Rally or Surge for Stamina Sorcerer?

Tdroid

Very simple question: Which buff skill do you think is better for a stam Sorc?

Stannum

I use surge. Cause of
1. Extra 2% weapon dmg
2. It seems that it returns more healing

olsborg

Surge, no question, get your crit chance to 50%+ and it will easily outheal Rally, just stay offencive.

Dracane

Critting is not so easy in pvp. You will not have a reliable self heal with surge. I'd say rally for pvp

Stannum

Dracane wrote: »

Critting is not so easy in pvp. You will not have a reliable self heal with surge. I'd say rally for pvp

you're almost right exept of crit rush. And really after momentum nerf it has rather low heal to name it "reliable". So you'll need vigor anyway.

eligh0716

I got a question kinda relevant... WHY ARE SORCS BETTER WITH A STAMINA BUILD? It makes no sense... A sorcerer is magic based... It's hard to play my sorc knowing stamina builds deal more dps... K bye.

Shinra

I use both.

Surge isn't quite reliable if the enemy uses barriers or stacks shields, but gives damn good heals.
Momentum is a bit weaker, but gives a good HoT as well as a flash-selfheal.

Dracane

dancing.in.the.webeb17_ESO wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Critting is not so easy in pvp. You will not have a reliable self heal with surge. I'd say rally for pvp

you're almost right exept of crit rush. And really after momentum nerf it has rather low heal to name it "reliable". So you'll need vigor anyway.

I said this because blocks and damage shields negate crits, critical rush won't help.
Rally is the Alliance war heal ? I thought we were talking about this 2 handed weapon buff, sorry am not familiar with these names

Stannum

eligh0716 wrote: »

I got a question kinda relevant... WHY ARE SORCS BETTER WITH A STAMINA BUILD? It makes no sense... A sorcerer is magic based... It's hard to play my sorc knowing stamina builds deal more dps... K bye.

Look, usually melee build should have higher dps then ranged. Magika sorc is disigned mosly for ranged playstyle, stamina sorc for melee.

Tdroid

Dracane wrote: »

dancing.in.the.webeb17_ESO wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Critting is not so easy in pvp. You will not have a reliable self heal with surge. I'd say rally for pvp

you're almost right exept of crit rush. And really after momentum nerf it has rather low heal to name it "reliable". So you'll need vigor anyway.

I said this because blocks and damage shields negate crits, critical rush won't help.
Rally is the Alliance war heal ? I thought we were talking about this 2 handed weapon buff, sorry am not familiar with these names

Rally is the 2-handed ability, Vigor is the Alliance war heal.

Edit: I need to pay more atention.

Tdroid

eligh0716 wrote: »

I got a question kinda relevant... WHY ARE SORCS BETTER WITH A STAMINA BUILD? It makes no sense... A sorcerer is magic based... It's hard to play my sorc knowing stamina builds deal more dps... K bye.

Are they, currently? I know Stam Sorc became more viable with Update 7, but I've always been under the impression than Magicka Sorc has always been very strong with Overload and Crystal Frag procs. Also, Hardened Ward being scaled of magicka.

Steel_Brightblade

I wouldn't say stamina sorcerer is better, different yes but both still good and both viable.other than what I just wrote, don't believe everything you read, a lot of flavour of the month builds get some what sensationalised.

PainfulFAFA

As a stam sorc you're gonna need to use your magicka for other buffs/escapes/offensive maneuvers and
surge costs TOO MUCH to be using every 30 secs with a low magicka regen (500-700).

Go with rally if youre using 2H.


The only time crit surge is useful is when you're using an AOE build.

Stannum

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

As a stam sorc you're gonna need to use your magicka for other buffs/escapes/offensive maneuvers and
surge costs TOO MUCH to be using every 30 secs with a low magicka regen (500-700).

Really? I play stamina sorc with zero in magika attr and without any magika buff gear and I have enought magika to keep surge on, sreak for gap close/evade and even for replenishing stamina with dark deal when it comes low.

Lioso

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

As a stam sorc you're gonna need to use your magicka for other buffs/escapes/offensive maneuvers and
surge costs TOO MUCH to be using every 30 secs with a low magicka regen (500-700).

I've found that the magicka regen from Sorc passives is enough to easily keep Surge up and have enough left over for a Streak or two. Granted, using Surge with a 2H is rather dependent on your crit chance. If you're not crit hitting enough (lower than 33% I'd reckon) Rally may be the better option.

Jar_Ek

Surge + Vigour... but that is without a 2hander...
With a 2hander... Surge + Vigour.

TheDarkShadow

Surge for pve.
In pvp, Surge is useless against shielded player so I guess Rally and Vigor are better.

flintstone

If you have one on each bar, do you get both heals?, a HOT and a crit heal.......just wondering.

Stikato

Surge + Rally here.

With the reduction in pvp healing, I find that having as many sources of healing, big and small, is critical.

