Should the Daedric Summoning sorc tree be fixed?

Xilc

So I have to assume I can't be the only one frustrated by the Daedric Summoning tree the Sorcerer class has.
It is literally the worst tree ever out of any class I have played. I use winged twilight and the clannfear, and they randomly disappear half of the time. Apparently, they are desummoned at random if you do any of the following:

• take a portal
• use a wayshrine
• walk through a door
• accidentally hit the button on your action bar
• enter a dungeon
• get disconnected from the server and have to log back in
• mount up on your horse (no lie, they randomly disappear sometimes)

Seriously, I find myself having to resummon them far more than I would even have to cast the spells that could replace them on the bar. It really places me in a bad position when I walk through a door and am attacked and have to dump over half of my magicka just to get them back, repeatedly. I feel like the devs are trying to mock me when I log back in from the stupid client randomly crashing and all my companions are gone, but oh wait.... Guess who is right next to me?


Of course, the stupid monkey. God forbid my summoned daedra be there when I log back in, but my monkey companion is. Additionally, I'm criticized (or made fun of) for using the summoned daedra in the tree...

Additionally, for each one of the Daedra you can summon, their damage is so poor that you can't possibly justify having it on your bar. I've ran some DPS numbers and using the daedra vs using some other spells in place of it, the daedra are just bad what is the point of having a Daedric Summoning tree, if the daedra you can summon are just awful?

Edit: As mentioned in a comment down below:

1. Pets do not gain damage when you gain spell damage
2. Pets do not gain damage from the champion passive Elemental Expert (pets deal shock damage, so it should be increased)
3. Pets do not gain damage from the champion passive Elfborn (pets can crit, so it should be increased)
4. Pets do not fully get the extra damage listed in their tooltip (the "plus x% more shock damage)

Do you guys think it needs to be fixed?

stojekarcub18_ESO

Yes

and so should every other skill affected by this. It's NOT just sorc skills.

MudcrabsRus

No

Learn how to use the skill tree properly.

MudcrabsRus

No

.

stojekarcub18_ESO

Yes

MudcrabsRus wrote: »

Learn how to use the skill tree properly.

Please, oh omnipotent one, teach us how to use these skill trees PROPERLY that we don't have to recast/resummon after zoning??

Xilc

Yes

MudcrabsRus wrote: »

Learn how to use the skill tree properly.

Learn how to use it properly, are you just trolling? What 'proper' way is there to use this? You put the daedra on your bar, you summon them, and they attack stuff. What am I missing? Am I wrong to want the summoned daedra to actually be useful rather than just being a waste of a point/slot????

MudcrabsRus

No

No, I should have said learn how to use your build properly, find out for yourselves.

MudcrabsRus

No

stojekarcub18_ESO wrote: »

MudcrabsRus wrote: »

Learn how to use the skill tree properly.

Please, oh omnipotent one, teach us how to use these skill trees PROPERLY that we don't have to recast/resummon after zoning??

I'm not god

Xilc

Yes

MudcrabsRus wrote: »

stojekarcub18_ESO wrote: »

MudcrabsRus wrote: »

Learn how to use the skill tree properly.

Please, oh omnipotent one, teach us how to use these skill trees PROPERLY that we don't have to recast/resummon after zoning??

I'm not god

Why are you spamming your reply 5 times?

MudcrabsRus

No

Xilc wrote: »

MudcrabsRus wrote: »

stojekarcub18_ESO wrote: »

MudcrabsRus wrote: »

Learn how to use the skill tree properly.

Please, oh omnipotent one, teach us how to use these skill trees PROPERLY that we don't have to recast/resummon after zoning??

I'm not god

Why are you spamming your reply 5 times?

I don't know? Have I ?

Xilc

Yes

MudcrabsRus wrote: »

No, I should have said learn how to use your build properly, find out for yourselves.

MudcrabsRus wrote: »

.

MudcrabsRus wrote: »

Learn how to use the skill tree properly.

This is three replies from you about the same exact answer.

Fat_Cat45

Yes

There's also other things going on in the background for all the Daedric Summoning skills and pets.

I have a full list here: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/2251746#Comment_2251746.

But a short summary is this:

1. Pets do not gain damage when you gain spell damage
2. Pets do not gain damage from the champion passive Elemental Expert (pets deal shock damage, so it should be increased)
3. Pets do not gain damage from the champion passive Elfborn (pets can crit, so it should be increased)
4. Pets do not fully get the extra damage listed in their tooltip (the "plus x% more shock damage)

LameoveR

We need new entire Shepherd class!
Daedric Shepherd!

josh5813

No

I don't see whats so wrong with the summoned Daedra. I have the summon Clannfear and the Winged Twilight thats been morphed into the choice that makes it do more damage and heal me when my life gets low and have traits that make them both do more damage and they are great.

