Dragon knight as a tank?

Diab3ticBatman

Hi all. I want to make my dragon knight a tank, but I keep having resource issues. If I go magicka, I get plenty for my abilities, which almost all of dragon knights tanking abilities are magicka, but then I lack stamina. If I go all stamina then I'm losing magicka. Am I doing something wrong? I tried balancing my CP for both stamina an magicka but I still only have about 200 champ points total and the effect isn't really helping. I only have access to craft able sets at the moment as I don't have footman or engine guardian. Any advice or tips or build ideas from other tanks? My ability bars are as follows

Bar 1: pierce armor, Green dragon blood, absorb magicka, heroic slash, hardened armor. Ulti - corrosive armor

Bar 2: inner fire/pierce armor, eruption, absorb magicka, burning talons, obsidian shield. Ulti - standard of might

I also use 2h in pvp which is why I also lean a bit into stamina.

Thanks to all in advance and appreciate any advice.

Edit: also I should mention I'm only VR1. The reason I have 200 CP is from an alt.

AverageJo3Gam3r

I'm a stam based tank. You can permablock during boss fights, you just have to throw in a heavy attack in between your taunts. Use igneous shield for the stam return, and cast your ultimate when you get low. I rarely need shards.

A few tips:
-put igneous shield on your front bar so you don't need to swap. Cast it whenever your magicka is at full
-you are using two expensive ultimates. I like to use a low cost one and a high cost one, so I have options for the battle roar resource return
-replace absorb magic on the second bar with shuffle. Dodged attacks = an attack you don't have to block
-once you get your resistances up and more comfortable, you'll learn which attacks you don't need to block

Also, what armor sets are you using?

Diab3ticBatman

AverageJo3Gam3r wrote: »

I'm a stam based tank. You can permablock during boss fights, you just have to throw in a heavy attack in between your taunts. Use igneous shield for the stam return, and cast your ultimate when you get low. I rarely need shards.

A few tips:
-put igneous shield on your front bar so you don't need to swap. Cast it whenever your magicka is at full
-you are using two expensive ultimates. I like to use a low cost one and a high cost one, so I have options for the battle roar resource return
-replace absorb magic on the second bar with shuffle. Dodged attacks = an attack you don't have to block
-once you get your resistances up and more comfortable, you'll learn which attacks you don't need to block

Also, what armor sets are you using?

I thought about adding shuffle but what I go with, and struggle debating with myself on, is 5 hist bark with 4 seducers. With hist bark shuffle becomes a wasted slot.I thought about using 5 seducers for the 8% reduced cost for magicka abilities, but not sure on that. Since the blocking change, perma blocking doesn't seem as viable so hist bark might not proc as much as it did before that update. I've also considered white strakes because on top of the damage shield it also gives spell resist. But I hate falling to that low of health so if my build is built around that then I feel I'm already failing as a tank. Putting igneous on bar 1 so I don't have to swap is actually a good idea. I also thought about using chains on one just to help group adds but idk if that's viable. Also in regards to the ultimate, I chose them due to usefulness and battle roar restores based on ultimate cost, but would you recommend ferocious leap there instead? I think it's like 120 cost or something instead of the 200-250 of the ultimate I have now. Which ultimate should I end up keeping on the other bar?
Thanks for your help.

AverageJo3Gam3r

Whitestrakes is good if you have a bad healer. Have you thought about willows path? Ive used that one a bunch and it works out well. For cheap ultimate, leap is good. Dawnbreaker is another one to consider. You'll only use it in emergencies when you need resources.

And this is all for group play. Solo is completely different

Didgerion

Here are several hints:
- Use stamina pots.
- Use reduce block cost enchantments on your jewelry.
- Don't invest CP in stamina regen (it is 0 when you block).
- Invest CP in magica regen.
- Use armor that increases stamina pool.
- Invest CP in reducing magica and stamina skills cost
- Use reflect instead of blocking projectiles.
- Use igneous shield often - it adds to your ultimate regeneration.
- Always do a heavy attack after you blocked a boss heavy attack.
- If you use your Corrosive armor ultimate - don't block for the duration and spam heavy attacks instead.

