Official Feedback Thread for Combat Animation Prioritization

ZOS_GinaBruno

This is the official feedback thread for Combat Animation Prioritization. We adjusted the combat animation priority so that you will see impacts and effects for each ability and attack fired when played in rapid succession, without it affecting DPS. Blocking mechanics have been excluded from this change based on feedback from the last PTS testing cycle.

Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

• Now that we’ve made some additional changes since the last PTS cycle, how was the overall responsiveness?
• How does everything feel compared to what’s currently on the Live megaservers? What about since the last PTS cycle?
• Were there any specific attacks or actions that could be canceled so they didn’t play?
• How does block casting feel overall?
• Do you have any other general feedback?

silky_soft

I got stuck in lethal arrow 3 times now. Can't skill, block, dodge or sprint. Had to run into fishes to die. Shield charge while I was in the cast seem to be the cause.

There is something wrong with shield charge. Works to well, like 100% root when it was 'fixed' last time.

mrdavis1118ub17_ESO

The old bow light attack bug is back, where it gets stuck doing light attacks. ie. fire once and it keeps firing on its own. Overload light attacks are still bugged, where they randomly stop working until you block to get unstuck, so very clunky. Block itself has become unresponsive at times, outside of lag issues. Pretty much everyone dueling on PTS (that ive talked to or watched stream) has noticed unpredictable block behavior.

It is overall a better attempt then the last PTS round, but still feels inconsistent.

Gilliamtherogue

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

This is the official feedback thread for Combat Animation Prioritization. We adjusted the combat animation priority so that you will see impacts and effects for each ability and attack fired when played in rapid succession, without it affecting DPS. Blocking mechanics have been excluded from this change based on feedback from the last PTS testing cycle.

Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

• Now that we’ve made some additional changes since the last PTS cycle, how was the overall responsiveness?
• How does everything feel compared to what’s currently on the Live megaservers? What about since the last PTS cycle?
• Were there any specific attacks or actions that could be canceled so they didn’t play?
• How does block casting feel overall?
• Do you have any other general feedback?

I've tested dual wielding and staff animations, and I have to say I'm impressed. I'm not exactly sure what you changed since you've reworked the issues that you tried to implement in Thieves Guild, but everything I've used feels so much cleaner to perform and watch. I haven't had any issues losing light attacks like before, the new animations seem intuitive if you understand how weaving works, and overall things feel faster to perform.

Compared to Live and the previous TG PTS, this feels like a much more polished game in combat. Live doesn't have *too* many issues with abilities, with the exception of staves. Destro staves have been getting worse and worse on Live, locking in heavy attacks, shooting incorrect targets, and sometimes not even working at all when weaving. On PTS I haven't had any of these issues, but it was even worse on the TG PTS than it was live.

Since I haven't tried blockcasting, so I'll return once I've gotten more game play in and comment on that. I haven't noticed any animations locking up, but I can't say I've gone through everything and tested it in more heated combat with more stuff going on.

Anyways, great job with this, I'll return once I've gotten more stuff in and make sure to check back in PTS build updates to see if anything changes.

LadyNalcarya

mrdavis1118ub17_ESO wrote: »

The old bow light attack bug is back, where it gets stuck doing light attacks. ie. fire once and it keeps firing on its own. Overload light attacks are still bugged, where they randomly stop working until you block to get unstuck, so very clunky. Block itself has become unresponsive at times, outside of lag issues. Pretty much everyone dueling on PTS (that ive talked to or watched stream) has noticed unpredictable block behavior.

It is overall a better attempt then the last PTS round, but still feels inconsistent.

This, pretty much.
Especially agree about the block.

Kas

It felt absolutely terrible. But i'd attribute this to 250ping compared to 70-90 I am used to on Europe servers so it's hard to give concrete feedback.
At least the new DK poison dots are terrible to see (and especially hear, i hear nothing at all) if you apply them within a light attack->skill->bash rotation. With the high ping and no add-ons I was usually unable to tell if they actually went through or not

Seri

I felt they were a mixed bag here. Overall I think things felt a little more fluid however every couple of light-attack puncturing sweep weaves now and then it seemed like my character was getting stuck on the followthrough animation, which meant I was either casting things I couldn't see almost felt like skills weren't even firing at all. This seemed particularly evident when it looked like weapon or posion proc'd but I'll need to check properly over. Didn't check staves though and I'm not a bow or 2H user.

