How ZOS could add children to Tamriel...

Gidorick

One of the more immersion damaging aspects of The Elder Scrolls Online is the fact that no children exist in any of the towns in any of the provinces in any of the lands of Tamriel. ZOS has given us the throwaway line of "Only Hermaeus Mora Knows" in response to the question of children.

I do, however, remain hopeful that there are plans to someday add children to ESO.

TL/DR
ZOS should add non-killable children to ESO and possibly do it through its own dedicated DLC

The core premise of this thread is to suggest just one possible way ZOS could add children to ESO, not whether or not they should be added. If you would like to debate that, please refer to one of these threads below:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/125590/add-children-to-eso/p1
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/153613/add-npc-children/p1
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/170467/do-you-wish-zos-to-add-children-to-tamriel/p1


So… moving forward let’s just all go with the understanding that this thread’s premise is based on the fact that ZOS should add children to ESO… and there are a couple options. ZOS could…

• Just add children and everyone moves forward as if they were always there.
• Add Children with a lore explanation worked into the story of a DLC

No Explanation Addition
ZOS doesn't really need to explain why there were no children before or why they returned. Players will accept it as just the natural progression of the game as an MMO. We do not have an issue with the fact that the justice system didn't exist at one point and we could accept children much in the same way.

If I stopped here, this would be a short and redundant thread. I’d prefer to continue by suggesting something a little more… immersive.

Lore Explanation DLC
The line "Only Hermaeus Knows" has been interpreted to be similar to the phase "Only God knows" in our world, meaning that the reason is unknowable to us. If ZOS decided to actually flesh this out into an actual narrative the story could be quite interesting and involve a DLC all its own revolving around the stealing of children across Tamriel. I’ve divided the following into a few sections for ease of consumption.

1. The Mage and His Wife
   The story could open with a man approaching the player with a desperate plea, to help him and his pregnant wife. Through panicked, heaving breaths, the husband explains that they are running for their lives. That daedra are after them a they are trying to steal their baby. The husband is a mage and he has been able to use mystical wards to protect his wife up to this point but the attacks are getting more frequent and more aggressive. He fears he isn't experienced enough to handle the power he feels bearing down on them.
   
   He has heard of your heroism and begs you for your help. He needs you to escort them to an old sorcerer he believe lives in a city in the new zone. His wife is currently safe in a city that is on the opposite side of that zone and he asks you to meet them there to protect them on their journey.
   
   What follows could be a series of escort quests that has the player perform a myriad of different tasks and fighting off increasingly difficult enemies. Starting off, the enemies could be bandits and thieves that seem to appear out of nowhere and dissolve into bubbling piles of black and purple goo when killed. As the quest progresses, the enemies could twist and distort with familiar Daedra manifesting with lovecraftian twists. Tentacles protruding from their back, Eyes opening in their chests, their heads splitting open to reveal a maw of teeth and tongues. You know, the stuff of nightmares… or The Thing… or Bloodborne.
   
   Players could perform tasks such as escorting the mage with his wife from one waypoint to the next, fending off enemies as you travel along-side the Mages carriage. ZOS could even introduce mount combat and mounted combat mechanics using this narrative. Where the player stays on their mount, riding beside the carriage driven by the mage with his wife in the covered rear. The player would hack at enemies from atop their trusty steed or maybe they could even attack the enemies directly with their mount.
   
   Another quest could have the player posing as the mage with a dummy for the wife. The mage could use an illusion spell to trick the daedra into thinking that you are them. You could then take them the opposite direction of travel and meet up with the mage later.
   
   Another quest could involve working with the local outlaws dens to gain access to an underground, magically hidden passage way from one city to the next with obvious issues along the way.
   
   
2. The Sorcerer
   When the player successfully gets the mage to his destination the player could be betrayed. Perhaps it’s by the mage with the player finding out that the woman was his prisoner the whole time and that he was taking her to sacrifice her child to Hermaeus Mora. Perhaps the sorcerer that you travel to turns out to be the one who is orchestrating the theft of all of Tamriel’s Children and he had to draw this particular child to him because the mage is more powerful than he realized and was successfully preventing his child’s in-utero abduction. Or perhaps there is no betrayal and the forces of Hermaeus Mora simply overwhelms the mages and steals the child anyway. Oh, and during this battle, the woman should be in labor. This would add to the sense of urgency of the battle and occupying the father while you fight off the tendrils of the daedric horde barreling down upon you.
   
