Maelstrom Arena - Changing the reward system

Volla

Hi first of all i just need to state that i'm doing this thread cause i see a problem with the reward system in Maelstrom and other form of daily's.

1. Main problem with the current system is that only the top players will have access to the loot in the arena that are then used as high end weapons or gear in PvP.
2. Another problem is that for many people its way to hard to get all the way to the end boss, there for there is a reward only for those who are the top gamers.
3. Same problem lays in the two set that drops from different instances, better to run a point system so you can collect and then choose your reward.

Some suggestions for solution: This can go for most of the system loot that you have in the daily or other forms of tasks
1. Make a point based system for the Maelstrom arena so people can collect points and have some sort of chans to get ahold of those weapons. With a system like this we can all collect points from the level we reach, for example so those top players can get a weapon every week but a lower player can get one maybe every 3 weeks by collecting points for it.
2. Make those weapons Bind on Equip so at least we others can buy em.
3. Or make them less OP as they are now, today i feel they have way to much impact in PVP so the bonus only involve PvE Effects.


I never been a supporter to a random loot system in these types of games, all loot should be accessible in some sort of way so all can be part of the loot from different places.

Cheers guys, try to have some constructive comments.

peniku8

The solution in my head: earn 1 token for every 100k points you get in your scored after completing the arena.
Make every weapon/trait compination available to be purchased for 50 tokens. Or 100. Or 200, I just don't wanna run it another 100 times for not getting a single inferno staff

XaXa

I think the difficulty is fine.

But It could be 1000 tokens to open and id be happy. Just as long as I see SOME goal and progress to completion.

Never recived a destro regardless of element / trait.

gamerguy757

Man, I do see what you're saying but think of it this way...imagine working hard for something, something very very powerful and hard to get. You feel accomplished. Take it from someone who's been on the Leaderboards for the last 2 months...your idea would give no real reward to the players that are extremely good and put in the time to get better. I have at least 20 VMA weapons, sets and jewelry all with different traits and enchantments. I can run it in a hour and get more stuff. It takes dedication to do that.
It's kind of the same concept with the Monster Helm vendor...you can buy your way to the best gear? That's not really fair to those that worked for it you know?
Also, the weapons...for the most part, aren't even that PvP good. Only the 2h is viable, and the Shield can be. The bow, destructo staves and 1h have awful enchantments on skills nobody uses in PvP. Now in PvE they are dangerous.
Even ZOS stated that the VMA can only be completed by around 1-3% of the world's players. It's designed to be the hardest PvE content next to MoL. If we complete it, we deserve to get those powerful pieces of gear, they shouldn't be available to purchase with points or gold.
Now the set pieces and jewelry, THOSE I can support being Bind on Equip. But the weapons? No.

razzle1184kicks

I'm all against token system for vsma, have I completed it no.

Token system for dungeons - not fussed, would I want it... no

And I understand where your coming from too

Why you ask,
I'd just feel more sense of an achievement knowing I made it to the end of vmsa and I have played games where people wanted the easy way and a different approach was implemented which just took the sense of achievement away, but people are happy with that, I wasn't as it was just handed out.

This Was a reason for leaving destiny once xur sold everthing and nothing was gained by grinding and doing exotic bounties, rng for the best stuff didn't exist after the change.

I applaud those that have finished vsma, as for my self I have yet to do it, but surely a token system would mean you'd grind as far as you could make it and then repeat - and it would end with no drive to finish it because there would be no need apart from the guys that want top spot on leader board.

For example I see some one with vsma, I know they are good players if not some of the best, not that others that don't have the weapons aren't.

People will agree and people won't, but I disgrace with a token system for those reasons.

I am currently aiming for vsma at the moment and the weapons being my main drive, followed by the title, but it will take me a few months but I'm loving learning my characters and watching it grow with every change I make to reach my goal.

nine9six

I haven't attempted MA or vMA yet partially because I'm 'over' the RNG loot systems in games. Eventually, I'll get around to doing it for the sake of doing it, but I would be much more incentivized to run through it on a consistent basis (same for Dungeons, etc.) if there were a Token System or sorts.

