A Sorc Tank build viable?

TitanJeff

I’m currently a level 35 Stamina NB and thinking of rolling something totally different in a sorcerer character. I’ve visited a few build site but have a lot to learn about it. My concern with a trational mage is being overly squishy. My NB now gets crushed a lot in dungeons and boss battles.

I’ve seen a Sorcerer Tank build which seems interesting:
http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/the-lightning-ward-endgame-magicka-sorcerer-tank-pve/

or

http://tamrielfoundry.com/topic/storm-beast-sorcerer-tanking-and-leveling-build-2-0-7/

I’d appreciate any feedback from those of you who have tried something like this. My concern is running out of magicka too often if I wear more than a couple of pieces of heavy armor.

Scyantific

Don't use Stamina. Magicka will be your main attribute because it directly affects the strength of your shields. Plus Dark Deal to restore Stamina/Health outside of a fight.

TitanJeff

Scyantific wrote: »

Don't use Stamina. Magicka will be your main attribute because it directly affects the strength of your shields. Plus Dark Deal to restore Stamina/Health outside of a fight.

Thanks.

I few of Sorc Tank builds I've found put 100% into health. I think the result would be a 20 minute battle versus a bear.

Jumper45

Health and Magicka. Healthy amounts. You'll want around 30k hp for tanking. though im not sure what the ratio is for magicka increasing the ward. That being said. other tank build wards are based off their max hp but you also dont want your pants down when the ward goes down.

With Monster helm you can hit 30,000 physical resistance 30,000 Spell resistance and 30k hp. without even really trying. Just some resistance sets with hp on it. that being said if u were to move 5k hp into magicka. and had like 15-20k magicka or something close to that? i could see the ward being pretty powerful with those resistances.

attenchun

Im playing a sorc tank on ps4. Got 35k armor buffed :ö Works fine to me

Septimus_Magna

NB tanks are very strong in terms of end game content, I would not roll a sorc for tanking because its probably the worst class for tanking.

ontheleftcoast

I'm thinking of changing one of my sorcs into a tank, just to see what he can do. He's VR12 with class skills maxed out but not for 1H or Undaunted and that's the rub. Ideally he'd want to use multiple shield spells to mitigate damage but I wonder if the Undaunted skill that taunts would be better than the 1H ability. Which do folks think would be better?

13igTyme

Just put it in magicka. You can dps, tank and heal with 30k+ magicka.

Zlater

You have to rethink tanking on a sorc: here's the key

5pieces heavy seducer, 2engines, 3HH jewls, and 2 potentates

Stack everything into Magicka and stay between 20-25k health, don't go over, more health will make you more squishy. Keep magicka at least at 30-35k, just shield stack out the nose holes and block the heavy attacks. I've tanked just about everything like this and it works probably a little too well, just don't be enticed by more max health, trust me I've tried and it wont work for a sorc cause you cant self-heal, so don't waste your time trying.

Pierce armor, Structured Entropy, Bound Aegis, Hardened Ward, Harness Magicka, Ice comet
Inner fire, Encase or Heroic Slash, Bound Aegis, Hardened Ward, Elude or Pulsar, Supression Field or Energy Overload

Thats it, it's all about active mitigation by shield stacking and learning the game mechanics.

Alucardo

Zlater wrote: »

5pieces heavy seducer, 2engines, 3HH jewls, and 2 potentates

Did anyone elses dyslexia kick in and read that as potatoes?

TitanJeff

Zlater wrote: »

I've tanked just about everything like this and it works probably a little too well, just don't be enticed by more max health, trust me I've tried and it wont work for a sorc cause you cant self-heal, so don't waste your time trying.

That's been a challenge for me because, in my n00b head, more health logically should help keep you healthier. And those Sorc Tank builds I linked to were 100% into health.

What do most use as weapons?

Alucardo

TitanJeff wrote: »

What do most use as weapons?

Personally I use sword and board for a couple of main reasons:

- Ransack (Deals damage, taunts AND gives you minor resolve increasing your physical resistance)
- Absorb Magic (or defensive stance if you prefer)

I use a resto staff on my other bar, 'cause Healing Ward

Zlater

TitanJeff wrote: »

Zlater wrote: »

I've tanked just about everything like this and it works probably a little too well, just don't be enticed by more max health, trust me I've tried and it wont work for a sorc cause you cant self-heal, so don't waste your time trying.

That's been a challenge for me because, in my n00b head, more health logically should help keep you healthier. And those Sorc Tank builds I linked to were 100% into health.

What do most use as weapons?

You should use S&B for tanking, Lightning staff for the Minor maim and DPS you can do on your second bar, also Resto staff for PvP or if you need to carry. Good players know how to be flexible and will be the first to carry the others if they really have to ;D

For hardcore Mitigation you need to have 2x S&B though.

Alucardo wrote: »

TitanJeff wrote: »

What do most use as weapons?