The Uninvited

Less clunky than previous attempt, still feels a bit sluggish. Also, sometimes skill aren't firing at all or it looks like that. And I'm using n-key rollover.

potirondb16_ESO

Did try on Stamplar, light and medium weave and those seems to be an issue, I sometime got stuck in light or medium weave priorisation and was unable to pursue with more bitting jabs... so not sure about this one.

SRIBES

It's terrible. My abilities miss fire constantly/don't hit the target. The combat feels clunky and almost laggy, I hope this change is reverted.

KenaPKK

Same. Combat feels sluggish and clunky. Block does not work sometimes, I've gotten stuck in animations, had some abilities not go off when I used them, had other abilities go off on their own... I hope the change is reverted too.

Oh, and revert the change to snares while jumping or whatever it was while you're at it. All movement in general feels sticky and sluggish, and I get stuck on rocks a lot more now. I would rather people be able to jump around and avoid some of a snare than this... Honestly snares are too strong anyway.

MoreDino

Did notice that some attacks weren't going off while using my 2h axe light/medium attacks. Reminded me of using staves on the live server where the action would stick and do a fully charged attack if I didn't block to cancel out of it. Please stop messing with animations.

Yoyuyi999

It's horrible. Please revert the change, it makes the skills feel way too clunky. Sometimes the animations of your skill will like be overrided by another animation. For example, I use a Light Attack, Siphoning Attacks, Light Attack Relentless Focus and sometimes when I proc the Siphoning Attacks my chracter would just sit there then after I use my relentless, it looks like I used both Siphoning and Relentless at the same time (My character would be in the animation of a light attack but the particles from siphoning attacks and relentless would also play out at the same time)

Just stop messing with animations and please fix this mess.

Enraged_Tiki_Torch

General Feedback? Yeah, do something else. It is nice you are trying to reach some common ground on this issue but to be frank, your wasting your time.

You are either Pro- or Anti- Animation Cancelling. I can care less whether Animation Cancelling is removed or not. However this is the second time you have pursued this endeavor and the best I can put together is it wasn't as bad as it was before. It's still clunky and unresponsive because your trying to bend the rules of time here. Maybe your goal can be achieved but honestly I think your efforts would be better placed in fixing long standing issues that demand a hell of a lot more attention than this.

The only players that care about animation cancelling are players who are trying to get the best performance out of their character. I believe this should be encouraged but not mandatory, however when one player wants to rank themselves against their peers. Skill should be the determining factor and Animation Cancelling demands a deeper level of skill and understanding from the player.

This is a choice that each player should make for themselves (definitely not for others). It is never been mandatory for a player to cancel animations if they feel its unnatural to the way they want to experience the game while still experiencing everything the game has to offer.

There is good reason to want the game to look more natural as some animation cancelling looks unnatural. However, the ones that look unnatural are Block canceling and Swap cancelling as in these cases; only a snip of each animation is played. Light, Medium, and Heavy animation cancelling (w/o Block or Swap cancelling succeeding) looks and feels like one attack although both the weapon attack and the ability cast trigger. Because the focus here is the latter case, I have strong thoughts on how poor of a pursuit this is. Seems like Zenimax is willing to go and screw up the combat system just to bend to the will of people who are putting their own interest before the game as though they never had the choice to begin with.

The players who are complaining about animation cancelling fall into 2 groups:

One group is filled with people who simply refuse to learn the game (yes..L2P I said it) but at the same time want to rank themselves evenly with their peers. For whatever reason they refuse to learn animation cancelling, so they will do everything they can to keep people from being able to do something they can't do themselves.

In their delusional realm of reality, they really think if they get animation cancelling removed from the game; they will be on equal footing with those players who they claim are "cheating". Life doesn't work that way as the people who are willing to learn and always strive to be better will always be better than the person who puts out no effort except trying to bring others down to their level.

