What SHOULDN'T be included in ESO housing?

Collins6542

No benefits, maybe a small storage allocation, but completely customizable!

P3ZZL3

Collins6542 wrote: »

No benefits, maybe a small storage allocation, but completely customizable!

Ok, please, someone, answer why....

Why should you have storage in a house, when you have it in the bank?

What would you actually do with the house?

Gidorick

P3ZZL3 wrote: »

Collins6542 wrote: »

No benefits, maybe a small storage allocation, but completely customizable!

Ok, please, someone, answer why....

Why should you have storage in a house, when you have it in the bank?

What would you actually do with the house?

You can craft from the bank but not storage in your home.

Armitas

I don't want to see houses at all, I want to see castles! If you're going to spend the time on developing it might as well pull ahead of the herd and gives some real castles not some quaint cottage.

Enodoc

P3ZZL3 wrote: »

kevlarto_ESO wrote: »

No bank, but I do hope storage

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P3ZZL3 wrote: »

Collins6542 wrote: »

No benefits, maybe a small storage allocation, but completely customizable!

Ok, please, someone, answer why....

Why should you have storage in a house, when you have it in the bank?

It's an extension of the character personal storage space that is only accessible from one location and not shared. That makes it intrinsically different from the bank (shared) and the inventory (carried with you) and would be great for dumping off things that you don't want to carry around with you and don't want to fill up the bank with, such as low-level soul gems and potions, quest trophies and trinkets, and disguises.

Audigy

Gidorick wrote: »

We're all pretty excited that housing is on the table for eventual release. There are MANY awesome things that homes in an MMO can have to enhance player experience and broaden gameplay. Many players have already voiced their thoughts on how homes could work in ESO (my thoughts: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/145287/another-housing-suggestion-a-3-phase-release-plan/p1) There are also numerous threads about what homes SHOULD have, features we want... But what about those features we do NOT want?

There are features that, if added to player homes, would negatively impact the growth of the game or would discourage community interaction. Like, I personally don't think we should be able to use a Wayshrine to directly access our home. Home entrances should be actual places in Nirn that we must travel to.

I'll start this list off and add to it as we discuss...

The features we do NOT want to see in ESO player homes
(first player to seriously suggest item is credited, sorry @VoidBlue )

1. Guild Bank Access (@Gidorick)
2. Personal Bank Access (@Elloa)
3. Merchants(@Elloa)
4. Crafting Stations(@Elloa)
5. Undaunted Outposts(@Elloa)
6. Farms(@Elloa)
7. Writ Postings (@Farorin)
8. Mob Spawns (@WhiteCoatSyndrome)
9. Fences (@Enodoc)
10. Guards (@Enodoc)
11. Home selling (@marco.cuevas.ventob14_ESO)
12. Dye Stations (@kevlarto_ESO)

So what are some features you do NOT want to see included in the player homes of the Elder Scrolls Online?

I am honestly shocked about that list. Did people not understand your question or are they completely out of their minds?

Pretty much everything that you listed there, especially banks, trade merchants, crafting stations, farms ... are what housing means for most of us old-school MMO players. Have people not played Ultima or DAOC?

I am not sure why you made that list or why some people seem to not understand what housing is, as honestly what else is our house supposed to do if not give us storage space, crafting tables, a garden to harvest or our own personal merchants? A house is not just a house somewhere without any purpose, a house is where we story our achievements in the game and where our chars will rest after a long day of adventuring.

They will be used to craft new gear, store our precious items, invite friends over to show them our trophies, harvest our garden and sell our products by NPC merchants.

So I would kindly ask you to please remove the "WE" as this list is anything but the will of "us", its more a misunderstanding or completely clueless folks that voted here

Enodoc

Audigy wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

We're all pretty excited that housing is on the table for eventual release. There are MANY awesome things that homes in an MMO can have to enhance player experience and broaden gameplay. Many players have already voiced their thoughts on how homes could work in ESO (my thoughts: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/145287/another-housing-suggestion-a-3-phase-release-plan/p1) There are also numerous threads about what homes SHOULD have, features we want... But what about those features we do NOT want?

There are features that, if added to player homes, would negatively impact the growth of the game or would discourage community interaction. Like, I personally don't think we should be able to use a Wayshrine to directly access our home. Home entrances should be actual places in Nirn that we must travel to.

I'll start this list off and add to it as we discuss...

