Fengrush's new video was depressing

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

audrieltheelf wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

audrieltheelf wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

audrieltheelf wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Ah so he is upset they didnt pay him to stream lol.

I'm assuming (making an ass of you and me) you're one of those that says "L2P" or "Git Gud" to someone asking a question in g/chat?

All he does is whine about how ESO bruised his ego. Noone cares what he thinks. Noone cares if he keeps playing or not. He really should get over himself and stop acting like hes some special snowflake. Hes nothing. He streeams a video game. If I was ESO Id ignore some whiny narcissist like him too.

It would behoove them to pay attention to someone that streams their video game. Those who watch, and follow him religiously, are going to follow him to the end of the game. So to say they shouldn't listen to him basically says they shouldn't listen to any of their players. /facepalm

I had never even heard of this guy before today. Please give me a break. He doesnt speak for me or anyone but himself.

Never said he spoke for you but, like it or not, he does speak for people who agree with him. I stated I didn't like him but that doesn't mean I can't agree with him. Does he act childish more often than he should? Yes. Could he have said it better and with fewer cuss words? I'm sure he could have. Does he have a point? Damn right he does. I mean no disrespect to you or your play style but to say ZoS shouldn't listen to him is saying they shouldn't listen to anyone. Everyone has a right to their opinion, like it or not.

And on that note, goodnight!

He doesnt have any points. His only point was that he is upset they dont ask him what to do. When he puts out videos they dont do what he says. AOE caps for example. They explained numerous times why its not as easy as he thinks. Yet he sits and whines because his huge ego (stroked by you) says he speaks for more than just himself. Showing his lack of intelligence even more he does nothing buyt drop f bombs entirely. He even says most of the people who watch his stream do not play anymore.

moesmaker

This.

If you dislike something so much that you dedicate a 30 mins vid on it, just quit!

Phinix1

moesmaker wrote: »

'They don't give a *** about me'. Well that's it in a nutshell indeed. Why should they (whoever 'they' may be at ZOS)?

'They' make a game and 'they' make it like 'they' want it. If you don't like it, move on man, don't sit for 30 mins whining and ranting feeling sorry for yourself.

It isn't quite that simple though. The point I think you are missing is that some people put a lot of time and effort and yes money into promoting and supporting this game, doing streams, writing addons, creating community content, etc.

Why should ZOS care about those people? Because those content creators are what make communities happen. They are what creates the long term success of the game.

Look at Skyrim. Do you honestly think it would be doing as well as it has for as many years as it has if addon authors weren't making new content for it, constantly upgrading the engine, adding new value to the IP? Not a chance. Companies need to learn to listen to these people, not demonize them when they aren't immediately good for PR.

Constructive criticism is just that. But it is only constructive if the company is willing to listen.

I understand why the guy is a little pissed. Months and months go by without glaring bugs and balance issues being addressed, all the while these guys are basically doing your work for you telling you how to fix your own stuff.

What reason would any sane business have NOT to listen? Is it really pure ego?

If so those people need replaced as it is extremely unprofessional.

Wing

I love how people dis him and the video when all hes doing is talking about what is going on, a lot of what he is saying is just what is happened over the past months / years.

a lot of us are mad because we LOVE the game, not because we hate it, we want to see it get better and feel like nothing is happening.

-small incremental balance patches are not a new concept.
-content that's buggy as heck after being on a public test server for over a month should not happen.

and we are still missing some very small basic features after years. I support this game, I like ALOT of aspects of this game, but there are some things that are still just no good.

and "just leave then" is not an acceptable response for a company that wants to stay in business, let alone an MMO.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

Ive been saying since they put out that flop of a pvp expansion they need to stop listening to these friggin streamers and start listening to people who play the game and have fun. Chasing these guys who honestly will never be pleased is not going to work. Then the guy has the nerve to belittle ZOS, belittle the head guy and then wonders why they dont talk to him. Its not their EGO its HIS.

moesmaker

Well actually it IS that simple, Phinix.

I don't see why people that put time in playing a game DESERVE (Feng's words) more attention than other players. It is YOUR choice to put your free time in making addons and videos, don't expect anything in return for that, no one asked you to do it.

And BTW: who is demonizing who?

