Templar post 2.3.2 suggestions

Cinbri

Post 2.3.2 suggestions:

Post as thread too to make sure that ZOS will see it.
First of all. Sweep ultimate finally became viable especially Crescent Sweep(funny but it contradict new trial crescent-moon theme). 2sec for Empowering Sweep is much needed but i still think that change mitigation mechanic to Major Protection buff will be better. And now we must get fixed Rite of Passage, coz with all penalties it apply, ultimate is pale.

Cinbri wrote: »

This is mostly all feedback with argumentation and theorycrafting i can provide for now:
1.Animations and visual improvements.
2.Small buffs and Improvements.
3.Skills Overhaul.
Rest of feedback depends only on what Wrobel will say on friday eso live. Hope 26 pages will result in some notacible and positive buffs. I really hope.

Suggestions:
Not a single viusal effect for templars was improved and i don't understand why. We got revamped Empower animation, dk molten armaments improved, sorc got new animation for revamped skill.
1. Yellow glwoing round hands for either Focused Healing passive or Focus buffs. It is impossible to see if those bonuses are still on you without addons that showing buffs duration. Focus now grants buff duration for 8 sec and still apply glowing yellow effect on body, but as i said before body effect is easily can be overwriten by other same boddy effects, so it is impossible to determine if buff still on you; nor the FH passive giving you hints if healing buff still on you.
Since Empower no longer trigger red glowing on hands, it is even more easy to dtermine such buffs - templar must get iconic "sun"-color buff that can't be overwritten

2. Honor the Dead mana return is also impossible to determine without addons.
3. Spear Shards animation must be fixed and i gave suggestion how it could be fixed.

Cinbri wrote: »

[*]Spear Shards: right now animation of this skill is too slow it may looks like it has cast time. At the time when templar start casting second Spear, first one didn't land yet. It is nice to have ranged AoE but with current animation speed it is impossible to target high/medium mobile targets. Regarding removing ability to target zone for this skill: it may improve speed of this skill but i remember how terrible it was whan you was unable to target zone for tactical play, adding such option was great improvement and should not be removed. DKs Eruption on other hand is landing at same second same as revamped Daedric Tomb.
Currently when templar choose target are of attack it starting 2nd phase of animation: currently templar throwing spear into air, after it animation end it proc next animation - of falling from sky spear.The way to fix it should be similar as new Daedric Tomb working - when templar throwing spear into air, in middle of this 1st animation, 2nd animation of spear falling from sky already should starting to proc.
Also you can notice that on last phase of 2nd animation, 3rd animation proccing - splitting shards, that decreasing animation even more. Improving this 3rd animation may result of increasing speed of cast for miliseconds.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEgXtanFhT4

And from this slow-mo you can see that target should be affected but still not affected by spear till 3rd animation played to an end:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPdZ31IEULc

4. Solar Barrage cast animation still apply short stuck.

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1. Templar Charge - now "fixed", but is still often auto-cancelling upon cast. Wrobel said that it related to path finding mechanic and lags making things even worse. Why than not to revamp skill and make it like NB ambush - it won't requare for skill to track path and lags won't negatively affect this skill. Also you can take animation from Vosh Rakh skill with cutting half of it and apply for templar Charge. My editing skills are bad but thats how it could looks like, similar to ambush but we would not travel through shadows but through light

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wql81mo8hk

2. Puncturing Sweep - this skill still loosing its effectiveness vs shields. It must be fixed to allow healing upon hitting damage shields.
3. Focus - since now both morphs working for 8 sec, Restoring Focus became equal to another morph and maybe looking like Chocking Talons of dk. Change of mana return - at least it is "fixed", alos now after CF expired 8 sec buff of mana return still proccing = 1920 more mana return from this morph.
4. Light Weaver/Balanced Warrior/Restoring Spirit - still suggesting to do this

Cinbri wrote: »

5. Restoring Spirit - there is no secret that magplars/stamplars have worst sustain, such small buff as increasing this passive's numbers to 8% all reduction will help a lot.
6. Light Weaver - very weak passive that almost don't have synnergy. I suggest to revamp ult giving component and make it return ultimates only to caster(not to allies as they are more sustainable) upon casting Healing Ritual and Rushed Ceremony abilities so those healings won't be only 100% defensive mechanic.
7. Balanced Warrior - templar now is only class without major sorcery buff. So in addition to weapon damage it should grant spelldamage and probably same number of physical resistance.

