Stop with the healer/dps builds

TiiZzArD xx

I'm a dedicated support player and a pure healer but it really is beginning to bug me that half the "healers" in pvp are getting kill greedy. We aren't ment to do damage and you're not helping by doing low dps. If you want to help, use combat prayer to buff damage for your squad.

I know healing can get boring but if you're a "healer" stick to healing and support. If you want kills just switch to dps.

Pick a side.

Darlgon

Rolf.. While I agree.. Umm.. My DK healer doesnt have Temp Class skill line to clutter up his bar, so he can put other stuff there.

Saddiq

Tricky position. If you talk to a lot of end-game users, they'll say vet DSA, 'vet' Trials, etc. all but require their healers to contribute to dps. My last run of DSA I was asked to essentially be a third DPS and had all 3 other members ask me to add specific things too my build to support their dpsing. I ended up stumbling on a new build I kind of liked--and I have been an exclusive healer until very recently. Biting jabs, for example, which contributes nothing to group healing, was requested of me and then on Teamspeak I was tasked with taking out large amounts of adds with it alone, having to heal on the side.

Saddiq

Forgot to mention, I can't imagine doing IC as full healer. Unless you're zerging, a far greater crime against humanity, or I guess in a very tight-knit four-man community that are sewn permanently to each other, you won't get anywhere in IC with a dedicated healer build.

Corpsage

lol the only time I break role is due to impatience in a dungeon run. For example today; I pretty much solo'd Black Heart Haven (set to v3, normal mode) while another V16 and his V1 and V3 buddies tagged along. Rather than ditch the group I just start what I'm beginning to call the "Templar Bloodlust" and start moving and killing at a pace they can follow to keep up with me. Ive also done this in Direfrost pre-IC at V14

Shinra

TiiZzArD xx wrote: »

I'm a dedicated support player and a pure healer but it really is beginning to bug me that half the "healers" in pvp are getting kill greedy. We aren't ment to do damage and you're not helping by doing low dps. If you want to help, use combat prayer to buff damage for your squad.

I know healing can get boring but if you're a "healer" stick to healing and support. If you want kills just switch to dps.

Pick a side.

In high-end dungeons like V-DSA, White Gold Tower or Imperial City Prison, as well as CoA or CoH Hardmodes, a healer who knows when to heal and when to dps is incredibly valueable.

Basically, healers who only heal and refuse to DPS are wasted potential which results either in wasted time or unnecessary wipes. Well, wasted time isn't that much of a problem for me, but I still want to beat a dungeon. And with a good DPS-Healer, that becomes easier. Specially with DPS-race bosses.

Cinnamon_Spider

Healbot/DPS in PVP and heal/DPS/tank in PVE here with a high spell power build and that won't be changing any time soon. But feel free to keep limiting yourself.

TiiZzArD xx

Heal bot is a good one, and keep in mind I'm just talking about small group pvp.

Leandor

TiiZzArD xx wrote: »

Heal bot is a good one, and keep in mind I'm just talking about small group pvp.

Even worse... Being a liability for your group for refusing to be flexible... Reduces effectivity of your group for sure.

TiiZzArD xx

I'd have to disagree but I think that's the beauty of eso. Plus I'm not saying I don't have radiant oppression and blazing spear but those at more to build ultimate and give stamina.

Septimus_Magna

I disagree, it makes combat a lot more dynamic because players can fulfill multiple roles. As a dps I support with healing when its needed, I think its great healers (and tanks) can help with dps when its needed. As long as the healer keeps everyone alive the more dps they do, the better.

tengri

If as healer you have the spare time and resources you better start to dps, too, bro... else you wont have my thanks for "doing your job" but my boot for chronic laziness...

Lord_Bidr

Hey you ain't paying for me subs, don't tell me what to do! 'Sides, ZOS said play how you want, so imma play how I wants.

andy_s

Pure healing is boring in ESO (imho), but on the contrary a healer role can be very interesting, because you can debuff bosses (elemental drain from destro staff), interrupt enemies' abilities (crushing shock from destro staff), provide you group with resoruces (templar's spear & repentance for stamina, siphon spirit from resto staff for health and magicka) and so on. When I play my healer, I always want to donate for 2-3 more skill slots

Lutallo

I can't speak for other classes, but if you're a Templar healer in PvP and you're not using Radiant Oppression, you're doing it seriously wrong.

