A Way Dark Anchors Could Be Improved for Players At All Levels

MajorClay

I want to start off by saying that I'm a huge fan of the Elder Scrolls series, and I typically try and be forgiving and lenient when it comes to small problems and inconveniences in ESO since it is the first MMO adaption. With the being said, there needs to be a big change done when it comes to Dark Anchors. I'm the kind of person who likes to get as close to 100% completion as I can when playing RPGs. That involves me doing every World Boss, Delve, Skyshard, Lorebooks, Dolmen, Achievement, and Mission I can find. Now two of the achievements I have to do are the Group Dungeon Conqueror achievements and the General Executioner achievement. These two achievements are the absolute bane of my ESO existence. Not only are they tedious, but they also rely 100% on chance. For this post I will focus on the General Executioner achievement.

From what I've read on Dark Anchors, there is 3 in each zone, 15 in each alliance, and 45 in total (not counting Cyrodil). There is 16 generals per area, and groups of four of them are assigned to each zone after the first zone in your alliance (Starting in Deshaan, Grahtwood, or Stormhaven). This group of four is taken in order of the General Executioner achievement's listing of them. You have a 10% chance of getting any 1 of the 4 generals at the end of the Dark Anchor.

This is where it gets to the part I don't understand. That 10% chance is upped to a 30%-40% chance of getting any 1 of the 16 generals in any zone when it comes to Cyrodil and Veteran Zones. Now I understand why Cyrodil is like this, but why the Veteran zones? Why aren't they done in the same way as your main alliance with the group of 4s having a 10% in certain zones.

I personally don't like going back to low-level zones when I'm a higher leveled and one-hitting all the enemies, but I also don't enjoy running a zone's dolmens 50+ times whilst I'm lower level to get all of my generals. I feel like making the Veteran Zones follow the same dolmen rules as your main alliance less people would be going back as V16 to do Lvl 20-48 dolmens. Also not as many people would be staying in their main alliance's zones as long trying to get every general, therefore making them almost too strong for the next zone. Now they would be able to move on knowing that they could finish off the generals in Veteran Zones where the experience is actually needed.

I've never been the V16 going back to finish off generals at a low-level Dark Anchor, but I can suspect that it takes some of the fun out if they're even easier than normal. With that being said I have been the low-level player who is unable to get any hits during a dolmen due to a Vet one-hitting everything, and it took the fun out of it for me as well. MMOs are supposed to have some tedious grind spots, but I believe that it makes it a bit more fun if the enemies are at least at your own level.

tinythinker

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/259806/dolmens-sky-drops-and-mixing-levels-in-base-game-zones-oh-and-dungeons

If you go to a DLC zone, you get leveled *up* to be a better match for what you find there. But for Alliance Zones, that doesn't make sense to do. Yet many Veteran (soon to be Champion) level players want to do things like dolmens for achievements or to help friends/guild mates. So add a max level for each dolmen, let's say that at a particular anchor it's level 12, and have anyone who enters a radius around the dolmen in which ranged attacks are possible but is over level 12 be scaled *down* to level 12. You keep your same gear, skills, etc, but your damage/healing done goes down and your damage taken goes up to match the mobs and level cap for that event. Higher level players can still help out and get chest rewards (for their true level) and kill generals, but they don't ruin the experience for lower level players.[color]

MajorClay

@tinythinker I read through the thread and I definitely see where you're coming from. The scaling system works pretty well in the DLC due to the fact that Champion Points still make the more experienced players stronger, but keep it to where the lower level players at least have a fighting chance.

The only part I didn't understand was how you would implement it. The way you said it made it sound as if only the Dolmens and Fissures would be scaled. I'm not a game designer, but I think that would cause problems because, as of now, the scaling isn't instant. So, would the entire world around the dolmens be scaled? If so, then wouldn't that hurt the progression of the game as low-level players would be allowed to do V16 content, or does the scaling only work one way?

I think this could work in theory, especially for achievement hunters. But I still think the higher level dolmens should utilize the same General spawn theorem as the low-level Dark Anchors. I think with the right implications both my fix and yours could be put together to make an over-all fair game. I think the scaling would have to only work one way (down), and also the higher-level dolmens should be made to fit suit. This would make for a more all-around fair and fun game as well as a way that high and low level players could work together on achievements.

Riggsy

Not only are they tedious, but they also rely 100% on chance.

There are so many more problems than this, Id rather the ZOS team focuses on core issues and not making achievements easier.

Nestor

MajorClay wrote: »

That 10% chance is upped to a 30%-40% chance of getting any 1 of the 16 generals in any zone when it comes to Cyrodil and Veteran Zones.

I don't think this is true, at least not in my experience. I get even less General Spawns in the Silver and Gold zones than I do i the leveling zones. It would be nice if the rate was this high.

idk

I don't see the suggesting the title proposes is in the OP. Seems to merely be a wordy complaint. Maybe I'm kinda slooooow.

MajorClay

Nestor wrote: »

MajorClay wrote: »

That 10% chance is upped to a 30%-40% chance of getting any 1 of the 16 generals in any zone when it comes to Cyrodil and Veteran Zones.

I don't think this is true, at least not in my experience. I get even less General Spawns in the Silver and Gold zones than I do i the leveling zones. It would be nice if the rate was this high.

