Why?!

Ratbert

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Ratbert wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

When you explain why it was ok for Best in slot gear to be gated behind PvE trials, the undaunted sets and passives gated behind PvE Dungeons, efficient leveling/CP gated behind PvE grinds, the acquisition of of those skyshards gated behind PvE content, I will have sympathy for stuff "gated" behind PvP content.

Because the game is centered around PVE? Seems like it to me with a lot more content for that class of player. You can't sit there and honestly say having things in a PVE dungeon is the same as having something only in a PVP area forcing a PVE player into said area. It is not the same thing for that player.

The AI of a PVE dungeon doesn't decide to all run to the front to stealth and gank players as they zone in making their night a headache. The vet 14 with 4 million CP doesn't scale down to the poor vet 2 with 12 CP needing to get into the PVP area to farm a mat for crafting.

The difficulty in obtaining what you need in a PVP infested griefing area is not the same as having something only in a PVE area. At best that is a minor annoyance.

Lol, having to grind PvE zones to be viable on PvP is a minor annoyance? You are so far out of touch with the actual player base, why are you even commenting?

The game was actually advertised as a PvP game, in case you didn't know. Since, you know, it's storyline is centered around a tri-faction war.

Oh yeah my bad.. I guess I've been running in PVP content this entire time.

It boggles me how the PVP player can't seem to understand how these two things are not the same. And that one class of player going to the content of the other isn't the same thing. I can't speak in any other languages.

Good luck guys.

DisgracefulMind

Ratbert wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Ratbert wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

When you explain why it was ok for Best in slot gear to be gated behind PvE trials, the undaunted sets and passives gated behind PvE Dungeons, efficient leveling/CP gated behind PvE grinds, the acquisition of of those skyshards gated behind PvE content, I will have sympathy for stuff "gated" behind PvP content.

Because the game is centered around PVE? Seems like it to me with a lot more content for that class of player. You can't sit there and honestly say having things in a PVE dungeon is the same as having something only in a PVP area forcing a PVE player into said area. It is not the same thing for that player.

The AI of a PVE dungeon doesn't decide to all run to the front to stealth and gank players as they zone in making their night a headache. The vet 14 with 4 million CP doesn't scale down to the poor vet 2 with 12 CP needing to get into the PVP area to farm a mat for crafting.

The difficulty in obtaining what you need in a PVP infested griefing area is not the same as having something only in a PVE area. At best that is a minor annoyance.

Lol, having to grind PvE zones to be viable on PvP is a minor annoyance? You are so far out of touch with the actual player base, why are you even commenting?

The game was actually advertised as a PvP game, in case you didn't know. Since, you know, it's storyline is centered around a tri-faction war.

Oh yeah my bad.. I guess I've been running in PVP content this entire time.

It boggles me how the PVP player can't seem to understand how these two things are not the same. And that one class of player going to the content of the other isn't the same thing. I can't speak in any other languages.

Good luck guys.

I actually PvE as well. I invest time in both PvE and PvP and am excellent in both. Unfortunately for you, you fail to understand that this patch was promised to PvP players, seeing as PvE players obtained much more content than PvPers. PvErs also have new content coming out relatively soon. I find it selfish and ridiculous that PvE players continue to whine, however, and act selfish as soon as PvPers get something out of ZoS.

It IS the PvPers who deal with the worst aspect of this game, lag-wise and bug-wise.

How about you keep your crying to yourself and allow a large part of the player base to finally enjoy something?

WebBull

They said multiple times over the last 3 months that this was an update for Pvpers......

Knootewoot

As PvP all i got whas removal or torchbugs and deers and the pledge gear i don't get as i PvP and not to pledges.

So now i finally get an update, and a fun one to where dying has an actual penalty, and who whines? Some PvE players who want access to everything and have it handed over.

I wish crasglorn was solo, but i kept it to myself
I also want dwemer spheres and deadroth spawn from my armor but dont want to do pledges, but i kept it to myself
I also want xp potion but don't want to fish for it, but kept it to myself.

So you keep this to yourself. You don't like PvP? Well goodbye, goodbye everyone. This update is not entirely for you. But even with this PvP update they added a few PvE dungeons. So what the .. are you whining.

DisgracefulMind

Knootewoot wrote: »

As PvP all i got whas removal or torchbugs and deers and the pledge gear i don't get as i PvP and not to pledges.

