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Official Discussion Thread for "ESO Live: Update 11 Special #1"

  • Coolio_Wolfus
    Coolio_Wolfus
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    Dyeing Costumes, Where's our dye-able weapons?
  • Rev Rielle
    Rev Rielle
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    b5572f7347efec353c917e1ee489d119.jpg

    This is the official discussion thread for the blog article ESO Live: Update 11 Special #1. Tune in Friday, June 24th for a brand new episode of our Twitch show, ESO Live, and a first look at Shadows of the Hist, the Style Parlor, and more content coming with Update 11!

    Thanks @ZOS_JessicaFolsom, Nice show.

    Just one suggestion; Perhaps next time if possible it might be better if the in-game character used to parade the recent changes/addition has access to all dyes, costumes, styles, etc etc etc? Then when any possible questions come up - such as the "Is the Emperor Costume dyeable?" in this recent ESO Live show - you would you quickly be able to answer such by showing us in real time.

    Otherwise, thanks!
    If you can be anything, be kind.
  • anitajoneb17_ESO
    anitajoneb17_ESO
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    I had read the article but waited for the show to know more. Unfortunately my "fears" happen to be justified.

    Basically the new update is... 2 x 4-man dungeons.
    The rest is... crown store updates.

    In my opinion, presenting the two combined is abusively misleading. Buying the DLC will NOT grant you access to the dye and appearance change systems without paying extra in crowns, and buying tokens for these in the crown store will NOT grant you access to the new dungeons.

    Don't get me wrong, I don't mind ZOS trying to make money. But I do mind when crown store stuff is presented as "DLC content".

    Which brings us to the size of this DLC : 2x 4-man dungeons. That's it. That's all. One year ago the IC DLC featured an entire new zone, new mechanics, a huge public dungeon and 2 group dungeons. I'd like to emphasize what somebody else already mentioned but was very appropriate : at this rate, what can we expect for, say, the August 2017 DLC ? 2 new side quests in Auridia ?

    On a side note, those dungeons will probably be as hard as WGT and ICP used to be upon release - that's to say unplayable for 90% of us - in their veteran versions, and easy as cake - that's to say completely boring and unrewarding - in their normal versions.

    Last but not least, what happened to the original - excellent - concept of vet dungeons being totally different from their normal versions (only sharing the same scenery) and expanding on their storylines ?

    First time I'm not thrilled by the announcement of a DLC, and first time I'm not very optimistic as to the future appeal of the game to me.

  • ListerJMC
    ListerJMC
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    ListerJMC wrote: »
    Will my Redguard vampire finally be able to get rid of his silly purpleness with the style parlor? That is the question...

    Ok so I just watched it, you can change your appearance as a vampire but you can't disable or tweak the effects of its drastic visual effects by the sounds of it. Looks like my Redguard's still stuck being purple :/.
    PC NA & EU || Mammoth Guilds - Victory or Valhalla || Altmer sorcerer main
    "Wood Elves aren't made of wood. Sea Elves aren't made of water. M'aiq still wonders about High Elves."
  • helediron
    helediron
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    Just watched the show of the new DLC. ... but there is no DLC. Just two dungeons. In three months a game company having seven-million advertised playerbase produces content consisting of two new dungeons. What was the rest of the company doing? Did they exhaust themselves doing the two previous mini-DLCs TG and DB?
    Edited by helediron on June 25, 2016 10:09AM
    On hiatus. PC,EU,AD - crafting completionist - @helediron 900+ cp, @helestor 1000+ cp, @helestar 800+ cp, @helester 700+ cp - Dragonborn Z Suomikilta, Harrods, Master Crafter. - Blog - Crafthouse: all stations, all munduses, all dummies, open to everyone
  • Mojmir
    Mojmir
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    helediron wrote: »
    Just watched the show of the new DLC. ... but there is no DLC. Just two dungeons. In three months a game company having seven-million advertised playerbase produces content consisting of two new dungeons. What was the rest of the company doing? Did they exhaust themselves doing the two previous mini-DLCs TG and DB?

