Is tanking without melee viable?

HaldaAinur

Running a magsorc tank at the moment, and am wondering if it's viable to tank with just staffs, as being a mostly magicka based build, obviously I won't have a lot of spare stamina around to use for hacking and slashing.

Notes:
-I have the undaunted taunt so relying on the shield taunt isn't too much of a problem.
-Self heal, check.

AverageJo3Gam3r

4 man dungeons that are not ICP, WGT, or the SotH ones? Sure. These dungeons or trials? Nope.

Of course, except in trials and the four dungeons listed above, you don't really need a tank either.

In a trial you need to permablock most of the time, meaning you need 1HS passives.

SolarCat02

Normal dungeons my light armor healer frequently ends up also playing tank. It can be tricky at points (playing heal-tank in a build not meant for that), but doable.

Vet dungeons that require a tank, or Trials of any level? Absolutely not. You need the shield for defense, and the tanking skills on the sword and board skill line.

lolo_01b16_ESO

Sure, it's possible. For vet trials you want to have a "proper" tank, but for everything else just having some kind of taunt on your bar and being familiar with the game mechanics is enough.

Curragraigue

The reason why people use sword and shield is not just for the taunt it is also for the damage mitigation. If you only have a staff when you block you will take more damage. You won't be able to tank at range for most bosses in a dungeon because you cannot root a boss. So once you taunt most bosses will come to you. From what I have seen most people that try to tank with no sword and board and not enough stam to block die.

I made this thread for people like you OP you might want to have a read. I have a build for a magicka Sorc that I tank with, wouldn't do Vet trials or Vet DLC dungeons but it is fine for everything else.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/281446/curras-how-to-tank-guide

OrphanHelgen

in current goldpledges, specially with a good group, yes.

I do it all the time for the goldkey.

But, the downside of this, is the buffs or debuffs you have to offer. You dont have ransack for boss debuf, you dont have ult regen build for warhorn, or even crusher enchant on weapon. Its harder to collect mobs and cc. Long story short, you can have some dmg, but the group dmg decreses. Its not noticable when doing banished cells, but in a 12 man raid its more noticeable.

HaldaAinur

Thanks for the responses! And yeah, I know the general do's and don'ts of tanking, I was just wondering if not using melee was viable so I could make the most of my magicka build by using weapons tailored to that.

I definitely intend to keep one hand and shield as a backup, and am currently trying new pots and potions to see what works best.

HaldaAinur

Curragraigue wrote: »

The reason why people use sword and shield is not just for the taunt it is also for the damage mitigation. If you only have a staff when you block you will take more damage. You won't be able to tank at range for most bosses in a dungeon because you cannot root a boss. So once you taunt most bosses will come to you. From what I have seen most people that try to tank with no sword and board and not enough stam to block die.

I made this thread for people like you OP you might want to have a read. I have a build for a magicka Sorc that I tank with, wouldn't do Vet trials or Vet DLC dungeons but it is fine for everything else.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/281446/curras-how-to-tank-guide

Bear in mind, I'm going magicka, so stam isn't really an option for me. I'm considering splitting my health in half, so I have 10 health and 10 stam simply for backup. Thoughts?

UrQuan

HaldaAinur wrote: »

Curragraigue wrote: »

The reason why people use sword and shield is not just for the taunt it is also for the damage mitigation. If you only have a staff when you block you will take more damage. You won't be able to tank at range for most bosses in a dungeon because you cannot root a boss. So once you taunt most bosses will come to you. From what I have seen most people that try to tank with no sword and board and not enough stam to block die.

I made this thread for people like you OP you might want to have a read. I have a build for a magicka Sorc that I tank with, wouldn't do Vet trials or Vet DLC dungeons but it is fine for everything else.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/281446/curras-how-to-tank-guide

Bear in mind, I'm going magicka, so stam isn't really an option for me. I'm considering splitting my health in half, so I have 10 health and 10 stam simply for backup. Thoughts?

Even if you're a magicka tank, you'll still need stamina for blocking, if nothing else. Having said that, you don't necessarily need to put any attribute points in stamina to achieve that. Most of the gear sets that are good for tanking provide bonuses to stamina and/or health. You can make up whatever else you need with enchants and by using tri-stat food.

For example, my DK has all of his attribute points in magicka, but when he's in his tank gear and using tri-stat food he's got 29K magicka, 27K health, and 22K stamina. He uses sword & board on both bars for tanking, although in his DPS gear he uses a staff on each bar (and in his DPS setup his stats are at 38K magicka, 19K health, and only 11K stamina).

kylewwefan

I pug a lot of dungeons. You may be alright with a mag tank. Or you may fall over dead on simple boss like bogdan, or the big lurcher or maw of the infernal. Mag tanks are good for kiting things around a room, not so much for holding boss in one place from my experience.

