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No cp duels
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Soulac✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Millerman34n wrote: »
Ressource management isn't possible with the build I use.
Most people will simply change some glyphs and run around with less dmg.
On the other hand shields nearly remain the same, so you can guess what will happen on the no CP campaign.
Whoever thought the no CP campaign is more or equally "balanced" than the one with CP will be disappointed anyway.
I think thats pretty much the point. U cant go into those tremendously high dmg builds anymore. I like the idea but it will surely have other balance issues. I think especially of battle roar. They simply cant balance cp and no cp.
Fights are near endless even though most run high damage builds.
It will be worse.R.I.P Dawnbreaker / Auriel´s Bow
Member of the Arena Guild and the overpowered Banana Squad.
Nathaerizh aka Cat - Nightblade V16 - EU
- Meow -3 -
LegendaryMage✭✭✭✭✭
✭mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »LegendaryMage wrote: »I agree with you Derra when you say that people will go for infinite sustain, I just don't see a problem there since most decent capped players at the moment (with top damage, keep in mind) are already doing that.
But here's what I don't understand. You agree that people will go for sustain and they will sacrifice damage for sustain. But you don't see problem with same sustain as live but lower damage?
If the sustain remains the same but the damage goes down, it's just a really long boring fight is it not? You can no longer burst people with combos, you have to really wait to drain their resources. Something they are trying hard to avoid by stacking regen/cost redux.
I personally fail to see the appeal.
I'll give you an example. My frag goes up to 14k or so on non-cp buffed fully. My harness is not even 6k and daedric ward buffed about 8.1k. If my frag is enough to strip down both these shields (more or less), what do you think happens to a sorc that has even less max magica than me (he's built for sustain) and has to take all of the damage arsenal at once?
He gets bursted and killed, which is exactly the thing that is harder to achieve on live because of all those other passives that help defense (hardy, elemental defender, bastion + infinite sustain vs a magica opponent for example). Think about it, on live it's all exaggarated so much that it gets to a point where 2 players cannot kill themselves for hours, until one makes a mistake and other one lands a lucky burst. On non-cp if you're built for too much sustain (or too much damage), you could and should pay a penalty for it when you get to fight a more balanced and optimized build.0 -
Soulac✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭LegendaryMage wrote: »mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »LegendaryMage wrote: »I agree with you Derra when you say that people will go for infinite sustain, I just don't see a problem there since most decent capped players at the moment (with top damage, keep in mind) are already doing that.
But here's what I don't understand. You agree that people will go for sustain and they will sacrifice damage for sustain. But you don't see problem with same sustain as live but lower damage?
If the sustain remains the same but the damage goes down, it's just a really long boring fight is it not? You can no longer burst people with combos, you have to really wait to drain their resources. Something they are trying hard to avoid by stacking regen/cost redux.
I personally fail to see the appeal.
I'll give you an example. My frag goes up to 14k or so on non-cp buffed fully. My harness is not even 6k and daedric ward buffed about 8.1k. If my frag is enough to strip down both these shields (more or less), what do you think happens to a sorc that has even less max magica than me (he's built for sustain) and has to take all of the damage arsenal at once?
He gets bursted and killed, which is exactly the thing that is harder to achieve on live because of all those other passives that help defense (hardy, elemental defender, bastion + infinite sustain vs a magica opponent for example). Think about it, on live it's all exaggarated so much that it gets to a point where 2 players cannot kill themselves for hours, until one makes a mistake and other one lands a lucky burst. On non-cp if you're built for too much sustain (or too much damage), you could and should pay a penalty for it when you get to fight a more balanced and optimized build.
Don't forget that the opponent will fight back and that you can't crit shields (your shard won't deal 14k uncrit).
R.I.P Dawnbreaker / Auriel´s Bow
Member of the Arena Guild and the overpowered Banana Squad.
Nathaerizh aka Cat - Nightblade V16 - EU
- Meow -0 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm looking forward to dueling on the no CP campaign and doing open world on the CP campaigns.
I'm just not a fan of 20minute+ duels with no sustain battle at all and it only revolving around who can land the biggest one-hit-wonder burst combo first.
It'll feel good to actually care about what abilities I cast and how I often I cast them again. at least in duels.