5. Rite of Passage - must get Sweep treatment, i.e. fixed to become usefull in PvP.
6. Eclipse - change to Total Dark will make ability even less viable than before, I will talk about it below(no matter what, 1 target cap must be removed of increased to 3 targets). Unstable Core - another useless change: in PvE dd won't spam it on several targets and wait 6 sec for it to explode, heal will still heal and tank won't waste huge amount of mana for it. But looks on Sun-Eaters from new trial: they cast ground aoe dot Eclipse, templar could get either same or revamped to work as Rune Prison of npc menders - stun through block(tempalr version of Fissilize).
7. Backlash - obviously PvE skill, but to give it at least some usability in PvP you can make it work as Mark - enemies won't be able to hide. That is just that easy.

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Templar sustain:
It is still no secret that templar sustain worse possible . Now Wrobel confirmed that templar like dk is "hold-your-ground" class, but unlike dk its sustain worse then nb or sorc in light armor...And myth about templar super tankiness is just a myth coz templar forced to stack defense to maximum coz lack of sustain and thus sacrifice all his damage outpoot.
Also Wrobel pointed some pain points:
a. Cyro Spirit and how it affects skill, so here: Blazing Shield=Dragonblodd and both not fixed coz it requare to take into account percentage improve and shieldstacking problem.
b. Inhale buffed to make dk more viable for self-healing, so here: Honor the Dead=Inhale and thats fine.
And now lets see on sustain passives:
Restoring Spirit = Battle Roar
Remembrance = Helping Hands
^^As we can see templar abilities can't directly restore stamina, especially if there is no corpses. Even NBs have direct stamina restore abilities. Thats why templar tank is worst from those 3 classes after block nerf that stoped regen stamina while blocking and thus making PvP for templar impossible to play "hold-your-ground" style. If he tanking Boss in PvE there is no way for him to restore stamina to sustain. ZOS hope watched HODOR runs through Maw of Lorkhaj and see fact that DK tank is most viable coz self-sustain.
Another tanking class - DK - must be taken as example of what is tanking class is, coz even in PvE Templar can't sustain even nearly as good as DK, for example this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S15Wh-hgv3w

Templar just can't fill role Wrobel invisioned for it, and this is problem related to Blinding Flashes:
a.Blinding Flashed effects:1.dodge-like buff. 2.AoE melee CC. Literally, it was melee version of Scales+CC, so removal of BF is equal to removal of Scales+root of Talons. Remove those from DK and you will see what will happen, same happened with templars. (While DK got set-off balance type of skill after it was removed from templars. "Shattering Rocks")
So, we got finisher in the coast of most effective defensive skill.
b.Next our mitigation skill Blazing Shield became broken, so we got 1 less viable defense for melee.
c. Now Total Dark nerf - not possible to reflect hard-hitting melee abilities and 1 cap target.
d. Now fixed, Cleansing Ritual was symbol how good for sustain such absorb-reflect skills, this bug made templars feel like true "hold-your-ground" class.
^^^With those nerfs we lost all defensive skills and left only with healing that is not mitigating damage but only serve to recover from harm that was done to us. No skills to help sustain or tank.
To fix it we should get back Flashes-like skill or revamp current templar skills to become viable to sustain:
1. The most easiest way to do it:
a. Revamp Total Dark and make it work as DK Scales.
b. Revamp Radiant Ward to apply some sort of CC upon cast with little damage shield.
As result to it: In PvP - templar will become as Wrobel wanted - enemies will be forced to come to melee to kill templar and in melee templar will be able to slowing them by CC. In PvE - tanking will still be not as viable as DK, but it will contradict with fact that templar better healer at least. Change of Radiant Ward will completely remove such problems as percentage skills in PvP and shieldstacking problem for this morph. Also it will cover another Eclipse problem - only hard hitting range stamina ability is Snipe, but Snipe has much longer range and Eclipse won't be able to reach it, aslo stamina build have high stamina regen and break free will be almost unnoticable for them while mana cost for Eclipse is high.
2. Another way to fix it:
a. Make Spear Shards to have unique synnergy that can be activated by its own caster.
b. Make Total Dark to reflect all types of abilities and increase cap to 3 targets.
As result those 2 changes will fix problem of self-sustainable templar tanks both in PvP and PvE and will negate fact that templar as tanking class without active stamina returns.
3. And last way to fix it: (some unique)
a. to remove such problems as percentage skills in PvP and shieldstacking problem, revamp Radiant Ward to work like: self-buff for 20 seconds that will grant Major Evasion buff(20%) and will have additional effect to help with sustain:

