IC making a comeback

PainfulFAFA

"comeback"
its full of cheeseblades

Manoekin

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

"comeback"
its full of cheeseblades

RIP

helediron

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

We have discussed making IC an instance which all campaigns flood into, however that requires some heavy back end work to Campaign & server structure with linking the zones associated to Cyrodiil. Simply put, it would take a very long time to get that implemented and live and it's not as easy as it sounds.

Move the whole current sewers implementation to under Coldharbour as veteran PvE area. Currently it has almost nothing to do with PvP. Remove TV stones and let it be the PvE grind place. Lorewise and structurally it fits there perfectly - both are roughly triangles. After that, as a PvE player, i suggest ZOS to redesign IC sewers and districts completely for PvP. No need to flood them into one, but design them as integral part of campaigns.

There is probably very few PvE players who care about IC. We do care about XP from grinds and vr16 materials. XP grind could move to Coldharbour underworld and by stopping the strangling of vr16 mats in Wrothgar, there will be no complains from PvE players. Feel free to make IC a pure PvP area, it is part of Cyro after all. The hybrid surely got money from both segments, but ultimately made IC to fail.

Psilent

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

"comeback"
its full of cheeseblades

Ran into these same players today in IC. I think it was Temple district. Saved a few EP, even 1 AD, that was getting pummeled by their skill spam. They tried over and over to kill me, but fossilize and jabs OP! Hehe

In the end, they left my group of 2 alone. XD

KenaPKK

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

@Yolokin_Swagonborn

Considering that my guild was the driving force behind at least EP getting access twice in one day. And I was in no way shape or form influenced by your post, it's just something I do.

Maybe DC was motivated by your post, or maybe it was pure coincidence. But it's not something that will last, the EP group that followed us will clear out the sewers soon until they get bored and AD eventually comes back in peace. And DC tried to lock EP out of the sewers, so that they could farm AD alone but were stopped.

Don't get me wrong, as fun as it was to farm AD I am actually in agreement with you. But I've seen AD vanish for a week or so, wait for EP to get bored and leave, many times.

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Good, bring the small scale pvp to AoB. We bumped into both AD and EP last night, and had good fights.

There are only a few EP players in the sewers, nothing small-scale worthy. The one small EP guild I mentioned is also not small-scale worthy, at least compared to the DC that went in.

There is especially no small-scale PvP coming from AD there, Axe is as close as you can get to farming Auridon PvErs. People who are willing to bargain stones via whisper, in exchange for you leaving them alone to grind for a few hours. AD on Axe aren't interested in PvP in any way shape or form, they will clear out for a while and come back quietly when the dust settles.

Besides we've been trying to promote small-scale here -> http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/234850/temporary-small-scale-pvp-solution-lets-agree-to-make-haderus-a-small-scale-pvp-zone/p1

Actually, a decent amount of EP made it into the sewers. They run around in a 4-5 man group and we've had quite a few good fights with them while wandering the sewers. As for AD, there are plenty of AD pvpers who are in there as well; though they may not be there for PvP specifically, they know there are other alliances in there and do fight when a fight is initiated. We've actually had people who have whispered and told us "gf" and stuff like that. For the most part, we kill and move on. I even gave a lowbie grinding soul gems and wished him luck :P

As for Haderus: I play on Haderus often as well, and it's not small scale. Both EP and AD move in massive groups, so the promotion of small scale there failed.

Don't expect immediate success. We're still working on Had, and I for one am making some good progress on the blueberry side.

WRX

newtinmpls wrote: »

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

We have discussed making IC an instance which all campaigns flood into, however that requires some heavy back end work to Campaign & server structure with linking the zones associated to Cyrodiil. Simply put, it would take a very long time to get that implemented and live and it's not as easy as it sounds.

Great... in the way of NOT

This would mean that when certain "I'm in the 1% streaming with my loyal fanboyz watching" peeps are farming an instance of IC there would be no alternate choice.

There are enough problems with bullies, you don't need to make it worse.

And I make a strong distinction between "it's PvP, expect to get fought" and bullying. They are NOT the same.

You have got to be kidding me.