Diab3ticBatman

AverageJo3Gam3r wrote: »

Whitestrakes is good if you have a bad healer. Have you thought about willows path? Ive used that one a bunch and it works out well. For cheap ultimate, leap is good. Dawnbreaker is another one to consider. You'll only use it in emergencies when you need resources.

And this is all for group play. Solo is completely different

I have considered it as the all around regen sounds pretty good, but I am unsure if that would give me a better benefit than seducers does with the magic recovery and more magic. I thought about maybe going all stamina and using the champion points I have to reduce magicka cost and increase magicka recovery, but again, I'm stuck unsure if it would be viable with only 70 champ points per tree. I don't normally solo stuff, as I usually only play on my tank when running with my buddy who is a dps sorc/side spec healer. I didn't even think of dawn breaker. I still have a bit more levels on my fighters guild for it, but the added weapon damage for slotting it might also help me throw out a bit more dps per hit. Not by all that much, but any is better than none at all. Thanks again for your help. I know the general idea and have read a few guides but most of what they deem a build revolves around either being v16 or having 500 champ points, which I just don't have. Theory crafting can get rather expensive, and being on console I can't run on the PTS so I figured I'd ask here.

Forestd16b14_ESO

..... You do know the dragon knight class was designed to be tanks right ? .............................................................. I just died a little inside.......

Diab3ticBatman

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

..... You do know the dragon knight class was designed to be tanks right ? .............................................................. I just died a little inside.......

I wouldn't say designed necessarily. They do have passives and abilities that benefit but the best tanks I've played with were nightblades. HOWEVER, I get that DKs are good at tanking. My old character was a nightblade dps and I tanked on him for a bit but made this character just to tank. And unlike with my nightblade, which was mostly stamina because I had very few magicka abilities that were useful as a tank as well as had easy resource gain through siphoning strikes, the DK has a lot of magicka abilities so stacking nothing but stamina isn't working the same so I'm struggling. Which is why I asked for help to begin with.

Personofsecrets

The trick is to not balance your stats, but to overly rely on having tons of magic, stamina, or magic regen and abusing the helping hands passive ability.

Diab3ticBatman

Personofsecrets wrote: »

The trick is to not balance your stats, but to overly rely on having tons of magic, stamina, or magic regen and abusing the helping hands passive ability.

That makes sense actually. I'll work on that. Spam igneous shield or another earthen heart ability to get the stamina back that you need. Thanks for the tip.

Forestd16b14_ESO

Diab3ticBatman wrote: »

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

..... You do know the dragon knight class was designed to be tanks right ? .............................................................. I just died a little inside.......

I wouldn't say designed necessarily. They do have passives and abilities that benefit but the best tanks I've played with were nightblades. HOWEVER, I get that DKs are good at tanking. My old character was a nightblade dps and I tanked on him for a bit but made this character just to tank. And unlike with my nightblade, which was mostly stamina because I had very few magicka abilities that were useful as a tank as well as had easy resource gain through siphoning strikes, the DK has a lot of magicka abilities so stacking nothing but stamina isn't working the same so I'm struggling. Which is why I asked for help to begin with.

The DKs have a passive that reduces damage when blocking by a flat 10%. That isn't beneficial that was straight up designed as a tank skill.

Just the magical ones been crying how their useless and now ZOS is making them into pyromancers.

Diab3ticBatman

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Diab3ticBatman wrote: »

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

..... You do know the dragon knight class was designed to be tanks right ? .............................................................. I just died a little inside.......

I wouldn't say designed necessarily. They do have passives and abilities that benefit but the best tanks I've played with were nightblades. HOWEVER, I get that DKs are good at tanking. My old character was a nightblade dps and I tanked on him for a bit but made this character just to tank. And unlike with my nightblade, which was mostly stamina because I had very few magicka abilities that were useful as a tank as well as had easy resource gain through siphoning strikes, the DK has a lot of magicka abilities so stacking nothing but stamina isn't working the same so I'm struggling. Which is why I asked for help to begin with.