So now i finally get an update, and a fun one to where dying has an actual penalty, and who whines? Some PvE players who want access to everything and have it handed over.

I wish crasglorn was solo, but i kept it to myself
I also want dwemer spheres and deadroth spawn from my armor but dont want to do pledges, but i kept it to myself
I also want xp potion but don't want to fish for it, but kept it to myself.

So you keep this to yourself. You don't like PvP? Well goodbye, goodbye everyone. This update is not entirely for you. But even with this PvP update they added a few PvE dungeons. So what the .. are you whining.

Oh, yes, PvErs got two badass dungeons to explore, and they're still crying. lol.

THEDKEXPERIENCE

Joy_Division wrote: »

Belidos wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

This update is for PVP PLAYERS. It is OUR turn to get new content. Plenty of new content for PvE is coming soon. If you don't like it, sorry.

The issues isn't that there was no pve content, the issue is that there was pve content but it's gated behind pvp. ie: the new crafting tiers etc.

When you explain why it was ok for Best in slot gear to be gated behind PvE trials, the undaunted sets and passives gated behind PvE Dungeons, efficient leveling/CP gated behind PvE grinds, the acquisition of of those skyshards gated behind PvE content, I will have sympathy for stuff "gated" behind PvP content.

Standing ovation.

Seriously, I run a dungeon twice tops. Besides what's the point of top gear if you're not going to show it off in PVP? This is the video game equivalent of buying a Ferrari and leaving it in the garage.

Pangnirtung

AngryNord wrote: »

That's because this is an MMO, not a singleplayer game.

Wrong. It is a play your game in your style game. If it was truly an MMO everything about it would be forced grouping.

If memory serves there were major quests before level 50 that FORCED you to play alone. That is your definition of an MMO?

Hope499

Wow people...this has been discussed time and time and time again.

No, as stated by the mods already, it is a PVP RELATED DLC

Iluvrien

Hope499 wrote: »

Wow people...this has been discussed time and time and time again.

No, as stated by the mods already, it is a PVP RELATED DLC

Then get the PvE crafting out of it. It is PvP, you say? Then make it PvP. Pure PvP.

Put the PvE crafting somewhere else, then it won't impact on anyone who doesn't want to take a personal interest in PvP.

Except that they didn't do that, did they? No.

Troneon

Iluvrien wrote: »

Hope499 wrote: »

Wow people...this has been discussed time and time and time again.

No, as stated by the mods already, it is a PVP RELATED DLC

Then get the PvE crafting out of it. It is PvP, you say? Then make it PvP. Pure PvP.

Put the PvE crafting somewhere else, then it won't impact on anyone who doesn't want to take a personal interest in PvP.

Except that they didn't do that, did they? No.

/thread

vovus69

They want everybody to entertain themselves with PVP. This is really bad DLC, but I understand that PVP herd needs it. So let's wait a bit - perhaps they will release something useful and new for solo pve. The fact that new crafting is linked with pvp *** is especially bad... Very disappointed. Will see what they will do next for solo pve crowd.

Uriel_Nocturne

Maybe I'm strange in that I'm primarily a PvE player and don't mind the structure of IC.

Personally, I can't wait for it to arrive this 15th to my One.

I rarely PvP (I only go in when the mood strikes me), but I'm definitely going to take my VR4 Main into IC as soon as I can.

Why? Because there is PvE stuff even though it's mixed with PvP.

I understand that by going in to the PvP area (Cyrodiil), I run the risk of dying at the hands of another player/a zerg-army on the prowl/or by the AI of the NPC enemies.

But this is no different (IMO) than any other time I've gone into the PvP.

Would I like to be able to go into IC and have the option of it being a Solo PvE experience? No, not at all. The entire Cyrodillic province is embroiled in the Alliance War. It's integral to the story. But i still plan on slogging my way through the Quests that present themselves in each of the Districts of the City.

What happens if I see a bunch of Lemons and/or Blueberries coming my way? I hide if possible, and wait for them to pass. Especially if I'm not traveling with a group. If I get caught, I'll lay there dead and wait for them to leave, then use my Soul Summoning ability to come back for free.

I'll be careful as I farm my crafting mats. I may even delve into the Sewers to see what I can see.