    no because those 2 (TG and DB) were done quite awhile ago by the origianl dev team, this new "design" is what we can expect from the slackers running things now.
  • Elsonso
    Elsonso
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    helediron wrote: »
    Just watched the show of the new DLC. ... but there is no DLC. Just two dungeons. In three months a game company having seven-million advertised playerbase produces content consisting of two new dungeons. What was the rest of the company doing? Did they exhaust themselves doing the two previous mini-DLCs TG and DB?

    It is a DLC, it is just is not like the others. I don't really consider the new Fallout 4 DLC to be one, either, but it is.

    I think the big reason for the size is One Tamriel. I do think it takes more than 9 months to make a decent, we'll thought out, planned, and implemented DLC the size of Orsinium, and that those will be few and far between. We will get small DLC like DB and TG, and Dungeon Pack DLC, like this one. This is not bad, and the game needs a fresh supply of new Dungeons and Trials.
    I had read the article but waited for the show to know more. Unfortunately my "fears" happen to be justified.

    Basically the new update is... 2 x 4-man dungeons.
    The rest is... crown store updates.

    In my opinion, presenting the two combined is abusively misleading. Buying the DLC will NOT grant you access to the dye and appearance change systems without paying extra in crowns, and buying tokens for these in the crown store will NOT grant you access to the new dungeons.

    Don't get me wrong, I don't mind ZOS trying to make money. But I do mind when crown store stuff is presented as "DLC content".

    I agree that they are becoming heavy on paid content in the Updates, and this one is a shining example of pay to play. The difference between DLC and base game comtent seems clear to me. I don't see them saying anything but the dungeons are "DLC content". Maybe because I know the difference, I missed where they said or implied it.
    Edited by Elsonso on June 25, 2016 3:06PM
    2022: Qu'ils mangent de la brioche
    "Tamriel One was fun and engaging, Tamriel Once .... not so much." - Jaraal, March 9, 2022
    "Stop treating the combat in this game as some sort of lab experiment." - code65536, July 18, 2022
    Best summary of Update 35: "SAY NO TO MUSTARD IN YOUR DOUGHNUT !" - pklemming, August 9, 2022.

    ><)))*>

    Twitter: https://twitter.com/ElsonsoJannus
  • dokupe
    dokupe
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    Could you please start uploading ESO Live to YouTube again? Twitch is a terrible platform for watching after it finishes and I can never catch it live due to the time zone difference.
    Future Gadget Lab is recruiting adventurers like yourself for endgame PvE content! Interested in joining? Hop on the discord and leave a message! https://discord.gg/BTKX7T5
  • anitajoneb17_ESO
    anitajoneb17_ESO
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    I had read the article but waited for the show to know more. Unfortunately my "fears" happen to be justified.

    Basically the new update is... 2 x 4-man dungeons.
    The rest is... crown store updates.

    In my opinion, presenting the two combined is abusively misleading. Buying the DLC will NOT grant you access to the dye and appearance change systems without paying extra in crowns, and buying tokens for these in the crown store will NOT grant you access to the new dungeons.

    Don't get me wrong, I don't mind ZOS trying to make money. But I do mind when crown store stuff is presented as "DLC content".

    I agree that they are becoming heavy on paid content in the Updates, and this one is a shining example of pay to play. The difference between DLC and base game comtent seems clear to me. I don't see them saying anything but the dungeons are "DLC content". Maybe because I know the difference, I missed where they said or implied it.

    Strictly speaking, you're correct. But I still have this feeling of confusion. I think it comes from the fact that so far, in ZOS communication and decisions, game systems (DLC or base game changes) have been kept fairly separated from "money systems" (crown store or ESO+). The word "update" related strictly to game systems. It's the first update where both aspects are bundled together in one delivery - and use the same communication channels.