• every dodge grants returns 1000 stamina to caster.

It should help sustain in both PvE and PvP and will negate fact that templar as tanking class without active stamina returns. Also in compare with Blinding Flashes - it 50% miss chance but only for melee 5m, while Evasion grants 20% to both melee and range. For magicka templars stamina based Evasion is stamina-drainer cos high cost, and stamplars are worst stamina-based class coz lack of sustain and also have only couple magicka skills to waste mana on.
To further comparison we can compare it with old Black Rose that had 20% of 900 stamina return upon block:
unbuffed block cost 1730 stamina, and to restore 900 stamina you must waste at least 6920 block stamina, same with dodge effect - it won't make you to dadge instantly vs 1 target and make you unkillable but each 1 more enemy will slightly increase chances to survive, also unlike Blinding Flashes, dodge not proccing on AoE dd skills. So for example:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EU9Ng9NOd2E

As you can see vs 8 targets 20 sec dodge-buff gave only 9 dodges: 9k stamina in 20 seconds vs 8 enemies, it equal to 900 stamina regen for 20 sec only while being already heavily outnumbered. To compare to dk Helping Hands passive with ~15k stamina = 750 stamina returns, in addition to Battle Roar passive effectiveness you can see on video i linked above from WGT.
This change will allow to invest more resources into offense, not just stuck as much defense as possible and have 0 damage outpoot.
b. Make Total Dark to reflect abilities as it is now on pts but remove cap completely. As many times already said why.
Radaint Aura:
Just rename it may it work as Equilibrium: restore stamina in cost of mana/hp. Add vuisual effect from npc mages:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5eJCMsiD4c&feature=youtu.be

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@Wrobel

themdogesbite

So many good ideas and feedback for templars here from someone that knows the tanky templar playstyle like few other do.. And still nothing will probably come from it and templar will be as usefull as a summoned pet.

Ryuho

@Cinbri that's awesome post. @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS please read it!

SeptimusDova

Thank you Cinbri for this post. Lots of good stuff in that.

Cinbri

Small edition:
If Scales-like Eclipse is too "homogenized" for zos, than how about:
since Scales is improved version of Defensive Stance:
Make Total Dark to work like Scales-like version of Absorb Magick morph of snb:
Absorb 4 incoming projectile and have some percentage bonus like deal aoe damage of % of projectile after absorbing, or restore amount of stamina based on % of projectile damage.
It will be still super unique templar skill and very powerfull. @Wrobel please look at it.
And about Rite of Passage - just remove templar disable while channel ultimate: previously it had disable but proc Focused Healing for all on big radius, now FH became 5% less and mobile(you don't need to cast Cleansing Ritual to affect targets) so it is like double nerf for ultimate.

Minno

@Cinbri you are a god amoung templars! Good post.

General comment:
If ZOS wants tanky templars, lets remind ourselves that is the vision they see the class. This will help us to provide skill feedback that sharpen our anger to a spear-point to get our class to work.