Winnamine

WRX wrote: »

newtinmpls wrote: »

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

We have discussed making IC an instance which all campaigns flood into, however that requires some heavy back end work to Campaign & server structure with linking the zones associated to Cyrodiil. Simply put, it would take a very long time to get that implemented and live and it's not as easy as it sounds.

Great... in the way of NOT

This would mean that when certain "I'm in the 1% streaming with my loyal fanboyz watching" peeps are farming an instance of IC there would be no alternate choice.

There are enough problems with bullies, you don't need to make it worse.

And I make a strong distinction between "it's PvP, expect to get fought" and bullying. They are NOT the same.

You have got to be kidding me.

Special snowflake is special.

Ok but really, what has been happening that seems more like bullying than pvp to you?

Enodoc

Dreyloch wrote: »

But the fact that PvE'ers would be cut off from PvE dungeons, made it the way it is.

They wouldn't be cut off at all. You don't even need to enter Cyrodiil to get to the dungeons, as you can port straight there from any wayshrine.

Docmandu

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

The event has been getting reset/monitored by our CS crew every few hours on each of our platforms/regions. If they see that it's in a bad state, they run a few commands and it gets fixed. We have a less human resources intensive fix coming in the next incremental patch however.

Other changes to IC are going through their design phases now and we'll have more details on those when the time comes. The changes are directed at making districts more meaningful to Imperial City itself and Tel Var stone acquisition rates are being looked into.

Very easy fix: remove 50% of the mobs so non-NBs can actually PvP down there without pulling 5+ mobs each time.

As for redesign.. I hope non of the people required for fixing Cyrodiil performance will be occupied by that. Not sure how much longer most of us are willing to endure the lag.

Synnkar

helediron wrote: »

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

We have discussed making IC an instance which all campaigns flood into, however that requires some heavy back end work to Campaign & server structure with linking the zones associated to Cyrodiil. Simply put, it would take a very long time to get that implemented and live and it's not as easy as it sounds.

Move the whole current sewers implementation to under Coldharbour as veteran PvE area. Currently it has almost nothing to do with PvP. Remove TV stones and let it be the PvE grind place. Lorewise and structurally it fits there perfectly - both are roughly triangles. After that, as a PvE player, i suggest ZOS to redesign IC sewers and districts completely for PvP. No need to flood them into one, but design them as integral part of campaigns.

There is probably very few PvE players who care about IC. We do care about XP from grinds and vr16 materials. XP grind could move to Coldharbour underworld and by stopping the strangling of vr16 mats in Wrothgar, there will be no complains from PvE players. Feel free to make IC a pure PvP area, it is part of Cyro after all. The hybrid surely got money from both segments, but ultimately made IC to fail.

Horrible suggestion. Please keep the IC as a PvP zone (including sewers), it is really outstanding when it works. The whole telvar stone risk vs. reward thing is really great and meaningful. But:

- Add a lot more content/objectives to it, especially the city, like grabbing districts, etc. so it has a continued purpose
- Increase rewards to account for the increased risks (which would in turn increase the risks by drawing more hunters) in the sewers

TheBull

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

The event has been getting reset/monitored by our CS crew every few hours on each of our platforms/regions. If they see that it's in a bad state, they run a few commands and it gets fixed. We have a less human resources intensive fix coming in the next incremental patch however.

Other changes to IC are going through their design phases now and we'll have more details on those when the time comes. The changes are directed at making districts more meaningful to Imperial City itself and Tel Var stone acquisition rates are being looked into.

TV stone acquisition won't matter without better rewards to spend them on...

Xsorus

Darlgon wrote: »

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

We have discussed making IC an instance which all campaigns flood into, however that requires some heavy back end work to Campaign & server structure with linking the zones associated to Cyrodiil. Simply put, it would take a very long time to get that implemented and live and it's not as easy as it sounds.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler I used to like the concept of IC and outer Cyro being population linked. No longer. We will have three bars of EP on at night.. and 20 defenders.. no one cares about the keeps, since they dont do anything inside. The idea behind locking Cyro with keeps was that, if you could not get below ground, you had to take back keeps. Since that is no longer the case, there is absolutely no reason to keep people from running from base to IC and ignoring keep defenses. If you are gonna do a major change, can you look at unlinking the two parts of Cyrodiil population? I mean.. the zone chats are already seperate.