For one they help kept the damage off of me and they both do good damage. When I'm fighting a group of say 3 to 5 enemies while I'm fighting 1 of them my Daedra can handle the others and if they are both attacking the same enemy they will usually have their life half way down or have already killed them.

MmmmTofu

Yes

'Sorcerer
Summoning
Volatile Familiar: Reduced the damage of this ability to 12% maximum magicka from 20% maximum magicka. This is a temporary solution until we completely resolve the issue where the Familiar is exploding twice.'

This is from summer 2014. Has this 'temporary solution' been solved?

Xilc

Yes

josh5813 wrote: »

I don't see whats so wrong with the summoned Daedra. I have the summon Clannfear and the Winged Twilight that been morphed into the choice that makes it do more damage and heal me when my life gets low and have traits that make them both do more damage and they are great.

For one they help kept the damage off of me and they both do good damage. When I'm fighting a group of say 3 to 5 enemies while I'm fighting 1 of them my Daedra can handle the others and if they are both attacking the same enemy they will usually have their life half way down or have already killed them.

They're great for solo leveling, sure, but come level 45? They become nearly useless. As mentioned previously:

Fat_Cat45 wrote: »

1. Pets do not gain damage when you gain spell damage
2. Pets do not gain damage from the champion passive Elemental Expert (pets deal shock damage, so it should be increased)
3. Pets do not gain damage from the champion passive Elfborn (pets can crit, so it should be increased)
4. Pets do not fully get the extra damage listed in their tooltip (the "plus x% more shock damage)

Knowledge is power.

UltimaJoe777

Got news for you: Magelight deactivates upon Zone Change too. All of the toggle skills do. You also forgot to add how they get unsummoned if you weapon swap without them on your other skill bar, although that is actually something that can be used to your advantage if done properly when it comes to the summons.

Xilc

Yes

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Got news for you: Magelight deactivates upon Zone Change too. All of the toggle skills do. You also forgot to add how they get unsummoned if you weapon swap without them on your other skill bar, although that is actually something that can be used to your advantage if done properly when it comes to the summons.

If Magelight dispels even half as much as the summoned daedra do, I don't want that spell either then...

MmmmTofu wrote: »

'Sorcerer
Summoning
Volatile Familiar: Reduced the damage of this ability to 12% maximum magicka from 20% maximum magicka. This is a temporary solution until we completely resolve the issue where the Familiar is exploding twice.'

This is from summer 2014. Has this 'temporary solution' been solved?

wow lol where did you find that?

josh5813

No

Xilc wrote: »

josh5813 wrote: »

I don't see whats so wrong with the summoned Daedra. I have the summon Clannfear and the Winged Twilight that been morphed into the choice that makes it do more damage and heal me when my life gets low and have traits that make them both do more damage and they are great.

For one they help kept the damage off of me and they both do good damage. When I'm fighting a group of say 3 to 5 enemies while I'm fighting 1 of them my Daedra can handle the others and if they are both attacking the same enemy they will usually have their life half way down or have already killed them.

They're great for solo leveling, sure, but come level 45? They become nearly useless. As mentioned previously:

Fat_Cat45 wrote: »

1. Pets do not gain damage when you gain spell damage
2. Pets do not gain damage from the champion passive Elemental Expert (pets deal shock damage, so it should be increased)
3. Pets do not gain damage from the champion passive Elfborn (pets can crit, so it should be increased)
4. Pets do not fully get the extra damage listed in their tooltip (the "plus x% more shock damage)

Knowledge is power.

They are still going strong for me even now that I got my AD character into the Coldharbour part of the Alliance story line.

My view on them might be different since even if my AD character is from the Sorcerer class I use heavy armor and fight with duel wield and sometimes switch off with a two handed weapon.

Xilc

Yes

josh5813 wrote: »

Xilc wrote: »

josh5813 wrote: »

I don't see whats so wrong with the summoned Daedra. I have the summon Clannfear and the Winged Twilight that been morphed into the choice that makes it do more damage and heal me when my life gets low and have traits that make them both do more damage and they are great.

For one they help kept the damage off of me and they both do good damage. When I'm fighting a group of say 3 to 5 enemies while I'm fighting 1 of them my Daedra can handle the others and if they are both attacking the same enemy they will usually have their life half way down or have already killed them.

They're great for solo leveling, sure, but come level 45? They become nearly useless. As mentioned previously:

Fat_Cat45 wrote: »

1. Pets do not gain damage when you gain spell damage
2. Pets do not gain damage from the champion passive Elemental Expert (pets deal shock damage, so it should be increased)
3. Pets do not gain damage from the champion passive Elfborn (pets can crit, so it should be increased)
4. Pets do not fully get the extra damage listed in their tooltip (the "plus x% more shock damage)

Knowledge is power.

They are still going strong for me even now that I got my AD character into the Coldharbour part of the Alliance story line.