While I can see how some people might get upset that there's no strictly-PvE option, I see the risk of dying due to PvP battle as part of the inherent risk of going into the one area of the game created for the entirety of the PvP community.

And by choosing to explore the IC DLC, I fully accept that risk. But my need to explore new territory overrides any fear of the risk, and I accept it gladly.

Like I said, this is just my opinion on the matter. I'm not trying to talk down on anyone else's opinion or belittle anyone, I just see no problem with how the IC mix of PvE in with PvP is bad, in any way.

Waffennacht

The internet and complaints...

I seriously don't understand someone whom ONLY wants PvE content is playing an MMO, even more so when they want more Solo content...

If I didn't want this experience I would not have purchased an online ONLY game.

Witcher three is just sitting there... lots of PvE content in there...

MornaBaine

painsworth01 wrote: »

C'mon! The issue is not that this is new content for PVP players! It's about time! The issue is that ZOS has raised levels and that includes crafting levels. The mats needed for that PVE crafting for the new levels are only available in this PVP dedicated zone, or so we are told. Sooooo...... the complaint is that PVE players who are not geared for pvp, esp. those who are primarily crafters, are simply being lured into the zone to be used as sacrificial lambs to give PVPers someone to gank.

Exactly this. ^^ PvPers have desperately needed new content. But it should not have come at the expense of the PvEers.

Noerknhar

I actually planned to respond to the thread, pointing out how PVPers are crafting too, how 99% of the game is gated behind PVE, but also how ppl. should not be forced to PVP, but all I am writing now is:

Darkness Falls, hell yeah!

I was always wondering why not every MMO leverages on that great idea of a PVP enabled PVE zone that Mythic came up with years ago. But I guess it was just a different time with less QQ and more actually playing the game (rather than ranting on the forums).

Hope499

Iluvrien wrote: »

Hope499 wrote: »

Wow people...this has been discussed time and time and time again.

No, as stated by the mods already, it is a PVP RELATED DLC

Then get the PvE crafting out of it. It is PvP, you say? Then make it PvP. Pure PvP.

Put the PvE crafting somewhere else, then it won't impact on anyone who doesn't want to take a personal interest in PvP.

Except that they didn't do that, did they? No.

Errrrr, sorry the game does not cater to your sole interests friend.

For all the people (myself included, and my entire 500 person guild) we are all very excited about mixing the elements together. Just get ready for some PvP if you venture inside IC, regardless if you are going in to battle or to craft.

Easy solution, is to not get the DLC if you dislike it. Most of us are excited for it.

TheBull

Artis

chaseman245 wrote: »

forgot to mention this:

"Play the game your way" isn't that what ESO was based on according to Zenimax? How does this apply to the Imperial City update?

That ship has sailed after they introduced the class system.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

My two cents coming from mostly a PvE player, feel free to yell if you want to...

First, PvP needed an expansion, and this was really fun (with the exception of the zerg fest in the sewers that makes it really hard to get back to the base). I actually think this was a good balance of PvP and PvE with some fairly high level mobs/bosses running around.

Second, the complaints of the crafters are justified. As stated many times, this is an MMO. People specialize and play the game in wildly different ways. Until now, a crafter did not need to PvP in order to provide a service to the community. This is no longer the case. I am fine with some dropped sets being from PvP and some being PvE. If you want to truly min/max your build, you most play all the game. Makes sense to me. But we aren't talking about dropped sets, we are talking about crafted sets.

Crafting is different in my eyes. Crafting is useful in three basic ways. 1. Making nice sets to level (not really affected). 2. Making an end game set that is solid, but probably not the best. 3. Adding a few pieces to round out a mostly dropped set. The last 2 are definitely affected by this. Until now, crafting was nice because it allowed for customizing some gear without breaking the bank (you make it yourself so it costs less), but this is no longer true. They have effectively added a crafting grind on par with any dropped set in the game. A grind, that can't be accomplished without PvP. I think this does hurt the crafting community to some degree.

I don't think it's the end of the world, mostly because you can get most mats from deconing stuff from dungeons, but I would like to see a little more variety in how we get V15-16 mats that don't include Tel Var stones.