I don't recall any resource issues just before the champion system. If you think duels last for ever now, build for sustain with no damage CP and see how long it takes you to kill someone with 50% battle spirit mitigation.
Edited by Xeven on February 18, 2016 3:47PM0 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭1.5 can rot in hell.
1.5 was absolutely the closest we ever came to overall balance -- including all of its blemishes.
Every single patch has been worse.
Excepting 1.0, I think 1.7 was probably the low point of the game -- but the only reason 1.6 wasn't worse was b/c players didn't have enough CPs.
Says the DK.0 -
LegendaryMage✭✭✭✭✭
✭LegendaryMage wrote: »mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »LegendaryMage wrote: »I agree with you Derra when you say that people will go for infinite sustain, I just don't see a problem there since most decent capped players at the moment (with top damage, keep in mind) are already doing that.
But here's what I don't understand. You agree that people will go for sustain and they will sacrifice damage for sustain. But you don't see problem with same sustain as live but lower damage?
If the sustain remains the same but the damage goes down, it's just a really long boring fight is it not? You can no longer burst people with combos, you have to really wait to drain their resources. Something they are trying hard to avoid by stacking regen/cost redux.
I personally fail to see the appeal.
I'll give you an example. My frag goes up to 14k or so on non-cp buffed fully. My harness is not even 6k and daedric ward buffed about 8.1k. If my frag is enough to strip down both these shields (more or less), what do you think happens to a sorc that has even less max magica than me (he's built for sustain) and has to take all of the damage arsenal at once?
He gets bursted and killed, which is exactly the thing that is harder to achieve on live because of all those other passives that help defense (hardy, elemental defender, bastion + infinite sustain vs a magica opponent for example). Think about it, on live it's all exaggarated so much that it gets to a point where 2 players cannot kill themselves for hours, until one makes a mistake and other one lands a lucky burst. On non-cp if you're built for too much sustain (or too much damage), you could and should pay a penalty for it when you get to fight a more balanced and optimized build.
Don't forget that the opponent will fight back and that you can't crit shields (your shard won't deal 14k uncrit).
Everyone fights back, I'm just giving you an example that now damage can be more meaningful vs sustain. My 14k buffed tooltip gets absorbed by the shield 100% as there are no cp passives to help offset it. It's a non crit we're talking about here, and if it's a crit and you run out of shields, remind me, does the opponent take full crit damage? 0 -
themdogesbite✭✭✭✭✭
✭1.5 can rot in hell.
1.5 was absolutely the closest we ever came to overall balance -- including all of its blemishes.
Every single patch has been worse.
Excepting 1.0, I think 1.7 was probably the low point of the game -- but the only reason 1.6 wasn't worse was b/c players didn't have enough CPs.
Says the DK.
Honestly though, every class was way stronger then currently during 1.5 and all classes could do things similar to DK if built correctly.
From the duels i had on PTS with non cp, i just slammed on seducer with 3x cost reduct enchants and skoria. Most fights were pretty dissapointing and quite frankly very boring. I can see how someone is excited about this as a sorc however, the class is very strong in this enviorment.Edited by themdogesbite on February 18, 2016 3:18PM:]2 -
ksimpscnub18_ESO✭✭✭Argonian Sorc master race.Tikijim DC NB
Wakka Flame DC DK
Nearcyde DC Templar0 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭Don't forget that the opponent will fight back and that you can't crit shields (your shard won't deal 14k uncrit).
You can't meaningfully crit anyone competent either. 7 impen turns a 50% more damage crit into a 25% more damage crit. 100 CP into resistant turns that into a 0% more damage crit. This is all before resistance and hardy are even brought into the picture. Block or dodge roll, and you can't be crit anyway.
Here is the current reality:
A 15k (respectable) procd frag tooltip is reduced to 7.5k with battle spirit. The only current sources of meaningful spell penetration are 5 light, nirnhoned, and weakness to elements - not enough. That 7.5k becomes 5625 after 100 Hardy CP are applied. After buffed spell resistances are applied, frags are hitting competent medium armor players for 4k to 4.5k all over Cyrodiil (if you can even hit them). Everyone is running 50% crit resistance minimum, so were looking at 5.6k-6k crits.
Your shard will never deal 14k crit let alone non crit unless they are a complete noob.