RNG is horrible and needs to die.

Ep1kMalware

most vma 'difficulty' often stems from the unwillingness to try. With that said, I wouldn't mind a trophy vault where tou could get vmsa weapons, where each stage in vet gives a small number, and normal permits a tiny amount each complete.

Just more general QQing. "I want free stuff ;("

Oreyn_Bearclaw

I agree 100% that VMA rewards (and the entire loot system in this game) needs scrapped and rebuilt from the ground up.

I disagree 100% with any of your proposals if I am being candid. There is nothing wrong with gating certain items behind difficult content. Making everything BOE would totally diminish the work required to get them. As to your suggestions.

1. You want items by NOT completing content? Sorry, I will never get behind this. VMA is 100% mechanic driven. Spend the 40-50 hours to learn it like the rest of us. It's really not that bad once you do it a few times.

2. Make them BOE? Sorry, already touched on that. They would become commonplace and there would be nothing special about having a weapon that you worked for. There are crafted items available that are very powerful. If you can't complete VMA, my guess is that you cant tell the difference anyways.

3. What would be the point of VMA weapons if they werent more powerful? They are BIS, and I wont pretend they are not. They are not, however, required for any content in this game save perhaps VMOL where the DPS checks are particularly high. If you cant clear VMA, I doubt you would have much success in VMOL anyways.

jkolb2030

I think that VMA weapons should still be locked behind actually completing the arena.. If you make a system so that you can complete the VMA a certain amount of times to get tokens to pick the weapon you want, that would be great and save everyone a lot of time and headaches.

Lets face it guys - the people who can complete VMA should be rewarded accordingly without the RNG ***.. Especially for how valuable these weapons are for competing in even higher end game content.

Now don't confuse that proposal for earning some form of token and being able to get the weapon WITHOUT completing VMA - that should not be the case, ever.

I have not completed VMA personally, but I do not want a system where i can potentially farm the first stage to get points and then end up buying the weapons without completing the whole thing.

Volla

Problem with the current system it only gain those who are capable and have the time play this Maelstrom Arena until they make it, its time consuming and for people who don't have the time and skills a reward system is much more fair thus all can have a fair chance to get the end weapons. This also means that the game itself will be more balanced and fun.

MaxwellC

Sorry no if you cannot complete VMSA then that's your problem and it's an L2P issue. I've completed it after dying over 100 times learning the mechanics on Veteran and taking over 4 hours to complete it. Now I complete it under 1 hour and 40 minutes with a score over 400k+.

I've completed it both with my Stam DK and Mag DK. The main issue with VMSA is duplicate rewards I can see maybe twice but when you receive the same 1h+ shield combo over and again you start to get pissed especially when all you want is a particular weapon with a trait.

People have suggested a token system which allows you to trade x amount let's say 10 maelstrom weapons for a token that will allow you to choose the weapon/category (2h Maul) but the trait will always be randomly given to you. This at-least cuts the impact of RNG significantly.

LegendaryArcher

As someone who likes ESO, but who had to quit because I couldn't bring myself to buy the DB DLC and give ZOS any more money, because after vMA 200+ runs I did not get a single Inferno Staff... I agree with most of the stuff said here. And that was all before DB. Now all the *** traits have been added, so chances to get a decent weapon are zero. Either you were lucky and got one just after vMA came out, or you will never get one.

Very happy with Black Desert, you should check it out if you wanna see a really great game with better story, graphics, pvp and loot system. I still miss the ESO environment though.

Maybe one day I'll come back, but for now I just cannot spend a single Cent on a game that treated me like this.

s7732425ub17_ESO

Give 1 token for each completion of Vet Maelstrom.

Have a vendor that sells a weapon of your choice with a random trait for 3 completion tokens.