Personally I use sword and board for a couple of main reasons:

- Ransack (Deals damage, taunts AND gives you minor resolve increasing your physical resistance)
- Absorb Magic (or defensive stance if you prefer)

I use a resto staff on my other bar, 'cause Healing Ward

-Ransack is highly unfavorable as it does not stack with bound aegis, you are essentially wasting a morph.
-Absorb magic is also a very useless skill, in actual fact if YOU are running 50% mitigation, or close to; due to armor you are only getting just over 2% to overall mitigation. However Defensive stance is REAL fun to use in PvP xD otherwise a waste of space and a waste of stam.
-Don't use a resto staff unless you absolutely have to or are PvPing. You shouldn't be losing much health, and if you are, that's probably why you have a healer ;D

Just a quick note, in 1.7 its a very good idea to swap negate/Overload for WW ult or slot Dark deal somewhere for the extra stam, just incase you get a little block-happy.

TitanJeff

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

NB tanks are very strong in terms of end game content, I would not roll a sorc for tanking because its probably the worst class for tanking.

Then I might need to look at this a different way. Let's start with the playing style I enjoy best.

With my current stamina NB build, I love using the bow. I like being stealth and getting into a prime position and attacking at a distance. I'm a slow player so like that I can get in a few shots before I have someone on me.

What I don't like about my build is that my defense is often rolling away to create space. What I'd like is to build another character who can hang in better if my reactions are slow (which they often are).

That's why I was thinking Sorcerer with heavy armor. But, from what I am reading, a Sorcerer's health comes from magicka and magicka comes from staying light.

Waffennacht

Ok I like to feel im extremely versed in the Sorc Tank.

Ive rolled with him since skyrim (gasp) its my play style and I love it.

I can solo dungeons (all but a few) and have (now) veteran PvP experience (where I killed two enemy players facing me)

It is Viable (that's whats important right?)

I run with pets (feel alone without them lol) and 4 heavy peices of armor and 3 peices of light armor (yeah that's right no 5 set bonus for me)

I have been tinkering with the build and have found I like this set up:

Bar one: Destruction Staff (right now fire, when i stop being lazy im going to make a frost to slow my opponents)
Healing Clannofear, Liquid Lightning, Magicka Monarch, Hardened Ward, Crystal Frag (thats the maybe instant one right?)

Bar two: Duel Wield Swords (for increased damage for finisher)
Healing Clannofear, Mage's Wrath, Magicka Monarch, Thundering Presence (the longer one), Hardened Ward

Ultimate is Atronach (the longer lasting one)

(This is pre update fyi)

For my attributes I have 28 points in Magicka and 22 in Health 0 in stamina

I use to run sword and board but I never blocked and with 0 stamina it does like no damage with lights and heavies so staff I went.

Healing is nothing compared to Clannofear so no resto staff. Just use Hardened, no point in healing ward.


Light armor does provide more magicka, but with this build magicka hardly runs dry and I can take a hit or two or more (depending on whats hitting me) without my hardened on.

I dont really focus on dealing massive damage, just a lot of sustained passive damage while I focus on knocking them down and regulating my own resources.

I miss Bolt but only because its great for traveling, never used it in battle.

TitanJeff

This sounds fun. May I ask what race you are for this build?

How is dual wield working with no stamina? I assume you have your gear enchanted with stuff to help there? Why DW over 2H?

Thanks.

Waffennacht

Actually I don't use the light heavy qttack with DW, its to boost spell power, that way my execution is that much stronger.

Mostly back up is buffs and execution.

All enchantments are max magicka and regen magicka.

Im high elf, great passives for the build

Waffennacht

Fyi i am going to have to change the build because of the updates.

Either I will have to change my attributes slightly for the new lightning form or find a new spell I want to replace it with.

Im hoping its a blessing in disguise (really depends on if its stamina based or magicka) if magicka based ill use it (that we can manage magicka better)

Zlater

Sounds like this might be what you're looking for, I don't think I'd call call it tanking though, but sounds a bit more defensive I get the impression by you're last comment that you aren't looking for a true tank, in which case you have a fit

TitanJeff

Zlater wrote: »

Sounds like this might be what you're looking for, I don't think I'd call call it tanking though, but sounds a bit more defensive I get the impression by you're last comment that you aren't looking for a true tank, in which case you have a fit

By "tank", I assume it meant mostly heavy armor and hard to kill. I'm probably using the term incorrectly. I probably should have just titled this thread "what can I build that's impossible to kill where I can shoot cool lightning bolts".

Hey Waffennacht, would a Breton work for this build?

Waffennacht

Im sure a Breton would work

I like to think of it as a "tank" sureyou don't have a taunt.... But you do get alot of aggro! So the pets take some aggro and so do you. Once you have all this lightning blasting around you get a ton of aggro.

