PvE questing - ALL solo? O.o

Magenpie

This kind of demonstrates how anti-social I am, because I've only ever grouped up for dungeons/dolmen etc before now.

My partner has just started playing and we've been group questing on KR.

I can't believe the quests don't co-op!?? As in, we both have to click on everything separately! It's so tedious and we get out of sync very easily. I'm a bit amazed at how clunky it is.

I'm *almost* certain most other games don't do this? Do they? I can't remember now.

Anyway, I'm going to do some searching about it too but is there any plan to de-clunk-i-fy the system or is it just the way it is?

Is there more group content apart from dungeons - something with a bit more...er...bite? It might be time to take a holiday in Cyrodiil at last (I went there once, on my own. It was scary.)

Some of the complaints I've read elsewhere on the forum make a bit more sense now as well.

I erect the Spine of Bafflement.

Robbmrp

There are some quests where you both don't have to click everything but not a lot. Other MMO's would require the same gathering for each person on the quest as well. At least the ones I've played.

Magenpie

Robbmrp wrote: »

There are some quests where you both don't have to click everything but not a lot. Other MMO's would require the same gathering for each person on the quest as well. At least the ones I've played.

I'm getting a bit under-confident with my memory now but I'm almost certain that for fetch-quest type things, most other games I've played allow the group to pool their finds or count the same kills towards their shared quests. In fact, I'm certain of that now I think about it.

I dunno, maybe it's just I haven't done PvE grouping in such a long time but it feels really really slow and awkward.

Smasherx74

Tarante11a wrote: »

Robbmrp wrote: »

There are some quests where you both don't have to click everything but not a lot. Other MMO's would require the same gathering for each person on the quest as well. At least the ones I've played.

I'm getting a bit under-confident with my memory now but I'm almost certain that for fetch-quest type things, most other games I've played allow the group to pool their finds or count the same kills towards their shared quests. In fact, I'm certain of that now I think about it.

I dunno, maybe it's just I haven't done PvE grouping in such a long time but it feels really really slow and awkward.

That's how WoW was and traditional MMOs. I think the main reason ESO doesn't have "group quest completion" is because there are a lot of quests that they want you to go kill or harvest whatever because it adds to the story/quest. At the same time it's anti-productive to the community if your friend is taking your objectives and they aren't counting towards your quest then you're stuck waiting for a respawn time.

Nestor

Most Quest Objectives will update if a group member talks to an NPC. And, a lot of the things you have to fetch get "pooled", usually kills and the like. However, some things won't, simply because the game looks at the player's inventory to see if the item is there, not the groups.

If you look at this another way, it can prevent issues if say the two of you had to gather something, one of you did, which cleared the markers, then for some reason the other member went AFK and has all the items. The game would not let you fetch what was needed.

Could they code it to make it work? Probably. Would it introduce all kinds of issues and problems? Yep.

nine9six

All of my friends, save for one, quit ESO when we were making our way through our first play through due to how impossible it was / is to keep in sync with one another's quest progress.

The one that stayed, who doesn't play much at all any more, went about questing on his own.

I like the "Group and Share" quest styles of other games I've played. ESO almost forces you to go it alone.

SolarCat02

The way it works is weird sometimes.
I was grouped with my husband, both doing writs. We had to craft the same items for enchanting. Shortly after I finished crafting the rune, he turned his in, and my quest updated. It had pulled the items from my inventory when he turned it in! I still had to walk to the turn in location to "Sign the Manifest" and get my reward.

The DLC seem to be a bit better at adjusting for teaming up (kills and talking to NPCs count but collecting items from the kills do not), but the original quests are spotty with the grouping. Sometimes I get credit for kills on the other side of the dungeon or a quest item shows up in my inventory after he picks it up, other times we both have to interact with something (and if we do it too closely together we get an error "Someone is using that." or "Item is not ready.") - so it's a bit weird grouping for the lower level things.

Magenpie

nine9six wrote: »

All of my friends, save for one, quit ESO when we were making our way through our first play through due to how impossible it was / is to keep in sync with one another's quest progress.

The one that stayed, who doesn't play much at all any more, went about questing on his own.

I like the "Group and Share" quest styles of other games I've played. ESO almost forces you to go it alone.

Well yes, exactly. I mean, it's not going to make me quit just yet - I'm enjoying my solo questing and exploring - but it's a bit of a shame I can't introduce other people to the game in a more inclusive way.

BF hasn't played an mmo before and it's not a particularly good start. x)

We shall see how it goes.

Lysette

Tarante11a wrote: »

This kind of demonstrates how anti-social I am, because I've only ever grouped up for dungeons/dolmen etc before now.

My partner has just started playing and we've been group questing on KR.

I can't believe the quests don't co-op!?? As in, we both have to click on everything separately! It's so tedious and we get out of sync very easily. I'm a bit amazed at how clunky it is.

