Maintenance for the week of March 25:
• [COMPLETE] ESO Store and Account System for maintenance – March 28, 9:00AM EDT (13:00 UTC) - 12:00PM EDT (16:00 UTC)

Stam Morph for C. Frags

  • CP5
    CP5
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    I like Crystal Blast in PvE, but it has very limited use in PvP because it's VERY rare that you get to just stand there and lob Blasts uninterrupted. Everyone who has been on the forums a long time knows I vouch for Crystal Blast, BUT.....

    ... Crystal Blast is not worth anywhere near what a Stamina morph of Frags would be worth to Sorcs.

    I do not and never have understood the knee-jerk resistance from some Sorcs to Stamina morphs! Seriously, why do YOU care if Stam Sorcs get some love? What does it cost you? Nothing.

    And what's all this HOGWASH about "you should have to suffer the consquences of your decision to choose Stamina, blah blah blah blah..."??? Do you hear Nightblades whining about Surprise Attack? Do you hear Templars grudging against Biting Jabs? NO, you don't hear any such thing, because those morphs have only made their respective classes STRONGER.

    It's not just about one sorc telling another sorc he cant have nice things. If you change one morph that opens the gates for all of the morphs. As suggested in this topic, why not then have a stamina morph or magicka det, and a magicka morph for vigor? why not change Whirling Blades to magicka?

    Don't act as if collectively all the stam sorc got together and decided they JUST want the one morph from crystal frag. The truth of the matter is you're not doing the damage you want to, an want the game to alter its own mechanics to satisfy your need. I chose a sorcerer to cast spells, that locks me out of effectively using the 2 handed skill line, should I get a magicka morph on one of the abilities? It wouldn't effect YOU. It;s a pandora's box that doesnt need to be opened. You would also effectively screw over any currently players (primarily PVEers) who use blast instead of frag. Do those people get a free pass to reset their morph and force them into using frag? Should I be concerned that suddenly my mage;s wrath might turn stamina?

    I'm well aware it's not the most popular opinion, what with stamina ruling the meta, I just dont feel the game should have to compensate for a player based decision, and I fear that should something like this happen, the flood gates will open, every skill will need to be looked at.

    I chose to play a sorc 110% because of the skills, knowing full well that I would run with a bow and medium armor. But the meta changed, and now if you don't stack heavily into one thing or another you won't be doing much of anything. What can a stamina sorcerer use from the dark magic and daedric summoning trees? Pets scale only from magicka damage so that leaves sorcs a toggle from that tree, and in dark magic most of the skills are very expensive and or require high spell damage to be used effectively. This is ESO, a class isn't confined to one particular role an the fact that those who run a stamina sorc are forced to run meta spin or wb builds, complimented by the same few skills that can be used from their class, there isn't some options.

    As for the bolded section, yes, that is what ZOS did in the past when they changed skills, they reset those individual skills that were changed and allowed people to chose to respec or not. And also yes, every skill needs to be looked at, but for far more than allowing build diversity and making more morphs worth using.
  • SmalltalkJava
    SmalltalkJava
    ✭✭✭
    I'm all for stam sorc love. Just not at the expense of blast.
  • Jar_Ek
    Jar_Ek
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    As @CP5 said, the reason that stamina sorcerers want some changes is because the game changed massively when softcaps were removed. At that point stamina morphs were added, they didn't exist before that only stamina weapons.
    Prior to that almost everyone was essentially a hybrid hence sorcerers could use magicka class skills and weapons and do well and still have the identity of a sorcerer - now to be at all competitive in PvP or high end pve, you need to run a stacked stamina or magicka build as DPS is pretty much king and stacking one resource can give both healing /defence and DPS, so hybrids are dead.
    When stamina class morphs came in, sorcerers were left out in the cold and petitioned and got some changes but not many and not ones that really opened many options up to use class skills and hence get any benefit from class passive lines. Hence why stamina sorcerers would like some more changes.

    The following are pretty much what stamina sorcerers would like

    1a. Change Crystal Blast to Crystal Punch, a stamina/weapon power/weapon crit scaling ability that acts like a melee range version of Crystal Frags, cast time with chance of instant proc on stamina ability usage included.
    1b. Change Daedric Tomb to Daedric Weapon, a stamina/weapon power/weapon crit scaling ability that arms your melee weapon with a 'bomb' that explodes on the first heavy attack (full or partial) used 3 seconds after activation.
    1c. Change Mage's Wrath (or Endless Fury) to Spellsword's Fury, a stamina/weapon power/weapon crit scaling ability that does more base damage than Mage's Fury but has less execute potential.
    2. Performing a melee attack resets Streak's stacking cost increase.
    3. Enable one morph of conjured ward to scale off health rather than magicka (empowered).
    4. Make Exploitation passive give Minor Weapon Crit to go along with the Spell Crit.
    5. Make surge work with DoTs in a nice way or at least with channels (ie flurry)
    6. Summoned pets to scale with stamina or magicka.
  • Pepper8Jack
    Pepper8Jack
    ✭✭✭
    Clarification: As I said in the original post, I don't want a stam scaling version of C. Frags, I would greatly prefer something unique that would therefore further solidify the identity of stamina sorcs (as opposed to being identical to magicka sorcs, as some people have complained about).