Edited by Xeven on February 18, 2016 4:03PM0 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭LegendaryMage wrote: »I agree with you Derra when you say that people will go for infinite sustain, I just don't see a problem there since most decent capped players at the moment (with top damage, keep in mind) are already doing that.
Ofcourse not and i have absolutely no problem with that. I just don´t like it personally because it will need totally different gear than a normal campaign.
Thus leading me to the thought most players that are a little greedy like myself won´t bother with the campaign as it´s simply to expensive.
On top of that it might lead to dividing the playerbase as new players naturally start out with the no CP campaign and it will be quite a steep learning curve for them to get involved in the normal camps.
I would have liked a 501 cp for everyone approach way better...
This would making pvp balancing easier aswell.Edited by Derra on February 18, 2016 3:57PM<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 501 -
Ishammael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭1.5 can rot in hell.
1.5 was absolutely the closest we ever came to overall balance -- including all of its blemishes.
Every single patch has been worse.
Excepting 1.0, I think 1.7 was probably the low point of the game -- but the only reason 1.6 wasn't worse was b/c players didn't have enough CPs.
Says the DK.
Properly geared Templars, Sorcs, and Nightblades could all perform at the level of DKs. Did you ever see krim on his sap tank? Grunt tank a full raid on his templar?
Regardless, I really don't understand any of your posts or threads.
Magicka Sorc has been the top of the PvP food chain since 1.6 dropped.3 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭1.5 can rot in hell.
1.5 was absolutely the closest we ever came to overall balance -- including all of its blemishes.
Every single patch has been worse.
Excepting 1.0, I think 1.7 was probably the low point of the game -- but the only reason 1.6 wasn't worse was b/c players didn't have enough CPs.
Says the DK.
Properly geared Templars, Sorcs, and Nightblades could all perform at the level of DKs. Did you ever see krim on his sap tank? Grunt tank a full raid on his templar?
Regardless, I really don't understand any of your posts or threads.
Magicka Sorc has been the top of the PvP food chain since 1.6 dropped.
Of course you don't, Ishammael. You dont want to. Read my post above this one and let it sink in. That is the reality of magic damage in Cyrodiil right now, and before that, it was compounded with nirnhoned resist being OP.
Maybe you're not on the 100 Hardy CP/Impen bandwagon, in which case sorcs are hitting you hard.
That doesnt make anything that I have ever said invalid. That just puts you behind the meta.
Edited by Xeven on February 18, 2016 3:56PM0 -
Soulac✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭LegendaryMage wrote: »LegendaryMage wrote: »mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »LegendaryMage wrote: »I agree with you Derra when you say that people will go for infinite sustain, I just don't see a problem there since most decent capped players at the moment (with top damage, keep in mind) are already doing that.
But here's what I don't understand. You agree that people will go for sustain and they will sacrifice damage for sustain. But you don't see problem with same sustain as live but lower damage?
If the sustain remains the same but the damage goes down, it's just a really long boring fight is it not? You can no longer burst people with combos, you have to really wait to drain their resources. Something they are trying hard to avoid by stacking regen/cost redux.
I personally fail to see the appeal.
I'll give you an example. My frag goes up to 14k or so on non-cp buffed fully. My harness is not even 6k and daedric ward buffed about 8.1k. If my frag is enough to strip down both these shields (more or less), what do you think happens to a sorc that has even less max magica than me (he's built for sustain) and has to take all of the damage arsenal at once?
He gets bursted and killed, which is exactly the thing that is harder to achieve on live because of all those other passives that help defense (hardy, elemental defender, bastion + infinite sustain vs a magica opponent for example). Think about it, on live it's all exaggarated so much that it gets to a point where 2 players cannot kill themselves for hours, until one makes a mistake and other one lands a lucky burst. On non-cp if you're built for too much sustain (or too much damage), you could and should pay a penalty for it when you get to fight a more balanced and optimized build.
Don't forget that the opponent will fight back and that you can't crit shields (your shard won't deal 14k uncrit).
Everyone fights back, I'm just giving you an example that now damage can be more meaningful vs sustain. My 14k buffed tooltip gets absorbed by the shield 100% as there are no cp passives to help offset it. It's a non crit we're talking about here, and if it's a crit and you run out of shields, remind me, does the opponent take full crit damage?
