An accidental test of the "No VR system"

Ruben

MakTheEater wrote: »

Do you think that when the cap will be raised, going from CP1000 to CP1001 will be the same as going from CP1 to CP2?

The cost of Champion Points goes down when the cap is raised:

Septimus_Magna

Xendyn wrote: »

Qyrk wrote: »

willymchilybily wrote: »

where is it stated new armor will be set at CP CAP? or 450CP?
im guessing people are just assuming that is whats going to happen? opposed to the trend +2VR (+20CP) VR18 = 180CP

It is currently the proposed changes when veteran ranks are removed. It has been mentioned in the forums last week (?). Essentially they are turning VR ranks to CP points and in terms of armor past VR levels, it is proposed to have certain CP in order to equip it.

Please be mindful that this is a proposal and subject to change. We won't know the concrete plans until later.

But those current plans are, according to Rich:

It's important that everyone understands they are not suddenly going to have to have 501 CP in order to equip the top level gear. We will introduce new gear, with higher CP requirements sometime in the future, but we won't be making huge jumps. (i.e. - we won't go from 160 to 400 suddenly)

Also:

To get a rough idea of balance - think of 10CP = 1 VR. (so 160 CP will roughly = VR16)

This would be stupid, it would change nothing from the current situation where players have to craft/grind new max level gear for every character every time the cap is increased.

Once they choose a level cap (lets say 160CP) it should stay the cap.

The whole point of having a cap is that end game gear stays viable for end game builds/content.

Just imagine the build diversity if every set could drop at end game levels with random/useful traits.

The item chase would still be there every time they release new content with new gear sets, the power increase with new sets would be relative small so you can still be successful with 'old' gear sets.

Darlgon

I dont get you guys.. dont you understand?

In LESS THAN A MONTH, he:

Leveled to VR12
Completed Cadwells Silver (which, a long time ago, used to be where you would be at VR4-6, BTW)

AND

RECEIVED 35% of the CP to cap..

And he still has over 1/3 of the game content to go, Cadwells Gold, Crag.

He has now,
Almost out leveled the Trials
Out leveled DSA
Out leveled lower Crag.

Even tho, I have to wonder if @wldkarde did any power-leveling with his other accounts or mob grinding to speed up the process.

The catch up mechanic is.. WAY out of whack at this pace, unless, by the time Dark Brotherhood launches, players can just skip Cadwells Silver AND Gold and just move to the new zones. Or, is that the idea? Which, by the way, is pointless if you take that char into the new areas and they are autolevled, even if they earn XP at the rate they would in a normal zone, for the most part.

@ZOS_RichLambert . Sorry to try a summon of the genie boss, but, I dont know who to point to this thread.

Brrrofski

Tankqull wrote: »

the entire idea to connect sets to CP points is stupid.

just imagine a player invited to take a look into ESO his inviting friend made him a seducer armor to help with the lowlvling as he was used too.

but oh poor lvl 20 cant wear it as seducer requieres 20CPs wich is not much in the scheme of 3600... but impossible for that poor lvl 20...
if they at all connect sth to the CPs its the stat values of equipment but than why rename the existing system at all?

I imagine with crafted sets, the material level is what will be related to CP.

0 for topgrain
140 for void
200 for ancestor silk etc

Slurg

Darlgon wrote: »

I dont get you guys.. dont you understand?

In LESS THAN A MONTH, he:

Leveled to VR12
Completed Cadwells Silver (which, a long time ago, used to be where you would be at VR4-6, BTW)

AND

RECEIVED 35% of the CP to cap..

And he still has over 1/3 of the game content to go, Cadwells Gold, Crag.

He has now,
Almost out leveled the Trials
Out leveled DSA
Out leveled lower Crag.

Even tho, I have to wonder if @wldkarde did any power-leveling with his other accounts or mob grinding to speed up the process.

The catch up mechanic is.. WAY out of whack at this pace, unless, by the time Dark Brotherhood launches, players can just skip Cadwells Silver AND Gold and just move to the new zones. Or, is that the idea? Which, by the way, is pointless if you take that char into the new areas and they are autolevled, even if they earn XP at the rate they would in a normal zone, for the most part.

@ZOS_RichLambert . Sorry to try a summon of the genie boss, but, I dont know who to point to this thread.

I understand perfectly fine. Take your condescension somewhere else. The OP, an experienced player, no-lifed the game for a few weeks on a new account and caught up. The vast majority of players using the catch up mechanism will be new players who play at a more casual pace. One outlier does not mean the catch up mechanic is broken.

Also - a lot of people have complained about being forced through Silver and Gold to level. I suspect they are moving toward removing that requirement as they add new zones.

wayfarerx

Slurg wrote: »

The OP, an experienced player, no-lifed the game for a few weeks on a new account and caught up.

