you're not fragging someone with dual wield, you're doing it wrong.

Asgari

psychotic13 wrote: »

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

Currently in PVP my sorc uses DW / Destro and i use my clanfear to heal me along with crit surge and dark exchange (not dark deal) .. It works very well and in most small scale situations i come out victorious. Id say more than 70% of the time.

I did try the clanfear before, I though because it had more health than the Matriach it would be a good choice, but the 7k cost to use it is ridiculous.

With my build its almost free with the combination of reduced cost and how much magicka you get back after it dies. As long as you practice keeping your shield up and the clanfear is near you, it wont lose its shield and will stay up far more often.

Waffennacht

@Princess_Asgari

Psychotic13 had found that the clannfear cost was bugged. Are you saying it's been fixed? If so that opens more options.

Asgari

Waffennacht wrote: »

@Princess_Asgari

Psychotic13 had found that the clannfear cost was bugged. Are you saying it's been fixed? If so that opens more options.

On PTS or Live? because i am not seeing any issue on live with using the clanfear. My magicka pool is normal

Jar_Ek

Yes... they are stamina sorcerers.

ClockworkArc

Minalan wrote: »

The infernal guardian mortars target the FURTHEST thing from you. While that probably works great in open Zerg PVP, it's going to be complete swampy a** in imperial city. You'll just end up aggroing every freaking boss and flag carrier while trying to hit someone.

How do you fit streak on the DW front bar? Most people put wrath there instead of crushing shock to proc frags.. if you're not fragging someone with dual wield, you're doing it wrong.

Mage's Fury, Curse, Streak, Degen, and Frags.

Beardimus

I way prefer dual wield, suits my ideal of a battle sorc. But with resource how it is now a destro is handy for weave etc and the spell damage glyph makes all the difference, u cant proc that easy on DW.

..but I've just gone back to dual on the back bar for an extra set piece and that's working a treat, for me. I ain't no elite, but I hate running two staves.

psychotic13

Minalan wrote: »

The infernal guardian mortars target the FURTHEST thing from you. While that probably works great in open Zerg PVP, it's going to be complete swampy a** in imperial city. You'll just end up aggroing every freaking boss and flag carrier while trying to hit someone.

How do you fit streak on the DW front bar? Most people put wrath there instead of crushing shock to proc frags.. if you're not fragging someone with dual wield, you're doing it wrong.

I mean in open world cyrodil, I realise it would be more of an Inconvenience in IC. I already run wrath on my front bar with the Destro so I could just slot streak over crushing shock, and also free up a space on the backbar as that's where I normally have streak.

Princess_Asgari wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

@Princess_Asgari

Psychotic13 had found that the clannfear cost was bugged. Are you saying it's been fixed? If so that opens more options.

On PTS or Live? because i am not seeing any issue on live with using the clanfear. My magicka pool is normal

Here is the thread I made before, I later found out this was because on console the cost value stays the same on the display once the pet has been summoned.

While on PC the cost shows its true cost which is something just over 7k iirc.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/278416/clannfear-bug-confirmed-video#latest

Beardimus wrote: »

I way prefer dual wield, suits my ideal of a battle sorc. But with resource how it is now a destro is handy for weave etc and the spell damage glyph makes all the difference, u cant proc that easy on DW.

..but I've just gone back to dual on the back bar for an extra set piece and that's working a treat, for me. I ain't no elite, but I hate running two staves.

I figured you'd just proc it from the back bar with a staff? That's how I do it with my Stamblade, proc with enchant with my bow

Rockndude

I am not sure there are any benefits to running DW anymore on a Sorc because of one specific change that was made:

Inevitable Detonation

magic det was able to do a great amount of damage to single targets until there was a change made to decrease the damage against single targets. A DW sorc build before this change occurred on the DW bar would open with entropy to buff, time det and curse to hit at the same time, hope to get a crystal frag proc at the same time those two skills went off, and spam mages wrath/endless fury at the same time resulting in massive burst damage. Defense was resto staff using mines, shield stacking, and streak to reposition.

Also, the meta for PVP currently in Shadows of the Hist is heavy armor builds and unless you have decent sustained damage you will have a very difficult time with taking down these builds because the base resistance they have, plus the resistance that blocking with a sword and board provides, on top of the healing they use and receive.