    Also, eso isn't wow. Elder scrolls games have always been about freedom. Why shouldn't we be free to make a viable stamina based sorcerer? And while we're at it, why not one that doesn't have to rely on 2h to deal damage? (tbh that statement is true for just about all classes).

    But this thread wasn't meant to be a debate over whether or not people should be allowed to make stamina sorcs, so getting back on track here:

    I absolutely love the crystal blade idea a couple people have thrown out, and I am absolutely up for a stam morph of mages fury though I really wouldn't want to lose either of the morphs that presently exist...
  • Pepper8Jack
    Pepper8Jack
    ✭✭✭
    Jar_Ek wrote: »

    The following are pretty much what stamina sorcerers would like

    1a. Change Crystal Blast to Crystal Punch, a stamina/weapon power/weapon crit scaling ability that acts like a melee range version of Crystal Frags, cast time with chance of instant proc on stamina ability usage included.
    1b. Change Daedric Tomb to Daedric Weapon, a stamina/weapon power/weapon crit scaling ability that arms your melee weapon with a 'bomb' that explodes on the first heavy attack (full or partial) used 3 seconds after activation.
    1c. Change Mage's Wrath (or Endless Fury) to Spellsword's Fury, a stamina/weapon power/weapon crit scaling ability that does more base damage than Mage's Fury but has less execute potential.
    2. Performing a melee attack resets Streak's stacking cost increase.
    3. Enable one morph of conjured ward to scale off health rather than magicka (empowered).
    4. Make Exploitation passive give Minor Weapon Crit to go along with the Spell Crit.
    5. Make surge work with DoTs in a nice way or at least with channels (ie flurry)
    6. Summoned pets to scale with stamina or magicka.

    1a: I think I'd rather it not have a proc chance because it makes it too similar to C. Frags
    1b: Agree, maybe make it exclusive to full and lose the 3 second activation
    1c: agree
    2: no way, that would open the door to magicka sorcs loopholing back to the reason why we ended up with stacking costs to begin with
    3: ehhh, I'm okay with not having a ward. We are wearing more than light armor now after all
    4: No brainer
    5: I'm okay with the concept of this but not sure how that could specifically be worked out
    6: At least one pet. I'm okay with pets being a magicka thing, but losing an entire class tree does hurt
  • Dexter411
    Dexter411
    ✭✭✭
    How about We change EVERYTHING!
    Give all 4 classes same abilites but only with different animation? Huh sounds fun! And oh i know, Give those abilites same numbers, same effects. YEY! That is what i want! I need it. ZOS plox do it.

    But seriously, first fix real problems with balancing four classes then we can make threads about "i play as x class i need y ability"
  • Pepper8Jack
    Pepper8Jack
    ✭✭✭
    Dexter411 wrote: »
    How about We change EVERYTHING!
    Give all 4 classes same abilites but only with different animation? Huh sounds fun! And oh i know, Give those abilites same numbers, same effects. YEY! That is what i want! I need it. ZOS plox do it.

    But seriously, first fix real problems with balancing four classes then we can make threads about "i play as x class i need y ability"

    I'm with you on prioritising class balance and bugs, but I see no reason why we can't throw around ideas for what could make a playstyle more viable while we wait for those things to be fixed. It's not as if we slow down ZOS with these kinds of discussions
  • Jar_Ek
    Jar_Ek
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Just for info that list has been around since August 2015, the discussion has been around for longer.
    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/209120/stamina-sorcerers-the-next-steps-for-zos/p1

    As for the specifics I am inclined to agree with you, I think that a direct stamina c. frgas copy is not the way to go and am not hard over art the streak modification esp. if there would be unpleasant unintended consequences. I think the ward changes for Empowered would be to support a tank playstyle with stamina sorcerers - it really wouldn't help DPS much.

  • Solariken
    Solariken
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭
    NobleNerd wrote: »
    More and more this whole stamina/magicka based abilities on every single class is causing a huge identity crisis for the classes!

    Instead of going deeper and deeper into the abyss of every single class playing so similar to every single class.... let's pull out of it by removing any resource scaling on any ability. Let's give each class it's own identity and have physical damage/spellpower be achieved through other options (i.e enchanting, potions, set bonuses, etc).

    #BringBackClassIdentity

    This is a very interesting idea! I would love to see more discussion on this.
  • PrinceBoru
    PrinceBoru
    ✭✭✭✭
    So wait.. you chose the stamina route on a class designed for magicka and now you want to be the same as a magicka build? Wheres the line? That's supposed to be a drawback of choosing stam over magicka.

    My thoughts exactly.


    It ain't easy being green.
  • Ahzek
    Ahzek
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Whats really funny about the past stam sorc buffs is that they only made magicka sorcs stronger, while kinda leaving to be desired by stam sorcs.
    Due to the changes to thundering presence magicka sorcs now get the benefit from both "old" morphs of lighning form.

    With the buffs to daedric protection now every mag sorc has 20% more stam regen cause they always run curse and ward, while stam sorcs are now kinda forced to restrict their slots with bound armor, or drop an ult slot for the pretty weak(as stam build) storm atro.

    Following that line of thought it seems pretty likely, if ZOS should introduce a stam frag at the expense of crystal blast, that mag sorc sjust get ale dmg slapped ontop of the cirrent frag morph ...
    Jo'Khaljor
Sign In or Register to comment.