How do I l2p against shieldbraker.

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO

Brrrofski wrote: »

Hopefully a set is coming out next DLC with the 5th trait that sorcs can see through invisibility.
*** for tat.

Nope, Nightblades already have many counters for Shadow Cloak and it's Morph's.., AOE attacks, Radiant Magelight, Detect Potions, Flares.. etc

There only one gear set that Nerf's Shields, have to use a 5 pc as well, I think you SORC guys/girls got off waaaayy easy..

thelordoffelines

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Hopefully a set is coming out next DLC with the 5th trait that sorcs can see through invisibility.
*** for tat.

Nope, Nightblades already have many counters for Shadow Cloak and it's Morph's.., AOE attacks, Radiant Magelight, Detect Potions, Flares.. etc

There only one gear set that Nerf's Shields, have to use a 5 pc as well, I think you SORC guys/girls got off waaaayy easy..

You mean just like how there were many countersto bolt escape like crit rush, ambush, any speed buff and bow dodge roll? Yet it still got nerfed for no reason.

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO

thelordoffelines wrote: »

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Hopefully a set is coming out next DLC with the 5th trait that sorcs can see through invisibility.
*** for tat.

Nope, Nightblades already have many counters for Shadow Cloak and it's Morph's.., AOE attacks, Radiant Magelight, Detect Potions, Flares.. etc

There only one gear set that Nerf's Shields, have to use a 5 pc as well, I think you SORC guys/girls got off waaaayy easy..

You mean just like how there were many countersto bolt escape like crit rush, ambush, any speed buff and bow dodge roll? Yet it still got nerfed for no reason.

Hey Man, I never had a beef with Bolt escape for SORC's, I believe it should never have been Nerfed in the first place, let alone the 2nd and 3rd place..

Also a FYI, I never call for Nerfs but if you look at my sig, you will see what I say about shields.

Note- I have a Argonian Nightblade Caster (Magicka Build) / healer and he uses shields (resto staff ones), so I feel your pain when it comes to shields..

WreckfulAbandon

Drink more Brawndo, it's got electrolytes.

Rayste

WreckfulAbandon wrote: »

Drink more Brawndo, it's got electrolytes.

Haha i love that movie. Idiocracy

xaraan

Some of the sorcs that we run with started running combat prayer instead of healing ward to deal with shield breaker. Give yourself a 5k heal after you get hit with a couple shots as well as a few minor buffs on top of it.

But this type of worry you are having is what I've been dealing with as a templar forever. Our shields are strong enough to mitigate more than part of most shots we take and we must rely on healing, but we are healing the damage we took, not putting healing dots on ourselves, so it's always a catch up game where once you start healing, it's hard to stop. We don't have the luxury of putting up something like Hardened Ward and letting it take the damage while we heal up and then we are ready to reapply ward and fight again - blazing shield is either only strong enough to absorb about a quarter or less of the damage it takes in a hit or runs out from it's horrible duration before we have any chance to recover and stop healing. Don't get me wrong, my templar is pretty strong; but if I'm getting wailed on by a few people, it's just a matter of time before I'm out of stam and dead - I'm not doing any damage during all that healing time.

Xeven

Xjcon wrote: »

Heal through it? Have more health. The reason it's a thing is because of how big shields are. That person has sacrificed their build to counter yours.

Lol they havent sactificed anything, and they certainly do not have to develop some sort of skillful timed combo. It's just weighted bow and right click to victory.

pjwb16_ESO

Go into Clouding Swarm and Instakill the boii

Nivzruo_ESO

Stop being a noob and dps, if you can't out dps 2k your god awful and need to rethink your life scrub,

Brrrofski

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

Brrrofski wrote: »

Hopefully a set is coming out next DLC with the 5th trait that sorcs can see through invisibility.
*** for tat.

Nope, Nightblades already have many counters for Shadow Cloak and it's Morph's.., AOE attacks, Radiant Magelight, Detect Potions, Flares.. etc

There only one gear set that Nerf's Shields, have to use a 5 pc as well, I think you SORC guys/girls got off waaaayy easy..

There are plenty of ways to get a shield down. Wrecking blow, fear, templar javelin throw thingy, Dk leap, Stonefist etc,then burn through shield.