The features we do NOT want to see in ESO player homes
(first player to seriously suggest item is credited, sorry @VoidBlue )

1. Guild Bank Access (Gidorick)
2. Personal Bank Access (Elloa)
3. Merchants(Elloa)
4. Crafting Stations(Elloa)
5. Undaunted Outposts(Elloa)
6. Farms(Elloa)
7. Writ Postings (Farorin)
8. Mob Spawns (WhiteCoatSyndrome)
9. Fences (Enodoc)
10. Guards (Enodoc)
11. Home selling (marco.cuevas.ventob14_ESO)
12. Dye Stations (kevlarto_ESO)

So what are some features you do NOT want to see included in the player homes of the Elder Scrolls Online?

I am honestly shocked about that list. Did people not understand your question or are they completely out of their minds?

Pretty much everything that you listed there, especially banks, trade merchants, crafting stations, farms ... are what housing means for most of us old-school MMO players. Have people not played Ultima or DAOC?

I am not sure why you made that list or why some people seem to not understand what housing is, as honestly what else is our house supposed to do if not give us storage space, crafting tables, a garden to harvest or our own personal merchants? A house is not just a house somewhere without any purpose, a house is where we story our achievements in the game and where our chars will rest after a long day of adventuring.

They will be used to craft new gear, store our precious items, invite friends over to show them our trophies, harvest our garden and sell our products by NPC merchants.

So I would kindly ask you to please remove the "WE" as this list is anything but the will of "us", its more a misunderstanding or completely clueless folks that voted here

@Audigy If you had all those things in your house, why would you ever go back to town? Serious question.

Audigy

Enodoc wrote: »

Audigy wrote: »

Gidorick wrote: »

We're all pretty excited that housing is on the table for eventual release. There are MANY awesome things that homes in an MMO can have to enhance player experience and broaden gameplay. Many players have already voiced their thoughts on how homes could work in ESO (my thoughts: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/145287/another-housing-suggestion-a-3-phase-release-plan/p1) There are also numerous threads about what homes SHOULD have, features we want... But what about those features we do NOT want?

There are features that, if added to player homes, would negatively impact the growth of the game or would discourage community interaction. Like, I personally don't think we should be able to use a Wayshrine to directly access our home. Home entrances should be actual places in Nirn that we must travel to.

I'll start this list off and add to it as we discuss...

The features we do NOT want to see in ESO player homes
(first player to seriously suggest item is credited, sorry @VoidBlue )

1. Guild Bank Access (Gidorick)
2. Personal Bank Access (Elloa)
3. Merchants(Elloa)
4. Crafting Stations(Elloa)
5. Undaunted Outposts(Elloa)
6. Farms(Elloa)
7. Writ Postings (Farorin)
8. Mob Spawns (WhiteCoatSyndrome)
9. Fences (Enodoc)
10. Guards (Enodoc)
11. Home selling (marco.cuevas.ventob14_ESO)
12. Dye Stations (kevlarto_ESO)

So what are some features you do NOT want to see included in the player homes of the Elder Scrolls Online?

I am honestly shocked about that list. Did people not understand your question or are they completely out of their minds?

Pretty much everything that you listed there, especially banks, trade merchants, crafting stations, farms ... are what housing means for most of us old-school MMO players. Have people not played Ultima or DAOC?

I am not sure why you made that list or why some people seem to not understand what housing is, as honestly what else is our house supposed to do if not give us storage space, crafting tables, a garden to harvest or our own personal merchants? A house is not just a house somewhere without any purpose, a house is where we story our achievements in the game and where our chars will rest after a long day of adventuring.

They will be used to craft new gear, store our precious items, invite friends over to show them our trophies, harvest our garden and sell our products by NPC merchants.

So I would kindly ask you to please remove the "WE" as this list is anything but the will of "us", its more a misunderstanding or completely clueless folks that voted here

@Audigy If you had all those things in your house, why would you ever go back to town? Serious question.

I think its important to say that nobody automatically has all those things in his or her house. Housing is a process, something that takes many months to build.

A player might start with a small house, that only has a single room and maybe a box for items. Over time this house could be enhanced, new parcels be bought and after a lot of investment, that house might become what housing was in DAOC or Ultima.

Towns in MMOs are not there to be a crafting city or a bank city, towns are there to give players something to do. It can be quest content, it can be due a hideout of the thieves guilds where we sell our stolen goods, it could be to chat with townsfolk to find new hidden locations, world events happen there, people visit their guild merchant, do duels or RP ...

Fact is, an MMO is a living world and it should be a living world where on every corner of this world, something important can happen.