My view on them might be different since even if my AD character is from the Sorcerer class I use heavy armor and fight with duel wield and sometimes switch off with a two handed weapon.

Okay, but point blank, the abilities are inferior because you can just swap them out for an ability affected by any of the extra damage passives. Example: Swapping out your clanfear for another spell that is affected by gains in spell damage would drastically affect your dps, while your clanfear or winged does not see any gain from spellpower.

UltimaJoe777

Xilc wrote: »

josh5813 wrote: »

Xilc wrote: »

josh5813 wrote: »

I don't see whats so wrong with the summoned Daedra. I have the summon Clannfear and the Winged Twilight that been morphed into the choice that makes it do more damage and heal me when my life gets low and have traits that make them both do more damage and they are great.

For one they help kept the damage off of me and they both do good damage. When I'm fighting a group of say 3 to 5 enemies while I'm fighting 1 of them my Daedra can handle the others and if they are both attacking the same enemy they will usually have their life half way down or have already killed them.

They're great for solo leveling, sure, but come level 45? They become nearly useless. As mentioned previously:

Fat_Cat45 wrote: »

1. Pets do not gain damage when you gain spell damage
2. Pets do not gain damage from the champion passive Elemental Expert (pets deal shock damage, so it should be increased)
3. Pets do not gain damage from the champion passive Elfborn (pets can crit, so it should be increased)
4. Pets do not fully get the extra damage listed in their tooltip (the "plus x% more shock damage)

Knowledge is power.

They are still going strong for me even now that I got my AD character into the Coldharbour part of the Alliance story line.

My view on them might be different since even if my AD character is from the Sorcerer class I use heavy armor and fight with duel wield and sometimes switch off with a two handed weapon.

Okay, but point blank, the abilities are inferior because you can just swap them out for an ability affected by any of the extra damage passives. Example: Swapping out your clanfear for another spell that is affected by gains in spell damage would drastically affect your dps, while your clanfear or winged does not see any gain from spellpower.

To be fair, Clannfear and Twilight Matriarch mainly exist for healing anyway.

Farorin

Yes

Yes, they should be tweaked and improved for general usefulness, like many of the useless, or near useless skills and skill lines from the other 3 classes.

Leeric

Yes

They are pretty terrible. I remember when ZOS claimed how good the "new" pet build would be and they had to "tone it down" on the PTS....all of that was nonsense of course.

Ffastyl

Not playing a Sorcerer I shall refrain from voting, but I must comment on:

Xilc wrote: »

And let's be honest, for each one of the Daedra you can summon, their damage is so poor that you can't possibly justify having it on your bar. I've ran some DPS numbers and using the daedra vs using some other spells in place of it, the daedra are just bad what is the point of having a Daedric Summoning tree, if the daedra you can summon are just awful?

ESO focuses on active combat and passive healing. While allowing passive combat, it is of such lesser power than active that most players consider it negligible. Summoned combat pets are a form of passive combat. Buffing their damage may be needed but it must be done in a way that is active, such casting another ability to buff the summons (i.e. +500% damage for 10 seconds). Simply increasing the base damage is a step towards afk fighting.

fastolfv_ESO

If by fixed you mean scrapped and turned into that dps tree of spells the sorc needs to well be a sorc then yes fix it

Alucardo

The random desummoning thing definitely needs looking at, but other than that it's fine.

MudcrabsRus

No

Xilc wrote: »

MudcrabsRus wrote: »

No, I should have said learn how to use your build properly, find out for yourselves.

MudcrabsRus wrote: »

.

MudcrabsRus wrote: »

Learn how to use the skill tree properly.

This is three replies from you about the same exact answer.

Lack of sleep on your part? I'm not even going their, lol.

Mivryna

Yes

I'd like to see the skill bar system reworked entirely, so that both are active at the same time, and it's controlled on the user's machine. This would fix the issues with responsiveness, and also allow toggled skills to take up only one slot instead of two, and still be functional.

myrrrorb14_ESO

No

Thought this was an old post at first :-)

The skill line is pretty good. Very good if you like pets. In my opinion its a lazy way to play, but it is very effective especially for solo play.

I had no issues playing a daedric herder. Made it to vet ranks in about 2 weeks of semi-casual play. Soloed all public dungeons, dolmens, and world bosses.

The whole having to resummon is unfortunate but that affects all classes that have toggled abilities.

Resipsa131

No

I can run around solo Craglorn as a V3 and collect Mats (Sorc is my crafting character) Pets are decent tanks and distractions and I can kill off groups of the v11 Atronachs and continue picking up maps getting the treasure maps ect. Deadric Summoning is the best for soloing even veteran content. Max Magicka/Some Health Enchants and keep Hardened Ward up at all times.

olsborg

Yes

Theres a bunch of things wrong with the pets. But most of all..their dmg in pvp is just plain bad.