   The battle could have a moment of escalation when the child is born and the Wretched Abyss bursts into the room with tentacles and gnashing teeth whipping out of the purple gaping maw. Hermaeus Mora would then steal the newborn child. Tentacles could then plunge into the heads of the parents, while trying to sink a tentacle into you as well. This would resulting in a battle where you have to try to get back the child, defend yourself, and defend the parents. At the end of the battle Hermaeus Mora escapes with the child.
   
   Speaking to the mother would reveal that she has no memory of being pregnant or of just giving birth. Hermaeus Mora stole her memories of there ever being a child.
   
   The mage begs you to get his child back and you, of course, agree to do so. Then the mages and/or sorcerer (who would depend on the chosen narrative) uses the Black Book the sorcerer owns to get the player to Apocrypha, the realm of Hermaeus Mora.
   
   
3. The Halls of Apocrypha
   Within, the player could meet a small group of children who has resisted Hermaeus Mora in Apocrypha. Think Little Lamplight from Fallout 3. These children could help you navigate the Daedric realm, and could be quest givers and could accompany the player on some of the quests. They could explain how children are imprisoned in Apocrypha and are forced to write day in, day out. No sleep. No food. Nothing but writing. When you discover one of the children writing one of the books you find that the children aren’t really writing but there is some grotesque squid creature attached to their heads with a mass of tentacles scribbling across pages that are scattered about.
   
   They could be writing Black Books, they could be writing something else that we’ve never heard of before. Perhaps Hermaeus Mora is trying to tap into the potential of imagination of children to write his own Oghma Infinium. Maybe we find out, maybe we don’t.
   
   As they write, the children could age at an accelerated rate… but they don’t grow. The writing literally consumes their souls. As the adventurer travels, they will find heaps of empty, drained carcasses of withered white haired children. At some points, between the towering books walls of Apocrypha’s maze, piles of dead children could block the player’s path.
   
   The players would fight the ghosts wandering the maze of books and perhaps the player could, at times, look inward and experiencing hallucination type quests. This could involve things like the player replaying portions of quest but have the details be slightly different from what actually happened. At some point maybe the player could be revered to an infant themselves and they have to fight other infants. The possibly are pretty much endless, but the more uncomfortable and abstract, the better.
   
   The core of the narrative while in Apocrypha could be delivered by children who are have been imprisoned within this realm, but who have either escaped the Transcribers (the squid mind reading creatures) or never had them attached. The player will eventually find the child, who will not yet have had a Transcriber attached. The player will have to fight to kill the Transcriber and have the child released. This could be tied into a series of events that will lead to all the children trapped within Apocrypha being released.
   
   At some point in the narrative, it could also be explained that once the child is born, the knowledge of the gender and the sight of the child creates a lasting bond between parent and child and that bond can be difficult to completely erase. This is why in-utero abductions are so important to Hermaeus Mora, there is a more complete removal of memories. This could also be the reason we see so many man-children across Tamriel. The mothers of these missing children feel a longing loss for their missing child that they project upon their older, adult children.
   
   
4. The Return to Tamriel
   In the end, after everything is said and done, the children are released from Apocrypha. The children who have been under the influence of the Transcribers decide to stay in Apocrypha, realizing there is nothing left for them in Tamriel and they miss the interconnection they felt. So, all of the uninfluenced children return to Tamriel with the player. The number of children actually released is small in comparison to the number of children taken. This is fine narratively though, because the children who were weren't returned are gone won't be remembered by the adults. The children who do return will remember their friends they left behind but will have developed enough wisdom through being in Apocrypha to know it's best to not mention the forgotten children to their parents.
   
   This could also be a good opportunity for ZOS to introduce mixed races to Tamriel by having the father and mother you assist be from two different races of Tamriel. This could also be central to the overall narrative of the story. Perhaps the original invocation of Hermaeus Mora was from a jilted Sorcerer whose lover left him for another of a different species and upon hearing they were having a child. Feeling betrayed, he called upon Hermaeus Mora to take the child, kill the man his lover left him for, and erase any memories of his lover ever having been with the other man. Hermaeus Mora could have then desired more children once he/she/it got a taste of their innocence. Perhaps this could be the Sorcerer the player, the mage, and his wife travel to during the first half of this story.
   
   In the following DLC, children would be returned to Tamriel. The world would see the effect of the actions of the player in the DLC. Some cities could have just a few children, some could have a whole group of them. The narrative of the Hermaeus Mora DLC would allow for there to be far fewer children than would seem appropriate.
   
   If ZOS were to allow players to make choices in the DLC, the children could react differently to the players. Perhaps the player is given the choice at one point to save the children or trade their lives for Knowledge and power from Hermaeus Mora. Of course the DLC would end the same way no matter what the player chooses but the children could know which players saved them and which tried to trade them.
   