Oh.. and..now that I think about it.. wouldnt a special wayshrine from base to the base inside IC accomplish this? Join campaign, then wayshrine into IC? That way, you would not have to link IC to PVE.

He does have a point; there is no reason to link the population if you are just going to open it up full time to everyone, the whole point of linked population is if you can pull people who are over populated and have access to the dungeon, if anyone can join its just making the lower population side have less people to defend

Derra

TheBull wrote: »

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

The event has been getting reset/monitored by our CS crew every few hours on each of our platforms/regions. If they see that it's in a bad state, they run a few commands and it gets fixed. We have a less human resources intensive fix coming in the next incremental patch however.

Other changes to IC are going through their design phases now and we'll have more details on those when the time comes. The changes are directed at making districts more meaningful to Imperial City itself and Tel Var stone acquisition rates are being looked into.

TV stone acquisition won't matter without better rewards to spend them on...

So much this ^

The aquisition rate of them is fine imho anyway. There is just nothing to spend them on.

kojou

Derra wrote: »

TheBull wrote: »

ZOS_BrianWheeler wrote: »

The event has been getting reset/monitored by our CS crew every few hours on each of our platforms/regions. If they see that it's in a bad state, they run a few commands and it gets fixed. We have a less human resources intensive fix coming in the next incremental patch however.

Other changes to IC are going through their design phases now and we'll have more details on those when the time comes. The changes are directed at making districts more meaningful to Imperial City itself and Tel Var stone acquisition rates are being looked into.

TV stone acquisition won't matter without better rewards to spend them on...

So much this ^

The aquisition rate of them is fine imho anyway. There is just nothing to spend them on.

I agree... I can get a couple thousand stones in no time. There is just nothing left for me to do with them once I have them.

josh.lackey_ESO

OdinForge wrote: »

@Yolokin_Swagonborn

Considering that my guild was the driving force behind at least EP getting access twice in one day. And I was in no way shape or form influenced by your post, it's just something I do.

Maybe DC was motivated by your post, or maybe it was pure coincidence. But it's not something that will last, the EP group that followed us will clear out the sewers soon until they get bored and AD eventually comes back in peace. And DC tried to lock EP out of the sewers, so that they could farm AD alone but were stopped.

Don't get me wrong, as fun as it was to farm AD I am actually in agreement with you. But I've seen AD vanish for a week or so, wait for EP to get bored and leave, many times.

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Good, bring the small scale pvp to AoB. We bumped into both AD and EP last night, and had good fights.

There are only a few EP players in the sewers, nothing small-scale worthy. The one small EP guild I mentioned is also not small-scale worthy, at least compared to the DC that went in.

There is especially no small-scale PvP coming from AD there, Axe is as close as you can get to farming Auridon PvErs. People who are willing to bargain stones via whisper, in exchange for you leaving them alone to grind for a few hours. AD on Axe aren't interested in PvP in any way shape or form, they will clear out for a while and come back quietly when the dust settles.

Besides we've been trying to promote small-scale here -> http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/234850/temporary-small-scale-pvp-solution-lets-agree-to-make-haderus-a-small-scale-pvp-zone/p1

Every faction should be able to go to a faction-exclusive IC, because some of us don't care for the ganking. I have personally not bought IC because of the ganking, nor will I until it's sorted out. It's got nothing to do with PvP; I spend most of my game time in Cyrodiil. I just don't like how IC rewards cheap-shotting scumbags.

starlizard70ub17_ESO

I'm not sure that IC is making a come back as much as people are finally getting burnt out on Worthgar. I've ran 5 V16 charactors through the storyline and most of the quests there, and what's left. Cycle through the daily world bosses in a group for some xp and the same BoP items I don't need, again. I've gone back to the AoB sewers for better xp gains, trophies and some PvP from time to time. If I happen to make it out with TV stones, great, but those are more like a bonus then anything else.
The biggest fail with how IC works and relates to Cryodiil is this; On 3 seperate charactors I went through AoB topside, completed all of the quests, did all the dungeons, picked up all the skyshards, etc... and saw opposing DC and EP players only a few times, mainly grinding in Cracked Wood Cave. Actually only saw AD players only a few times also. Everyone is in IC and topside Cryodiil is at best an afterthought. While it may be good in theory, in practice no one leaves IC in a gated campaign.