This. I could power-level a new character on a new account to 160 cp in no time, but if I played like an actual new player (exploring, reading the lorebooks, chatting with other players, experimenting with crafting, doing side quests, banging my head against dungeons for the first time, etc) then it would take considerably longer.

I think it's great that an experienced player will be able to power to endgame in relatively short order, why shouldn't they be?

Kammakazi

Brrrofski wrote: »

It'll create more of a level gap.

You need 501 CP to wear said armor.

Person A has 501. He has 501 CP to spend and can equip said armor.

Person B has 174. He has only 174 CP to spend and can only wear rubbish gear.

Ummm... I don't see the balance there.

Tell them to git gud.

Hiero_Glyph

Ackwalan wrote: »

The higher level gear will require a higher cp. So instead of gear requiring a VR16 character to equip it, that same gear will require a cp of 450, or what ever cap is put on it. The VR grind is just going to change to a cp grind for higher level gear. Nothing is really changing, except the color of the smoke and mirror.

Except this isn't even remotely true. Based on what limited information we have you would only need 160 CP to equip any previous v16 items. Your claim that you would need 450 CP would mean that the items would require v45. Maybe in the distant future this may be the case but as a solution this is nowhere near what ZOS has proposed. Feel free to provide evidence to support your claim though.

Darkstorne

MakTheEater wrote: »

If going from CP1000 to CP1001 will require the same experience as CP1 to CP2 then they should have just lowered the exp needed to reach the new VR from 1000k-850k to 200k.

Of course there's always going to be new levels to acquire (or "grind" through if you prefer) with new content. The goal with the new system is to make everything less of a grind than it was before. Once a new player reaches level 50 and finishes his alliance's questline, he'll no longer be told "Now go do it all over again for a different faction!" And after drearily slogging through much of that copy/pasted content be faced with "Great! Now go do it all AGAIN!"

It also ensures that players who have levelled from 1-50 and started earning CP also get to use that CP to boost their alts. They won't have to earn them all over again with each character (unlike with VR). It's like ESO's version of WoW's Heirloom items, or SWTOR's Legacy skill tree. It's a smart system that recognizes that end-game players want some grinding through new content, but don't want to be forced to grind as excessively as they are today. One trip through the story per character is more than enough, thank you very much.

WldKarde

Interesting stuff all, thanks for sharing,

I guess my point for starting this thread, was that I was so surprised at the rate I was gaining champ points.

I realize that I have a "main" account to fall back on for crafting (armor and XP pots) and the whole "Been there Done that" aspect of quickly burning through quests (not to mention knowing a few decent grinding spots )... But I was genuinely surprised by how quickly my CP's were stacking up.

I understand folks frustration with leveling alts (again check my sig ), and I think it's great that ZOS has come up with a way for new players to catch up. But it just seems strange to me that every future character will be able to equip their gear based on what that account's "main" has earned.

I don't have a better solution, mind you, it just seems like we're heading to the other extreme.

As I said in another thread, I plan on continuing to play until they shutdown the servers...but I'll still share my 2 cents

Elijah_Crow

wldkarde wrote: »

Interesting stuff all, thanks for sharing,

I guess my point for starting this thread, was that I was so surprised at the rate I was gaining champ points.

I realize that I have a "main" account to fall back on for crafting (armor and XP pots) and the whole "Been there Done that" aspect of quickly burning through quests (not to mention knowing a few decent grinding spots )... But I was genuinely surprised by how quickly my CP's were stacking up.

I understand folks frustration with leveling alts (again check my sig ), and I think it's great that ZOS has come up with a way for new players to catch up. But it just seems strange to me that every future character will be able to equip their gear based on what that account's "main" has earned.

I don't have a better solution, mind you, it just seems like we're heading to the other extreme.

As I said in another thread, I plan on continuing to play until they shutdown the servers...but I'll still share my 2 cents

Thanks for sharing your experience. I think it's fantastic that someone can start playing on a new account and in 4 to 8 weeks be wearing top level gear and working on end game content. This is going to be one of the best time for returning players and new players alike. Looking forward to being able to adventure with some of my more casual friends who haven't gotten past VR2.

Ackwalan

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

The higher level gear will require a higher cp. So instead of gear requiring a VR16 character to equip it, that same gear will require a cp of 450, or what ever cap is put on it. The VR grind is just going to change to a cp grind for higher level gear. Nothing is really changing, except the color of the smoke and mirror.

Except this isn't even remotely true. Based on what limited information we have you would only need 160 CP to equip any previous v16 items. Your claim that you would need 450 CP would mean that the items would require v45. Maybe in the distant future this may be the case but as a solution this is nowhere near what ZOS has proposed. Feel free to provide evidence to support your claim though.