Shieldbreaker would be the equivalent of a set that could see through invisibility. Something to counter your only class survival tool.

Teargrants

Nivzruo_ESO wrote: »

Stop being a noob and dps, if you can't out dps 2k your god awful and need to rethink your life scrub,

Thanks bruh, you're a genius.

However, Shield Breaker isn't just 2k dps potential, it is 2k unresistable dps potential; you cannot mitigate it period. That's sort of a big deal when PvP is all about mitigating dmg. Let's look at the typical Shield Breaker engagements and not just w/e target dummy idea you had in your head.

Stam NB v Sorc
- NB has dodge roll, shuffle, cloak, fear to avoid dmg & make it hard to pull off burst.

Stam DK v Sorc
- DK has dodge roll, shuffle, scales to avoid/reflect dmg, properly timed scales counters frags & keeps Sorc burst at bay. And don't forget Petrify, which is not only a double CC, but also counts as a dmg shield on you for Shield Breaker.

Stam Templar v Sorc
- Templar has dodge roll, shuffle, purify to avoid/purge dmg, you may not be aware but Purify does more that just remove Curse, it also removes the Endless Fury execute proc and makes Frags disappear in midair. That's basically all of your Sorc burst gone.

Meanwhile, what does magicka Sorc have in terms of dmg mitigation/avoidance when fighting these Shield Breaker builds?
- Dodge roll? Sure, about 2x unless you want to dodge more and kill yourself.
- Block? Does nothing to stop unresistable damage, just wastes your stam.
- Stop using any shield to avoid 2k dps? Magicka Sorc w/o shields is dead sorc w/in 1-2 burst rotations.
- Only viable option? Maintain full shields while spamming a secondary source of heals. Sorc has 2 options:
1. Degeneration + Power Surge = RNG based & reliant on being able to do appreciable dmg to enemy.
2. Resto Staff heals = fairly lack luster + pretty much dedicating an entire bar of skills to a bunch of heals.

These are the issues you run into when fighting Shield Breaker, and that's not even delving into the issue of it being your opponent's normal dmg + Shield Breaker procs or multiple opponents which are beyond the scope of this post. True, most bow users spamming Shield Breaker are total nubs who just try to run away as soon as you look at them funny, but that's neither here nor there as far as regards the balance of the actual set itself.


Moving on, not related to your post but something that needs to be said, the Forum Warrior's favorite touted solution, "stop relying on shields", "stack more than 15k into health" is just a *** poor argument that comes from not playing Sorc or just being deliberately facetious.

- Since IC, pretty much all Sorcs I've seen sit around 20k health if not a bit more. That's about the average for other classes in Cyrodiil, perhaps a bit on the low end for DKs/Temps. So pray tell, how much "more" precisely are Sorcs supposed to stack into health? 30k?
- Like it or not, Hardened Ward is the class's primary tool for damage mitigation. Sorc by design was given a big damage shield and crappy heals. Magicka Sorc cannot simply "stop" relying on shields without a redesign of the class, or a powerful non class magicka heal (such as what stam builds have w/ dodge roll + Rally + Vigor).

_Proteus_

The counter is to simply pressure them enough so that if they keep light attacking, they will just die. Inevitable det, curse and then go into a combo on them.

eliisra

Whatever you do don't refresh the shields. That's what giving Shield Breaker such high dps. Need to not have any shields up and just out-heal or get out of range. Entropy, Surge, Blessing of Restoration, loads of skills that will outheal one derp spamming light attacks.

But if you're already fighting enemies outnumbered as sorc, you're 100% screwed trying to counter someone using Shield Breaker light attacks from 40 meters away. You need your shields to survive the enemies on you, but if you use them you die to a 5-piecie set bonus extremely fast

Basically ZoS doesn't want any class but NB's to solo and have freedom in PvP. So welcome to the life of DK+ templar, we've already been gimped solo for 7 months now.

Dracane

Nivzruo_ESO wrote: »

Stop being a noob and dps, if you can't out dps 2k your god awful and need to rethink your life scrub,

Good luck focusing any damage on a Nightblade that is slippery like a wet fish.
Before you even manage to focus anything on them, you are already dead. Combined with irresistable damage glyph, weighted or reinforced trait, you die in a bit more than 5 seconds

Xjcon

Xeven wrote: »

Xjcon wrote: »

Heal through it? Have more health. The reason it's a thing is because of how big shields are. That person has sacrificed their build to counter yours.

