So, ZOS... Any Plans To Nerf Wrecking Blow?

Khaos_Bane

It's called wrecking blow for a reason ! Stop being ridiculous OP !

Callous2208

robkrush wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

robkrush wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

I haven't landed a clean wb in forever. Everyone just moves out of range, blocks, or rolls. I just keep it on the bar because you know, what else does a stamplar have? How are people using this so effectively? Out of stealth?

CC then WB.

Ah gotcha. So basically my temp will never be using wb to its full potential.

You lead with that flying spear attack that knocks down enemies, plus it's great mobility a perfect opener, then jabs or WB. That's all you need as a temp. Use immovable and rally(if you use WB) prior to leaping. Maybe some wards or heals. Maybe purifying light right before your leap to mark them and add to your damage.

I was just being silly. But yea that charge is still buggy as hell. I just crit charge now.

Phinix1

I came in like a wreeeeecking bloooooooooow!

Tankqull

Callous2208 wrote: »

robkrush wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

robkrush wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

I haven't landed a clean wb in forever. Everyone just moves out of range, blocks, or rolls. I just keep it on the bar because you know, what else does a stamplar have? How are people using this so effectively? Out of stealth?

CC then WB.

Ah gotcha. So basically my temp will never be using wb to its full potential.

You lead with that flying spear attack that knocks down enemies, plus it's great mobility a perfect opener, then jabs or WB. That's all you need as a temp. Use immovable and rally(if you use WB) prior to leaping. Maybe some wards or heals. Maybe purifying light right before your leap to mark them and add to your damage.

I was just being silly. But yea that charge is still buggy as hell. I just crit charge now.

use stampede the 60% snare enables you to spam WB to your hearts content...

Callous2208

Tankqull wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

robkrush wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

robkrush wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

I haven't landed a clean wb in forever. Everyone just moves out of range, blocks, or rolls. I just keep it on the bar because you know, what else does a stamplar have? How are people using this so effectively? Out of stealth?

CC then WB.

Ah gotcha. So basically my temp will never be using wb to its full potential.

You lead with that flying spear attack that knocks down enemies, plus it's great mobility a perfect opener, then jabs or WB. That's all you need as a temp. Use immovable and rally(if you use WB) prior to leaping. Maybe some wards or heals. Maybe purifying light right before your leap to mark them and add to your damage.

I was just being silly. But yea that charge is still buggy as hell. I just crit charge now.

use stampede the 60% snare enables you to spam WB to your hearts content...

Yea I need to change over to that. Trying to readjust some things now that I'm attempting to pvp a bit more.

Spacemonkey

Morimizo wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

Add long reach spears to kill WB-spammers?

This a very reasonable suggestion, but against ZOS/Bethesda policy for players to use polearms. Most likely a secret Daedric contract signed in 2003, not sure what they got in return.

They obtained a non functional 'radiant' AI. But it wasn't just polearms, it was also crossbows and an assortment of skills and spells: mark, recall, levitate, oh how I miss you all

dodgehopper_ESO

robkrush wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

I haven't landed a clean wb in forever. Everyone just moves out of range, blocks, or rolls. I just keep it on the bar because you know, what else does a stamplar have? How are people using this so effectively? Out of stealth?

CC then WB.

Templars have the weakest cc, which explains why Callous is having some level of difficulty. It is possible to binding javelin --> Charge of some kind ---> WB though.

dodgehopper_ESO

robkrush wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

robkrush wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

I haven't landed a clean wb in forever. Everyone just moves out of range, blocks, or rolls. I just keep it on the bar because you know, what else does a stamplar have? How are people using this so effectively? Out of stealth?

CC then WB.

Ah gotcha. So basically my temp will never be using wb to its full potential.

You lead with that flying spear attack that knocks down enemies, plus it's great mobility a perfect opener, then jabs or WB. That's all you need as a temp. Use immovable and rally(if you use WB) prior to leaping. Maybe some wards or heals. Maybe purifying light right before your leap to mark them and add to your damage.