Selstad

Have to say I'm a bit amused at the "the game killed itself" argumentation going on in many of these threads, and the promise of gloom and doom in the very near future. It's amusing because the same exact things were said back in 2014 when the game was released, heck it was even said during the beta that the game was killing itself, that it was going to die rather quickly and all that.

Same thing has been said about other MMOs as well, WoW per example has been dying so many times and been promised a swift doom for years now per example. Thing is, there are those that don't like the game and those that do like the game. The game will continue to go on as long as there are players to play it. Forecasting doom every month or so, really doesn't cut it. It's like those with a cardboard cut-out sign saying "The end is near!", they're still saying it and one day they will eventually be right, but the fact that we're still here means they're not right yet

moesmaker

There was even a thread that was called 'The day ESO dies...' Or something. Was very funny also.

Pallmor

I like most of Fengrush's videos, and his appearances on a lot of ESO shows (like Sypher's) are great. But the guy focuses on some VERY specialized builds (in particular his PvP Stamina Sorc). It's not really reasonable to expect ZOS to have the resources to cater to everyone. And he is a far outlier compared to average ESO players. You can't create a specialized and unusual build (no offense to stam sorc fans out there, but sorcs were just never meant for stam) and then complain that ZOS isn't doing more to keep you happy. Fengrush is in an even smaller percentile of players than Deltia and Sypher, and 99.9% of everyday players probably couldn't give a rat's posterior about how ZOS is treating min-max/solo-PvP/stam-sorcs.

Phinix1

moesmaker wrote: »

Well actually it IS that simple, Phinix.

I don't see why people that put time in playing a game DESERVE (Feng's words) more attention than other players. It is YOUR choice to put your free time in making addons and videos, don't expect anything in return for that, no one asked you to do it.

It's as simple as you choose to make it, man.

I'm not saying people that put a lot of time and effort theory crafting solutions to a game's problems deserve more attention from developers because they put in lots of time.

They deserve developer attention because what they are working out and offering for free is good for the health of THEIR PRODUCT!

Maybe that wording is a little more clear?

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

Phinix1 wrote: »

moesmaker wrote: »

Well actually it IS that simple, Phinix.

I don't see why people that put time in playing a game DESERVE (Feng's words) more attention than other players. It is YOUR choice to put your free time in making addons and videos, don't expect anything in return for that, no one asked you to do it.

It's as simple as you choose to make it, man.

I'm not saying people that put a lot of time and effort theory crafting solutions to a game's problems deserve more attention from developers because they put in lots of time.

They deserve developer attention because what they are working out and offering for free is good for the health of THEIR PRODUCT!

Maybe that wording is a little more clear?

Good for the health of their product in your opinion only.

moesmaker

Loud and clear sir!

But still, it is their choice to do so, there are absolutely no strings attached, no commitment from the company that makes the game.

And to be honest, I think awesome addon-developers are heroes, ranting streamers not.

Phinix1 wrote: »

moesmaker wrote: »

Well actually it IS that simple, Phinix.

I don't see why people that put time in playing a game DESERVE (Feng's words) more attention than other players. It is YOUR choice to put your free time in making addons and videos, don't expect anything in return for that, no one asked you to do it.

It's as simple as you choose to make it, man.

I'm not saying people that put a lot of time and effort theory crafting solutions to a game's problems deserve more attention from developers because they put in lots of time.

They deserve developer attention because what they are working out and offering for free is good for the health of THEIR PRODUCT!

Maybe that wording is a little more clear?

Phinix1

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Good for the health of their product in your opinion only.

Please, let's not make this another PVE vs. PVP issue. There is no reason why a good MMO can't do both reasonably well.

Certainly no one could deny that balance and bug fixes are good for EVERYONE.

People testing and finding bugs on the PTS, and people theorycrafting fixes for balance issues through real-world testing of builds in combat scenarios, are essentially trying to help ZOS get the ball rolling on that.

Anyone who has been around a while and seen how long it takes ZOS to patch balance issues and bugs compared to other companies knows they need all the help they can get.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Wing wrote: »

and "just leave then" is not an acceptable response for a company that wants to stay in business, let alone an MMO.