Gilvoth

TheBull wrote: »

i just realized "captain pricard" is "PURE imperialist" ....

that is NOT a good thing imo (coming from my dark elf point of view)

just droped my love for him like a hot potato! -wish i had seen this earlier-

Gilvoth

the whole "oblivion" thing with him talking at start now just made me vomit a little bit ....

i will try to maintain that whole " i am locutis" in memory of him! i can try, maybe idk

this aint good dude, this is not cool, my struggle with this man and his influince on both elderscrolls in general and his works and influince in star trek, really struggling here with this atm ...

CapnPhoton

WebBull wrote: »

They said multiple times over the last 3 months that this was an update for Pvpers......

This...

Quite surprised at all the reaction to something people knew about months ago. Plus it is the first add on for PVP, where all the other added content has been PVE, not to mention free.

*shrug

Bazeric

Too many post to pull quotes from but let me add something. First the shi-*mud* flinging contest.

It's great that PVP got some love(full stop).

Now to address the concerns of the OP.

Yes there is now crafting stuff "locked" (we'll see once IC update gets a thorough pass) behind a hybrid PVP/PVE area. Now you have two options if you'd like to get it.
1. Ham up and go to the IC.
2. Buy stuff from those willing to brave IC.

In b4 PVE crafter QQ - It can be difficult for PVPers to accumulate wealth, especially if that is only what they do and they aren't the best at it. Now they have a form of farming that allows them an opportunity to make the money they need to buy the armors/potions/foods that you crafters make.

So your market might take a small hit until the next DLC, but you might make friends/have fun in IC. Give it a week or two to pan out.

Joy_Division

Ratbert wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

When you explain why it was ok for Best in slot gear to be gated behind PvE trials, the undaunted sets and passives gated behind PvE Dungeons, efficient leveling/CP gated behind PvE grinds, the acquisition of of those skyshards gated behind PvE content, I will have sympathy for stuff "gated" behind PvP content.

Because the game is centered around PVE? Seems like it to me with a lot more content for that class of player. You can't sit there and honestly say having things in a PVE dungeon is the same as having something only in a PVP area forcing a PVE player into said area. It is not the same thing for that player.

The AI of a PVE dungeon doesn't decide to all run to the front to stealth and gank players as they zone in making their night a headache. The vet 14 with 4 million CP doesn't scale down to the poor vet 2 with 12 CP needing to get into the PVP area to farm a mat for crafting.

The difficulty in obtaining what you need in a PVP infested griefing area is not the same as having something only in a PVE area. At best that is a minor annoyance.

Now you are just making crap up.

Who said the game is centered around PvE? You did. Made up crap. No developer has ever utter such a thing. What the developers did do was devise the game so that there was interaction between PvP and PvE. So not only are you making stuff up, but that isn't even consistent with what the developers have done.

Just because you dislike being forced to PvP doesn't mean that there are people who dislike being forced to PvE. Just because you can't "honestly" imagine it doesn't mean it isn't true. Sorry, your preferences are not considered the norm.

You're right the AI doesn't gank me. Instead it bugs out, has insta-kill mechanics, requires I find 3 specific roles to fill, murders pugs who i'm grouped who rage quit and then waste me time, is monotonous and boring the 50th time I do it for some key that will get me crap loot, and in the case of Sanctum is a "You cannot pass this point unless you are in a hardcore trials group...Tough luck, no infallible aether gear for you."

If you didn't whine so much and worry about getting ganked, you would have already realized in just an hour, that it is possible to get stones, trophy items, mats without ever seeing a live enemy player threaten you.

And one other thing Mr. I ignore the Golden Rule, we aren't all griefers intent on stealing your TV stones.

DenMoria

I have a question, and this isn't a slam against PvPers at all.

Can't you just kill each other anywhere and gank whoever you want anywhere in Cyrodil now? What difference does it make if there's more places to kill each other?

Just wondering. I've been to Cyrodil and all it seems to be is people running around either alone or in groups killing each other.

I'm not a PvPer myself, but I found it extremely boring. If I wasn't killing somebody because they were trying to kill me, I was being killed by somebody that attacked me in the first place.

I probably just don't get it because I'm not the competitive sort and, frankly, couldn't care less about all the different factions or who wins the war anyhow.

Still - if PvPers have been this long without some kind of new content for themselves, I say, who am I to complain. ESO is just starting, I'm sure there'll be lots of content on both the PvE and the PvP sides in the future.

Sallington

Last night was the most fun I've had in ESO to date.