Surge, Rally, Critical Leach, Imperial Red Diamond. Still debating between absorb stam, absorb health, and disease on weapon enchant (any advice)

Also, combining daedric protection, sorc magicka regen passive, mages guild passive, Support passive, and purple drink gives the sustain in all 3 stats to keep the build going. Stam regen is still the linchpin. Roll dodge reduction in CP is key.

Weakness is to spike damage builds. Key is to know when to: block, break free, dodge roll. More importantly...when not to.

Olen_Mikko

If you don't use any other 2h skill, then i'd say surge, so you can equip other weapon instead.

TheDarkShadow

Olen_Mikko wrote: »

If you don't use any other 2h skill, then i'd say surge, so you can equip other weapon instead.

But for a stam sorc, 2h is almost like a must. They have no other single target dps skill that could beat uppercut and its morphs. Bow is kind of alright when you need range dps, but if you can melee, uppercut still do more damage. DW has very good AoE but for single target, DW still lag behind 2h. Unlike NB or Templar, Sorc have no dps skill in there class lines that scale on stam. So most stam sorc use 2h + something else (DW or bow).

PainfulFAFA

Streak costs 3k
Boundless storm (magicka) costs 3k
Surge costs 3k
Darkdeal costs about 2k
The reason i say not to use surge is probably because im not a wrecking blow monkey

I play a 2h/dw DOT stam sorc build especially because of the nice changes to certain dark magic abilities.
Most of the fights i lose is because i ran out of magicka to lock my enemy down.
But thats just my playstyle .

Stannum

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

Boundless storm (magicka) costs 3k

Ok, you do not use 33s magika buff, but you use 15 sec magika buff when you have better stamina analog.

Malanor

i suppose with 3 overload's bar is possible to use both.

Jitterbug

I don't know if the people answering Surge have actually tried it in game or just really want to hang on to what little sorc is left in stam sorc but Rally is without comparison the stronger of the two heals.

Olen_Mikko

TheDarkShadow wrote: »

Olen_Mikko wrote: »

If you don't use any other 2h skill, then i'd say surge, so you can equip other weapon instead.

But for a stam sorc, 2h is almost like a must. They have no other single target dps skill that could beat uppercut and its morphs.

Ahh, ok. I have not played Sorc, so that is new knowledge to me too!

Alucardo

I use Rally, because the burst heal is just so good. My crit is pretty low and I hate playing on chance, especially where health is concerned. At least with Rally I know I'm getting constant healing, with a burst heal as well.

Bhakura

Tdroid wrote: »

Very simple question: Which buff skill do you think is better for a stam Sorc?

I have khajit stam sorc, tested it, surge is better if you have the crit chance. 50%+ beats rally hands down, throw in shadow mundus with divine traits and its pretty much guaranteed immortaility in PVE.
throw in twohander with brawler and you can tank hordes and hordes of stuff without even loosing life.

(just make sure you dont loose the surge buff while fighting said hordes *blush* exp talking here)


edit: maybe shouldnt have said that, now they gonna nerf it ...

Alucardo

TheDarkShadow wrote: »

But for a stam sorc, 2h is almost like a must. They have no other single target dps skill that could beat uppercut and its morphs. Bow is kind of alright when you need range dps, but if you can melee, uppercut still do more damage.

While I do use 2h, I use it as a utility, not my main source of DPS. I got tired of the whole "You must use 2h cause damage" crap when it came to sorc, so at VR3 I switched it up.

Rally is literally the only 2h skill I use. My primary weapon is S+B.
Shield Assault - Gap closer and small shield
Bound Armaments - Minor resolve (armor), Max stamina and increases heavy hits
Absorb Magic - The healing received from projectiles is pretty nice
Pierce Armor - Reduces your targets resistance against spell and physical damage. Low costing and does decent damage.
Liquid Lightning - After piercing your target, they will be taking more damage from the DoT AND your pierce armour attacks.
Velocious Curse - Apply this every so often and it will add to your melee+liquid lightning damage quite nicely.
Thundering Presence - More resistance against physical and spell damage.

With the good balance between magicka and stamina abilities I find it hard to run out of resources, and I don't feel like a potato spamming WB over and over again. The healing from Rally and Absorb Magic is really good, though I might play around with Surge a little more to see how it fares. Build is still kind of new, so I'm still working out the kinks, but so far I'm enjoying it.

Ahzek

For PvP in can wholeheartedly recommend both. Surge is the only edge stam sorc has on other classes and can provide you with some very nice healing here and there. However I only find it to actually work out when you dont really rely on it , but instead have it running in the back, keeping you in top condition while you can stay aggressive. Rally is more of an "Oh ***!" heal and provides a pretty usefull hot that shouldnt be underestimated. Combine all this with vigor and you are on a good way to keep your HP up most of the time.

Bhakura

Strange, everyone saying rally is better ... ive tested it, taking down my crit chance ... rally only better if you have zero to none crit chance ... confused now, need more testing i guess.
I guess people are staring blind on the extra tick you get from renewing rally .... idk