   So anyway… those were just a few thoughts about how ZOS could add children to ESO.

Forumer-in-Prison

In other news...


Children of Tamriel! Coming soon to the Crown Store

dsalter

or they could make them invincible, they don't tell guards crimes but they flee the moment combat nearby starts. and none ever outside main towns giving to the whole towns dont kill kids so they stay in them.

craybest

it would be weird to not have children for a lore reason, and the main quest not have been to rescue them in the first place, it is the most important thing we should be doing, not helping in wars. i prefer to add them as if they were always there.

Mettaricana

Maybe souls reincarnate like lord nevar and molag bal stealing all the souls prevents kids from being born....

DRAGONBREAK!!

Mojmir

no

Duiwel

If they add children my Blade of Woe better work on them!

Unkillable children was probably the ONLY flaw Skyrim had...

That is until mods took care of that.

Epona222

The lack of children in game does not bother me in the slightest.

The only thing that does bother me slightly is the number of baby cribs around in houses and palaces in DC areas - there's even one in Ravenwatch Castle, which is beyond odd.

Simply removing the cribs and not adding children would be fine with me.

lokesgard

I like it!

Mady

Gidorick wrote: »

no children exist in any of the towns in any of the provinces in any of the lands of Tamriel.

WTF.... I never realized that there are no children in the game (playing since beta lol).

We seriously need children!

phaneub17_ESO

Then you would have lewd RPers hanging around the children NPCs doing their thing. I've come across a few once in a while, some of them are really creepy.

Volkodav

I've always wondered why there are no children running around in Tamriel.I mean,does everyone just spring into the world fully grown,like a Talos?
Surely,they procreate.Or how would they be able to talk about wives and mothers and fathers.
Oh,and how could we rescue sons and daughters?

Van_0S

Killable children using blade of woe!
https://youtu.be/XfLtmpj2CSI

Mojmir

Mady wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

no children exist in any of the towns in any of the provinces in any of the lands of Tamriel.

WTF.... I never realized that there are no children in the game (playing since beta lol).

We seriously need children!

we have enough in game and on the forums,and the looped scripted messages they would have if they were added into the game....no thank you.

Volkodav

Mojmir wrote: »

Mady wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

no children exist in any of the towns in any of the provinces in any of the lands of Tamriel.

WTF.... I never realized that there are no children in the game (playing since beta lol).

We seriously need children!

we have enough in game and on the forums,and the looped scripted messages they would have if they were added into the game....no thank you.

Huh? What scripted messages would Child NPCs have?? I dont get it.

Cryptical

Summary - base game addition, solo mission, not a new dlc area. A 'pied piper of hamelin' plot line. The piper took the kids, you are going to break into the mountain and rescue them. Quest progression advances with increased crafting skills. Quest ends when you infiltrate the child-only dungeon and get the kids out.

Rough shape -

START
Pick some place not currently used for a major plot hook. Like the edge of the main city of your alliances fourth zone, or such. A couple is arguing over whether to seek help. One wants to keep quiet as commanded, the other wants to take action in some way. There's your plot hook to pick up.

Search out a specialist, but only find info in written material, which is scattered around X places. Info says the only way to enter the piper's domain is to take on the aspects of a child, and the specialist was experimenting with ways to apply those aspects.

IN ANY ORDER
Increase clothing to some level to be able to craft a child's smock quest item.
Increase enchanting to some level to be able to craft a 'glyph of childhood' quest item.
Increase woodworking to some level to be able to craft a 'child's wooden sword/staff/greatsword/etc' toy quest item. Making use of the fighter guild 'pick a special weapon' mechanic here.
Maybe also use other crafting skills, as thematic appropriate.

When all components are acquired, take them to the specialist's work space and combine them into a costume quest item that makes you into a child size version of yourself, in non-armor clothing, with a wooden sword. Specialist's work space was set up in the entryway in front of the piper's door, and using the quest item grants access to the area. Making use of the 'turn into a monkey to access the lab' example from coldharbour here.

We are in disguise inside the piper's mountain. Most of his staff ignore us, some see through our disguise like sentries, there are plenty of children around and according to fable they like it here. Either skulk around the entire place to disable his magical fields separating the mountain from the outside, or take out the piper himself. Disabling the ward fields prompts the piper to disappear having 'escaped'. Killing the piper and looting the body provides a key stone that unlocks opens the exit door.

Conclusion - some children stay in the mountain, because it was actually an enjoyable time. Some go home and can be found in previously inaccessible/empty homes throughout the land - but not in the open outside because that would conflict with the open outside that others experience.
Random opinions offered to you around the map, depending on your method of conclusion -
Disable ward fields : "You should have gone after that piper, end the problem at the source" / "You saved the children first, I thank you."
Kill the piper : "You ended a nightmare of all parents, bravo!" / "You could have sealed that mountain forever, killing the piper like that!"