Rune_Relic

TiiZzArD xx wrote: »

I'm a dedicated support player and a pure healer but it really is beginning to bug me that half the "healers" in pvp are getting kill greedy. We aren't ment to do damage and you're not helping by doing low dps. If you want to help, use combat prayer to buff damage for your squad.

I know healing can get boring but if you're a "healer" stick to healing and support. If you want kills just switch to dps.

Pick a side.

2.1

Blocking nerfed
Rolling nerfed
Streak nerfed

The best mitigation is healing/shields.
If you are going that route then you aren't going to use stamina for DPS and nerf shields/heals
Your only viable option is Magicka and there is no reason not to go all out magicka for Heal/DPS

I am sad that your experience has proven this.
You can ask ZOS to roll back the rolldodge/streak/blocking nerfs if you want people to use these options for damage mitigation.

Healing is part of the DPS rotation now rather than block/dodge/streak

Kas

sorry, but this is terrible, terrible advice.
dps'ing whiel heal is needed is a terrible thing.

however, good play includes mvoement and coordinated focus. if an enemy is out of position and your group does not need a heal, it's crucial that a good templar joins the burst. often this is done with jesus beam but it doesn't have to.

i fully agree that a healer jabbing around somewhere while others need heal is terrible. however, a support-only player is mediocre at best. if you want to win while strongly outnumbered, you need to seize your chances to lower enemy numbers. any player not joining in, isn't doing his job.

Lilarna

As answer to the very first post, have you read other threads where healers explain that if they don't ditch in some dps in IC, they don't get any loots or tel var stones ?

Maybe it'll change your point of view on their behaviour, which is their own to decide on in the first place by the way.

eliisra

TiiZzArD xx wrote: »

I'm a dedicated support player and a pure healer but it really is beginning to bug me that half the "healers" in pvp are getting kill greedy. We aren't ment to do damage and you're not helping by doing low dps. If you want to help, use combat prayer to buff damage for your squad.

I know healing can get boring but if you're a "healer" stick to healing and support. If you want kills just switch to dps.

Pick a side.

No. In smaller PvP groups you need to be flexible as a healer. Slot a mix of support, dps, utility, heal and defensive skills, than use what's best depending on situation and targets. Playing strict heal/support bot is just not a good idea for small scale. Pure dps builds, only mashing dps skills, doesn't work either.

Example: Let's say everyone is wiped besides you and a NB. You guys are trying to revive your buddies. Than a tanky "come at me" DK arrives. But you have no skills to deal with him, only heals because you "picked a side". The NB cant kill him alone and you have no dmg to help. At that point, if you only had some dps skills slotted, you could have saved the day.

In raids exceeding 12 players, you get close to 0 XP, if you only heal. Also get less loot. That's why you see healers trying to squeeze in dps. Ideally they should only do so when no one is taking big dmg, but some are more desperate than others. Healers need CP and IC drops to, but apparently ZoS doesn't give a ***.

Healing in raids:
no xp
no mount
no loot

Enjoy.

Lightninvash

TiiZzArD xx wrote: »

I'm a dedicated support player and a pure healer but it really is beginning to bug me that half the "healers" in pvp are getting kill greedy. We aren't ment to do damage and you're not helping by doing low dps. If you want to help, use combat prayer to buff damage for your squad.

I know healing can get boring but if you're a "healer" stick to healing and support. If you want kills just switch to dps.

Pick a side.

im a full healer and support in pvp but jesus beam allows me to get kills sometimes. and I norm use destro ice staff for rooting ppl when they try and escape to wear down stam, as console player ima be more valued in the ic update when ppl cant roll as much so they will have to stay there and fight or risk dodge rolling and being stuck again just to be perma stunned. I love the Templar I built I survive really well on group battles, even tho I wear vet 1 crap gear atm at vet 10. dps healer to me makes no sense because its hard to do both of those at once because once you switch from heals you are useless as a healer. and once you switch to heals you have crap dps unless jesus beam. its always a trade off with it see me I only switch for like 1 maybe 2 hits for rooting or for initial hit with my aoe to reduce max hp or something then iim right back as healer healing the ppl using siege weapons that are being pummeled by other siege weapons

13igTyme

A healer who can DPS will always be more effective and efficient than a healer who doesn't. In every MMO to date this is the truth.

driosketch

This is not universally true. Since I tend to run with at least half random player groups, I find I usually don't have the spare resources or time to swap bars or get bored. Because someone is always taking damage. But if every one is fine, some extra dps is a good thing.