Feel free to read what I wrote.

MrDerrikk

Ackwalan wrote: »

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

Ackwalan wrote: »

The higher level gear will require a higher cp. So instead of gear requiring a VR16 character to equip it, that same gear will require a cp of 450, or what ever cap is put on it. The VR grind is just going to change to a cp grind for higher level gear. Nothing is really changing, except the color of the smoke and mirror.

Except this isn't even remotely true. Based on what limited information we have you would only need 160 CP to equip any previous v16 items. Your claim that you would need 450 CP would mean that the items would require v45. Maybe in the distant future this may be the case but as a solution this is nowhere near what ZOS has proposed. Feel free to provide evidence to support your claim though.

Feel free to read what I wrote.

@Ackwalan

I thought you said what he assumed you said, but after re-reading it twice I can see what you were getting at.
Yes, it's just a simple change like that. However, it'll mean that:

-There will no longer be VR and CP in-game, causing confusion and unnecessary complications
-The problems of people having CP in non-vet campaigns won't be an issue as this will make them not count
-You will only need to level alts to lvl50 and then they can be the same level as your main
-More points that I'm too tired to remember now, but I'm sure others will mention.

Rosveen

And all this commotion because once upon a time ZOS decided to make us go through all three alliances, ruining faction loyalty and turning vet ranks into a seemingly endless grind which they've been trying to fix ever since. Funny how this bad start is still reverberating.

shugg

Rosveen wrote: »

And all this commotion because once upon a time ZOS decided to make us go through all three alliances, ruining faction loyalty and turning vet ranks into a seemingly endless grind which they've been trying to fix ever since. Funny how this bad start is still reverberating.

Actuly i believe they added it becouse ppl complained they wsnted to ecperiance the content without rolling another faction, so its us the gamers that made this rod for our backs.

MrDerrikk

shugg wrote: »

Rosveen wrote: »

And all this commotion because once upon a time ZOS decided to make us go through all three alliances, ruining faction loyalty and turning vet ranks into a seemingly endless grind which they've been trying to fix ever since. Funny how this bad start is still reverberating.

Actuly i believe they added it becouse ppl complained they wsnted to ecperiance the content without rolling another faction, so its us the gamers that made this rod for our backs.

It was a two-fold fix, so both of you are correct.

Mettaricana

Why is everyone afraid of progression? Its like dude its the point of the game to get better go a year with no new gear or higher better sets and this place will be dead.... quit crying about your all legendary recrafts I legendaried all my crap right before ic launched I was like well **** but I got over it now I jave vr 16 all legendary if they asd better gear that needs more cp to wear fine ill get it if I don't like the gear ill casually update mystuff until something I like comes along. I can't wait til this cp replaces vet ranks all my lower vets can finally be viable without sinking cash into exp pots and pulling my hair out in boredom.

Catch up mechanic just means I'm not waiting a friggan year to play with friends in endgame stuff and the fact cp is gotten from anything I do exp related even running a crappie level 10 dungeon with a random noob just means I can help friends guildies etc regardless and benefit from it. As a near maxed trait crafter gear progression keeps me in business they add new setd my inbox floods I make my gold they get their stuff world keeps going.

Also the lvl 50 insta maxes my alts is gonna open a lot of race build and diversity options that no one was willing to grind to vr 16 to test vr 1-16 isn't tougher everything just hits harder and has more health vr 16 isn't god mode.

pronkg

I honestly think they will adjust the CP needed per gear to almost the exact amount of CP you would get today when you go to V16 without enlightenment. So probably will be more like 200/300 somewhere in between those numbers.

This post is the reason the zenimax guy said "roughly"

They are working on it and obviously can't give specifics yet. I suggest just play the game like you always do.

Only thing I'm scared of is how easy it will be to make 8 top level characters and run 8 daily silver and gold pledges to farm easy monster gear. Which I believe they don't want that to happen

Zenimax has lots and lots of thinking to do. Cause this system might just destroy their entire game if not handled with care.

Fuzzybrick

If it didn't take time for a new player to catch up, it wouldn't be an mmo. Everything I herd so far sounds acceptable to me.
I'm a ps4 player. Played since consol release and I have about 170ish points if I remember correctly. About 40 if those points I earned since latest expansion. I have 6 vet toons one of which is vet16. I have a job which requires me to work 48 to 60 hours a week. I have 2 children and I'm married. I don't see the issue some people are having. I agree with @wldkarde I'm looking forward to the new system. And guess what? If they see that is not working.... I'm sure they can change it back.

Mettaricana

Basically translates to noone has time to relevel for months on end so they fixed it. Only gripers are former kr grinders and vanilla wow players who can't cope with a game being fast to level and think grinding means skill