If anyone knows of a way to still use a DW sorc effectively in this patch, please elaborate because I am also curious and would like to learn.

Thelon

Rockndude wrote: »

.
If anyone knows of a way to still use a DW sorc effectively in this patch, please elaborate because I am also curious and would like to learn.

@Rockndude
here's a random vid from my channel. hope it helps

psychotic13

Thelon wrote: »

Rockndude wrote: »

.
If anyone knows of a way to still use a DW sorc effectively in this patch, please elaborate because I am also curious and would like to learn.

@Rockndude
here's a random vid from my channel. hope it helps

What gear are using out of curiosity?

Dracane

Dual wield Sorcerer is not viable in my opinion.
You are forced to use overload spam if you truly want to deal with most opponents. And I am not talking about unskilled people, as shown in most YouTuber's videos (not telling any names of course) People that can be bursted down without any effort or tactic.

The benfits: You get another item slot. Which means, you can have 2 5 set pieces and 2 monster pieces. This is huge.
Your frags and curse will hit a liddle bit harder


The downside: You have no constant damage. The only things you could use, are daedric tomb, essence drain or mage's fury.
Daedric tomb is super expensive and hard to aim, essence drain has only 12 meters range and is interruptable.
Mage's Fury is the weakest spammable in the game, its initial bolt is so weak....


Keep in mind, that one light attack of a staff will outperform the damage bonus that dual wield grants crystal shard and daedric curse. Also, staff offers you instant damage when you need. In dual wield you either burst someone down with only the typical frags-curse-fury combo (which does not work against people that are above semi-average skill level. So not people shown in youtube videos)

With that being said, the only reason to take dual wield is for an additonal set piece. Overload can be very deadly vs certain enemies, but is also way too easy to counter.

Vaoh

That an interesting question. It depends who you ask....

When you ask someone who has mained a DW/Restro Mag Sorc since PS4 launch (...me) your answer is going to be a resounding Yes. Totally viable. In fact, 100% viable. I 1vX with it all the time and am extremely successful.

If you ask someone who has not put in such a huge amount of commitment, the answer is simply No.

This is a very aggressive play style now and I have only seen a literal handful of DW Mag Sorcs in PvP since Dark Brotherhood launched since it is so bad now.

psychotic13

Vaoh wrote: »

That an interesting question. It depends who you ask....

When you ask someone who has mained a DW/Restro Mag Sorc since PS4 launch (...me) your answer is going to be a resounding Yes. Totally viable. In fact, 100% viable. I 1vX with it all the time and am extremely successful.

If you ask someone who has not put in such a huge amount of commitment, the answer is simply No.

This is a very aggressive play style now and I have only seen a literal handful of DW Mag Sorcs in PvP since Dark Brotherhood launched since it is so bad now.

What set up are you running may I ask?

Vaoh

psychotic13 wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

That an interesting question. It depends who you ask....

When you ask someone who has mained a DW/Restro Mag Sorc since PS4 launch (...me) your answer is going to be a resounding Yes. Totally viable. In fact, 100% viable. I 1vX with it all the time and am extremely successful.

If you ask someone who has not put in such a huge amount of commitment, the answer is simply No.

This is a very aggressive play style now and I have only seen a literal handful of DW Mag Sorcs in PvP since Dark Brotherhood launched since it is so bad now.

What set up are you running may I ask?

I have a very powerful gear setup in mind which I will fully acquire once One Tamriel releases. It's so strong, I will even invest in the gold mats to upgrade everything to Legendary. That is a setup which I will not give away yet

Any theory crafter can take the basic principles of Magicka Sorcerers and build them up through their gear to buff them correctly in PvP. I've done a lot of switching around with Gossamer, Winterborn, Magnus, Willpower, Transmutation, Willow's Path, Spell Power Cure, and Succession. Look at all of these, see what you might be able to mix and match from their set bonuses, and give it a try. It'll likely go pretty well.

And just in case you were hoping to run the same gear and do just as well.... know that it is extremely play style dependent. What I do works extremely well for me. Matching my gear definitely does not mean it'll work well for you. I doubt anyone in ESO could just pickup my build and play style and just make it work even remotely how I do.

psychotic13

Vaoh wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

That an interesting question. It depends who you ask....

