32 bit vs 64 bit, what is the difference?

ParaNostram

Hey, so I'm not very good at computer stuff, just a fair disclaimer, I don't even know enough to know how much I don't know. That being said, I have a few questions to pose with the hope that somebody with greater knowledge could tell me...

One, how does the game change with the implementation of a 64 bit client?

Two, does running a 64 bit client as opposed to a 32 bit client improve over all game performance? I want to do whatever I can to get every last inch of performance I can so I can participate in the epic PvP battles with as little trouble as possible.

Nestor

64 bit allows for more memory space to be addressed. This can result in more stability because memory caches and arrays are not filled up as fast. Also a 64 bit program can do more data processing and number crunching per CPU cycle, but that all depends on how things were coded as to how much that is a factor. It can also make for a more efficient code, as evidenced by the smaller EXE size.

There may be other differences but it all depends on the programs and how they are coded as to what they are.

Tryxus

Difference is 32

nine9six

Tryxus wrote: »

Difference is 32

haha beat me to it.

Thybrinena

Tryxus wrote: »

Difference is 32

lol
For me the 64 bit client isn't working as well as the 32 bit yet but I'm sure things will smooth out.

ParaNostram

Nestor wrote: »

64 bit allows for more memory space to be addressed. This can result in more stability because memory caches and arrays are not filled up as fast. Also a 64 bit program can do more data processing and number crunching per CPU cycle, but that all depends on how things were coded as to how much that is a factor. It can also make for a more efficient code, as evidenced by the smaller EXE size.

There may be other differences but it all depends on the programs and how they are coded as to what they are.

I'll be honest, I don't understand what you said. Would it make my game run smoother//get more FPS?

bikerangelo

ParaNostram wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

64 bit allows for more memory space to be addressed. This can result in more stability because memory caches and arrays are not filled up as fast. Also a 64 bit program can do more data processing and number crunching per CPU cycle, but that all depends on how things were coded as to how much that is a factor. It can also make for a more efficient code, as evidenced by the smaller EXE size.

There may be other differences but it all depends on the programs and how they are coded as to what they are.

I'll be honest, I don't understand what you said. Would it make my game run smoother//get more FPS?

Ideally, yes, but the 64 bit version is very buggy and you have to dig through the game's program files to get it running.

ParaNostram

bikerangelo wrote: »

ParaNostram wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

64 bit allows for more memory space to be addressed. This can result in more stability because memory caches and arrays are not filled up as fast. Also a 64 bit program can do more data processing and number crunching per CPU cycle, but that all depends on how things were coded as to how much that is a factor. It can also make for a more efficient code, as evidenced by the smaller EXE size.

There may be other differences but it all depends on the programs and how they are coded as to what they are.

I'll be honest, I don't understand what you said. Would it make my game run smoother//get more FPS?

Ideally, yes, but the 64 bit version is very buggy and you have to dig through the game's program files to get it running.

Alright I'll wait for the bugs to be fixed then make the jump, or I'll just install 64bit on my next machine.

Ommy71

64 bit, if you like Deep Purple.

KhajitFurTrader

ParaNostram wrote: »

I'll be honest, I don't understand what you said. Would it make my game run smoother//get more FPS?

The latter, not necessarily. Biggest advantage is better stability through more usable memory, as @Nestor has already said. When the Orsinium/Wrothgar DLC was released, the devs talked about how they almost hit a limit in how much graphical stuff they could put into a single region of the game. Going 64-bit on the client removes this limit, setting the game up for the future, with many more awesome zones to come.

filthymushroom

Nestor wrote: »

64 bit allows for more memory space to be addressed. This can result in more stability because memory caches and arrays are not filled up as fast. Also a 64 bit program can do more data processing and number crunching per CPU cycle, but that all depends on how things were coded as to how much that is a factor. It can also make for a more efficient code, as evidenced by the smaller EXE size.

There may be other differences but it all depends on the programs and how they are coded as to what they are.

In theory this means the game should run smoother because it uses memory more efficient. Also in ESO the CPU is the bottleneck in situations with a lot happening. So I expect that the 64bit client can do more calculations with the CPU in these cases and thus will be sending more data to the GPU.

In practice I expect that during heavy PvP or in Trials it will mean a higher minimum FPS. The maximum FPS wont be affected (much) I suppose. Overall this will mean the game should be better playable in busy situations. This is, off course, expecting that the 64bit client is properly optimized.

Kas

What's 64 bit vs 32bit?

the most important difference is that "addresses" (and hardware stuff like "registers", "busses", etc) are 64 bit instead of 32bit.
Your pc can have data in memory but it needs to know where to find that data.
Therefore addresses are used.

Now, if such an address is only 32 bit long, it can have 2^32 different values. hence your pc can only accesses ~4billion different addresses and thus only 4GB of ram can effectively be used. with 2^64 possibilities you exceed everything that modern pc's could have be FAR.

The theoretical downside is that addresses are larger: i.e. in thery if your game has to remember x millions of addresses, a 64bit system needs more space for that.
However, in practice you need to keep in mind that hardware (and your operating system) has to be designed to handle 64bit. While it is backwards compatible, this usually involves a waste of some form. Thus those drawbacks are very subtle because every modern pc is on 64bit hardware, anyway.

This different hardware has more implications, though: The typical units used within a computation during single cpu cycle are larger. Simplified, your CPU adds two larger numbers in a single cycle (X GHz means X billion cycles per second).
Further, the 64bit mode has access to more registers (units were those numbers are stored during computations) This is an important part of it.


So what does it help us if ESO is 64bit now?

(minor)
It can use more memory now. It is a great thing if your computer has more ram so that programs do not have to load data from disk when many different programs are op. For a single application, like a game, t's great if you can preload (or keep) more data, but the game still has to be designed around it and since everybody has different amounts of available ram, good caching strategies often are non-trivial and in many scenarios just don't make sense. If you want to perform a complex computation on data of a certain size, more memory doesn't help you. Note: even with lots of memory a programmer does not want to be wasteful. This has implications for cache efficiency etc, but I won't go into detail here. All in all, ESO should not need 4GB of RAM and 64 bit is SIMPLY NOT NEEDED for that.

(major)
But if ESO is no longer a 64bit application, there is no need for the backwards compatibility and compilers, your operating system and hardware can do all their magic. Now this is fairly complicated, but in general you can think of it like this:
A programmer just writes a program that appears to do stuff within X CPU cycles (ofc nobody thinks of cycles directly but in abstraction but you can relate to them if you have to). Now modern compilers will produce very clever machine code that uses your hardware to its fullest and gets more than one thing done in a single cycle. This mostly relates to the larger number of available registers but there are also clever techniques to put use the larger units to just do two smaller things in parallel.

In summary:

The main reason for 64bit systems is to use more than 4GB of RAM.
This mostly concerns operating systems but also applications if they want to use more than 3GB themselves.
THIS IS NOT A FREE PERFORMANCE BOOST - and probably also the reason ESO was done in 32bit in the first place.
Just using more memory does not help - it's better avoided by clever code. I guess even our 64bit ESOs will rarely (never?) use mor than 4GB of RAM.

The secondary reason is to make full use of modern hardware and compilers. They do MAGIC (for 32bit and 64bit) that programmers do not even have to care about. In the 64bit world, compilers and hardware have more tools available and can perform even better. This is where we get the actual benefit from the change.

Mush55

32 bit works

Kas

Mush55 wrote: »

32 bit works

not true
(though this would actually be a difference ...)