The DKs have a passive that reduces damage when blocking by a flat 10%. That isn't beneficial that was straight up designed as a tank skill.

Just the magical ones been crying how their useless and now ZOS is making them into pyromancers.

I'm not saying the class can't be a good tank. I mean I made a DK strictly for that. But if we are talking passives alone, then nightblades could be "made for tanking" because one of their passives, called shadow barrier, gives a big boost to spell resistance and armor when a shadow ability is activated, and is increased by each piece of heavy equipped. Since dps should be wearing medium, this ability is made strictly for tanking. But like I said I'm just having trouble with my build and asked for help. I never said dragon Knights can't tank or asked if they could tank, just how to help me and my DK be a better one.

NBrookus

You can buy Footman, and it has jewelry, so you can run two full 5 piece sets. I doubt you could find a V1 set, though. Keep it in mind for when you level up some. Hist Bark + Footman was a good combo when my DK tank was stamina based, even with Footman maxxed at V14.

Diab3ticBatman

NBrookus wrote: »

You can buy Footman, and it has jewelry, so you can run two full 5 piece sets. I doubt you could find a V1 set, though. Keep it in mind for when you level up some. Hist Bark + Footman was a good combo when my DK tank was stamina based, even with Footman maxxed at V14.

Where can you buy footmans? Guild traders or an actual npc vendor? I'm thinking this might still be the best setup as well, though I still have a ways to go being just a vr1. Just enchant my hist with whatever stat im lacking in. Put most of my attribute points in stamina and health, and then use my champion points for magicka cost reduction and magicka recovery. Using earthen heart abilities can give back stamina as well so that would benefit me. Then use a low cost ultimate to regain my resources when in a tough spot. If you were vr1 is there any gear combo you'd prefer or recommend? I was thinking 5 hist with 4 seducers, or 5 seducers with 4 willows path, but I can't make up my mind. Thanks in advance.

Personofsecrets

Diab3ticBatman wrote: »

Personofsecrets wrote: »

The trick is to not balance your stats, but to overly rely on having tons of magic, stamina, or magic regen and abusing the helping hands passive ability.

That makes sense actually. I'll work on that. Spam igneous shield or another earthen heart ability to get the stamina back that you need. Thanks for the tip.

I prefer the Obsidian Shard ability, but to each their own. Pretty soon the tank will have to use Igneous Weapons because of it's valuable group buff so that will be another earthen heart ability to fit into a tanking rotation.

hrothbern

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Diab3ticBatman wrote: »

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

..... You do know the dragon knight class was designed to be tanks right ? .............................................................. I just died a little inside.......

I wouldn't say designed necessarily. They do have passives and abilities that benefit but the best tanks I've played with were nightblades. HOWEVER, I get that DKs are good at tanking. My old character was a nightblade dps and I tanked on him for a bit but made this character just to tank. And unlike with my nightblade, which was mostly stamina because I had very few magicka abilities that were useful as a tank as well as had easy resource gain through siphoning strikes, the DK has a lot of magicka abilities so stacking nothing but stamina isn't working the same so I'm struggling. Which is why I asked for help to begin with.

The DKs have a passive that reduces damage when blocking by a flat 10%. That isn't beneficial that was straight up designed as a tank skill.

Just the magical ones been crying how their useless and now ZOS is making them into pyromancers.

With the recent cascade of nerfs on the NB Siphoning Tank, during the past 6 months, regarding her only strong point of Resource Management, a DK Tank really shines !

NBrookus

Diab3ticBatman wrote: »

NBrookus wrote: »

You can buy Footman, and it has jewelry, so you can run two full 5 piece sets. I doubt you could find a V1 set, though. Keep it in mind for when you level up some. Hist Bark + Footman was a good combo when my DK tank was stamina based, even with Footman maxxed at V14.