Power of the light is really the only stamplar move in dawn's wrath... and in its current iteration its just not good in any morph or unmorphed. Reapers mark is 1,000 times better, maybe 1,000,000.

robkrush

dodgehopper_ESO wrote: »

robkrush wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

I haven't landed a clean wb in forever. Everyone just moves out of range, blocks, or rolls. I just keep it on the bar because you know, what else does a stamplar have? How are people using this so effectively? Out of stealth?

CC then WB.

Templars have the weakest cc, which explains why Callous is having some level of difficulty. It is possible to binding javelin --> Charge of some kind ---> WB though.

Read on. We've discussed all this already. Thanks.

Khaos_Bane

Looks like someone wrecking blow yo face.

Patouf

NB have very very good stamorph skills.

Up stam morph for the others class, WB is too easy and appealing for PvP (=spam).

leepalmer95

Patouf wrote: »

NB have very very good stamorph skills.

Up stam morph for the others class, WB is too easy and appealing for PvP (=spam).

Well stam dk's don't have any other choice to use wb if they wan't to dps,

2h skill line gives an execute, gap closer and high dmg skill, all of these things other classes have as class skills but dk's don't. The only stam morphs they have are dots which are useless.

Greiver

How about getting rid of the cc ability the move has. It hits hard, no need for a cc with it so the user can smack you with it over and over. It's zenimaxs fault for not putting other options in. I hate the move, but get why people use it. What else is a Stam sorc suppose to use.

dday3six

The only thing that needs to be addressed with Wrecking Blow is phantom range. Currently there is a point of no-return in the animation that tags a player and they're still hit even if they move out of range.

LBxFinalDeath

If WB gets nerfed crystal frags needs to be nerfed accordingly as well.

Why?

Both have lengthy charge timers and both are easily dodged.

Only dif is Crystal Frags can be used quite farther away than WB and unlike WB a second crystal frags can be instant casted if proc'd.

Wrecking Blow being the easiest to dodge since you can quite literally move forward into the WB spammer and cancel their animation.

If you can't cancel a WB animation you need to L2P.

Just saiyan.

leepalmer95

Greiver wrote: »

How about getting rid of the cc ability the move has. It hits hard, no need for a cc with it so the user can smack you with it over and over. It's zenimaxs fault for not putting other options in. I hate the move, but get why people use it. What else is a Stam sorc suppose to use.

Every other high hitting ability has cc... xD The move is fine people just need to figure out pvp is more than spam 1 ability at someone until you or they die.

LBxFinalDeath wrote: »

If WB gets nerfed crystal frags needs to be nerfed accordingly as well.

Why?

Both have lengthy charge timers and both are easily dodged.

Only dif is Crystal Frags can be used quite farther away than WB and unlike WB a second crystal frags can be instant casted if proc'd.

Wrecking Blow being the easiest to dodge since you can quite literally move forward into the WB spammer and cancel their animation.

If you can't cancel a WB animation you need to L2P.

Just saiyan.

You can't proc frag with a frag. Also frag can be reflected ^^

LBxFinalDeath

I didn't mean proc frag with frags but whatevs.

WB can be canceled if a NB goes cloak, crystal frags tracks if its fired at a cloaked NB who doesn't go into cloak fast enough. (I can confirm personally, its the bane of those "Oh God a 60 man EP zerg..I can feel the lag, lemme cloak and dip real quick." moments)

Once again can't nerf one without nerfing the other since they are essentially the same move just one is magicka and the other is stam.

Srsly doe its a L2P issue, WB is easily countered just as Crystal Frags is.

TequilaFire

Just get on with it and nerf sweet rolls.
Nerf the forum!