Lol they havent sactificed anything, and they certainly do not have to develop some sort of skillful timed combo. It's just weighted bow and right click to victory.

How much of a WP loss is it instead of running Hundings Rage?

Waseem

instead of having 12k hp and 40k magicka, have 25k hp and 30-34k magicka

Tankqull

xaraan wrote: »

Some of the sorcs that we run with started running combat prayer instead of healing ward to deal with shield breaker. Give yourself a 5k heal after you get hit with a couple shots as well as a few minor buffs on top of it.
...

they must have the superman version of that spell... mine barely covers one SB proc when it crits at nearly twice the reuse time ^^

and the hunter bleed through is awesome - died to it 3 times tonight as a non vamp/ww sorc :P

Jhunn

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »

Nope, Nightblades already have many counters for Shadow Cloak and it's Morph's.., AOE attacks, Radiant Magelight, Detect Potions, Flares.. etc

There only one gear set that Nerf's Shields, have to use a 5 pc as well, I think you SORC guys/girls got off waaaayy easy..

Or you could like.. use normal offensive abilities?

The set is just ridiculous and a perfect example of what happens when people QQ because they can't kill someone. Ugh.

nimander99

l2p

... can't believe no one tossed that in yet

Levo18

Vigor needs a magicka morph!!!!!!

Dyride

Honestly I don't think the shield breaker set would be a problem if it wasn't for the fact that Expert Hunter and morphs will also proc on the damage.

Also anyone saying they "sacrificed" for the 5 piece bonus is bogus. As stated earlier, 2-4 bonuses are Max Stam, Weapon power, and Stamina Regen which provides best in slot bonuses for something that gives a distinct advantage against magicka builds.

A set that gave Spell Resist, Health, and Stam Regen would have been a more suitable tradeoff for something provides unresisted DPS.

Alucardo

Dyride wrote: »

Also anyone saying they "sacrificed" for the 5 piece bonus is bogus. As stated earlier, 2-4 bonuses are Max Stam, Weapon power, and Stamina Regen which provides best in slot bonuses for something that gives a distinct advantage against magicka builds.

It does have SOME truth to it. Agreed the 2-4 bonuses are really, really nice - SB is worth having just for them, but I've actually switched to Hunding's now and hung up the SB. Was testing tonight, and having constant extra damage instead of just something that procs through shields using basic attacks was a lot better.
SB was fun for a while, but it's not so fun when you come across a build that does not rely on shields. But if you had Hunding's? HULK SMASH.

Egonieser

Teargrants wrote: »

Nivzruo_ESO wrote: »

Stop being a noob and dps, if you can't out dps 2k your god awful and need to rethink your life scrub,

Thanks bruh, you're a genius.

However, Shield Breaker isn't just 2k dps potential, it is 2k unresistable dps potential; you cannot mitigate it period. That's sort of a big deal when PvP is all about mitigating dmg. Let's look at the typical Shield Breaker engagements and not just w/e target dummy idea you had in your head.

Stam NB v Sorc
- NB has dodge roll, shuffle, cloak, fear to avoid dmg & make it hard to pull off burst.

Stam DK v Sorc
- DK has dodge roll, shuffle, scales to avoid/reflect dmg, properly timed scales counters frags & keeps Sorc burst at bay. And don't forget Petrify, which is not only a double CC, but also counts as a dmg shield on you for Shield Breaker.

Stam Templar v Sorc
- Templar has dodge roll, shuffle, purify to avoid/purge dmg, you may not be aware but Purify does more that just remove Curse, it also removes the Endless Fury execute proc and makes Frags disappear in midair. That's basically all of your Sorc burst gone.

Meanwhile, what does magicka Sorc have in terms of dmg mitigation/avoidance when fighting these Shield Breaker builds?
- Dodge roll? Sure, about 2x unless you want to dodge more and kill yourself.
- Block? Does nothing to stop unresistable damage, just wastes your stam.
- Stop using any shield to avoid 2k dps? Magicka Sorc w/o shields is dead sorc w/in 1-2 burst rotations.
- Only viable option? Maintain full shields while spamming a secondary source of heals. Sorc has 2 options:
1. Degeneration + Power Surge = RNG based & reliant on being able to do appreciable dmg to enemy.
2. Resto Staff heals = fairly lack luster + pretty much dedicating an entire bar of skills to a bunch of heals.