My stats may be off, I took them from an old thread I found. I couldn't find anywhere to double check them against official numbers.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/97179/generals-of-molag-bal-achievement

MajorClay

Giles.floydub17_ESO wrote: »

I don't see the suggesting the title proposes is in the OP. Seems to merely be a wordy complaint. Maybe I'm kinda slooooow.

I may have worded it weird, sorry. From the research I've done it seems that the Dolmens in the Veteran Zones aren't using the same algorithm as the Dolmens in your home alliance. This makes them much harder to farm for specific generals and therefore cause Veterans to farm low-level Dolmens for the General Executioner achievement.

What I am suggesting is that if all Dolmens both home alliance and Veterans (but not including Cyrodil) used the same 4 general per zone algorithm it would benefit low-level players by not having Vets taking all the kills.

EdmundTowers

I think dolmens need to be reworked. Dolmens feel pretty epic when its just by yourself or with a small group of 2-3 people, but when theres a ton of players or a higher level comes in, I start to feel sorry for molag bal and his minions. I type /eat and just wait it out cuz theres nothing more I need to do.

I have a suggestion for a fix. And that is that anchors need to be closed from both sides to complete it. At some point in the fight, Molag Bal grabs all the players with his god powers. Csn use that floating to the sky animation and player characters can be screaming for added effect at this point. Then all the players get thrown into cold harbor. Players now have to fight hordes of daedra to close the other side of the anchor and escape.

Now heres where the balance comes in, players that are at the proper level for the dolmen, go to the other side of the gate together and are the ones that actually close it. Players who are overleveled get seperated by Molag Bal and thrown into an arena/dungeon by themselves scaled to their level. There they must fight molags champions and then find a way out through a portal (or something). Maybe Caldwell shows up and shows you a way out.

Then achiements are earned by all.

greylox

They felt epic at the start but they have been made easier while players have been made stronger so I can only assume they've given up on them.

Nestor

MajorClay wrote: »

My stats may be off, I took them from an old thread I found. I couldn't find anywhere to double check them against official numbers.
[/quote]

I did not see an official response in that thread. I really do think it is a 10% chance of getting a General at any Dolmen based on the Dolmen Farming I do. It just works better in the leveling zones if your chasing a certain general to farm them there. I would like it if the 4 per zone meta carried through on the Silver and Gold zones. Lumping all 16 Generals into a Pool that only has a 10% chance to proc makes it difficult to find them. And, not difficult in a challenging fun way either, more a tedious way.

Enodoc

I agree, I believe the primary cause of the reason Vet characters farm low-level dolmens is because you know which Generals are going to appear there from a 1-in-4 list. In the Veteran zones, they are picked from a 1-in-16 list, so if you want specific general, you go to where the chance is higher.

As you said, the best way to address this would be to set it so that each Veteran zone only chooses Generals from the same list of 4 as the non-Vet version of the zone.

snorlockb16_ESO

Scale up for DLC works well, so scale down for other areas could easily be implemented. A Zone 1 would scale down to lvl 14 or so. The fights would be challenging but hardly impossible. Ordinary drops would occur, which would also fix the achievements for creature drops.

idk

snorlockb16_ESO wrote: »

Scale up for DLC works well, so scale down for other areas could easily be implemented. A Zone 1 would scale down to lvl 14 or so. The fights would be challenging but hardly impossible. Ordinary drops would occur, which would also fix the achievements for creature drops.

I believe devs have said they do not want to scale players down/make us weaker. This should not be a priority for Zos. Not a big deal at all. Have seen many high level vets play respectfully at low level dolmens.

ChrispyRambo

I didn't even know about the Dolem generals until I was a higher level. I saw the "Daedric Lord Slayer" title in the achievement list but still had to look it up online to figure out exactly what to do. I always thought that there should have been an "NPC" character in each zone that reported to you & let you know what generals were spotted in each area.(maybe a little story behind it). That way I probably would have tried to kill them all at the appropriate level before moving on. But I'm not going to lie tho. Going back to the lower levels and being able to decimate some of the anchors by myself helped me get through the tedious task of getting that achievement. 234 tries until the Ogrim Bothers finally presented themselves to me allowing me to get the "Daedric Lord Slayer" title. By this point I said eff it & went on to get the 250 achievement. I don't know if I would have done them all if I scaled down.

tinythinker

@MajorClay, I've played games where events pop up in various places on the map. In one, if you are standing in or enter the radius of the event, if you are in the at or under the level limit, you are fine. If you are more than x level over the ideal, you have the option to be scaled down. So let's say the event was level 10 and I was level 40. For that game, since I am more than 6 levels over the rating of the event, I can choose to be leveled down to 16. After the event is over or if I leave its radius, I am automatically returned to level 40.

Hence the discussion in that other thread about how it would work in ESO. The last it was discussed, the number we came up with to be scaled down to was +3 over the event. To offer more thought on this, since ESO doesn't like to interrupt the action, this would be done automatically done but could have a message that you have been scaled to the event. So if you are level 50 and ride into an active anchor set to level 22, you would be level 25 so long as you were in the radius of the dolmen, defined as at minimum a few meters over the longest ranged attack in the game. Your stats would be reduced to a level 25 equivalent, the inverse of how they calculate a higher level equivalent of stats for DLC.

(In the other game if you are too low level, you can stay but you get less XP and will probably die. ESO already scales xp based on how far over or under you are so that low levels can't teleport to a friend in a high level area and get ridiculous amounts of xp from grouping with the higher level character versus higher level mobs.)