Battlespirit?R.I.P Dawnbreaker / Auriel´s Bow
Member of the Arena Guild and the overpowered Banana Squad.
Nathaerizh aka Cat - Nightblade V16 - EU
- Meow -1 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭LegendaryMage wrote: »LegendaryMage wrote: »mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »LegendaryMage wrote: »I agree with you Derra when you say that people will go for infinite sustain, I just don't see a problem there since most decent capped players at the moment (with top damage, keep in mind) are already doing that.
But here's what I don't understand. You agree that people will go for sustain and they will sacrifice damage for sustain. But you don't see problem with same sustain as live but lower damage?
If the sustain remains the same but the damage goes down, it's just a really long boring fight is it not? You can no longer burst people with combos, you have to really wait to drain their resources. Something they are trying hard to avoid by stacking regen/cost redux.
I personally fail to see the appeal.
I'll give you an example. My frag goes up to 14k or so on non-cp buffed fully. My harness is not even 6k and daedric ward buffed about 8.1k. If my frag is enough to strip down both these shields (more or less), what do you think happens to a sorc that has even less max magica than me (he's built for sustain) and has to take all of the damage arsenal at once?
He gets bursted and killed, which is exactly the thing that is harder to achieve on live because of all those other passives that help defense (hardy, elemental defender, bastion + infinite sustain vs a magica opponent for example). Think about it, on live it's all exaggarated so much that it gets to a point where 2 players cannot kill themselves for hours, until one makes a mistake and other one lands a lucky burst. On non-cp if you're built for too much sustain (or too much damage), you could and should pay a penalty for it when you get to fight a more balanced and optimized build.
Don't forget that the opponent will fight back and that you can't crit shields (your shard won't deal 14k uncrit).
Everyone fights back, I'm just giving you an example that now damage can be more meaningful vs sustain. My 14k buffed tooltip gets absorbed by the shield 100% as there are no cp passives to help offset it. It's a non crit we're talking about here, and if it's a crit and you run out of shields, remind me, does the opponent take full crit damage?
14k tooltip is 7k against players. Which means it won't even fully take down a 8k Hardened Ward, let alone 14-15k shield stack. The tooltip for shields gets adjusted the moment you step into Cyro, but the tooltip for damage stays the same because you still hit NPCs for full damage.
I still think TTK is lower in non-CP and thus fights are longer and more boring (for me).
Anyhow, if you enjoy dueling on non-CP campaign that's all good, the point of duels is to have fun....I just don't think it is for everyone. I would personally prefer a max-CP campaign for duels. That means new players can experiment with builds that are viable with high CP but not the other way round.Edited by Maulkin on February 18, 2016 4:28PMEU | PC | AD1 -
Ishammael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭1.5 can rot in hell.
1.5 was absolutely the closest we ever came to overall balance -- including all of its blemishes.
Every single patch has been worse.
Excepting 1.0, I think 1.7 was probably the low point of the game -- but the only reason 1.6 wasn't worse was b/c players didn't have enough CPs.
Says the DK.
Properly geared Templars, Sorcs, and Nightblades could all perform at the level of DKs. Did you ever see krim on his sap tank? Grunt tank a full raid on his templar?
Regardless, I really don't understand any of your posts or threads.
Magicka Sorc has been the top of the PvP food chain since 1.6 dropped.
Of course you don't, Ishammael. You dont want to. Read my post above this one and let it sink in. That is the reality of magic damage in Cyrodiil right now, and before that, it was compounded with nirnhoned resist being OP.
Maybe you're not on the 100 Hardy CP/Impen bandwagon, in which case sorcs are hitting you hard.
That doesnt make anything that I have ever said invalid. That just puts you behind the meta.
You were trying to say that your 15k tooltip CF, less all mitigating factors, is an example of why Sorc's are underpowered in PvP. A totally ridiculous straw man. So yeah, I don't understand your posts.
RE: Me being "being the meta". Not only untrue, but straight ad hominem when we are having a discussion.
Regardless, my original comment was about overall balance -- yes, 1.5 was closest.2 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭1.5 can rot in hell.
1.5 was absolutely the closest we ever came to overall balance -- including all of its blemishes.