    I liked the way ESO live was used to discuss "the game", and only the game. I like it less when it's mixed with promoted crown store/ESO+ stuff.

    Besides, I understand now why they said "a barber shop is technically difficult to implement". I was puzzled to hear that, because, while I'm no programmer, I felt that it was just granting access to the already existing character creation settings and interface, there is nothing technically difficult in that. In fact, they were looking for the best way to monetize this feature that many players have been asking for.

    Business is business... I know... but I can't help regretting that it is increasingly interfering with my (currently favourite) universe of fantasy and escapism.

    Edited by anitajoneb17_ESO on June 26, 2016 1:19AM
  • Pangnirtung
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    helediron wrote: »
    J In three months a game company having seven-million advertised playerbase produces content consisting of two new dungeons. What was the rest of the company doing?

    Making pets and costumes?
  • thestampede38
    when will the update come out again?
  • tspecherb14_ESO
    tspecherb14_ESO
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    So ,there is no in-game barbershop, just crown store. I would have thought a happy middle ground could have been found to make this more immersive (add more to cities, be a gold sink, etc) yet be immensely profitable. Other, older games have done an in-game shop for the hairstyle/look aspect and store option for race/name changes. Other than that, glad to see it coming.
  • Coolio_Wolfus
    Coolio_Wolfus
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    helediron wrote: »
    J In three months a game company having seven-million advertised playerbase produces content consisting of two new dungeons. What was the rest of the company doing?
    Making pets and costumes?
    According to the last ESO Twitch broadcast, most of their team are trying to fix the console versions.Hence the lack of support tickets answered, that and the new Japanese Client.

    Support 'seems' to either be leaving tickets open indefinitely or closing unresolved CS fixable issues.
    (Not saying they are or not but from my PoV it appears to be the case.)

    when will the update come out again?
    Apparently August and sooner on the PTS.

    And all this:
    A quick question: ZoS, why hasn't the NPC broken neck syndrome been fixed yet:
    If they are not looking towards your character when you interact they fail to turn to face you...

    6fb5aeb5073a3fadabf1e536fcb61dd2.png
    24841f9c2d3834e353bdb460256efe12.png
    8c6eda0ab067b7c3a37d5d008fa71672.png
    bfd12c6b9dbcb6df569e552bd6a869f0.png
    bc05b6120d04b2d6758e24373f2d07d9.png

    ... and somehow manage to not break their necks!!!

    You get the usual mid conversation head turning a little bit, but it is from the weird angle they start at instead of from facing the player interacting.

    Also: Lower* Level Soulstones DO NOT work on a scaled map, they should at least be able to revive yourself, other players scaled up from their level and recharge your officially lower level gear.

    *Lower character level, such as a level 26 on Hew's Bane scaled to level CP160, cannot use any level 1-9 10-19 20-29 type soulstones, this would be true for any of the lesser soulstones than the level 50+ ones, and is a nasty way to treat trying to scale up a lower level player, have to re-run content every time you die until you can afford the top tier 'filled' soulstones and a gear repair from all of your deaths

    With One Tamriel on the horizon with all zones switching to scaling this will become a Major Issue.

    If support or a member of CS wants to contact me directly on these or a suggestion for a way to do Alliance changes whilst staying within the lore of TESO, I'll be happy to pass that on in this thread or elsewhere as per request.

    ^
    FAO: @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_KaiSchober @ZOS_MattFiror
    Edited by Coolio_Wolfus on July 4, 2016 2:29AM
  • DjSolJAH
    DjSolJAH
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    Any word of fixing the game breaking issues with console release of DB before focusing on new content?
    Zee blues are coming!!!! Always.... Always coming...
  • SlayerSyrena
    SlayerSyrena
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    Access to so many new hairstyles in that video and we only see three new ones ... One weave, one beard and one fugly hairstyle looking like it's woven in the shape of the Titanic when it was sinking ... (Just, why ...)