Ezareth

starlizard70ub17_ESO wrote: »

I've gone back to the AoB sewers for better xp gains, trophies and some PvP from time to time. If I happen to make it out with TV stones, great, but those are more like a bonus then anything else.

My biggest Beef is the design with how Tel Var Stones are awarded via PvP.

If I want to Grind Tel Var stones I'll usually do it somewhere on my side working between the starting area and the center clearing each room as I go. Over the course of several hours I'll consistently be attacked over and over by nightblades or small groups looking to gank. My problem is I usually kill these players but they never carry any stones and by fighting them I'm putting my own stones at risk (which is usually between 1-2K or 30-40 minutes of "work").

I think Tel Var stones awarded in PvP needs to have some sort of associated "Risk" by the player who is trying to gank. There are many skilled PvPers like @FENGRUSH who will go to an area via the sewers, kill several players/small groups and take their stones and then port safely back home, dump them all in the bank and then rinse/repeat.

I think if you get ganked by a player with zero stones then at most they should only be able to take 10% of your stones just like a PvE Mob. If you have stones I think you should have a change to take more stones based upon the number of stones you're carrying. I don't think you should be able to take more stones from someone than you're carrying yourself beyond the 10%. (Maybe even 20% but definitely not 80%).

I want to see some PvP action between players who all have something to lose if they want to be able to take loot from others. I'll often get jumped by <Insert random NB terribad here> several times trying to make my way back to the base and get zero stones from him each time I kill him but if he attacks me at the right time and manages to kill me once, I lose 80% of my stones which is BS IMO. If they have zero stones they shouldn't have a chance to take the majority of mine.

Being attacked and killed by large groups should similarly reduce the Maximum percentage of stones you are awarded...otherwise in the event Tel Var stones ever become desirable again the whole of IC will be overrun with zergs farming solo players hard earned stones again. Promote small man combat, not zergs!

On the flip side If I'm trying to do some actual PvP, run into a small group, kill everyone but the last player who then flees to the nearest sweeper and then suicides I get no stones from him which is BS.

Being awarded stones shouldn't be a last hit mechanic. It should be the *exact* same formula that is used to determine AP awarded from the maximum possible pool. If I do 90% of the damage to a player I should get 90% of my maximum possible stone award from them regardless of who gets the killing blow. Killing blow mechanics promote people gaming the system and they are skewed towards players who have damage shields and can stand in Boss AoE mechanics for example.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler do you guys have any plans in the works to change how Tel Var stones are awarded?

OdinForge

josh.lackey_ESO wrote: »

Every faction should be able to go to a faction-exclusive IC, because some of us don't care for the ganking. I have personally not bought IC because of the ganking, nor will I until it's sorted out. It's got nothing to do with PvP; I spend most of my game time in Cyrodiil. I just don't like how IC rewards cheap-shotting scumbags.

Every campaign should be gated, or none should be gated at all.

I have personally not bought IC because of the ganking, nor will I until it's sorted out. It's got nothing to do with PvP

As much as I agree that it really is a "useless PvP update", it is still a PvP update like it or not. And it's likely the only PvP update (aside from future potential arenas and battlegrounds) we're gonna get.

If you're in a PvP zone, you're gonna get PvP that's how it works. Put on some better gear, maybe try some impen and fight back.

One thing that I've always felt, you should be able to gank stones if you're carrying close to or equal amounts of stones. Risk / reward, not 0 risk / all reward.

zyk

josh.lackey_ESO wrote: »

Every faction should be able to go to a faction-exclusive IC, because some of us don't care for the ganking. I have personally not bought IC because of the ganking, nor will I until it's sorted out. It's got nothing to do with PvP; I spend most of my game time in Cyrodiil. I just don't like how IC rewards cheap-shotting scumbags.

