Stamina NB: Shadowy Disquise or Dark Cloak?

kadar

Considering the recent changes to the Cloak ability: which morph are you Stamblades using these days and why? Include playstyle if relevant.

GreenSoup2HoT

Shadowy Disquise

the crit is nice. not gonna lie. snipe cloak snipe cloak is a great combo now.

if i was melee again i might think about picking up dark cloak.

crit > mitigation imo.

kadar

Dark Cloak

I play a melee NB build. My bow bar is more utility, DoT, and buffs, and my 2H bar is for damage. I've found that I'm getting only minimal benefit from the guaranteed crit, and my play style benefits more from the minor protection buff. I like to hang around in the fight, and like a little staying power that minor protection provides.

My reasoning is this:
1) My crit % is already quite high (around 65% w/ bow).
2) Can't crit shields.
3) I take a lot of damage being melee dps, so that 8% adds up.

Strider_Roshin

Neither. I swapped mine for siphoning attacks. Zero regrets.

Duiwel

Dark Cloak

I used SD on my magblade up until Sunday evening.

Dark Cloak on both NB's now experimenting on my Magblade.

but for the stamblade I will stick with Dark Cloak regardless I mean he is pure DW daggers...

WillhelmBlack

Shadowy Disquise

I've always used it.

raasdal

Shadowy Disquise

I play no-cp so that is a no brainer. With about 25% crit chance on my main bar, the guaranteed crit is too good to say no to imo.

sluice

Shadowy Disquise

I'm using Shadowy Disquise, now that Dark Cloak was nerfed..

But since, I switched my build to 100% melee (DW/TH), I think the new Dark Cloak could be more beneficial.
I'm currently in the high 50/low 60 crit % unbuffed.

tonemd

Shadowy Disquise

The_Outsider wrote: »

I play a melee NB build. My bow bar is more utility, DoT, and buffs, and my 2H bar is for damage. I've found that I'm getting only minimal benefit from the guaranteed crit, and my play style benefits more from the minor protection buff. I like to hang around in the fight, and like a little staying power that minor protection provides.

My reasoning is this:
1) My crit % is already quite high (around 65% w/ bow).
2) Can't crit shields.
3) I take a lot of damage being melee dps, so that 8% adds up.

Hmm, been debating this. If you treat SD as a crit buff only, you could just weave it into your attacks (if you're 2H I'm sure you're running WB). You could potentially save any CP put in to crit % for something else and could change your mundus to either damage, crit damage, or recovery.

Is your build built around 2 out of 3 attacks critting?

KundaliniHero

I would say neither; unless you are a Wood Elf or Khajiit going for a one shot gank build or you want to be hated more than a sorc by running an aim shot spam build, outside of those possibilities I dont see either morph being all that useful. As a NB your crit should already be high due to passives. When it comes to magicka dumps for a stamina NB nothing beats Mass Hysteria, period. I would rather get more casts with that than crowding my bar with an ability that is no longer sure of what its supposed to be. I would however suggest trying Siphoning Attacks, this skill is absolutely superb for sustain in PVP especially for stamina based classes.

sluice

Shadowy Disquise

KundaliniHero wrote: »

I would say neither; unless you are a Wood Elf or Khajiit going for a one shot gank build or you want to be hated more than a sorc by running an aim shot spam build, outside of those possibilities I dont see either morph being all that useful. As a NB your crit should already be high due to passives. When it comes to magicka dumps for a stamina NB nothing beats Mass Hysteria, period. I would rather get more casts with that than crowding my bar with an ability that is no longer sure of what its supposed to be. I would however suggest trying Siphoning Attacks, this skill is absolutely superb for sustain in PVP especially for stamina based classes.

Just like Streak for a Sorc, cloaking is not only an offensive ability but also a defensive ability!
The amount of time I still survive a fight because I managed to cloak myself out of it...

I cannot imagine playing my NB without Shadowy Disguise/Dark Cloak.
This build is all about sneaking around and even though I'm a Wood Elf Stamina Vampire Nightblade,
I still have enough Magicka to efficiently use:
-My cloak
-Mass Hysteria
-Piercing Mark
-Double Take

KundaliniHero

sluice wrote: »

KundaliniHero wrote: »

I would say neither; unless you are a Wood Elf or Khajiit going for a one shot gank build or you want to be hated more than a sorc by running an aim shot spam build, outside of those possibilities I dont see either morph being all that useful. As a NB your crit should already be high due to passives. When it comes to magicka dumps for a stamina NB nothing beats Mass Hysteria, period. I would rather get more casts with that than crowding my bar with an ability that is no longer sure of what its supposed to be. I would however suggest trying Siphoning Attacks, this skill is absolutely superb for sustain in PVP especially for stamina based classes.