Typed on phone.

Edit: I've always found it funny that if you let that mom kill the doctor in phaer, she says it will be a secret, but random people rebuke me "you let that woman kill that man in phaer, Shane on you!"

Rohamad_Ali

Wat ? Finally a paradise with no kids and you want to ruin my immersion .

Caroloces

Maybe a variation on the Rumpelstiltskin tale . . .?

Runkorko

No need. Think we have enough. Mostly in Cyro..

Gidorick

I like the way you think @Cryptical ! It kind of sounds like some twisted Peter Pan tale. If we're going the pied piper route, they COULD use that as a chance to introduce music making. Imagine having to compose a song to counteract the piper's original song.

TerraDewBerry

I like the idea of adding children to the game, and would love to do some quests to rescue them and bring them back home safely. Great idea OP.

Enemy-of-Coldharbour

I'd hate to see what some people would try to do to them (and you know it would happen).

Drakoleon

More kids???

Gidorick

Enemy-of-Coldharbour wrote: »

I'd hate to see what some people would try to do to them (and you know it would happen).

This could be mitigated with the right design. @Enemy-of-Coldharbour

Hammy01

Funny how there are no kids in the game but there are baby rockers all over the place.... What the heck happened to the babies?

Lysette

i found the children in Skyrim pretty much annoying with the exception of the daughter of the grocery vendor in Whiterun. I do not want to see this kind of children in ESO, where parents have failed to teach them manners.

Abeille

I prefer them to be added with no explanation, and for the npcs that were supposed to be children to begin with to be converted to children. I'm talking about the quests involving families where the parents talk about their sons and daughters (usually daughters) as if they were "only children", but they actually look to be about the same age as their parents.

I will accept that change as a fix that has everything to do with the game's mechanics and nothing to do with the lore.

And yes, make them unkillable just like all the merchants and quest npcs in the game who can't be attacked already.

Shunravi

Meh, why not.

Thevampirenight

Abeille wrote: »

I prefer them to be added with no explanation, and for the npcs that were supposed to be children to begin with to be converted to children. I'm talking about the quests involving families where the parents talk about their sons and daughters (usually daughters) as if they were "only children", but they actually look to be about the same age as their parents.

I will accept that change as a fix that has everything to do with the game's mechanics and nothing to do with the lore.

And yes, make them unkillable just like all the merchants and quest npcs in the game who can't be attacked already.

Well there is a reason why they made them unkillable or target able in skyrim. There would be lawsuits, because harming children is very much a taboo. I think they see more problems with adding children, which is why they have not done it. But yes they should add them into the game, yes even the babies! They could even have quests to bring a baby who lost a parent to an orphanage. Maybe some woman asks if you would find a baby, either from an orphanage or to steal one, from someone else. There is many possibilities and things they could do. Of course the children would not get harmed. But they could be added to bring life into the game. This I would like to see. It would bring more a sense of realism.

Abeille

Thevampirenight wrote: »

Abeille wrote: »

I prefer them to be added with no explanation, and for the npcs that were supposed to be children to begin with to be converted to children. I'm talking about the quests involving families where the parents talk about their sons and daughters (usually daughters) as if they were "only children", but they actually look to be about the same age as their parents.

I will accept that change as a fix that has everything to do with the game's mechanics and nothing to do with the lore.

And yes, make them unkillable just like all the merchants and quest npcs in the game who can't be attacked already.

Well there is a reason why they made them unkillable or target able in skyrim. There would be lawsuits, because harming children is very much a taboo. I think they see more problems with adding children, which is why they have not done it. But yes they should add them into the game, yes even the babies! They could even have quests to bring a baby who lost a parent to an orphanage. Maybe some woman asks if you would find a baby, either from an orphanage or to steal one, from someone else. There is many possibilities and things they could do. Of course the children would not get harmed. But they could be added to bring life into the game. This I would like to see. It would bring more a sense of realism.

Yeah, I'm aware of that. But there are so many characters that can't be killed in the game already that I honestly can't understand how this is even a problem. They just have to make them unkillable like all of these unkillable characters.

I mean, unlike in Skyrim, we can't even use mods or console commands to kill characters that otherwise would be unkillable. Therefore, adding unkillable children to ESO should be even less of an issue than on Skyrim.

And yes, add babies too. There are baby cradles in the game already, just put them there. Made them untargetable like birds, cats and dogs.

quadraxis666

No kids. nice to not hear them in this game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMOmOHTsT2k