Ran with a group of 12 guildies. Took out some enemy groups, fought some bosses (a couple that were pretty challenging and extremely fun). Ran through the sewers collecting skyshards, loot and stones...

It's the PERFECT mix of PvE and PvP. Always needing to be on your toes, worrying about losing your TV stones, debating whether attacking that enemy group is worth the risk... all of it. Just a very well built DLC all around.

Iluvrien

Hope499 wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

Hope499 wrote: »

Wow people...this has been discussed time and time and time again.

No, as stated by the mods already, it is a PVP RELATED DLC

Then get the PvE crafting out of it. It is PvP, you say? Then make it PvP. Pure PvP.

Put the PvE crafting somewhere else, then it won't impact on anyone who doesn't want to take a personal interest in PvP.

Except that they didn't do that, did they? No.

Errrrr, sorry the game does not cater to your sole interests friend.

For all the people (myself included, and my entire 500 person guild) we are all very excited about mixing the elements together. Just get ready for some PvP if you venture inside IC, regardless if you are going in to battle or to craft.

Easy solution, is to not get the DLC if you dislike it. Most of us are excited for it.

How about catering to the pattern they previously established since launch last year? How about being consistent in their expectations for crafting and crafters?

I am glad that you and your guild are excited by the mixed elements, but does that mean that you are then incapable of seeing how this change negatively impacts the enjoyment of other people?

Nebthet78

.

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Nebthet78 wrote: »

ontheleftcoast wrote: »

My understanding is crafters won't have to go into IC to get mats. All trials and group dungeons that scale will drop VR15+ items when the group is that level. So forget going to IC, grab some friends, power level with the new increased XP rates to VR15 and head to the Wayrest sewers and kill rats for leather scraps. Get VR15 weapons and armor to decon for mats. You'll soon have piles of materials and no idea what to use them for. All without having to get a single Telvar stone.

Unless that bit about dungeons scaling to VR15/16 is wrong. In which case f#ck ZOS and the ice horse they rode in on.

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

They did implement the mats in PvE zones.

Crafters can get mats in vet dungeons. If you do the dungeon at vr16, you will get vr16 drops. Deconstruct the vr16 gear and you have mats.

Unfortunately, this in incorrect.

While the old dungeons will scale to V15/16, only the bosses and mini-bosses have a "chance" to drop the scaled loot. None of the trash mobs do.

Meaning, the only decent way to get the new mats is to run IC pvp area. The 2 new dungeons when I ran them only gave crap gold.. like seriously, 11gold for killing a mini-boss!!! WTF??

Glad I am not paying for it.

You can still port to the new dungeons and farm mats without having to do any pvp at all.

Pvp-ers are forced to do pve more than pve-ers are forced to do pvp.

I tried those new dungeons.. the loot drops are terrible and the boss only gave 11g,... Vet 16 boss and you only got 11g!!! I am not putting myself through that crap ever again.

DisgracefulMind

DenMoria wrote: »

I have a question, and this isn't a slam against PvPers at all.

Can't you just kill each other anywhere and gank whoever you want anywhere in Cyrodil now? What difference does it make if there's more places to kill each other?

Just wondering. I've been to Cyrodil and all it seems to be is people running around either alone or in groups killing each other.

I'm not a PvPer myself, but I found it extremely boring. If I wasn't killing somebody because they were trying to kill me, I was being killed by somebody that attacked me in the first place.

I probably just don't get it because I'm not the competitive sort and, frankly, couldn't care less about all the different factions or who wins the war anyhow.

Still - if PvPers have been this long without some kind of new content for themselves, I say, who am I to complain. ESO is just starting, I'm sure there'll be lots of content on both the PvE and the PvP sides in the future.

We've PvPed in Cyrodiil for over a year and a half now. Don't you think sieging down keeps, running across the map, sitting at outposts, etc. might get a little dull for us after awhile? It's the same exact thing every day. New environment, new places to fight, and so on are what we needed and wanted. You wouldn't understand the PvPer's mindset, and that's fine, but just know: we needed new content, yes we did.

Minnesinger

It is a PvP update. Seriously, you should ask yourself if you ask something they never promised. There is PvE but the main point was/ is PvP. None forces players to do IC if they don´t have stomach for PvP. Stop QQ you babies!!!