HaldaAinur

UrQuan wrote: »

HaldaAinur wrote: »

Curragraigue wrote: »

The reason why people use sword and shield is not just for the taunt it is also for the damage mitigation. If you only have a staff when you block you will take more damage. You won't be able to tank at range for most bosses in a dungeon because you cannot root a boss. So once you taunt most bosses will come to you. From what I have seen most people that try to tank with no sword and board and not enough stam to block die.

I made this thread for people like you OP you might want to have a read. I have a build for a magicka Sorc that I tank with, wouldn't do Vet trials or Vet DLC dungeons but it is fine for everything else.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/281446/curras-how-to-tank-guide

Bear in mind, I'm going magicka, so stam isn't really an option for me. I'm considering splitting my health in half, so I have 10 health and 10 stam simply for backup. Thoughts?

Even if you're a magicka tank, you'll still need stamina for blocking, if nothing else. Having said that, you don't necessarily need to put any attribute points in stamina to achieve that. Most of the gear sets that are good for tanking provide bonuses to stamina and/or health. You can make up whatever else you need with enchants and by using tri-stat food.

For example, my DK has all of his attribute points in magicka, but when he's in his tank gear and using tri-stat food he's got 29K magicka, 27K health, and 22K stamina. He uses sword & board on both bars for tanking, although in his DPS gear he uses a staff on each bar (and in his DPS setup his stats are at 38K magicka, 19K health, and only 11K stamina).

I'll probably put some into stam then, just for the sake of sustainability. So, basically just go for stamina recovery sets?

HaldaAinur

Did just that, and my problem has been solved, hurrah!

Autolycus

For vet dungeons, yes. I am confident that even the newest vet dungeons are doable without a traditional tank. For trials, though, I am quite confident that tanking without 1h&s is neither feasible nor preferable; the group will suffer substantially in a trials setting with a staff tank.

UrQuan

HaldaAinur wrote: »

Did just that, and my problem has been solved, hurrah!

Woo hoo!

Asardes

A tank has to block while keeping the boss in place. If he doesn't hold him there is a loss of DPS because the DDs can't stack DoTs effectively. Blocking without a shield is much less effective due to the missing passive skills. I run as a tank/DD hybrid in most dungeons with my stamina DK and sometimes I'm caught on my 2H bar by the boss. If I block with my maul I still take a lot more damage than I would while blocking with the shield. Definitely you can't tank the gold pledges that need X adds kept alive (Veteran Banished Cells, Veteran Crypt of Hearts) successfully with a ward that does damage, like boundless storm, and an effective way to mitigate damage that comes from the 1H+S.

A shield-less thanking setup that uses only the Inner Fire skill or morphs would be viable for bosses that don't stand still no matter what, don't have strong melee damage, but still aggro in the sense that they direct most of their ranged attacks at the tank. It's even better if the boss also has strong AoE attack. I've successfully tanked some of the bosses just with a bow, self heals, dragon scales and the 2H back bar, while taunting with Inner Rage. The list of victims includes:

City of Ash: Razor Master Erthas - boss moves to predetermined places and his bow does very little damage
Blackheart Haven: Roost Mother - has strong AoE attacks, and moves randomly so staying far is actually better to avoid the AoE.
Veteran Fungal Grotto: Vila Theran - this boss has a very specific mechanic and staying close it's not an option; here you are actually required to use the range taunt.
Veteran Crypt of Hearths: Nerien'eth - only for farm runs though, since it's hard to kite the adds and keep them alive for gold pledge while using just the Inner Fire taunt; it's actually easier this way, since you don't get caught in the AoE attack.
Veteran Imperial City Prison: Lord Warden Dusk - this might seem surprising, but it's a very mobile boss and staying close puts you at a considerable risk of being CCd into the portals.

But for the rest of the 4 man content 1H+S tanking is better. In trials, even normal ones, don't even try to go in without heavy armor and 1H+S.

HaldaAinur

Gotcha- I'm definitely sticking to staff and one hand and shield for my current bars, and I have a good amount of spare heavy armor to put on when needed. Thanks for the input!

Asardes

The only problem is that you need lighting fast reflexes and internet connection to switch to 1H+S when the boss is preparing a heavy attack. On some bosses that's not really an option, and I'm talking primarily about trial bosses, like Possessed Mantikora sweep or even ground attack and even some new dungeon bosses like Dranos "steel tornado" and Velidreth "body check" attack - not actual names as I can't remember them now. Those ones almost one shot you even when blocking with shield, warded and spamming shields. If you are caught with staff in hand you are certainly toast and so is the rest of the team.