Just like Streak for a Sorc, cloaking is not only an offensive ability but also a defensive ability!
The amount of time I still survive a fight because I managed to cloak myself out of it...

I cannot imagine playing my NB without Shadowy Disguise/Dark Cloak.
This build is all about sneaking around and even though I'm a Wood Elf Stamina Vampire Nightblade,
I still have enough Magicka to efficiently use:
-My cloak
-Mass Hysteria
-Piercing Mark
-Double Take

Well I would say as it stands streak is a far superior skill because it stuns, does modest damage and can't be nullified. You can't stop a Sorc from streaking if he wants to streak but you most definitely can stop a NB from cloaking. Cloak regardless of morph has a 101 ways to counter/nullify it, Radiant Magelight alone has made hit and run shenanigans a thing of the past, yes its that good. Like I said "unless you are a Wood Elf or Khajiit going for a one shot gank build" than its nowhere as good as it once was, for me atleast. Then again my playstyle was already phasing it out before TG hit and honestly i've never looked back. I will bar it though from time to time for the sewers to avoid aggroing mobs and get into gank position but that's about it.

Dont get me wrong I dont fault you for using it though especially with vampire, being able to move through the sewers faster than any other class while invisible is fun as hell, there is something to be said for speed but I have found that when going up against experienced players that whole approach can gimp you in a protracted fight, but to each his own.

kadar

Dark Cloak

@KundaliniHero , I agree w/ almost everything you pointed out. Streak is the bomb. Cloak isn't as good as it was. 101 ways to counter Cloak. However,

1) I've never seen even a decent Nightblade without a morph of Shadow Cloak on a bar in PVP. While they may exist, the ones I've encountered lay in a line of corpses behind me.

2) Cloak is still BY FAR the strongest form of mitigation any Nightblade have access to, imo. On top of also being an extremely strong offensive tool (especially Shadowy Disquise morph). The passives activated w/ every cast of Cloak alone are enough reason to slot it, imo (+10% Weap/Spell dmg, Major Resolve + Major Ward, 3% Health).

3) Siphoning Attacks... I use this spell for PVE and I'm intrigued by the idea as it would allow me to run much lower regen and have much higher burst... But w/ my playstyle I see myself running out of Stam w/ a Siphoning setup mostly because as melee, my light attack weave is unreliable in PVP. BUT, maybe I could learn to use it. In that case....I still wouldn't drop Cloak.

4)

"I have found that when going up against experienced players that whole approach can gimp you in a protracted fight"

Totally agree. Many NBs I come across rely on Cloak as a security blanket. They don't know what to do when their "win" button isn't working.

kadar

Dark Cloak

@tonemd

tonemd wrote: »

The_Outsider wrote: »

I play a melee NB build. My bow bar is more utility, DoT, and buffs, and my 2H bar is for damage. I've found that I'm getting only minimal benefit from the guaranteed crit, and my play style benefits more from the minor protection buff. I like to hang around in the fight, and like a little staying power that minor protection provides.

My reasoning is this:
1) My crit % is already quite high (around 65% w/ bow).
2) Can't crit shields.
3) I take a lot of damage being melee dps, so that 8% adds up.

Hmm, been debating this. If you treat SD as a crit buff only, you could just weave it into your attacks (if you're 2H I'm sure you're running WB). You could potentially save any CP put in to crit % for something else and could change your mundus to either damage, crit damage, or recovery.

Is your build built around 2 out of 3 attacks critting?

I actually don't WB. I find I do more DPS w/ Surprise Attack + it suits my play style more.
Really interesting point about the CPs: it would allow my to reallocate about (checking) 37 points in Ritual tree... EXCEPT (ugh) Precise Strikes also affects my vigor/rally healing...
Mundus is Warrior.

Is your build built around 2 out of 3 attacks critting?

Yes, my crit is typically between 53 and 65% crit chance, so that would be 2 out of 3-ish.