    *wants to see some new spiky/wild hairstyles so badly*

    Ebonheart Pact
    All PC/NA, Level 50 * Current Champion Points: 930
    Cyndril - Bosmer Vampire Nightblade - Dual Wield Blades and Bow
    Saryn Duskbringer - Altmer Vampire Sorcerer - Destro and Resto Staves
    Valmion Hlaalu - Dunmer Templar Healer - Resto and Destroy Staves
    Solus Lighthawke - Altmer DK Tank- Sword n' Board and Greatsword
    Stitches-for-Riches - Argonian Templar Healer- Resto
    Ashiran Zahuluu - Dunmer Stam Sorc - Dual Wield Blades and Bow
    Aldmeri Dominion
    Kivian Nightshade - Altmer Magicka NB - Destro/Resto Staves
    Daggerfall Covenant
    S'rala Sugar Claws - Khajiit Stamina Sorc - Dual Wield and Greatsword

    Member of the closed early beta group, The Psijic Order
    Guest on first ESO Live
    My ESO fan art and comics
  • Abeille
    Abeille
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    Access to so many new hairstyles in that video and we only see three new ones ... One weave, one beard and one fugly hairstyle looking like it's woven in the shape of the Titanic when it was sinking ... (Just, why ...)

    *wants to see some new spiky/wild hairstyles so badly*

    Wait... WAIT.

    Is that the hairstyle mentioned on that letter "A Call for Common Hair", by Anonymous, about Prince Hubalajad?!
    It's inside the Hew's Mane tavern, in Hew's Bane.
    Just so that everyone knows, my Altmer still can't have black hair. About a dozen of Altmer NPCs in the game have black hair. Just saying.

    Meet my characters:
    Command: Do the thing.

    Zadarri, Khajiit Fist of Thalmor: The thing was done, as commanded.
    Durza gra-Maghul, Orc blacksmith: The thing was done perfectly, in the most efficient way.
    Tegwen, Bosmer troublemaker: You can't prove I didn't do the thing.
    Sings-Many-Songs, Argonian fisher: Sure, I'll do the thing... Eventually. Maybe.
    Aerindel, Altmer stormcaller: After extensive research, I've come to the conclusion that doing the thing would be a waste of resources.
    Liliel, Dunmer pyromancer: Aerindel said I shouldn't do the thing. Something about "resources".
    Gyda Snowcaller, Nord cryomancer: I will find a way to do it that won't waste resources and make Aerindel proud of me.
    Beatrice Leoriane, Breton vampire: I persuaded someone else into doing the thing. You are welcome, dear.
    Sahima, Redguard performer: Doing the thing sounds awfully unpleasant and really not my problem.
    Ellaria Valerius, Imperial priestess: I'll pray to the Eight for the thing to be done, if it is Their will.
  • natewook
    natewook
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    So ,there is no in-game barbershop, just crown store. I would have thought a happy middle ground could have been found to make this more immersive (add more to cities, be a gold sink, etc) yet be immensely profitable. Other, older games have done an in-game shop for the hairstyle/look aspect and store option for race/name changes. Other than that, glad to see it coming.

    Honestly, I strongly believe that there should be middle ground between the pay walls and free to play. because not everyone is going to have enough money to pay for it. :(
    I'm not really saying that the barber shop should be free for everyone and anyone, and I'm not saying it should be stuck behind a flat fee for only those who have the money to pay or sub for it. What I am saying is that there should be NPC ‘s who sell the tickets at 100K or higher which climbs in price for each time you buy one and/or rare drops form bosses in DLC areas. :)
    sometimes I'll take subjects to far and ask for an arm, leg and maybe an eye, please be patent with me.
    remember this thread people: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/193736/should-eso-turn-up-the-heat-aka-gore-revisited/p1
    necromancer? why I've neve- I would never do such a thing! XD
  • Banetek
    Banetek
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    When can we expect to see pvp updates>?
  • anitajoneb17_ESO
    anitajoneb17_ESO
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    natewook wrote: »
    What I am saying is that there should be NPC ‘s who sell the tickets at 100K or higher which climbs in price for each time you buy one and/or rare drops form bosses in DLC areas. :)