I'm *almost* certain most other games don't do this? Do they? I can't remember now.

Anyway, I'm going to do some searching about it too but is there any plan to de-clunk-i-fy the system or is it just the way it is?

Is there more group content apart from dungeons - something with a bit more...er...bite? It might be time to take a holiday in Cyrodiil at last (I went there once, on my own. It was scary.)

Some of the complaints I've read elsewhere on the forum make a bit more sense now as well.

I erect the Spine of Bafflement.

This is an issue Angry Joe pointed out from the very start of ESO - that it is not really good in coop gameplay.

Some kind of "vacation" instance in Cyrrodil would be good as well - for those not interested into taking part in the warfare - not in a safe zone though, but just not counting to the army strength of the campaign - would have to come with not being able to gain alliance points.

Robbmrp

Tarante11a wrote: »

Robbmrp wrote: »

There are some quests where you both don't have to click everything but not a lot. Other MMO's would require the same gathering for each person on the quest as well. At least the ones I've played.

I'm getting a bit under-confident with my memory now but I'm almost certain that for fetch-quest type things, most other games I've played allow the group to pool their finds or count the same kills towards their shared quests. In fact, I'm certain of that now I think about it.

I dunno, maybe it's just I haven't done PvE grouping in such a long time but it feels really really slow and awkward.

There are quests in this game that do that also. There are also quests that require you each to do the exact same thing which is dumb. I wish they had a questing system that would allow you to share the quest with someone at the point your on. If they haven't done the starting quest it wouldn't matter. It would make it easier to grab a friend and quest. There are also quests that when one person talks to the NPC about it, it completes it for the other but not that many. They need more of those for sure.

mike_de

It's a singleplayer game with odd Multiplayer content.

Magenpie

nine9six wrote: »

All of my friends, save for one, quit ESO when we were making our way through our first play through due to how impossible it was / is to keep in sync with one another's quest progress.

The one that stayed, who doesn't play much at all any more, went about questing on his own.

I like the "Group and Share" quest styles of other games I've played. ESO almost forces you to go it alone.

It's also about layout isn't it, now that I think about it. I mean, in many mmos, you have a quest 'hub' where you and your friends can pick up 5 or 6 quests and then venture out into the surrounding area, do the 'circuit', then head back to the hub and hand in. Most of those quests you could to cooperatively.

I absolutely understand why ZOS might have moved away from that design, mainly because players (probably myself included at one point or another) have been moaning on about how boring and grindy mmo PvE can be. So, ESO has hubs but with fewer quests, most of which are linear story-driven things? Do you think?

I love that for solo-ing! Given that's what I do most of the time, it's great, but it seems to be utterly pants for grouping in world PvE.

Hmmm. Interesting stuff. Well, I think so anyway. ^^

Oh!!! Hang on!! Is that what Craglorn is for?!!!

Magenpie

And noooow, bf is mildly miffed because he wishes we'd bought a different, more companionable game. Oh dear. No subs from him I feel.

Just didn't occur to me to check beforehand!

x(

Barbet

Have one person pick the quest up and share it with the other. Works like a charm. Though there is a couple where it wont count for both of you, but not a lot. Suck it up.



If I ain't laughing, I aint playing.

Magenpie

Barbet wrote: »

Have one person pick the quest up and share it with the other. Works like a charm. Though there is a couple where it wont count for both of you, but not a lot. Suck it up.



If I ain't laughing, I aint playing.

Thank you for most helpful and polite advice. Will give it a whirl.

What am I supposed to be sucking up? I'm never sure what saying something like that is supposed to achieve. It doesn't make me feel any better about the game, or the other people who play. Might be a bit unhelpful when talking to newer players/ZOS customers who also help fund your fave game.

And tbh we don't have to at all - we bought the base game cheaply, if we don't like how the game plays, we're unlikely to buy any dlc, store stuff or sub. He'll just play something else.

It is ok to be politely critical of something. I'm not expecting the game to be changed as a result, but I am perfectly within my rights to point out my disappointments and walk away.

nine9six

Yes, the layout also had an impact on them. After we figured out that we weren't going to be able to really group-up and play we started going it alone.

I'd ask, "Did you do (that) quest?" - to which they'd reply, "No. Where did you find that one at?"

For their first attempt at an MMO (giving the game a shot solely because of the IP) it was not easy on them and they have mentioned that they'll likely not play another online (MMO) game again.

Would we have been able to group a little better I could have 'mentored' them. But trying to guide numerous people on the many aspects of a game like this, all individually, and at different points in the game, was just too much.

It's a shame, really.

Agobi

Tarante11a wrote: »

nine9six wrote: »

All of my friends, save for one, quit ESO when we were making our way through our first play through due to how impossible it was / is to keep in sync with one another's quest progress.