Have a vendor that sells a weapon of your choice with your choice of trait for 10 completion tokens.

Don't change the current drop rate of weapons in the reward box at the end or the weekly rewards.

Fixed.

Kalante

peniku8 wrote: »

The solution in my head: earn 1 token for every 100k points you get in your scored after completing the arena.
Make every weapon/trait compination available to be purchased for 50 tokens. Or 100. Or 200, I just don't wanna run it another 100 times for not getting a single inferno staff

Damn 100 tries lol.

Kalante

s7732425ub17_ESO wrote: »

Give 1 token for each completion of Vet Maelstrom.

Have a vendor that sells a weapon of your choice with a random trait for 3 completion tokens.

Have a vendor that sells a weapon of your choice with your choice of trait for 10 completion tokens.

Don't change the current drop rate of weapons in the reward box at the end or the weekly rewards.

Fixed.

That would pretty cool. To have a tangible end goal instead of depending on RNG. But sadly this is not pre 2010 anymore.

Akimbro

vMA wasn't designed to be completed by the majority. It's meant to be rewarding to those who are able to overcome the difficulty. With that said, I personally am against a trophy or allocation system where people who aren't able to complete it can reap the same rewards. I can already tell that people will be farming the first few easy stages endlessly to get their loot. However, I am definitely for a better reward system that isn't complete RNG on one huge loot table. I think a better way to do it would be to have selective RNG, since ZOS definitely won't do away with their beloved RNG.

After completing the run, you get a trophy or token, whatever you want to call it. Then, you can take that token to a vault, where there are 5 chests where you can choose from which to redeem your token. Each chest will be for a certain weapon category so you will have Two-Handed, Dual Wield, 1H/S, Bows, and Staves. The 50% weapon drop rate and the trait/weapon type RNG will still exist, but it becomes more selective towards the weapon that you want. This would allow players to at least be able to acquire some sort of usable weapon, aside from those hunting a specific trait.

Hellbender27

Just No please no nerfs to VMA no freebies if you can't beat it you then don't deserve it screw that spent dedicated WEEKS and thousands of deaths to learn VMA and I hate, loved and cried through it enjoyed every single part of it and when you FINALLY beat it YUUUUUUUUUS .. Please leave VMA as is period. Don't take that feeling away from beating it. Everything else is nerfed to *** and this is the last HARD thing in ESO. Go craft a weapon and gold it be happy! PLZ ZOS leave it alone !!!

AlnilamE

LegendaryArcher wrote: »

Very happy with Black Desert, you should check it out if you wanna see a really great game with better story, graphics, pvp and loot system. I still miss the ESO environment though.

OK, I giggled. OP is complaining about grinding vMA and you want to send him to a game that has MORE grind and RNG?

Don't get me wrong, I play the game and I like it for what I play, but the PvP is mostly gear based (more so with today's update), and everything in the game seems to have a triple layer of RNG.

DjSolJAH

razzle1184kicks wrote: »

I'm all against token system for vsma, have I completed it no.

Token system for dungeons - not fussed, would I want it... no

And I understand where your coming from too

Why you ask,
I'd just feel more sense of an achievement knowing I made it to the end of vmsa and I have played games where people wanted the easy way and a different approach was implemented which just took the sense of achievement away, but people are happy with that, I wasn't as it was just handed out.

This Was a reason for leaving destiny once xur sold everthing and nothing was gained by grinding and doing exotic bounties, rng for the best stuff didn't exist after the change.

I applaud those that have finished vsma, as for my self I have yet to do it, but surely a token system would mean you'd grind as far as you could make it and then repeat - and it would end with no drive to finish it because there would be no need apart from the guys that want top spot on leader board.

For example I see some one with vsma, I know they are good players if not some of the best, not that others that don't have the weapons aren't.

People will agree and people won't, but I disgrace with a token system for those reasons.