Every single patch has been worse.
Excepting 1.0, I think 1.7 was probably the low point of the game -- but the only reason 1.6 wasn't worse was b/c players didn't have enough CPs.
Says the DK.
Properly geared Templars, Sorcs, and Nightblades could all perform at the level of DKs. Did you ever see krim on his sap tank? Grunt tank a full raid on his templar?
Regardless, I really don't understand any of your posts or threads.
Magicka Sorc has been the top of the PvP food chain since 1.6 dropped.
Of course you don't, Ishammael. You dont want to. Read my post above this one and let it sink in. That is the reality of magic damage in Cyrodiil right now, and before that, it was compounded with nirnhoned resist being OP.
Maybe you're not on the 100 Hardy CP/Impen bandwagon, in which case sorcs are hitting you hard.
That doesnt make anything that I have ever said invalid. That just puts you behind the meta.
You were trying to say that your 15k tooltip CF, less all mitigating factors, is an example of why Sorc's are underpowered in PvP. A totally ridiculous straw man. So yeah, I don't understand your posts.
RE: Me being "being the meta". Not only untrue, but straight ad hominem when we are having a discussion.
Regardless, my original comment was about overall balance -- yes, 1.5 was closest.
Listen, I'm not saying they are underpowerd, in fact MagiBlades and Sorcs probably have it better than any other magic class, including MagiDK. (Currently)
Show me where I ever said they were under powered.
If you look around the forums and are honest, you will admit that Sorcs get a lot of hate.
I am defending my class, I'm not saying they are underpowered. Maybe Magiplars and MagiDKs are under performing vs Sorc. That doesnt change the fact that if we are nerfed we will no longer be competitive with the clases that do give us trouble. Pretty much anything stamina, for my above listed reasons.
Buff other classes, do not nerf Sorc. That's all I'm saying, and all I have EVER said.Edited by Xeven on February 18, 2016 4:34PM0 -
LegendaryMage✭✭✭✭✭
✭mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »LegendaryMage wrote: »LegendaryMage wrote: »mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »LegendaryMage wrote: »I agree with you Derra when you say that people will go for infinite sustain, I just don't see a problem there since most decent capped players at the moment (with top damage, keep in mind) are already doing that.
But here's what I don't understand. You agree that people will go for sustain and they will sacrifice damage for sustain. But you don't see problem with same sustain as live but lower damage?
If the sustain remains the same but the damage goes down, it's just a really long boring fight is it not? You can no longer burst people with combos, you have to really wait to drain their resources. Something they are trying hard to avoid by stacking regen/cost redux.
I personally fail to see the appeal.
I'll give you an example. My frag goes up to 14k or so on non-cp buffed fully. My harness is not even 6k and daedric ward buffed about 8.1k. If my frag is enough to strip down both these shields (more or less), what do you think happens to a sorc that has even less max magica than me (he's built for sustain) and has to take all of the damage arsenal at once?
He gets bursted and killed, which is exactly the thing that is harder to achieve on live because of all those other passives that help defense (hardy, elemental defender, bastion + infinite sustain vs a magica opponent for example). Think about it, on live it's all exaggarated so much that it gets to a point where 2 players cannot kill themselves for hours, until one makes a mistake and other one lands a lucky burst. On non-cp if you're built for too much sustain (or too much damage), you could and should pay a penalty for it when you get to fight a more balanced and optimized build.
Don't forget that the opponent will fight back and that you can't crit shields (your shard won't deal 14k uncrit).
Everyone fights back, I'm just giving you an example that now damage can be more meaningful vs sustain. My 14k buffed tooltip gets absorbed by the shield 100% as there are no cp passives to help offset it. It's a non crit we're talking about here, and if it's a crit and you run out of shields, remind me, does the opponent take full crit damage?
14k tooltip is 7k against players. Which means it won't even fully take down a 8k Hardened Ward, let alone 14-15k shield stack. The tooltip for shields gets adjusted the monenth you step into Cyro, but the tooltip for damage stays the same because you still hit NPCs for full damage.
I still think TTK is lower in non-CP and thus fights are longer and more boring (for me).