When you ask someone who has mained a DW/Restro Mag Sorc since PS4 launch (...me) your answer is going to be a resounding Yes. Totally viable. In fact, 100% viable. I 1vX with it all the time and am extremely successful.

If you ask someone who has not put in such a huge amount of commitment, the answer is simply No.

This is a very aggressive play style now and I have only seen a literal handful of DW Mag Sorcs in PvP since Dark Brotherhood launched since it is so bad now.

What set up are you running may I ask?

I have a very powerful gear setup in mind which I will fully acquire once One Tamriel releases. It's so strong, I will even invest in the gold mats to upgrade everything to Legendary. That is a setup which I will not give away yet

Any theory crafter can take the basic principles of Magicka Sorcerers and build them up through their gear to buff them correctly in PvP. I've done a lot of switching around with Gossamer, Winterborn, Magnus, Willpower, Transmutation, Willow's Path, Spell Power Cure, and Succession. Look at all of these, see what you might be able to mix and match from their set bonuses, and give it a try. It'll likely go pretty well.

And just in case you were hoping to run the same gear and do just as well.... know that it is extremely play style dependent. What I do works extremely well for me. Matching my gear definitely does not mean it'll work well for you. I doubt anyone in ESO could just pickup my build and play style and just make it work even remotely how I do.

I'm not planning on copying it if that's what you thought lol, like you said builds vary and play to people's strengths. More than likely we'd be running different abilities and that would change a build completely depending on what you're trying to focus on.

I'm not really sure about the sets you've mentioned though? Yes some of them can add a nice amount of damage but they also require a lot of micro management, I'd never use winterborn in PvP either, not that I've tried it but wouldn't the ice pillars just be too easy to walk away from? If I wanted major evasion from gossamer I could always just out shuffle on the overload bar. Clearly we have very different ideas about these in terms of PvP.

Care to elaborate on why some of these sets are useful in PvP over something else?

Vaoh

psychotic13 wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

That an interesting question. It depends who you ask....

When you ask someone who has mained a DW/Restro Mag Sorc since PS4 launch (...me) your answer is going to be a resounding Yes. Totally viable. In fact, 100% viable. I 1vX with it all the time and am extremely successful.

If you ask someone who has not put in such a huge amount of commitment, the answer is simply No.

This is a very aggressive play style now and I have only seen a literal handful of DW Mag Sorcs in PvP since Dark Brotherhood launched since it is so bad now.

What set up are you running may I ask?

I have a very powerful gear setup in mind which I will fully acquire once One Tamriel releases. It's so strong, I will even invest in the gold mats to upgrade everything to Legendary. That is a setup which I will not give away yet

Any theory crafter can take the basic principles of Magicka Sorcerers and build them up through their gear to buff them correctly in PvP. I've done a lot of switching around with Gossamer, Winterborn, Magnus, Willpower, Transmutation, Willow's Path, Spell Power Cure, and Succession. Look at all of these, see what you might be able to mix and match from their set bonuses, and give it a try. It'll likely go pretty well.

And just in case you were hoping to run the same gear and do just as well.... know that it is extremely play style dependent. What I do works extremely well for me. Matching my gear definitely does not mean it'll work well for you. I doubt anyone in ESO could just pickup my build and play style and just make it work even remotely how I do.

I'm not planning on copying it if that's what you thought lol, like you said builds vary and play to people's strengths. More than likely we'd be running different abilities and that would change a build completely depending on what you're trying to focus on.

I'm not really sure about the sets you've mentioned though? Yes some of them can add a nice amount of damage but they also require a lot of micro management, I'd never use winterborn in PvP either, not that I've tried it but wouldn't the ice pillars just be too easy to walk away from? If I wanted major evasion from gossamer I could always just out shuffle on the overload bar. Clearly we have very different ideas about these in terms of PvP.

Care to elaborate on why some of these sets are useful in PvP over something else?

They provide easy and convenient 2/3/4 piece bonuses to give you powerful stats. Most Sorcs are not smart enough to figure this out, but you should be stacking lots of Max Magicka over Spell Damage. Gives you higher shield strength (entire survivability) and lots of damage. Also you should Heavy Attack with Dual Wield when you need to for high Stamina replenishment.