It is a perfectly acceptable response (but keep in mind that it is not ZOS' response here, just the response from some of us).
Each company has a target audience and should stick with it. Why ? Because you cannot please everyone, and if you try to, you'll waste your energy (resources) and end up not pleasing anyone, or pleasing an audience that is not sufficient enough (quantity-wise) to keep your business profitable.

It seems pretty obvious to me that ZOS started with two target audiences (MMO-players and TES-players) without clearly knowing which one to target. Thus the feeling of "uncompleteness" the game showed at launch, and the issues with balancing difficulty, or enforcing group play (Craglorn) vs. solo, and such.
Now it seems also obvious that ZOS has chosen the "TES-players" part of the audience as the main target of the game. With IC for small-scale / solo PvP, Orsinium and Thieves' Guild being very solo-play oriented, and scaling, it all points towards ZOS' target being players who enjoy visiting, farming, questing, enjoying the landscape and the lore, and NOT the hard-core min-maxers nor the competitive PvPers.

Whether you like it or not, and if you don't, just LEAVE.

Because ZOS cannot please everyone and has to make choices. And did.

What Fengrush is doing is ranting for not getting meat in a restaurant that has chosen to be vegetarian.

.

vamp_emily

moesmaker wrote: »

This.

If you dislike something so much that you dedicate a 30 mins vid on it, just quit!

I think allot of people miss the true message behind these negative videos/posts.

People really love playing this game and don't want to stop playing it but update after update ZOS is just forcing people to move on to another game.

This game has so much potential to last a very long time.

Cuyler

If you're having PvP problems I feel bad for you, son
I've got 99 problems but FENGRUSH ain't one

Phinix1

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Each company has a target audience and should stick with it. Why ? Because you cannot please everyone, and if you try to, you'll waste your energy (resources) and end up not pleasing anyone, or pleasing an audience that is not sufficient enough (quantity-wise) to keep your business profitable.

With respect, I believe your logic to be flawed.

There is simply no reason why a good MMO company cannot deliver BOTH PVE and PVP content of a reasonable quality.

If we were talking about an MMO company also attempting to excel in the social media genre inside their game platform, that might be one thing. Obviously trying to please people that like social media will clash with gamers who don't want advertisements and popup notifications plastered all over their immersion like a billboard. The two are largely exclusive.

But PVP and PVE? There is no good reason these can't go hand-in-hand.

It would be like saying a chef should focus on vegetables because incorporating meat into their stir fry would be trying to please all the people at once and the quality of their meal must necessarily suffer.

The game engine is the same. The abilities are the same. If anything, PVP reveals balance issues and bugs that also exist in PVE but might go overlooked due to the lower-impact nature of PVE combat.

sekou_trayvond

Buh bye.

30 minutes of a childish, incoherent, swearing, and uninformed streamer.

Like a ginger Angry Joe.

moesmaker

vamp_emily wrote: »

moesmaker wrote: »

This.

If you dislike something so much that you dedicate a 30 mins vid on it, just quit!

I think allot of people miss the true message behind these negative videos/posts.

People really love playing this game and don't want to stop playing it but update after update ZOS is just forcing people to move on to another game.

This game has so much potential to last a very long time.

I noticed the message behind the video, I am just amazed that someone puts 30 mins of his precious time into this.

Maybe ZOS is forcing SOME people to move on, but it is certainly not me and I wonder how many actually move on.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

Its like walking into a top 40 dance bar and telling them you want them to change to country music. Noone wants the change but dag nabbit they dont know who you think you are! You stream about stuff and post on yelp! They should listen to you.

Phinix1

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Its like walking into a top 40 dance bar and telling them you want them to change to country music. Noone wants the change but dag nabbit they dont know who you think you are! You stream about stuff and post on yelp! They should listen to you.

That statement would make any sense at all if this "top 40 dance bar" sold themselves with massive promotional hype videos touting their revolutionary take on country music.

darkstar2084

everyone gets burnt out sooner or later. I play both pve and pvp i think there is more longevity in doing that than just playing mainly one. For me I can no longer be bothered moving to a new mmo. I can't bring myself doing the the grind anymore, so will just play this more casually.

Jhunn

sekou_trayvond wrote: »

Buh bye.

30 minutes of a childish, incoherent, swearing, and uninformed streamer.

Like a ginger Angry Joe.

At least you're being a mature and intelligent asset to the discussion.