Anyhow, if you enjoy dueling on non-CP campaign that's all good, the point of duels is to have fun....I just don't think it is for everyone. I would personally prefer a max-CP campaign for duels. That means new players can experiment with builds that are viable with high CP but not the other way round.
I got a bit confused with numbers as the enemy shields were weaker than mine, and my damage was higher so I was almost stripping everything with one frag.
A full cp campaign for everyone is a nice idea too, but what are we going to do when cap gets raised to 600, 700, 800, 1000? Duels at 3.6k cps truly never end.Edited by LegendaryMage on February 18, 2016 4:39PM1 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭LegendaryMage wrote: »mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »LegendaryMage wrote: »LegendaryMage wrote: »mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »LegendaryMage wrote: »I agree with you Derra when you say that people will go for infinite sustain, I just don't see a problem there since most decent capped players at the moment (with top damage, keep in mind) are already doing that.
But here's what I don't understand. You agree that people will go for sustain and they will sacrifice damage for sustain. But you don't see problem with same sustain as live but lower damage?
If the sustain remains the same but the damage goes down, it's just a really long boring fight is it not? You can no longer burst people with combos, you have to really wait to drain their resources. Something they are trying hard to avoid by stacking regen/cost redux.
I personally fail to see the appeal.
I'll give you an example. My frag goes up to 14k or so on non-cp buffed fully. My harness is not even 6k and daedric ward buffed about 8.1k. If my frag is enough to strip down both these shields (more or less), what do you think happens to a sorc that has even less max magica than me (he's built for sustain) and has to take all of the damage arsenal at once?
He gets bursted and killed, which is exactly the thing that is harder to achieve on live because of all those other passives that help defense (hardy, elemental defender, bastion + infinite sustain vs a magica opponent for example). Think about it, on live it's all exaggarated so much that it gets to a point where 2 players cannot kill themselves for hours, until one makes a mistake and other one lands a lucky burst. On non-cp if you're built for too much sustain (or too much damage), you could and should pay a penalty for it when you get to fight a more balanced and optimized build.
Don't forget that the opponent will fight back and that you can't crit shields (your shard won't deal 14k uncrit).
Everyone fights back, I'm just giving you an example that now damage can be more meaningful vs sustain. My 14k buffed tooltip gets absorbed by the shield 100% as there are no cp passives to help offset it. It's a non crit we're talking about here, and if it's a crit and you run out of shields, remind me, does the opponent take full crit damage?
14k tooltip is 7k against players. Which means it won't even fully take down a 8k Hardened Ward, let alone 14-15k shield stack. The tooltip for shields gets adjusted the monenth you step into Cyro, but the tooltip for damage stays the same because you still hit NPCs for full damage.
I still think TTK is lower in non-CP and thus fights are longer and more boring (for me).
Anyhow, if you enjoy dueling on non-CP campaign that's all good, the point of duels is to have fun....I just don't think it is for everyone. I would personally prefer a max-CP campaign for duels. That means new players can experiment with builds that are viable with high CP but not the other way round.
I got a bit confused with numbers as the enemy shields were weaker than mine, and my damage was higher so I was almost stripping everything with one frag.
A full cp campaign for everyone is a nice idea too, but what are we going to do when cap gets raised to 600, 700, 800, 1000? Duels at 3.6k cps truly never end.
The CP system can handle just about 800 to 900 cp before things get completely out of control. That means they have about one and a half years from DB release to come up with a systemrework (which is needed anyway - caps are just bandaid fixes).<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 501 -
Sypher✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I'm looking forward to dueling on the no CP campaign and doing open world on the CP campaigns.
I'm just not a fan of 20minute+ duels with no sustain battle at all and it only revolving around who can land the biggest one-hit-wonder burst combo first.
It'll feel good to actually care about what abilities I cast and how I often I cast them again. at least in duels.
May i ask what makes you feel people won´t just use the same sustain setups that were used in 1.5 dueling? 1 Kena 1bs 5 seducer maelstrom weapons mage mundus to make up for cp magica loss and just go full resource focused enchantments.
The problem is some classes can build an infinite sustain setup with no CP aswell and all they loose is dmg. I could build a sorc and a magica NB that way (Mag NB will be superstrong anyway bc of siphoning attacks which lets me play with 800 mag 600 stamreg on live).