These are the issues you run into when fighting Shield Breaker, and that's not even delving into the issue of it being your opponent's normal dmg + Shield Breaker procs or multiple opponents which are beyond the scope of this post. True, most bow users spamming Shield Breaker are total nubs who just try to run away as soon as you look at them funny, but that's neither here nor there as far as regards the balance of the actual set itself.


Moving on, not related to your post but something that needs to be said, the Forum Warrior's favorite touted solution, "stop relying on shields", "stack more than 15k into health" is just a *** poor argument that comes from not playing Sorc or just being deliberately facetious.

- Since IC, pretty much all Sorcs I've seen sit around 20k health if not a bit more. That's about the average for other classes in Cyrodiil, perhaps a bit on the low end for DKs/Temps. So pray tell, how much "more" precisely are Sorcs supposed to stack into health? 30k?
- Like it or not, Hardened Ward is the class's primary tool for damage mitigation. Sorc by design was given a big damage shield and crappy heals. Magicka Sorc cannot simply "stop" relying on shields without a redesign of the class, or a powerful non class magicka heal (such as what stam builds have w/ dodge roll + Rally + Vigor).

I second this, spot on.

People who whine about sorc shields are people who have never played one and have no idea how it works, and it's not such a steamroll how people think. If you get killed by a sorcerer, you got killed by a good player, not by a good class, same would apply if you got killed by any class.
Playing a sorcerer is a constant mini-game of attribute bar micromanagement and buff-tracking, trying to do it successfuly in mid combat without opening yourself up and making yourself vulnerable takes practice. Stacking shields means you also deal no damage and burn magicka, they also do not protect from CC, which is Sorc's biggest enemy and ultimately the weakest point.
Even a noob NB can kill me by just CC'ing me enough times.

I've lost track how many time's i've died *instantly* because i've got carried away and not tracked by shield duration. As soon as my health is opened, all it takes is 1 ambush and 1 dawnbreaker and i'm dead faster than I can realize. People who wish this sort of fate for sorcerers are just butthurt noobs who want easy kills, they don't fully grasp how weak sorcerers really are without their class shield.

And No, you can't stack more HP or more Stamina, it just doesn't work that way. The survivability is far too little for the extra HP or Stamina to have any kind of desired effect, but you severely limit your DPS capability which is the only and main point to a sorcerer. They have no stealth bonuses or crits or poisitional bonuses like stamina classes do, your only option is to fight head-on and if you don't have the burst, you are dead, plain and simple. No shield is going to rescue you.

Malmai

Xjcon wrote: »

Heal through it? Have more health. The reason it's a thing is because of how big shields are. That person has sacrificed their build to counter yours.

Best !!!

Sausage

OrphanHelgen wrote: »

Streak the oposite way

Pretty much this, Ive fought with skilled teleporters and they are hard to kill, but it takes practice to master teleport, but if you do it right, your enemy cant do almost nothing.

Sav72

LOL so much hate for shield breakers!!!

Redemption, for all that time the Shield spammers ruled PVP!!!

In all honest, if you do equip Shield Breaker, you nerf your build.

I equip it when there is a small group of Sorc, zerging people.

Sausage

Btw, if Spell Crafting is gonna bring Shields to everybody, ShieldBreaker set was indeed needed.

Malmai

Shield stacking is/was dumbest idea ever.

Dracane

Levo18 wrote: »

Vigor needs a magicka morph!!!!!!

OMG please yes ! Please please please
Then I could finally drop this annoying healing staff. Would just be fair in my opinion, if Magicka had a reliable non class heal.

Teargrants

Waseem wrote: »

instead of having 12k hp and 40k magicka, have 25k hp and 30-34k magicka

12k HP in Cyrodiil, excuse me? That's actually physically impossible, the absolute lowest you can have is just about 14.7k if you have like no CP. That aside, so according to you the answer to all my problems is I need 5k more HP?

You do understand that 5k HP is gone in 3 more shield breaker procs?