PainfulFAFA

Nerf Wrecking blow and you will destroy Stamina DK and Stamina Sorc.

block, roll, snare, immobilize, l2p

WreckfulAbandon

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

I have mixed feelings about this:

1) I hate getting "rekt" by WB spammers in PvP. Hardened Ward is totally inadequate to defend against this attack. BUT...

2) Stam Sorcs don't have ANY viable alternatives to Wrecking Blow!

Maybe the solution is to buff OTHER abilities, both offensive and defensive, so that Wrecking Blow isn't so problematic.

You are so transparently partisan when it comes to sorcs it's not even funny. So if stamina sorcs had something better to use you'd be all for a nerf then? Forget the other stamina classes, they can sort out their own problems amirite?

To address the OP, I would just remove the empower and leave it how it is. Obviously fix the CC immunity issue but that's hardly a WB specific issue. And yes some well placed buffs would not hurt this game.

Patouf

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

Nerf Wrecking blow and you will destroy Stamina DK and Stamina Sorc.

block, roll, snare, immobilize, l2p

Don't just nerf it, but also up some morph stam of templars/DK/Sorc

Spam a skill... well, it means there is a problem.


Make stam class more stronger : more versatile, interesting, complexe and completed with differents options/combo !

Lylith

MrGrimey wrote: »

Sausage wrote: »

I hope not, its one of the last skills of what against you need to dodge or block, dodging and blocking was meant to be useful right? Lets not turn this into standard game.

Not saying to nerf wrecking blow, but blocking has a no stam regen penalty and rolling has a hefty penalty as well

I think if anything, the CC needs adjusting

can't adjust what's broken.

it needs to be fixed.

Vangy

No. There is nothing wrong with Wb except cc immunity is broken leading to infinite cc if u know how to ac properly. Purely a l2p issue.

We don't see nb or stam Templars spamming Wb. Why? Cos they have Sa and jabs that hit just as if not harder. The only other skills for stam users are rapid strikes (not viable) and ransack. Using ransack is just ransack bash cancel which also begets tons of whining since it hits just as hard and pretty much auto breaks free/interrupts anything.

Tons of ways to counter Wb. On sorc I just streak through and drop mines + curse. Then I laugh as the noobs crit Rush into mines and slap them on the face with crystal shards. Boom. Spammer dead. I have Templar friends who just pop an immovable pot and stand there and out heal Wb spammer till their stamina runs dry and jab them to death. As a nb your always stealth ganking anyway so this issue is irrelevant.

The only thing that needs to be done is cc immunity needs to be fixed. Or we can give the dks and stam sorcs OTHER viable class morphs and synergies. Bear in mind most of the Wb whiners are magicka users and this solution means that some of ur morphs might be given over to stam so yeah be careful what u wish for.

PainfulFAFA

Vangy wrote: »

No. There is nothing wrong with Wb except cc immunity is broken leading to infinite cc if u know how to ac properly. Purely a l2p issue.

We don't see nb or stam Templars spamming Wb. Why? Cos they have Sa and jabs that hit just as if not harder. The only other skills for stam users are rapid strikes (not viable) and ransack. Using ransack is just ransack bash cancel which also begets tons of whining since it hits just as hard and pretty much auto breaks free/interrupts anything.

Tons of ways to counter Wb. On sorc I just streak through and drop mines + curse. Then I laugh as the noobs crit Rush into mines and slap them on the face with crystal shards. Boom. Spammer dead. I have Templar friends who just pop an immovable pot and stand there and out heal Wb spammer till their stamina runs dry and jab them to death. As a nb your always stealth ganking anyway so this issue is irrelevant.

The only thing that needs to be done is cc immunity needs to be fixed. Or we can give the dks and stam sorcs OTHER viable class morphs and synergies. Bear in mind most of the Wb whiners are magicka users and this solution means that some of ur morphs might be given over to stam so yeah be careful what u wish for.

this
/thread

Crimsonwolf666

RAGUNAnoOne wrote: »

Better idea buff other moves especially DK/Temp class skills, Destruction staff, and 1H shield to be competitive with it.