I have no idea where the idea of resource battles comes from. I´ve never had resource issues on any of my builds since patch 1.2 - ever.
No matter how you spin it, it will be harder to manage resources and mitigate damage without actually building for it.
Fact of the matter is for dueling. There are too many people willing to respec their CP right before a fight to either put their red points into 100 elemental or 100 hardy depending on who they are fighting (and a few other changes as well).
I don't have time for that nonsense.DC Dragonknight 'Sypher - AD Nightblade Sypher Ali - AD Sorcerer Sypher Sensei - EP Sorcerer Sypharian - DC Templar Ali Sypher
Youtube: www.youtube.com/SypherPK
Twitch: www.twitch.tv/SypherPK6 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭No matter how you spin it, it will be harder to manage resources and mitigate damage without actually building for it.
He's not spinning anything. He's simply saying that if he were to fight in that campaign he would definitely build for it. But he can't be bothered so he won't.Fact of the matter is for dueling. There are too many people willing to respec their CP right before a fight to either put their red points into 100 elemental or 100 hardy depending on who they are fighting (and a few other changes as well).
I don't have time for that nonsense.
The CP reallocation can indeed be a problem but not on a daily basis. I wouldn't spend 3k every time I fight a particular build for fun. If it's a tournament with prize money and bragging rights then its a different story, the temptation is too high.
If zos even care about duels enough to prevent that sort of thing they can do it very easily. They can make it so you can only reset your CPs in one of the respec shrines.
That way you can easily police tournaments by making contestants stay in Cyrodiil for the whole duration of the tourney. They can crash/relog their clients if they have issues, but if they visit one of the 3 regions with shrines they get disqualified. Easy.Edited by Maulkin on February 18, 2016 5:32PMEU | PC | AD2 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭Agreed. I have never respecd for a duel.
It will also be harder to deal damage without building for it so the point is moot.
Hardy is currently over performing without a competing physical damage star to entice some CP spread. It's not like players can currently take some CP out of magic mitigation and put it into physical mitigation when fighting a stam dk for example. (Well I guess they can if they want to spend 3k to put it into lol armor focus)
In TG, they can, but not yet.
My instinct is that no CP duels will be dominated by MagiSorcs and MagiBlades, as there is no more magic or crit resist stars, and shields will benefit most in that environment.
Edited by Xeven on February 18, 2016 5:57PM0 -
olsborg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Will be interresting to see pvp on azura. The new battlespirit with 50% reduction was made because ppl had too high stats with cp. Without cp I doubt we would need to have battlespirit changed from the 20% damage reduction.
I foresee it being very, very hard to kill eachother 1v1 unless someone has very,very bad sustain and run out of resources.
PC EU
PvP only2 -
Master_Kas✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭1.5 can rot in hell.
1.5 was absolutely the closest we ever came to overall balance -- including all of its blemishes.
Every single patch has been worse.
Excepting 1.0, I think 1.7 was probably the low point of the game -- but the only reason 1.6 wasn't worse was b/c players didn't have enough CPs.
Says the DK.
Properly geared Templars, Sorcs, and Nightblades could all perform at the level of DKs. Did you ever see krim on his sap tank? Grunt tank a full raid on his templar?
Regardless, I really don't understand any of your posts or threads.
Magicka Sorc has been the top of the PvP food chain since 1.6 dropped.
Of course you don't, Ishammael. You dont want to. Read my post above this one and let it sink in. That is the reality of magic damage in Cyrodiil right now, and before that, it was compounded with nirnhoned resist being OP.
Maybe you're not on the 100 Hardy CP/Impen bandwagon, in which case sorcs are hitting you hard.
That doesnt make anything that I have ever said invalid. That just puts you behind the meta.
You were trying to say that your 15k tooltip CF, less all mitigating factors, is an example of why Sorc's are underpowered in PvP. A totally ridiculous straw man. So yeah, I don't understand your posts.
RE: Me being "being the meta". Not only untrue, but straight ad hominem when we are having a discussion.
Regardless, my original comment was about overall balance -- yes, 1.5 was closest.
Listen, I'm not saying they are underpowerd, in fact MagiBlades and Sorcs probably have it better than any other magic class, including MagiDK. (Currently)
Show me where I ever said they were under powered.