The one that stayed, who doesn't play much at all any more, went about questing on his own.

I like the "Group and Share" quest styles of other games I've played. ESO almost forces you to go it alone.

Well yes, exactly. I mean, it's not going to make me quit just yet - I'm enjoying my solo questing and exploring - but it's a bit of a shame I can't introduce other people to the game in a more inclusive way.

BF hasn't played an mmo before and it's not a particularly good start. x)

We shall see how it goes.

You are lucky..they have spent a considerable amount of time making this game more grouping-friendly...at launch it was virtually impossible to play with my friends because of zoningissues and other cr@p like the stuff you mention

ShedsHisTail

Tarante11a wrote: »

This kind of demonstrates how anti-social I am, because I've only ever grouped up for dungeons/dolmen etc before now.

My partner has just started playing and we've been group questing on KR.

I can't believe the quests don't co-op!?? As in, we both have to click on everything separately! It's so tedious and we get out of sync very easily. I'm a bit amazed at how clunky it is.

I'm *almost* certain most other games don't do this? Do they? I can't remember now.

Anyway, I'm going to do some searching about it too but is there any plan to de-clunk-i-fy the system or is it just the way it is?

Is there more group content apart from dungeons - something with a bit more...er...bite? It might be time to take a holiday in Cyrodiil at last (I went there once, on my own. It was scary.)

Some of the complaints I've read elsewhere on the forum make a bit more sense now as well.

I erect the Spine of Bafflement.

It's extra strange when you consider that in 4-man dungeons, when one person starts the quest, anyone who hasn't completed gets a prompt to start the quest as well. So, the capability is there; it just doesn't seem to be used on the surface world.

waterfairy

I agree that there should be a group completion, especially when it's a quest where you have to farm x amount of items in an area and you're forced to fight over the same bushes with your group...that's just plain stupid.

AlnilamE

I actually find that more quests as you go along will give you group credit.
The problem is that some quests have choices that you can make that alter the outcome, for example, so each player has to make their own choice.

Also, some quest stages may by by-passed by having the Intimidate or Persuade options save you some legwork, so if one player has those perks and the other doesn't they may need to take some extra steps.

Personally, I don't mind it most of the time because I like reading the dialogue and taking my time and I'd hate for that to be interrupted because my partner just clicked through everything. I've quested in groups as large as 6-7 (for the dailies in Cyrodiil, not zone quests) and you just have to coordinate a bit and it works beautifully.

Clerics1985

Most Quests in Cyradill Clump together inside your group as long as you share them with the group before running


Seems like if you want a Real co-op Questing experience you will find it on the battleground

rotaugen454

I've posted requests for "synchronize quest on group leader" to community reps and Devon on multiple occasions with no response. It is THE major issue keeping guild mates from coming back to the game. It would be nice if they at least acknowledged it.
@ZOS_JessicaFolsom
@ZOS_GinaBruno
@Wrobel

Magenpie

AlnilamE wrote: »

I actually find that more quests as you go along will give you group credit.
The problem is that some quests have choices that you can make that alter the outcome, for example, so each player has to make their own choice.

Also, some quest stages may by by-passed by having the Intimidate or Persuade options save you some legwork, so if one player has those perks and the other doesn't they may need to take some extra steps.

Personally, I don't mind it most of the time because I like reading the dialogue and taking my time and I'd hate for that to be interrupted because my partner just clicked through everything. I've quested in groups as large as 6-7 (for the dailies in Cyrodiil, not zone quests) and you just have to coordinate a bit and it works beautifully.

just want to particularly include @nine9six here too.

That's good to know, thanks @AlnilamE - and I'll admit that if people are new to mmos there's a bit of cat-herding at the start (apologies to any Khajiit reading, no offence intended.) So sometimes they aren't aware that it's best to wait for everyone to get to the same quest point to continue. Also, WONDERS! it's a new game and everyone is excited and running about opening ALL the boxes.

However, there's a particularly silly bit on KR for example - the temple quest [spoilers] - where we ended up having to kill the same four groups separately, then the quest allowed us to solve a puzzle together, then made us click four pillars separately again. It was weird, inconsistent and sloooooow going, because we didn't know at what stage of the quest we were both at.

Of course, it doesn't help that I've done these before too, so the waiting around and faffing about is more annoying to me, but as I said before, it feels...clunky.

If it gets better later on, I might suggest he quests solo for a bit, which might be good anyway because he gets a feel for the game without me bossing him about (*whistles innocently*) then we can team up again for delves, dolmen and...dangerous questing after that.

And really, perhaps I sound more grumpy than I am - I think it's a lovely game, he really loved Skyrim, so we'll keep playing for a while. It's just a shame about the group stuff.