Skill comment:
I will offer better response during lunch but here's my suggestion:

nova should be stronger than meteor. Steps to do this include:
A) meteor should have AOE/knockback removed if it is to remain unreflective.
all class ultimates reviewed to provide viable choices against using meteor. (Don't escape the work ZOS)
C) AOE snare to remain on pvp morph.
D) AOE dmg mitigation to remain as is (if not stronger)
E) impact dmg increased with increased DOT (A supernova, under physics immersion, obliterates all within its vicinity, including asteroids.)
F) keep 250 cost or increase to 300.
G) remove ally dmg synergy. Replace with resource regen for allies or allies synergize for mobility.

Give templars a reason to be templars. #templarstrike2016

bikerangelo

Jaywics

Theres almost 50+ pages in the templar feedback thread, and yet they failed to truly address it in the last eso live.

Nice post, however I dont think they are listening/reading the many templar issues we keep bringing up.

Dread_Guy

Jaywics wrote: »

Theres almost 50+ pages in the templar feedback thread, and yet they failed to truly address it in the last eso live.

Nice post, however I dont think they are listening/reading the many templar issues we keep bringing up.

there's nothing else for us to do, but keep writing and speaking our minds about it. Eventually, someone will listen...hopefully

SeptimusDova

The reality will hit when the pts goes live, and the subs cancel at an alarming rate.We are but a small fraction of the Templar community. When the masses receive their "blessing" from Wrolag Bal they will be up in arms

Joy_Division

Lot of good stuff here.

• I like the yellow glowing hands idea for the focused healing passive.
• Solar barrage animation does stop/stuck player IIRC. So does Blessing of Restoration for that matter. Very annoying. Yes, plz fix.
• OP is right. Restoring Spirit, Balanced Warrior, Light weaver are terrible passives.
• OP is also right about eclipse. It's worse.
• I'm not sure what "sweep" treatment is for Rite of Passage; I think this means it needs to be buffed. If so, that is correct.
• Templars indeed have the worst sustain with resources, a bad combination for a stay at home class.
• OP is absolutely correct in the erosion of templar defenses: Blinding flashes, Sun Shield, Eclipse, and Purifying ritual are either gone or have taken major hits. That's a huge drop-off!
• I don't tank, but the OP's commentary of lack of resource management and nerfed skills makes a lot of sense to me.

I think the OP is onto something here with the idea of completely redoing the Radiant aura skill. Adding is some of the lost defensive functionality strikes me as a really good idea since the buff system and tri-pots make the spell pointless. If it also gave a shield, evasion, or provided some actual "house" with the sort of mechanics he describes would definitely help.

About the only thing here I would disagree with is the suggestion of making Eclipse like the dragonknight scales. I know that's the easiest fix, but that's their signature skill and should remain exclusively theirs. The other suggestions are certainly better than what's on Live. The reflect everything idea might be the way to go since the target has such an easy counter to it.

Cinbri

@Joy_Division Yes, i agree that it too homoginized but that why i like @Solariken idea, especially after watching new trial and after changes made clear that ZOS don't know how to fix it:
"Surround yourself with the Void(we already have "dark" version of skill - Dark Flare) that absorb 4 incoming projectile and have bonus based on % of absorbed projectile(like small amount of stamina return)", like Absorb Magick morph, but unique. ZOS don't need even to create some new mechanic, they could take it from Absorb Magick morph; same with visual effect - floating shadows that previously used for Total Dark morph, it easily visible and opponent will understand why his damage not reaching target; it is easy to do in 2 left weeks. No secret that stamplars are spamming Cleansing Ritual to purify projectiles, so this change will be usefull for both magicka templars and stamplars.

Why we need it:
1. ZOS must realise that almost noone use Eclipse
2. ZOS must realize that after nerf even less people will use Eclipse
3. Once again they must realize that with new meta after people will realize that stacking on enemy = 1 shot by Detonation, they will split up and start using all kinds of ranged skill, so we will see much more snipers. And we all know who will be picked as easiest target - our "hold-your-home" class, that in fact can't hold anything and we will just die after tons of snipes on us.

Mr_Nobody

Charge auto cancelling on cast? I will tell you how it feels 80% of the time if u try to CC a person within a short range.

1) You cast charge
2) You go into animation
3) You fly for a second doing nothing
4) You stop flying and get rekt by the said enemy because you just wasted 2 seconds doing nothing but trying to charge.