If you look around the forums and are honest, you will admit that Sorcs get a lot of hate.
I am defending my class, I'm not saying they are underpowered. Maybe Magiplars and MagiDKs are under performing vs Sorc. That doesnt change the fact that if we are nerfed we will no longer be competitive with the clases that do give us trouble. Pretty much anything stamina, for my above listed reasons.
Buff other classes, do not nerf Sorc. That's all I'm saying, and all I have EVER said.
Said the same thing, now look at everything regarding cloak/stealth.
Just wait, it's ZOS we're talking about
EU | PC1 -
Ishammael✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Buff other classes, do not nerf Sorc. That's all I'm saying, and all I have EVER said.
I think we can both agree on this.
For a DK: I want miss change on Cinder Storm and Dragon Blood back. That's pretty much it -- would solve a ton of problems. Maybe rework inferno to how it used to be, or give it minor heroism or something.0 -
hammayolettuce✭✭✭✭✭
✭A no CP campaign isnt going to work. Its just going to be another buff campaign since you can still grind inside of IC and make XP/CP.
Everyone magicka build is going to run sustain just like all stamina builds will and fights will be just as boring on this campaign as they are on the current live ones. The only real difference is everyone will having smaller resource and health pools along with far less damage.♥ Snü (Magicka DK) ♥ Thnu (Stamplar) ♥ Pizza for Breakfast (Magplar) ♥ Sparklefingers (Magicka Sorc) ♥♥ Bean and Cheese Burrito (Magicka DK) ♥ Snurrito (Stamplar) ♥DARFAL COVANT2 -
Poxheart✭✭✭✭✭1.5 can rot in hell.
1.5 was absolutely the closest we ever came to overall balance -- including all of its blemishes.
Every single patch has been worse.
Excepting 1.0, I think 1.7 was probably the low point of the game -- but the only reason 1.6 wasn't worse was b/c players didn't have enough CPs.
Says the DK.
My NB was head and shoulders better than my DK in 1.5.Unsubbed and no longer playing, but still checking the Alliance War forum for the lulz.
Pox Dragon Knight
Poxheart Nightblade
The Murder Hobo Dragon Knight - Blackwater Blade
Knights of the WhiteWolf0 -
hammayolettuce✭✭✭✭✭
✭1.5 can rot in hell.
1.5 was absolutely the closest we ever came to overall balance -- including all of its blemishes.
Every single patch has been worse.
Excepting 1.0, I think 1.7 was probably the low point of the game -- but the only reason 1.6 wasn't worse was b/c players didn't have enough CPs.
Says the DK.
My NB was head and shoulders better than my DK in 1.5.
Its so funny that people still try to act as if NBs were so weak pre 1.6. What the dont realize is that NBs were incredibly strong just like DKs were in large fights.♥ Snü (Magicka DK) ♥ Thnu (Stamplar) ♥ Pizza for Breakfast (Magplar) ♥ Sparklefingers (Magicka Sorc) ♥♥ Bean and Cheese Burrito (Magicka DK) ♥ Snurrito (Stamplar) ♥DARFAL COVANT0 -
Takllin✭✭✭✭✭hammayolettuce wrote: »1.5 can rot in hell.
1.5 was absolutely the closest we ever came to overall balance -- including all of its blemishes.
Every single patch has been worse.
Excepting 1.0, I think 1.7 was probably the low point of the game -- but the only reason 1.6 wasn't worse was b/c players didn't have enough CPs.
Says the DK.
My NB was head and shoulders better than my DK in 1.5.
Its so funny that people still try to act as if NBs were so weak pre 1.6. What the dont realize is that NBs were incredibly strong just like DKs were in large fights.
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Cody✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭IxSTALKERxI wrote: »IxSTALKERxI wrote: »Argonian master race.
DO NOT STEAL MY LINE
Lol sorry, but it's true. They'll actually be strong now in non-cp campaigns after latest buffs.
they got a health buff correct? a decent buff, but I personally think they should have gotten some kind of stealth passive.
still though, if it is a health buff (correct me if I am wrong, i know they will get some kind of stat boosting passive next month) they will be at least a semi-decent choice. the health buff racial could save me glyphs, level up points and the like.
Edited by Cody on February 19, 2016 12:59AM0