IC needs some work, but a PVE only version of it would be extremely boring. IMO, it should be a high risk/high reward area. Choosing to go there should require a strategy to deal with gankers.

I duo'd in IC to help a friend grind mats recently, and dealing with the gankers is what made it enjoyable -- vs a boring, mindless grind against predictable NPCs.

Celas_Dranacea

IC is awesome, I find time to run around in there each week. I've made a lot of new friends by just randomly inviting people or joining groups while I'm on the AD side of the sewers farming CP and telvar stones, or making runs to the center.

I do also love going to the enemy sewers to see how long I can survive ganking - it's a really fun test of skill.

Lastly sometimes I'll go up top for death match style mindless killing - I'll admit not for the daily quests though.

I like the population the way it is in IC. at times there are not many people in there so I can pve grind/farm efficiently without interruption, save the occasional 1v1 or small group encounter. At others the population is higher and I go into pvp mode.

For me a successful IC is not defined by huge numbers of people in there at all times.

There's been good suggestions for adding new objectives etc but I can see myself playing in IC just like it is for a long time.

Lava_Croft

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

"comeback"
its full of cheeseblades

That probably would have ended way different if it were 3 players of any other class, right? You would have totally rekt them!

Right?

PainfulFAFA

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

"comeback"
its full of cheeseblades

That probably would have ended way different if it were 3 players of any other class, right? You would have totally rekt them!

Right?

If Lotus Fan was dodgeable and if I had control over my character when I get spAmbushed; absolutely it would've been different.

Lava_Croft

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

"comeback"
its full of cheeseblades

That probably would have ended way different if it were 3 players of any other class, right? You would have totally rekt them!

Right?

If Lotus Fan was dodgeable and if I had control over my character when I get spAmbushed; absolutely it would've been different.

Because both of those things are exclusive to Nightblades, right? Lotus Fan is the only skill that's weird with dodge and Ambush is the only gap closer that has the stupid mini stun.

It's not a nerf Nightblades thread.

Poxheart

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

"comeback"
its full of cheeseblades

That probably would have ended way different if it were 3 players of any other class, right? You would have totally rekt them!

Right?

If Lotus Fan was dodgeable and if I had control over my character when I get spAmbushed; absolutely it would've been different.

Because both of those things are exclusive to Nightblades, right? Lotus Fan is the only skill that's weird with dodge and Ambush is the only gap closer that has the stupid mini stun.

It's not a nerf Nightblades thread.

Ambush is the only gap closer with no minimum range, so yeah this is now a nerf Nightblades thread.

PainfulFAFA

Poxheart wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

"comeback"
its full of cheeseblades

That probably would have ended way different if it were 3 players of any other class, right? You would have totally rekt them!

Right?

If Lotus Fan was dodgeable and if I had control over my character when I get spAmbushed; absolutely it would've been different.

Because both of those things are exclusive to Nightblades, right? Lotus Fan is the only skill that's weird with dodge and Ambush is the only gap closer that has the stupid mini stun.

It's not a nerf Nightblades thread.

Ambush is the only gap closer with no minimum range, so yeah this is now a nerf fix Nightblades thread.

Fixed.

Lava_Croft

Poxheart wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

"comeback"
its full of cheeseblades

That probably would have ended way different if it were 3 players of any other class, right? You would have totally rekt them!

Right?

If Lotus Fan was dodgeable and if I had control over my character when I get spAmbushed; absolutely it would've been different.

Because both of those things are exclusive to Nightblades, right? Lotus Fan is the only skill that's weird with dodge and Ambush is the only gap closer that has the stupid mini stun.

It's not a nerf Nightblades thread.

Ambush is the only gap closer with no minimum range, so yeah this is now a nerf Nightblades thread.

There's quite a few skills that are special in one way or the other. What you suggest is one big soup of the same working skills that just have different names and art assets.

Gap closers needs their stupid mini stun fixed. Once this is done, no decent player is going to die to Teleport Strike spam.

PainfulFAFA

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Poxheart wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

"comeback"
its full of cheeseblades

That probably would have ended way different if it were 3 players of any other class, right? You would have totally rekt them!

Right?