Minno

@Cinbri its sad to know a Nightblade has better tools for protecting his "home":

1) dodge skill that has mag cost with mobility
2) dmg mitigation rune that doesn't need to be targeted (dark veil)
3) range attack that buffs healing received plus heals over time and on hit
4) cheap magicka cost spells (their main heal spam is 900 per cost...)
5) AOE dmg ulti that also heals.
6) shade NPC to teleport to that also reduces targets dmg (minor maim)
7) additional ulti cost regen passives
8) dmg buff spell that also uses light attacks to trigger an instant cast range burst magicka dmg

Edit: more skills

Those skills to me sound easy to get tanky than the current Templar outfit.

contact.opiumb16_ESO

Minno wrote: »

@Cinbri its sad to know a Nightblade has better tools for protecting his "home":

1) dodge skill that has mag cost with mobility
2) dmg mitigation rune that doesn't need to be targeted (dark veil)
3) range attack that buffs healing received plus heals over time and on hit
4) cheap magicka cost spells (their main heal spam is 900 per cost...)
5) AOE dmg ulti that also heals.

Those skills to me sound easy to get tanky than the current Templar outfit.

agreed, sorcerers and NB are tankier than templar. I have all 3 (no DK so...) but the templar have no sustain, no def, no dps, no mobility compared to the other 2 HL toons i have

SeptimusDova

@Minno
Killers blade also has a nice heal plus it's an execute. Was plopping around on the NB today 37K one shots from stealth. Yeah really balanced.Kills will get higher once the Crit issue gets fixed I will have an NB with over 100 percent crit.

RinaldoGandolphi

@Cinbri just nailed it! Right out of the park!

Sorcs and NB are tankier then Templars
Sorcs and Nightblades do more DPs then Templars

and with this update

Sorcs, DK, and Even Nightblades will also be better healers then Templars

Why be a Templar? It seems with every update ZOS just keeps making the Templar worse,how is this even possible?

Minno

SeptimusDova wrote: »

@Minno
Killers blade also has a nice heal plus it's an execute. Was plopping around on the NB today 37K one shots from stealth. Yeah really balanced.Kills will get higher once the Crit issue gets fixed I will have an NB with over 100 percent crit.

I have a Nightblade alt that's lvl 40 now. He was stam and I left him for a good part of a year (hated his style.). Now he's magicka and looking at the tanking options he has is making me forget why I rolled Templar in the first place.

Really scary to see a design intent fail so hard from a gaming company with a major league intellectual property...

Cinbri

I can post video of same author about tanking PvE as nightblade. Unlike him again Templar don't have any stamina return ability and won't be able to tank PvE content even as long as nightblade, no need to say that it ruining PvP. In fact templar affected most badly by block nerf, coz DK and NB could adopt to new gameplay and use their sustain abilities like Wrobel said on ESO Live; but templar don't have a single one that can used just by default.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QISx7HNxqkM
If ZOS cares so much about PvE, here is the video where so called non-tanky class tank more than Templar that supposed to be tanky class.
With my suggestion to Radiant Ward revamp or just making templar able to pick own Shards, this problem will gone.

Minno

Cinbri wrote: »

I can post video of same author about tanking PvE as nightblade. Unlike him again Templar don't have any stamina return ability and won't be able to tank PvE content even as long as nightblade, no need to say that it ruining PvP. In fact templar affected most badly by block nerf, coz DK and NB could adopt to new gameplay and use their sustain abilitie; but templar don't have a single one that can used just by default.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QISx7HNxqkM
If ZOS cares so much about PvE, here is the video where so called non-tanky class tank more than Templar that supposed to be tanky class.

Add a caveat: this isn't a nerf-nb comment. It's a buff Templar lol.