This!

Forestd16b14_ESO

RAGUNAnoOne wrote: »

Better idea buff other moves especially DK/Temp class skills, Destruction staff, and 1H shield to be competitive with it.

Yes to buffing everything else and yes to "changing" WB to have a actual cast time like the NPCs WB. If it was like NPCs WB then there wouldn't be a problem cause they actually have a cast time unlike players WB.

Alucardo

@CrowsDescend come on man, you're better than this!

Molag_Crow

Alucardo wrote: »

@CrowsDescend come on man, you're better than this!

I tried to resist but I... I couldn't...

dlepi24

I've tried every combination of 1h/s, dw, 2h and bow and for my DK it's 2h and bow. People that spam WB are pretty bad at the game. If you die to them it's kind of an embarrassment. You literally can walk thru them. I record clips daily of me just messing around with wrecking blow spammers and just walking thru them and teabagging them mid fight over and over again to show how easily it can be countered. The only time WB spammers are annoying is in a fight with multiple attackers. I don't think WB itself is a scumbag move like most do. For my build it's the best burst DPS (maybe you haven't noticed but that has become the meta more and more every update) and it's a CC. If I can I usually try to get a wrecking blow off and if I can try landing one more with the empowered damage. That's where the problem with wrecking blow can be is with the CC. I bet I do more damage in a fight with animation cancelling bow and poison injection weaves, unstable flame, crit rushes and executioners than I do WB. I don't keep a CC on my bar other than WB and take flight so that's how I use it. I use it as a CC and good burst damage to open up my executioners or take flights. I don't see what the problem with it is. If anything, just fix CC's.

Gilliamtherogue

The problem with Wrecking Blow is that it has far too much power placed into itself (For PvP, in PvE it is very lack luster). Let's dissect wrecking blow in it's current state to find out what I mean.

-1 Second Cast Time
-Requires a Target
-7 Meter Range
-1607 Cost (with full medium armor, balanced blade passive, and 15% cost reduc from CP, no stamina reduc jewelry)
-1.96:1 weapon damage scaling coefficient and .1867:1 stamina scaling coefficient
-Empower on next ability
-Able to weave fully charged heavy attacks with no down time between casts, giving 5%+ stamina return and increasing the next attack by 10% (WB-> 20% stronger full charged HA -> 10% stronger WB -> repeat)
-4 Meter knockback and 3.5 second stun every hit. (Procs exploiter passive from Champion points)

Some of these points are rather obvious is why they are advantageous, some are not. Let's go through the lesser known obvious powers.

-Cast time cannot be bashed unlike other casts such as crystal frags.
-Requiring a target means that the ability will always land after casted as long as they stay in range (which sometimes is longer than 7 meters) compared to a free casted ability such as jabs/arrow spray/cleave/etc.
-7 meter range is rather finicky and often time goes further than the range states, and out ranges many other melee abilities.
-Cost to cast is extremely low for a 1s cast time, most "instant" damage abilities cost ~200 less but can be casted at ~150% the frequency, draining stamina much quicker.
-The ability to clip fully charged heavy attacks heavily negates the need for stamina and has no indication of if it is being done or not unless you run a damage recording addon that shows the source. Other abilities can be animation canceled but still have slight visual indicators, and deal much less damage in comparison. Clipping fully charged heavy attacks that hit at the exact time as a casted ability is NOT animation canceling in line with how the priority system is meant to work, it is a clear bug as you cannot do this with any other abilities.
-High damage scaling coefficients due to being a cast make offensive stat stacking even more potent than with other builds. To put into comparison, Surprise Attack has a 1.35091:1 weapon damage and .128625:1 stamina scaling coefficient, much less than Wrecking Blow.

The fact that this ability has so many innate steroids and utility within itself is mind boggling. No other ability in game is this jam packed in nature to cater to toxic PvP playstyles, so why is it still here?