Where can you buy footmans? Guild traders or an actual npc vendor?

Guild traders. Loot and leaderboard rewards from DSA (where Footman drops) are Bind on Equip. You can also farm DSA for Footman if you are so inclined.

At VR1 for a stam tank with resource issues, right now I'd probably pick 5 piece Hist Bark + 4 piece Armor Master; or swap those two.

Also look at the new blue Orzoga recipe from Orsinium to see if one of them addresses your pain points better than regular blue or purple food.

Diab3ticBatman

NBrookus wrote: »

Diab3ticBatman wrote: »

NBrookus wrote: »

You can buy Footman, and it has jewelry, so you can run two full 5 piece sets. I doubt you could find a V1 set, though. Keep it in mind for when you level up some. Hist Bark + Footman was a good combo when my DK tank was stamina based, even with Footman maxxed at V14.

Where can you buy footmans? Guild traders or an actual npc vendor?

Guild traders. Loot and leaderboard rewards from DSA (where Footman drops) are Bind on Equip. You can also farm DSA for Footman if you are so inclined.

At VR1 for a stam tank with resource issues, right now I'd probably pick 5 piece Hist Bark + 4 piece Armor Master; or swap those two.

Also look at the new blue Orzoga recipe from Orsinium to see if one of them addresses your pain points better than regular blue or purple food.

I'll check those two sets out. Yeah I've heard good things about the orzonga food so I'll check that out as well. Thanks.

Steel_Brightblade

I went Max stamina, prismatic enchants on armours, using 5x hist bark, 3x agility, 2x endurance and engine guardian sets. Never have stamina problems, sit on 32K HP, 34K stamina and 20K magic, I use stamina health food. The HP I'd over kill to be honest. For ultimates I USSR corrosive armour occasionally but primarily I use aggressive war horn, use it all the time as that's never a bad time to improve the groups damage. I light attack a lot to charge ultimate.

Diab3ticBatman

Steel_Brightblade wrote: »

I went Max stamina, prismatic enchants on armours, using 5x hist bark, 3x agility, 2x endurance and engine guardian sets. Never have stamina problems, sit on 32K HP, 34K stamina and 20K magic, I use stamina health food. The HP I'd over kill to be honest. For ultimates I USSR corrosive armour occasionally but primarily I use aggressive war horn, use it all the time as that's never a bad time to improve the groups damage. I light attack a lot to charge ultimate.

I might have to do this too but the problem is im only vr1 and so this kind of build is harder for me to pull off. What do both of your bars look like if you don't mind me asking?

Steel_Brightblade

Pierce armour, heroic slash, absorb magic, igneous shield, coagulating dragons blood on main bar, back bar various depending on what I'm doing from bow, 2h or other s&b skills, armour buffs etc.

CaptainPocky

For vet dungeons and most trials I use:

Bar 1 (1H/S): Pierce Armor, Evasion, Deep Slash, Eruption, Talons, Standard
Bar 2 (1H/S): Inner Fire, Engulfing Flames, Chains, Dragon Blood, DK Armor, Damage Shield Leap

I run v14 Bastion (which I need to upgrade with Armor Master), healthy endurance rings, arcane weapons/neck, and 2 random monster pieces for the health bonuses. Champ points in reduce flame and poison damage.

All this gives me ~42k health, 30k resists, and 25k magicka. I'm honestly a bit too tanky though, as its overkill with a healer for most dungeons! I solve that problem by running with 3 DPS though

CaptainPocky

I change it up slightly for Sanctum Ophidia, but I doubt you'll be doing that at v1!

Steel_Brightblade

I believe I initially made my tank based on a build I saw on here called the "enduring dragon" its a good post and the author seems to have done a lot of the math and was happy to answer questions. From his base I evolved it to suit my play style.

Diab3ticBatman

Steel_Brightblade wrote: »

I believe I initially made my tank based on a build I saw on here called the "enduring dragon" its a good post and the author seems to have done a lot of the math and was happy to answer questions. From his base I evolved it to suit my play style.