Joy_Division

Cinbri wrote: »

@Joy_Division Yes, i agree that it too homoginized but that why i like @Solariken idea, especially after watching new trial and after changes made clear that ZOS don't know how to fix it:
"Surround yourself with the Void(we already have "dark" version of skill - Dark Flare) that absorb 4 incoming projectile and have bonus based on % of absorbed projectile(like small amount of stamina return)", like Absorb Magick morph, but unique. ZOS don't need even to create some new mechanic, they could take it from Absorb Magick morph; same with visual effect - floating shadows that previously used for Total Dark morph, it easily visible and opponent will understand why his damage not reaching target; it is easy to do in 2 left weeks. No secret that stamplars are spamming Cleansing Ritual to purify projectiles, so this change will be usefull for both magicka templars and stamplars.

Why we need it:
1. ZOS must realise that almost noone use Eclipse
2. ZOS must realize that after nerf even less people will use Eclipse
3. Once again they must realize that with new meta after people will realize that stacking on enemy = 1 shot by Detonation, they will split up and start using all kinds of ranged skill, so we will see much more snipers. And we all know who will be picked as easiest target - our "hold-your-home" class, that in fact can't hold anything and we will just die after tons of snipes on us.

Can you or @Solariken link the original post for the idea to change eclipse?

I think we are in full agreement the skill is currently inadequate and what's in the patch notes is unappealing. This is one area where I think we templars are kind of all over the place with regards to proposed solutions. From what is here, the @Solariken idea looks like something I'd take.

Also, you mentioned something about a new ability by a trial monster. Can you describe what it does in a bit more detail.

Solariken

Thread link: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/240429/eclipse-morphs-suggestion/p1

Thread OP:

@Wrobel, Eclipse needs some tender love and care. I don't know anyone who still uses this ability. It has some very wonky design features that overly limit its use including the one target restriction and the shared CC timer with every other hard CC. The intended mechanics are great, but just not practical in its context. Let me propose a change that I hope you will consider.

Proposed change to the base skill:

Eclipse
Surround yourself with four lightless spheres that intercept any harmful projectiles for 4 seconds. Each projectile intercepted causes a sphere to explode, dealing X Magic damage to nearby enemies. (8m range)

Proposed morphs:

Total Dark [perhaps change the name, Unyielding Light?]
Surround yourself with four lightless spheres that intercept any harmful projectiles for 4 seconds. Each projectile intercepted causes a sphere to explode, dealing X Magic damage to nearby enemies and healing nearby allies for X.

Unstable Core
Surround yourself with four lightless spheres that intercept any harmful projectiles for 4 seconds and grants Major Evasion (20% dodge chance) for 4 seconds. Each projectile intercepted causes a sphere to explode, dealing X Magic damage to nearby enemies. While slotted, you gain Minor Expedition (10% increased movement speed) at all times.

Additional thoughts:
This suggestion gives Templars a defensive ability that is analogous to Reflective Scale but fits more with the Templar niche. It addresses some Templar survivability problems and adds some needed utility (if you troll my thread with BoL hate I will ram my javelin right up your [snip]). Total Dark might be attractive for PvE tanks and PvE/PvP healers, while Unstable Core might be attractive to stamplars and magicka jabplars.

This is one set of ideas and I'm sure there are other great alternatives that have been proposed. Regardless, Eclipse needs an overhaul. I would love to hear some constructive player feedback on this suggestion.

TheM0rganism

1) Add an AOE stun to the damage portion of both Sun Shield morphs.

2) Replace Master Ritualist passive with a 2 sec Minor Expedition buff for all party members affected by a Restoring Light spell.

3) Add a 8% all-resources return per enemy hit on Empowering Sweep along with making it physical damage.

4) Make Eclipse return % of max health.

5) Spears should add high passive regen (mag = luminous, sta = blazing) when inside its range to party members.

6) Healing Ritual casts a 2k shield upon activation as well.

7) Backlash should keep targets from cloaking for it's duration and for 2 seconds after it pops.

8) Radiant Aura should just be a magika version of Repentance.

9) Piercing Javelin should cause a bleed.