Minno

Cinnamon_Spider wrote: »

Healbot/DPS in PVP and heal/DPS/tank in PVE here with a high spell power build and that won't be changing any time soon. But feel free to keep limiting yourself.

It's that hybridization of the healer/dps/tank that makes ESO fun and challenging, so I agree with you!
If I wanted pure heals I'd go back to WoW.

Though Templar heal ticks are pretty sexy on this update

Ballzy321

and here I thought I could play how I wanted. Man was I wrong

capnbinky

Saddiq wrote: »

Forgot to mention, I can't imagine doing IC as full healer. Unless you're zerging, a far greater crime against humanity, or I guess in a very tight-knit four-man community that are sewn permanently to each other, you won't get anywhere in IC with a dedicated healer build.

Dedicated healers are GOLD in IC. Felt like god mode.

capnbinky

eliisra wrote: »

In raids exceeding 12 players, you get close to 0 XP, if you only heal. Also get less loot. That's why you see healers trying to squeeze in dps. Ideally they should only do so when no one is taking big dmg, but some are more desperate than others. Healers need CP and IC drops to, but apparently ZoS doesn't give a ***.

Healing in raids:
no xp
no mount
no loot

Enjoy.

This is the real issue. The game needs to actively reward players for heavy support roles, or your group levels past you until you are left behind.

With the heinous cross-the-board nerfing slamming tanks so hard, though, I wonder if ZOS actually doesn't want dedicated support roles?

Angarato

Minno wrote: »

show previous quotes

Cinnamon_Spider wrote: »

Healbot/DPS in PVP and heal/DPS/tank in PVE here with a high spell power build and that won't be changing any time soon. But feel free to keep limiting yourself.

It's that hybridization of the healer/dps/tank that makes ESO fun and challenging, so I agree with you!
If I wanted pure heals I'd go back to WoW.

Though Templar heal ticks are pretty sexy on this update

the best healers in wow arena did stupid amounts of dps sometimes. disc priest, restokin come to mind

Auricle

What about a magicka NB healer? Funnel Health does damage AND heals... Should one forgo that skill just so they can know their place..?

This thread was a fail from the get go, honestly. Don't tell people how to play, dude. Not cool.

TiiZzArD xx

You guys got me all wrong... I don't like when people say they are a healer, and people are dying because the "healer" is busy using biting jabs or whatever. Radiant oppression is always on my bar, same with spear for stamina players. The odd time I'll slot destructive reach because I have the master destro. I add the odd dps but it's not for damage it's for crowd control.. I'm not telling you that a dps templar shouldn't use breath of life for an extra heal every now and then, nor am I telling you how to play.. Just do the claim your a "healer" if you're doing dps most of the time..

Reeko

TiiZzArD xx wrote: »

You guys got me all wrong... I don't like when people say they are a healer, and people are dying because the "healer" is busy using biting jabs or whatever. Radiant oppression is always on my bar, same with spear for stamina players. The odd time I'll slot destructive reach because I have the master destro. I add the odd dps but it's not for damage it's for crowd control.. I'm not telling you that a dps templar shouldn't use breath of life for an extra heal every now and then, nor am I telling you how to play.. Just do the claim your a "healer" if you're doing dps most of the time..

As a nightblade healer i HAVE to dps as funnel health is my main heal, which heals based on how much damage i do with it.

If a group wipes because the healer was not healing that is just a bad healer. If a healer does nothing but heals and the group conquers that is a good healer. If the healer heals enough to keep everyone up AND does dps to end the fight fast e r? That is a GREAT healer.

Draehl

I don't know about anyone else, but 10+ years of MMOs has consisted of my playing nearly exclusively sustained dps/self-offhealer archetypes. Affliction Warlock, Necro/Monk in GW, offensive support Necro in GW2, Zealot in Warhammer, Bloodmage in Vanguard, etc. These builds are very strong for soloing and can contribute in PvP swapping roles as needed in a group, and offering self sustained for 1v1. No, it's not the most focused build at one particular role, but it is very focused toward being effective in sustained fights.