I'm trying to keep my future build a total secret for now. I'm really excited because I KNOW it will be so good it's the same thing I plan to use to solo vWGT as well, minus Dual Wield which will I'll replace with Destro for PvE. My current setup of gear has taken me to the Planar Inhibitor and burned her to 64% health after 3 blue phases. That's why I'm so confident in my future build. It is simply so much stronger in every way.

Thelon

psychotic13 wrote: »

What gear are using out of curiosity?

@psychotic13

that's 5x Vicious Death, 5x Seducer, 2 x Engine Guardian. All Impen, all tri-stat enchants, all gorden, 5 light, 1 med, 1 heavy

psychotic13

Vaoh wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

Vaoh wrote: »

That an interesting question. It depends who you ask....

When you ask someone who has mained a DW/Restro Mag Sorc since PS4 launch (...me) your answer is going to be a resounding Yes. Totally viable. In fact, 100% viable. I 1vX with it all the time and am extremely successful.

If you ask someone who has not put in such a huge amount of commitment, the answer is simply No.

This is a very aggressive play style now and I have only seen a literal handful of DW Mag Sorcs in PvP since Dark Brotherhood launched since it is so bad now.

What set up are you running may I ask?

I have a very powerful gear setup in mind which I will fully acquire once One Tamriel releases. It's so strong, I will even invest in the gold mats to upgrade everything to Legendary. That is a setup which I will not give away yet

Any theory crafter can take the basic principles of Magicka Sorcerers and build them up through their gear to buff them correctly in PvP. I've done a lot of switching around with Gossamer, Winterborn, Magnus, Willpower, Transmutation, Willow's Path, Spell Power Cure, and Succession. Look at all of these, see what you might be able to mix and match from their set bonuses, and give it a try. It'll likely go pretty well.

And just in case you were hoping to run the same gear and do just as well.... know that it is extremely play style dependent. What I do works extremely well for me. Matching my gear definitely does not mean it'll work well for you. I doubt anyone in ESO could just pickup my build and play style and just make it work even remotely how I do.

I'm not planning on copying it if that's what you thought lol, like you said builds vary and play to people's strengths. More than likely we'd be running different abilities and that would change a build completely depending on what you're trying to focus on.

I'm not really sure about the sets you've mentioned though? Yes some of them can add a nice amount of damage but they also require a lot of micro management, I'd never use winterborn in PvP either, not that I've tried it but wouldn't the ice pillars just be too easy to walk away from? If I wanted major evasion from gossamer I could always just out shuffle on the overload bar. Clearly we have very different ideas about these in terms of PvP.

Care to elaborate on why some of these sets are useful in PvP over something else?

They provide easy and convenient 2/3/4 piece bonuses to give you powerful stats. Most Sorcs are not smart enough to figure this out, but you should be stacking lots of Max Magicka over Spell Damage. Gives you higher shield strength (entire survivability) and lots of damage. Also you should Heavy Attack with Dual Wield when you need to for high Stamina replenishment.

I'm trying to keep my future build a total secret for now. I'm really excited because I KNOW it will be so good it's the same thing I plan to use to solo vWGT as well, minus Dual Wield which will I'll replace with Destro for PvE. My current setup of gear has taken me to the Planar Inhibitor and burned her to 64% health after 3 blue phases. That's why I'm so confident in my future build. It is simply so much stronger in every way.

Lots of sets give a good 4pc, if you're trying to stack Magicka why not use necropotence? Thanks for the insight though, although I have a completely different idea in mind.

Thelon wrote: »

psychotic13 wrote: »

What gear are using out of curiosity?

@psychotic13

that's 5x Vicious Death, 5x Seducer, 2 x Engine Guardian. All Impen, all tri-stat enchants, all gorden, 5 light, 1 med, 1 heavy

All tri enchants isn't something you usually see on a MagSorc, how high does your Magicka end up being because of this? I'm guessing the extra stam, and stam from engine guardian helps a lot when it comes to CC breaking?

Swindy

Thelon wrote: »

Rockndude wrote: »

.
If anyone knows of a way to still use a DW sorc effectively in this patch, please elaborate because I am also curious and would like to learn.

@Rockndude
here's a random vid from my channel. hope it helps

4 well setup, well organised, murderers.
Kudos...great vid.

AverageJo3Gam3r

Lol at people that think a build is a nuclear launch code. You do you man. You do you.