I am currently aiming for vsma at the moment and the weapons being my main drive, followed by the title, but it will take me a few months but I'm loving learning my characters and watching it grow with every change I make to reach my goal.

Lol let us know how you feel about the current system after you've run it 50+ times and not received the drop you wanted. Bet you won't be singing the same sunshine about the current system

FLuFFyxMuFFiN

razzle1184kicks wrote: »

I'm all against token system for vsma, have I completed it no.

Token system for dungeons - not fussed, would I want it... no

And I understand where your coming from too

Why you ask,
I'd just feel more sense of an achievement knowing I made it to the end of vmsa and I have played games where people wanted the easy way and a different approach was implemented which just took the sense of achievement away, but people are happy with that, I wasn't as it was just handed out.

This Was a reason for leaving destiny once xur sold everthing and nothing was gained by grinding and doing exotic bounties, rng for the best stuff didn't exist after the change.

I applaud those that have finished vsma, as for my self I have yet to do it, but surely a token system would mean you'd grind as far as you could make it and then repeat - and it would end with no drive to finish it because there would be no need apart from the guys that want top spot on leader board.

For example I see some one with vsma, I know they are good players if not some of the best, not that others that don't have the weapons aren't.

People will agree and people won't, but I disgrace with a token system for those reasons.

I am currently aiming for vsma at the moment and the weapons being my main drive, followed by the title, but it will take me a few months but I'm loving learning my characters and watching it grow with every change I make to reach my goal.

Yeah that sense of RNG achievement is soooo nice /sarcasm

LegendaryArcher

AlnilamE wrote: »

LegendaryArcher wrote: »

Very happy with Black Desert, you should check it out if you wanna see a really great game with better story, graphics, pvp and loot system. I still miss the ESO environment though.

OK, I giggled. OP is complaining about grinding vMA and you want to send him to a game that has MORE grind and RNG?

Don't get me wrong, I play the game and I like it for what I play, but the PvP is mostly gear based (more so with today's update), and everything in the game seems to have a triple layer of RNG.

Of course there is a lot of RNG involved, more than in ESO, but you're forgetting to add one key thing: the gear behind that oh so terrible RNG is BoE! Take Kzarka weapons as an example.

If the chance to get vMA weapons would be 10 times smaller than it is now, I'd be fine with that, as long as the weapons are BoE. I'd just sell my 30 vMA daggers and swords and buy 1 Inferno. Those DKs running vMA for the 600th+ time, with 30 Infernos in their bag, but not a single dagger, would be very happy.

AlnilamE

LegendaryArcher wrote: »

AlnilamE wrote: »

LegendaryArcher wrote: »

Very happy with Black Desert, you should check it out if you wanna see a really great game with better story, graphics, pvp and loot system. I still miss the ESO environment though.

OK, I giggled. OP is complaining about grinding vMA and you want to send him to a game that has MORE grind and RNG?

Don't get me wrong, I play the game and I like it for what I play, but the PvP is mostly gear based (more so with today's update), and everything in the game seems to have a triple layer of RNG.

Of course there is a lot of RNG involved, more than in ESO, but you're forgetting to add one key thing: the gear behind that oh so terrible RNG is BoE! Take Kzarka weapons as an example.

If the chance to get vMA weapons would be 10 times smaller than it is now, I'd be fine with that, as long as the weapons are BoE. I'd just sell my 30 vMA daggers and swords and buy 1 Inferno. Those DKs running vMA for the 600th+ time, with 30 Infernos in their bag, but not a single dagger, would be very happy.

I've never even seen a Kzarka on the market, though. I don't even want to know how much it would cost. I only got Livertos this week and I'm working on upgrading them (and the rest of my gear as I finalize what that is).

But yeah, vMA can be very frustrating when you want something very specific for one character and keep getting everything but.

For DSA and for dungeons/trials, that will be somewhat remedied by being able to trade BoP items inside the dungeons in the next update (if I read the patch notes right). But for vMA, it's just you. So maybe a token system there would make sense?