    Hell, no.
    If there's to be an ingame option for such "services" (barbershop, dyes, etc...) those should be reasonably obtainable ingame. At least, this way it's clear and not ambiguous in any way : you want it, you pay for it in real currency. This is not a game element, this is a business element, an extra product offered to you.
    If they started with an hypocritical "you can obtain it ingame by grinding boss X and Y with a chance of 0.000000001% per try, I'd be furious. Because of the hypocrisy.

    The road chosen by ZOS is pretty clear. First, they offered a somewhat equivalent game experience obtainable by two different payment options. Now, with the dyes but mostly with the crafting bag, they're offering TWO DIFFERENT GAME EXPERIENCES at two different prices. Only those with little to no interest in farming/crafting/trading consider the crafting bag as a not-so-meaningful option. For everyone else, it IS a game-changing feature. Not P2W, sure, but game changing. B2P/crown players have now a clearly lesser game experience as compared to subbers. And we/they can feel that every 10 minutes, when they ask their group to stop because bag is full, because they have to relog to their mules to transfer their crafting mats, because they make choices in what they farm as opposed to subbers who can hoard everything and anything.

    I unsubbed as soon as the game became B2P. Why ? Because buying all DLCs in crowns is, mathematically, cheaper than subbing, and since ZOS is a profit company and not a charity or some "big cause" I'd like to support, I don't see why I'd choose the more expensive option for the same game experience.
    I resubbed with Dark Brotherhood update. Why ? Because, while buying all DLCs is still cheaper than subbing, it does not refer to an identical game experience anymore. The crafting bag changes everything.

    I am personally not angry - because mathematically, the whole year I paid DLCs in crowns instead of subbing still saved me money. But I can understand why some B2P/crown players are angry. We were "promised" (whatever that means) the same game experience for both subbers and non-subbers, and now, non subbers clearly get a lesser game experience if they persist in not subbing. Dyes will just add even more differences.

    I'm not saying any of this is good/bad, justified/unjustified. All I'm saying is : that's how it is. With the crafting bags, the offer has changed from "1 game, 2 different payment methods", to "2 different games at different prices".

    But if they were baiting me for some endless grinding "catch the very rare thing if you can", then I'd be EXTREMELY angry.



    Edited by anitajoneb17_ESO on June 29, 2016 5:23AM
  • natewook
    natewook
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    natewook wrote: »
    What I am saying is that there should be NPC ‘s who sell the tickets at 100K or higher which climbs in price for each time you buy one and/or rare drops form bosses in DLC areas. :)

    Hell, no.
    If there's to be an ingame option for such "services" (barbershop, dyes, etc...) those should be reasonably obtainable ingame. At least, this way it's clear and not ambiguous in any way : you want it, you pay for it in real currency. This is not a game element, this is a business element, an extra product offered to you.
    If they started with an hypocritical "you can obtain it ingame by grinding boss X and Y with a chance of 0.000000001% per try, I'd be furious. Because of the hypocrisy.

    The road chosen by ZOS is pretty clear. First, they offered a somewhat equivalent game experience obtainable by two different payment options. Now, with the dyes but mostly with the crafting bag, they're offering TWO DIFFERENT GAME EXPERIENCES at two different prices. Only those with little to no interest in farming/crafting/trading consider the crafting bag as a not-so-meaningful option. For everyone else, it IS a game-changing feature. Not P2W, sure, but game changing. B2P/crown players have now a clearly lesser game experience as compared to subbers. And we/they can feel that every 10 minutes, when they ask their group to stop because bag is full, because they have to relog to their mules to transfer their crafting mats, because they make choices in what they farm as opposed to subbers who can hoard everything and anything.