I googled it and found the post pretty interesting read and getting some tips and things to think about from reading it so thanks for sharing that info.

Steel_Brightblade

No problem, enjoy your tank.

Diab3ticBatman

Steel_Brightblade wrote: »

No problem, enjoy your tank.

Thanks. My first character was a dps nightblade but around VR3-4 I changed him to a tank and before the nerf to siphoning strikes and the block regen nerf i was a forced to be reckoned with, people loved my tanking. Kind of funny tho because I was somewhat of an MMO noob at the time and I meant to pick a DK in the beginning so I was playing questing with a buddy in auridon and I asked him finally "so when do we get to pick our class?" And he's like wait didn't you pick DK when you created your character. Turns out It picked nightblade automatically and didn't know that. So long story but I finally decided to make my DK and since I enjoyed tanking figured I'd make this character a tank. But lot different than my nightblade in many ways, once I figure out all the perks I'll be happy. Again thanks for all the advice definitely have a better idea of how to improve my build.

RoamingRiverElk

Moderately high HP + high max stamina + low or moderate max magicka + low stamina regen + high magicka regen + blocking cost reduction glyphs is good for magicka based tanks - if you purely want to survive and don't need to do damage. Lowering the cost of ultimate with the Potentates set can be good, but since you're v1 it would be very difficult for you to get it... unless it's available as v1 from the specialist vendors in Cyrodiil.

There are many setups for DKs that work for tanking, especially for the regular group dungeons, so go with whichever sets you particularly like.

Diab3ticBatman

RoamingRiverElk wrote: »

Moderately high HP + high max stamina + low or moderate max magicka + low stamina regen + high magicka regen + blocking cost reduction glyphs is good for magicka based tanks - if you purely want to survive and don't need to do damage. Lowering the cost of ultimate with the Potentates set can be good, but since you're v1 it would be very difficult for you to get it... unless it's available as v1 from the specialist vendors in Cyrodiil.

There are many setups for DKs that work for tanking, especially for the regular group dungeons, so go with whichever sets you particularly like.

So simply speaking of craftable sets or vr1 easily obtainable gear, what would you recommend? I know I asked others this but I like multiple opinions. I currently am running 5 seducers with 4 hist, but sometimes go 5 hist with 4 seducers depending on what I'm doing. I balanced my glyphs between magicka and health because I can buy those from npc vendors easy. I don't think they sell the block reduction. I also use the atronach mundus. I used my champ points on magician and arcanist for thief. For Mage I did some in blade expert for the riposte passive, 10 in piercing and 10 in precise strikes, and the rest in mighty. For warrior I split them between block expertise an spell shield on a 3 to 1 ratio, respectively. I also used impenetrable for the trait as I don't have any nirnhoned. My sword has the defending trait. My attribute points I split between health an stamina again on a 3 to 1 ratio. For food I use stamina and health. From the opinions here and the guides I've been reading it seems good but I haven't gotten to test these changes as of yet. But does that sound like a good setup?

Mike0987

Ballance your stats, I think I do 26S, 25H, 13M. And I carry two full sets of gear one for DPS and the other for tanking. If the dungeon level is low enough you can keep your DPS gear on and use sword and shield in your off hand without changing gear all the time.

Wild_Monk

I do not see any interest to play in the class of "Knight of the Dragon". Being a boy for bullying? How ironic, the dragon - a very strong animal .
Just be an armored monster, such as those, who call themselves wizards to help.

I have developed this character to level 31, and forgot it, for several reasons.
At first, in the real PvP combat, DK will not have time to read the wards, namely the protection in this class - the most serious advantage.
Attack from invisibility, a few killers tear this DK for 2 seconds.

Second. The protection level of heavy armor is not much higher , than middle armor. I have medium armor at level 30 - 6000. A heavy armor - 8000. The difference is not great.
Experienced player told me yesterday, that the best armor is average. While I believe, that he is right.