10) Rite of Passage is boring af. Make one of it's morphs insta-rez one party member in the radius.

dodgehopper_ESO

I've played as a Templar Tank build in both PvE and PvP since the very start of the game. I've also played as a magicka healer/dps Templar and a Stamina DPS Templar. I can tell you that the changes to Block Stamina Regeneration were catastrophic to the Templar Tank. While a Templar can potentially still tank, you have to give up an awful lot more than other classes, and you have to be on your A Game. Like others have said, I personally prefer to tank in a Sorcerer or Nightblade, which is sad. The Templar class has clear built in tank passives, but they just don't perform well in the current design of the game.

This effects pvp as well because in pvp every damage dealer has to also self mitigate to some degree. The Templar forms of mitigation are much less advantageous than what other classes have at their disposal, and its glaringly obvious. While people can make it work, it is clearly a gear+ player skill disparity that wins the day.

Joy_Division

Solariken wrote: »

Thread link: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/240429/eclipse-morphs-suggestion/p1

Thread OP:

@Wrobel, Eclipse needs some tender love and care. I don't know anyone who still uses this ability. It has some very wonky design features that overly limit its use including the one target restriction and the shared CC timer with every other hard CC. The intended mechanics are great, but just not practical in its context. Let me propose a change that I hope you will consider.

Proposed change to the base skill:

Eclipse
Surround yourself with four lightless spheres that intercept any harmful projectiles for 4 seconds. Each projectile intercepted causes a sphere to explode, dealing X Magic damage to nearby enemies. (8m range)

Proposed morphs:

Total Dark [perhaps change the name, Unyielding Light?]
Surround yourself with four lightless spheres that intercept any harmful projectiles for 4 seconds. Each projectile intercepted causes a sphere to explode, dealing X Magic damage to nearby enemies and healing nearby allies for X.

Unstable Core
Surround yourself with four lightless spheres that intercept any harmful projectiles for 4 seconds and grants Major Evasion (20% dodge chance) for 4 seconds. Each projectile intercepted causes a sphere to explode, dealing X Magic damage to nearby enemies. While slotted, you gain Minor Expedition (10% increased movement speed) at all times.

Additional thoughts:
This suggestion gives Templars a defensive ability that is analogous to Reflective Scale but fits more with the Templar niche. It addresses some Templar survivability problems and adds some needed utility (if you troll my thread with BoL hate I will ram my javelin right up your [snip]). Total Dark might be attractive for PvE tanks and PvE/PvP healers, while Unstable Core might be attractive to stamplars and magicka jabplars.

This is one set of ideas and I'm sure there are other great alternatives that have been proposed. Regardless, Eclipse needs an overhaul. I would love to hear some constructive player feedback on this suggestion.

Ahh, yes I remember reading this before.

It's a solid suggestion and one I'd take. Certainly worthy of consideration. Cinbri's "void" absorb resource alternative might be enough to convince ZoS it's not a reflective scales reskin.

Cinbri

Joy_Division wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

@Joy_Division Yes, i agree that it too homoginized but that why i like @Solariken idea, especially after watching new trial and after changes made clear that ZOS don't know how to fix it:
"Surround yourself with the Void(we already have "dark" version of skill - Dark Flare) that absorb 4 incoming projectile and have bonus based on % of absorbed projectile(like small amount of stamina return)", like Absorb Magick morph, but unique. ZOS don't need even to create some new mechanic, they could take it from Absorb Magick morph; same with visual effect - floating shadows that previously used for Total Dark morph, it easily visible and opponent will understand why his damage not reaching target; it is easy to do in 2 left weeks. No secret that stamplars are spamming Cleansing Ritual to purify projectiles, so this change will be usefull for both magicka templars and stamplars.

Why we need it:
1. ZOS must realise that almost noone use Eclipse
2. ZOS must realize that after nerf even less people will use Eclipse
3. Once again they must realize that with new meta after people will realize that stacking on enemy = 1 shot by Detonation, they will split up and start using all kinds of ranged skill, so we will see much more snipers. And we all know who will be picked as easiest target - our "hold-your-home" class, that in fact can't hold anything and we will just die after tons of snipes on us.

Can you or @Solariken link the original post for the idea to change eclipse?

I think we are in full agreement the skill is currently inadequate and what's in the patch notes is unappealing. This is one area where I think we templars are kind of all over the place with regards to proposed solutions. From what is here, the @Solariken idea looks like something I'd take.