    I unsubbed as soon as the game became B2P. Why ? Because buying all DLCs in crowns is, mathematically, cheaper than subbing, and since ZOS is a profit company and not a charity or some "big cause" I'd like to support, I don't see why I'd choose the more expensive option for the same game experience.
    I resubbed with Dark Brotherhood update. Why ? Because, while buying all DLCs is still cheaper than subbing, it does not refer to an identical game experience anymore. The crafting bag changes everything.

    I am personally not angry - because mathematically, the whole year I paid DLCs in crowns instead of subbing still saved me money. But I can understand why some B2P/crown players are angry. We were "promised" (whatever that means) the same game experience for both subbers and non-subbers, and now, non subbers clearly get a lesser game experience if they persist in not subbing. Dyes will just add even more differences.

    I'm not saying any of this is good/bad, justified/unjustified. All I'm saying is : that's how it is. With the crafting bags, the offer has changed from "1 game, 2 different payment methods", to "2 different games at different prices".

    But if they were baiting me for some endless grinding "catch the very rare thing if you can", then I'd be EXTREMELY angry.



    I agree, I would be mad if the only way to get barber shop tokens was by grinding bosses for hours on end.
    but that's where your argument is flawed, I never said that grinding bosses for the drop or buying tokens for 100K and higher should be the only option. I was saying that there should be very hard to obtain alternative form paying crowns for those of us that don't have a lot of money to pay for these things.
    sometimes I'll take subjects to far and ask for an arm, leg and maybe an eye, please be patent with me.
    remember this thread people: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/193736/should-eso-turn-up-the-heat-aka-gore-revisited/p1
    necromancer? why I've neve- I would never do such a thing! XD
  • anitajoneb17_ESO
    anitajoneb17_ESO
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    natewook wrote: »
    I agree, I would be mad if the only way to get barber shop tokens was by grinding bosses for hours on end.
    but that's where your argument is flawed, I never said that grinding bosses for the drop or buying tokens for 100K and higher should be the only option. I was saying that there should be very hard to obtain alternative form paying crowns for those of us that don't have a lot of money to pay for these things.

    I'm afraid I don't understand your position.
    You're saying there should be two ways to get the tokens : 1/ paying crowns 2/ earning it ingame but it should be very hard. Am I understanding correctly ?

    What I say is that I disagree with the fact that it should be very hard. It should be reasonably difficult, (like for instance getting perfect roe to make ambrosia).

    I'd be angry if there were ingame token to be found, but as rare as a full glass motif book (for instance).

    Edited by anitajoneb17_ESO on June 29, 2016 4:24PM
  • natewook
    natewook
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    natewook wrote: »
    I agree, I would be mad if the only way to get barber shop tokens was by grinding bosses for hours on end.
    but that's where your argument is flawed, I never said that grinding bosses for the drop or buying tokens for 100K and higher should be the only option. I was saying that there should be very hard to obtain alternative form paying crowns for those of us that don't have a lot of money to pay for these things.

    I'm afraid I don't understand your position.
    You're saying there should be two ways to get the tokens : 1/ paying crowns 2/ earning it ingame but it should be very hard. Am I understanding correctly ?

    What I say is that I disagree with the fact that it should be very hard. It should be reasonably difficult, (like for instance getting perfect roe to make ambrosia).

    I'd be angry if there were ingame token to be found, but as rare as a full glass motif book (for instance).
    oh i understand now. good point, and yes that's my position. :)
    sometimes I'll take subjects to far and ask for an arm, leg and maybe an eye, please be patent with me.
    remember this thread people: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/193736/should-eso-turn-up-the-heat-aka-gore-revisited/p1
    necromancer? why I've neve- I would never do such a thing! XD
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