If Lotus Fan was dodgeable and if I had control over my character when I get spAmbushed; absolutely it would've been different.

Because both of those things are exclusive to Nightblades, right? Lotus Fan is the only skill that's weird with dodge and Ambush is the only gap closer that has the stupid mini stun.

It's not a nerf Nightblades thread.

Ambush is the only gap closer with no minimum range, so yeah this is now a nerf Nightblades thread.

There's quite a few skills that are special in one way or the other. What you suggest is one big soup of the same working skills that just have different names and art assets.

Gap closers needs their stupid mini stun fixed. Once this is done, no decent player is going to die to Teleport Strike spam.

I don't think you know that teleport strike has a root (aka immobilize).
In other words, as a NB i can be up in your face SAing you and weaving/spamming ambush (while still up in your face).

That is the most annoying part of this particular gap closer and IC is infested with this.

Lava_Croft

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Poxheart wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

"comeback"
its full of cheeseblades

That probably would have ended way different if it were 3 players of any other class, right? You would have totally rekt them!

Right?

If Lotus Fan was dodgeable and if I had control over my character when I get spAmbushed; absolutely it would've been different.

Because both of those things are exclusive to Nightblades, right? Lotus Fan is the only skill that's weird with dodge and Ambush is the only gap closer that has the stupid mini stun.

It's not a nerf Nightblades thread.

Ambush is the only gap closer with no minimum range, so yeah this is now a nerf Nightblades thread.

There's quite a few skills that are special in one way or the other. What you suggest is one big soup of the same working skills that just have different names and art assets.

Gap closers needs their stupid mini stun fixed. Once this is done, no decent player is going to die to Teleport Strike spam.

I don't think you know that teleport strike has a root (aka immobilize).
In other words, as a NB i can be up in your face SAing you and weaving/spamming ambush (while still up in your face).

That is the most annoying part of this particular gap closer and IC is infested with this.

Funny then how 3 Nightblades spamming Ambush and Surprise Attack are still a joke compared to 3 people spamming Wrecking Blow, but I guess since Wrecking Blow is not a Nightblade skill it doesn't fit into the current agenda of Nerf Nightblades.

Like I said, 3 players of any other class and you would have been rekt just as hard.

FENGRUSH

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Poxheart wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

Lava_Croft wrote: »

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

"comeback"
its full of cheeseblades

That probably would have ended way different if it were 3 players of any other class, right? You would have totally rekt them!

Right?

If Lotus Fan was dodgeable and if I had control over my character when I get spAmbushed; absolutely it would've been different.

Because both of those things are exclusive to Nightblades, right? Lotus Fan is the only skill that's weird with dodge and Ambush is the only gap closer that has the stupid mini stun.

It's not a nerf Nightblades thread.

Ambush is the only gap closer with no minimum range, so yeah this is now a nerf Nightblades thread.

There's quite a few skills that are special in one way or the other. What you suggest is one big soup of the same working skills that just have different names and art assets.

Gap closers needs their stupid mini stun fixed. Once this is done, no decent player is going to die to Teleport Strike spam.

I don't think you know that teleport strike has a root (aka immobilize).
In other words, as a NB i can be up in your face SAing you and weaving/spamming ambush (while still up in your face).

That is the most annoying part of this particular gap closer and IC is infested with this.

Funny then how 3 Nightblades spamming Ambush and Surprise Attack are still a joke compared to 3 people spamming Wrecking Blow, but I guess since Wrecking Blow is not a Nightblade skill it doesn't fit into the current agenda of Nerf Nightblades.

Like I said, 3 players of any other class and you would have been rekt just as hard.

Id fight 3 people WBing over ambushes any day - at least I can maintain control of my character and movement. Thats pretty important for me when trying to use skills to do anything.

BuggeX

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

"comeback"
its full of cheeseblades

i dont see nothing wrong, the first 3 ambush/Lotus Comes from 3 different Players, all 3 engaged with theyr gap closer.
one of them used his main dmg surce, SA. I gues you tryed to escap or rolldoge, cause of this the last gap closer killed you.

Im not saying gap closer arent broken, but the deathrecap Show a legitim move from a Group of 3 Nbs