Also, you mentioned something about a new ability by a trial monster. Can you describe what it does in a bit more detail.

Sun-Eaters summon Eclipse - ground based aoe dot of void energy that looks like black hole. And Fang of Lorkhan can summon Void that can't be breaked and consuming your char.

So, with this cutting connection with sun - Eclipse mean summon of Void energy, and Void energy is something that absorbing/consuming energy no matter what.
So if templar casting Eclipse, he cuts connection with the sun in form of summoning Void that can consume every projectile. Perfectly match with name Total Dark.
^^C'mon ZOS, i even made it lore-wise.

Ryuho

Solariken wrote: »

Thread link: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/240429/eclipse-morphs-suggestion/p1

Thread OP:

@Wrobel, Eclipse needs some tender love and care. I don't know anyone who still uses this ability. It has some very wonky design features that overly limit its use including the one target restriction and the shared CC timer with every other hard CC. The intended mechanics are great, but just not practical in its context. Let me propose a change that I hope you will consider.

Proposed change to the base skill:

Eclipse
Surround yourself with four lightless spheres that intercept any harmful projectiles for 4 seconds. Each projectile intercepted causes a sphere to explode, dealing X Magic damage to nearby enemies. (8m range)

Proposed morphs:

Total Dark [perhaps change the name, Unyielding Light?]
Surround yourself with four lightless spheres that intercept any harmful projectiles for 4 seconds. Each projectile intercepted causes a sphere to explode, dealing X Magic damage to nearby enemies and healing nearby allies for X.

Unstable Core
Surround yourself with four lightless spheres that intercept any harmful projectiles for 4 seconds and grants Major Evasion (20% dodge chance) for 4 seconds. Each projectile intercepted causes a sphere to explode, dealing X Magic damage to nearby enemies. While slotted, you gain Minor Expedition (10% increased movement speed) at all times.

Additional thoughts:
This suggestion gives Templars a defensive ability that is analogous to Reflective Scale but fits more with the Templar niche. It addresses some Templar survivability problems and adds some needed utility (if you troll my thread with BoL hate I will ram my javelin right up your [snip]). Total Dark might be attractive for PvE tanks and PvE/PvP healers, while Unstable Core might be attractive to stamplars and magicka jabplars.

This is one set of ideas and I'm sure there are other great alternatives that have been proposed. Regardless, Eclipse needs an overhaul. I would love to hear some constructive player feedback on this suggestion.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @Wrobel @ZOS this is great idea, and easy to implement, casue u have already flip flap from DKs.. Just animation rework..

themdogesbite

Can we just get @Cinbri in charge of Templar balanceing already? Please?

Cinbri

Further improvements of Light Weaver:
1. Remove increase duration of Radiant Aura.
2. Make ult return to templar below 60% upon using Healing Ritual and Rushed Ceremony skills.
3. Revamp Armor bonus:

• a. grant 6k Armor rate while inside of area of protection of Restoring Light abilities (inside Rune Focus, upon casting Healing Ritaul, inside Cleansing Ritual.) [to buff our zones of protection], or:
• b. Grant 16k Armor rate for 6 sec after using templar ultimates (Sweeps, Nova, Rite of Passage.)
• c. Remove other bonuses and make standing inside of area of protection of Restoring Light abilities to proc major Evasion buff.

Another reason why Eclipse should become self-buff with absorbing: removal of double reflect made this skill even more weak. Now there is no way to counter Scales, even Defensive Stance; so Scales became much more stronger. Templar won't be able to land buffed Vampire Bane and Solar Flare vs users of those skills, but with using of absorbtion Eclipse he won't be killed by his own range skills at least.
Regarding Radaint Aura:
Just rename it and may it work as Equilibrium: restore stamina in cost of mana/hp. Add vuisual effect from npc mages:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5eJCMsiD4c&feature=youtu.be

Mr_Nobody

Have they ever implemented any of the suggestions?

I think we should ask for a certain nerf so they buff other areas. That's how they think.

#ZoS Analysts, Lol.

bertenburnyb16_ESO

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