Personally im right in the face of boss etc so my thunderous presence keeps hitting (combined with liquid lightning that's over 1000 dmg per sec) This means I step infront of my ally that's being aggroed (I have some team dungeon exp in my build)

So no conventional tank type taunt (you can always add it cause I only run hardened on both bars cuz that split second of switching weapons is death in a solo dungeon)

Gotta go ill finish the thought later

WyldfireWyrm

They are still viable, but are easily the worst option.

Waffennacht

I don't see how they can be the "worst" at all.

In PvP my build took on an equal level vet and another lower level enemy and killed both.
I can solo spindleclutch, city of ash, tempest island, and more i can't name off of the top of my head.

I don't see how it is the "worst" option.

And with stamina being nerfed I think this build gets far from the "worst"

And tell me exactly what is better? Dk?

Also if shield stacking is broken good then we can add that and be broken good.

I don't trash talk your build, especially if I haven't tried it

Zlater

Waffennacht wrote: »

I don't see how they can be the "worst" at all.

In PvP my build took on an equal level vet and another lower level enemy and killed both.
I can solo spindleclutch, city of ash, tempest island, and more i can't name off of the top of my head.

I don't see how it is the "worst" option.

And with stamina being nerfed I think this build gets far from the "worst"

And tell me exactly what is better? Dk?

Also if shield stacking is broken good then we can add that and be broken good.

I don't trash talk your build, especially if I haven't tried it

He's exactly right, When I get on my healer the worst tanks in-game I find are actually DK Tanks. They lose health like no other Class and seem to be impossibly needy. The best class I've healed so far is a NB, and I've been told by the healer, on my Sorc right after vDSA that as the tank it was incredibly easy to keep me up and probably found I was easily one of the best tanks they've healed so far. Its a matter of doing the research to find how the numbers work in this game, exactly what sort of tanking capabilities you have and how to make it work in your favor. You'll be surprised to find that very often the meta isn't the strongest or most suitable, but just the most fashionable build.

WyldfireWyrm

Waffennacht wrote: »

I don't see how they can be the "worst" at all.

In PvP my build took on an equal level vet and another lower level enemy and killed both.
I can solo spindleclutch, city of ash, tempest island, and more i can't name off of the top of my head.

I don't see how it is the "worst" option.

And with stamina being nerfed I think this build gets far from the "worst"

And tell me exactly what is better? Dk?

Also if shield stacking is broken good then we can add that and be broken good.

I don't trash talk your build, especially if I haven't tried it

I guess it will boil down to personal experience here, because the worst tanks I've healed are sorcerers. Their class shield is good, but breaks fairly easy and sounds like it's a big magicka drain. Their CC is good though, especially when they run the Negate ultimate.

Second worst are Templars. They have a great class shield as well, but it's also a magicka drain and they lack any good CC.

DKs are second best with great CC and tons of mitigation, but I think it's the second hardest tank to play well. Bad DK tanks can become resource starved easier than Sorcerers or Nightblades, which throws all their benefits out the window.

The best tanks I've played with are NBs. Avoidance is better than mitigation, especially when we're talking about avoiding the super heavy hits. Their CC is solid and not as good as DKs, but their resource management is better. I feel like they are the hardest tanks to play well, but they are beastly when played properly.

So I probably should not have said they were easily the worst, but I do think they are worst based on my personal experience as a healer with them. Honestly, the arguement could probably be made that Templars are the worst tanks. And my info on the tanks comes from my experiences as a healer with these tanks, talking to the tanks and playing as a Templar tank (which is the only class I've tanked on).

Waffennacht

I can totally see that.

Are you suppose to spam the shield and stand there? No lol.

My sorc tank has the 20k health with heavy armor, ill allow my self to be hit a few times without ward up, then throw down ward. Using crystals to heal the small damage I took.

I will BET YOU EVERYTHING that they are running either mostly light armor or the exact opposite of 5 heavy and 1 med 1 light.
This is a Huge mistake. With only 1 peice light armor you give up 14% of magicka regen/max magicka that's a huge percentage left on the table. With undaunted and just using 4 heavy 3 light I actually run 16% max magicka/regen than someone using the standard 5 peices. That's gonna make a big difference. (And if they aren't high elf im running 25% higher)

Honestly I would love to run a dungeon with you. I feel like we would never die (im sick of doing dungeons alone... stupid group finder...)

Cathexis

I've been running a stamina healer build and it is a ton of fun in the new patch. It could easily be adapted into a block build. Just putting that out there.

Waffennacht

@Cathexis wanna share your build? Im curious about it, let's discuss!

Cathexis

Waffennacht wrote: »

@Cathexis wanna share your build? Im curious about it, let's discuss!

Sent you a pm with my thoughts on the matter, but take them with a grain of salt (I'm not a tank build type).

Waffennacht

That's fine when I get home im gonna learn more about such builds and abilities

Vizier

Is a Sorc Tank viable he asks... You can have a Sorc Tank and DPS at the same time bud... Been FOTM for oh, like 6-7 months now.