Oh wait.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

Phinix1 wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Its like walking into a top 40 dance bar and telling them you want them to change to country music. Noone wants the change but dag nabbit they dont know who you think you are! You stream about stuff and post on yelp! They should listen to you.

That statement would make any sense at all if this "top 40 dance bar" sold themselves with massive promotional hype videos touting their revolutionary take on country music.

Ive played this game since the beta and at no time did they ever call their pvp revolutionary. Nor did they pump the game up to be a pvp game. So the analogy applies. You walk into a bar full of casuals and start cussing demanding everyone listen to you even tho you are not a casual. You make these outlandish demands and then are ignored. So you go outside (because they finally got tired of you and tossed you out) and start ranting about how noone else should go in.

OdinForge

Like it or not.

This is a game for casuals now, people interested in serious PvP should look elsewhere.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Phinix1 wrote: »

But PVP and PVE? There is no good reason these can't go hand-in-hand.

MMMhhhhh ???? Really ?

Look at how these two love each other. Really.
Like PvEers in IC love being PvPed by people they automatically call "grievers/gankers". Like PvPers in IC love being around PvEers which they usually call "filthy casual farmers", and how much they enjoy having mobs interfering with their PvP fights.

Look at all (well... not all.. that would take you months of reading...) of threads complaining that skills have been altered for the sake of PvP and destroy balance in PvE... and vice-versa...

Regardless... my argument was not centered around a PvP vs. PvE split, but around a "MMO" mentality versus a "RPG" mentality. Which includes (but is not restricted to) opposite attitudes such as solo vs. group play, min-maxing vs. diversity, and personal enjoyment vs. competition.

.

starlizard70ub17_ESO

People tend to forget that streamers like FENGRUSH and others make money off their streaming pages from hits on that page by their "followers" So in a real sense they really don't care about the game they're playing, other then the amount of money their streaming pages make. That's why they whine when things don't go their way. Streamers don't care about making your gaming experiance better, they only care about making THEIR gaming experiance better. The game will be better off without them. (Now the players who make video game guilds to help other players are great and add to the game community, FENGRUSH and his type don't add anything to the game.)

SemiD4rkness

starlizard70ub17_ESO wrote: »

People tend to forget that streamers like FENGRUSH and others make money off their streaming pages from hits on that page by their "followers" So in a real sense they really don't care about the game they're playing, other then the amount of money their streaming pages make. That's why they whine when things don't go their way. Streamers don't care about making your gaming experiance better, they only care about making THEIR gaming experiance better. The game will be better off without them. (Now the players who make video game guilds to help other players are great and add to the game community, FENGRUSH and his type don't add anything to the game.)

It's not just the streamers, the best pvp guilds are all leaving the game. Casual won, let them keep this boring quest simulator to themselves. They could literally make this game a single player game and 90% of the community (CASUALS) wouldn't even bother.

SeptimusDova

@Fengrush wasn't the only streamer to move on. Three others have done so . They just did so in a more classy less F-Bomb way.Brother we get it and if you read this some of us understand your frustration and your rant is your opinion. It's your stream and your you tube. Please in the future use less profanity; not for zos but for us.

now a question for the masses

We can level to VR16 we can craft gear to VR16. It becomes more complicated and tedious to do so right now if a person has not purchased a DLC that has the materials. Instead that person must rely on guild stores to procure their mats. Was this intentional did they just put the last two levels behind a DLC convenience gate? Does Craglorn Scale to VR16? What scales to VR16 for the Non-DLC box buyer?

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO

SemiD4rkness wrote: »

starlizard70ub17_ESO wrote: »

People tend to forget that streamers like FENGRUSH and others make money off their streaming pages from hits on that page by their "followers" So in a real sense they really don't care about the game they're playing, other then the amount of money their streaming pages make. That's why they whine when things don't go their way. Streamers don't care about making your gaming experiance better, they only care about making THEIR gaming experiance better. The game will be better off without them. (Now the players who make video game guilds to help other players are great and add to the game community, FENGRUSH and his type don't add anything to the game.)

It's not just the streamers, the best pvp guilds are all leaving the game. Casual won, let them keep this boring quest simulator to themselves. They could literally make this game a single player game and 90% of the community (CASUALS) wouldn't even bother.

People leave games all the time. Noone cares.