The second group is a hypocritical bunch. They say it breaks immersion but I will make a bet with you. Check those people's account and see how many add-ons they run. Bet you more than half of them who claim it is immersion breaking are running quite a few immersion breaking add-ons. They don't care about immersion, but they know Zenimax has spoken about wanting the game to feel immersive. They are subversively pulling your strings. They share some of the jealousy that spews from people in group one but they are a little more malicious about it by hiding their true intentions.

The last group of people are *** for bringing up the issue. If I animation cancel and Bob over there doesn't, how am I ruining his enjoyment of the game by animation cancelling? He is not looking at my monitor and being forced to watch me do immersion breaking tactics. He can choose not to animation cancel. He can let his animations play all the way through before activating another if that is his cup of tea. Bob is a *** who wants to ruin how I play the game. Plain and simple.

Most people fall into group one as like most other complaints on the forums. They got outplayed by another player in the game and this is their excuse. The whole world has to know cause they are the center of the universe. That it isn't there fault, it's the game's fault for having such a broken mechanic.

All 3 of these groups should not by any means influence the future of any project. There ideas always backfire when pursued because they lack the positive foundation and wisdom to see how their ideas will play out. I have never seen any game (as example) concede to such ideas and come out better for it. This will definitely be the case here as screwing with your combat system will further deteriorate the playability of this game. Please don't let money misguide you here...

MichYodias

I really prefer the old old animations and no cool down on bar swapping. When breathe of life was all rainbowy, the game was most responsive.

Yoyuyi999

Please revert the change, it literally ruins combat. I can't tell what I'm doing half the time and just feels so clunky.

John_1999

Pls don't add this to the game.
I've tested it, I don't fell I have full control over my char.

John_1999

The thing is, the combat system in TESO is unique. A lot people play this game especially pvp because of the combat system.
That is what makes TESO different from other mmos. You change one of the major parts of the game in a negative way. The combat system works well on live, why changing something that works and the most people like in this game.

Pleas do never ever add this to live game.

Jade1986

KenaPKK wrote: »

Same. Combat feels sluggish and clunky. Block does not work sometimes, I've gotten stuck in animations, had some abilities not go off when I used them, had other abilities go off on their own... I hope the change is reverted too.

Oh, and revert the change to snares while jumping or whatever it was while you're at it. All movement in general feels sticky and sluggish, and I get stuck on rocks a lot more now. I would rather people be able to jump around and avoid some of a snare than this... Honestly snares are too strong anyway.

I notice this stuff on live atm period. O.o I dont think its just the pts.

Tillalarrien

If its not a major improvement on the previous version, and judging by the comments here it isn't, then I would also suggest abandoning the project and focus your efforts elsewhere (adding more flaggs to IC for example )

Animation prioritisation is not something I am even considering a problem in this game atm.
Either remove or keep canceling, but don't change it in the way that will make the game unplayable/less enjoyable for next year until you get around to fixing it.

Changing it this way won't stop people that are complaining against animation canceling! It will just get people (the huge majority of the player base that are perfectly fine with how animation work right now) to complain in-game and on rant-threads about it feeling different, clunky and unresposive. Combat is major part of this game. If you change it for the worse, game whole game is changed for the worse..

While I am sure there is a way to improve on this so both players and devs are happy I think it would simply require to much time and resources to be worth it.

Players are happy with the state of animations like they are right now on live. So why, ZOS? Plys come to terms with the fact that this doesn't need changing and just let us be happy. Don't go changing things for the worse.

Helluin

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=em46ajNfuTU

This video was linked for another purpose on a Radiant Destruction topic but it shows also how are the animations (in this case Execute and Killer's Blade) with block casting.

It's really redundant to add any comment about how terrible become the animations.

Yes, it's really useful but... @Wrobel we can keep saying it's a matter of skill, it's necessary, it's indended, etc. but the reality is simply another one: the animations to allow this seem completely broken.
Not just the job of the animation team is ruined by it but it's disgusting to be seen.