KingYogi415

We get 30 more CP soon. Enjoy the power creep

jkolb2030

MaxwellCrystal wrote: »

Sorry no if you cannot complete VMSA then that's your problem and it's an L2P issue. I've completed it after dying over 100 times learning the mechanics on Veteran and taking over 4 hours to complete it. Now I complete it under 1 hour and 40 minutes with a score over 400k+.

I've completed it both with my Stam DK and Mag DK. The main issue with VMSA is duplicate rewards I can see maybe twice but when you receive the same 1h+ shield combo over and again you start to get pissed especially when all you want is a particular weapon with a trait.

People have suggested a token system which allows you to trade x amount let's say 10 maelstrom weapons for a token that will allow you to choose the weapon/category (2h Maul) but the trait will always be randomly given to you. This at-least cuts the impact of RNG significantly.

What kind of build were you running with your stamDK? I'm preparing myself to attempt a run at vMA with my stamDK, but everything i've read say that its unnecessarily more difficult with stamDK than any other class - not really sure where to start with my build

bsupino

I'm kind of in the middle of opinions in this subject.
I'm a casual/regular player, play almost everyday for 1/2 hour tops and want o have a competitive build, not a Top Notch, leaderboard, etc build, but have managed to do most end game content, including one run at vMA a long time ago with my Stamblade and trying again now.

That being said I do think that vMA is very hard and thus deserve a unique reward for those who beat it. The weapons shouldn't be tradeable or sold in anyway.

On the other hand, any player who beats vMA is worthy enough of a decent reward, for the majority of players who are able to beat it once or twice, the thought of even trying it again only comes after a long while. So vMA should reward in the same way as Undaunted pledges now with monster shoulders. You don't know which you're gonna get, which trait, but you know for sure that if you complete it you'll get one.

And don't get me wrong, you guy's who are able to beat it 100 time are way better than players like me, but you have to admit that we who are able to achieve it at least once, deserve a reward as well.

L2Pissue

loot system sucks in everything.. today msa tomorrow dsa and so on

razzle1184kicks

DjSolJAH wrote: »

razzle1184kicks wrote: »

I'm all against token system for vsma, have I completed it no.

Token system for dungeons - not fussed, would I want it... no

And I understand where your coming from too

Why you ask,
I'd just feel more sense of an achievement knowing I made it to the end of vmsa and I have played games where people wanted the easy way and a different approach was implemented which just took the sense of achievement away, but people are happy with that, I wasn't as it was just handed out.

This Was a reason for leaving destiny once xur sold everthing and nothing was gained by grinding and doing exotic bounties, rng for the best stuff didn't exist after the change.

I applaud those that have finished vsma, as for my self I have yet to do it, but surely a token system would mean you'd grind as far as you could make it and then repeat - and it would end with no drive to finish it because there would be no need apart from the guys that want top spot on leader board.

For example I see some one with vsma, I know they are good players if not some of the best, not that others that don't have the weapons aren't.

People will agree and people won't, but I disgrace with a token system for those reasons.

I am currently aiming for vsma at the moment and the weapons being my main drive, followed by the title, but it will take me a few months but I'm loving learning my characters and watching it grow with every change I make to reach my goal.

Lol let us know how you feel about the current system after you've run it 50+ times and not received the drop you wanted. Bet you won't be singing the same sunshine about the current system

So because you've ran it 50+ times and your bored then people like me that want to achieve one of the hardest arenas in the game and achieve one of the top in rewards without a stupid cheap token system is in the wrong?

But it's my opinion and that is yours and I'm happy either way a token system would ruin it.

Should rng be re worked, yes but not the way most are wanting.

I'd rather run it 50+ times then get it first time and the get what I want first time on all the other trails, dungeons etc... really hate hand out games.

But I like grinding (why i like mmos) and will still be singing while your still moaning.

But seriously don't get to beat down about a game