Magenpie

Clerics1985 wrote: »

Most Quests in Cyradill Clump together inside your group as long as you share them with the group before running


Seems like if you want a Real co-op Questing experience you will find it on the battleground

But I am a weedy scardy cat and will die. A lot. Instantly.

Also, I see you with your carrot tempting the nabcake onto the killing floor, you naughty thing.

Although there is that helpful tip on one of the loading screens that says running away is perfectly fine.

'Brave, brave, brave Sir Robin...'

rotaugen454

Tarante11a wrote: »

Clerics1985 wrote: »

Most Quests in Cyradill Clump together inside your group as long as you share them with the group before running


Seems like if you want a Real co-op Questing experience you will find it on the battleground

But I am a weedy scardy cat and will die. A lot. Instantly.

Also, I see you with your carrot tempting the nabcake onto the killing floor, you naughty thing.

Although there is that helpful tip on one of the loading screens that says running away is perfectly fine.

'Brave, brave, brave Sir Robin...'

Funny, my Nord Templar with the red hair and long mustache is named The_Brave_Sir_Robin, and he avoids all combat.

I really want PvE questing to sync. I'm hoping that will be part of the One Tamriel release.

magnusthorek

They tried to force co-op and the disgraced wasteland called Craglorn was born

Magenpie

magnusthorek wrote: »

They tried to force co-op and the disgraced wasteland called Craglorn was born

I could look this up but I'd rather ask you - is Craglorn for group PvE then or is it just trials? Is it any good? Although, from your comment, I''m guessing you don't think it is?

Epona222

magnusthorek wrote: »

They tried to force co-op and the disgraced wasteland called Craglorn was born

Which is an awful shame, because the narrative around the quests is pretty good. The main problem is in finding a group to go through it all with, where everyone stays on the same quest stage. I'm lucky, had an agreement with my friends that we'd do Craglorn stuff together, and we've been slowly working through it. Anyone trying to put together a group to do a particular quest that they are on, may have problems.

AlnilamE

Craglorn is an interesting zone.

There are two main questlines (Lower and Upper Craglorn), all delves are 4-person instances and there are a number of daily quests that can be done.

The Lower Craglorn quest line has 4 quests that can be done in any order to unlock the final quest. The Upper Craglorn questline has 2 quests that can be done in any order to unlock the final quest.

While the zone is designed for 4 person groups, most content can be done by fewer players (and the daily quest in Elhinir Sewers can be done by a larger group), there are a few quests or quest steps that require 4 people.

If you are interested (after the BF hits level 50 and gets a few Champion Points, of course) keep in mind that these are the 4-person gates:

- The Corrupted Stone (main quest): The door in the last stage of the quest requires 4 people to open.
- The Missing Guardian (the last quest in Lower Craglorn): The First step in this quest requires 4 people to open a portal. It's fairly common for people to ask in zone for help with this, as all you need to do to help is activate a pillar at the right time and then you can go on with your day.
- Critical Mass (Daily Quest at Spellscar), requires four players to collect elemental essences and open a portal.

I really enjoy the questlines and some of the daily quests there, but you have to be aware of these issues.

As for group content vs. Solo, I find that I prefer to do my questing by myself, but save delves, dolmens, world bosses for guild activities. Those are quite fun to do together and easier to keep track of where everyone is.

Magenpie

AlnilamE wrote: »

Craglorn is an interesting zone.

There are two main questlines (Lower and Upper Craglorn), all delves are 4-person instances and there are a number of daily quests that can be done.

The Lower Craglorn quest line has 4 quests that can be done in any order to unlock the final quest. The Upper Craglorn questline has 2 quests that can be done in any order to unlock the final quest.

While the zone is designed for 4 person groups, most content can be done by fewer players (and the daily quest in Elhinir Sewers can be done by a larger group), there are a few quests or quest steps that require 4 people.

If you are interested (after the BF hits level 50 and gets a few Champion Points, of course) keep in mind that these are the 4-person gates:

- The Corrupted Stone (main quest): The door in the last stage of the quest requires 4 people to open.
- The Missing Guardian (the last quest in Lower Craglorn): The First step in this quest requires 4 people to open a portal. It's fairly common for people to ask in zone for help with this, as all you need to do to help is activate a pillar at the right time and then you can go on with your day.
- Critical Mass (Daily Quest at Spellscar), requires four players to collect elemental essences and open a portal.

I really enjoy the questlines and some of the daily quests there, but you have to be aware of these issues.

As for group content vs. Solo, I find that I prefer to do my questing by myself, but save delves, dolmens, world bosses for guild activities. Those are quite fun to do together and easier to keep track of where everyone is.

Oooo! How very lovely and helpful. Thank you!

hee hee - think 50 might be some way off - we're competing with 'Totally Empire War' [sic] 'Hearts of Iron IV' and 'Tropico N'