The mistake so many MMOs did since WOW is simple, they put everything at one location, usually the main city and left the whole rest of the gaming world empty. No player housing, no hide outs for thiefs, no crafting stations with unique recipes, no farms or trade hubs outside of the cities ... Look at WOW, the only reason people go into the towns are the AH´s and Banks - that's a pretty horrible state for an MMO.

If I look at the list by the OP then I see exactly the same mistake, people don't want to give housing a reason to even exist! We do not have any farms yet in the game, but still people don't want them in our house. Why? What would change to the towns if we had a farm?

What would change to the towns if we had a crafting table in our house? We do have crafting tables all around Tamriel, yet we are not allowed to have one in our own home?

What would change if we had storage space in our house? We can access the bank from several hubs throughout Tamriel, but once again in our house we shouldn't?
To me, all of this doesn't make any sense. People act as if towns would become deserted, just because our house would get a real function and offer what other locations that are not a town already offer. This however is silly and shows the lack of experience that I spoke of.

Towns right now at ESO are there to get the undaunted quest lines, sell stolen goods and pick up story related quests. This is what people do in towns and why they are in town. Nothing of that will be taken away by a house.

Other things however, that we can do all around Tamriel already like trading, crafting, digging up flowers or hunting animals are not related to towns. Or do you hunt food in a town, do you pick flowers in a town? I don't do that!

A house will depending on what players want with it, serve as another alternative to do things. Just because people can store items in a house, they might just as well store them in town. One thing doesn't cancel the other thing out. Same with the farm, you might be able to harvest Nirnhood, but you might not be able to harvest mountain flowers, as those only grow close to mountains and if your house is close to a river and not a mountain then it wont grow.
You might be able to grow pigs, but you still need to hunt down wolfs in the forest and so on.

In my opinion, an MMO that has a living world, will profit a lot from housing, as it will benefit the game and what we can do in it. SWG, DAOC and Ultima are considered the best MMO´s of all time still and they offered much more in their housing system than just a roof, doors, windows and walls.

Honestly, housing is not a replacement for a town it never was - its however another option to do things, but therefore it must actually serve a purpose and not be just a thing with a roof and 4 walls, as those houses we have hundreds in Tamriel already.
If people want a house without any purpose other than being a house, then be my guest there are several in each town already and we don't need to ask for housing anymore, as this costs development time and I would be really angry if we get housing in the way that @Gidorick wants it, as this type of housing would be a waste of time in my opinion.
Don't take this the wrong way please and sorry for the harsh words, but ya after all those months of requesting housing we finally get it and then such a thread comes up, its shocking as I said.

P3ZZL3

@Gidorick @Enodoc ...

I just don't see it. As I asked earlier, what do you ACTUALLY want a house for? Don;t get me wrong, I see why people would "generally" want a house but I'd like the actual purpose for it explained as I'm clearly being dense.

The point you make @Gidorick is tentative at best and is really just picking a minor nuance in it. It just seems like a shill to get more storage imo rather than just asking for better banking space or organisation capabilities.

Outside of that, and taking away the list "we" or rather some respondents to this thread, have made, then all you have left is a space where you could maybe buy a picture or role play in. What else is there to do? Again, please elaborate on this as the "list" seems to remove anything I would suspect the majority would want.

If I were to support housing inside ESO then it would have to offer something for the masses which, "the list" completely ignores.

Artheiron

Doors and windows. :P jk

uploading images to use in photo frames like archage had. I remember a guy had kim jong un poster on his wall.

stevenbennett_ESO

I see a lot of different things people don't want, but not a lot of rationale *why*.

From a pure convenience standpoint, very little of this list are items which should be prohibited - as others have said, there's precedent in TES games for many of these items in houses. The argument that people will spend time in houses instead of cities and thus will have less character interaction isn't really a big thing, because cities are still necessary as quest hubs and other things.

The ONLY argument I've seen for restrictions is an immersion issue: does it make any in-game sense for things to be there, and from *that* perspective here's the simple rule I can think of: If it requires NPC interaction, it shouldn't be there, but if it's something you can do on your own, it should.

What that means, as I see it, is that crafting stations & dye stations are fine, but banks, merchants, and the like are not.

On the other hand, houses are commonly used for storing things, so how do we make that make sense? I'd definitely like to see storage for trophies, trinkets, disguises, and the like. Perhaps some visual representation of things in your Collection as well. (Stables with all your mounts visible, etc…)

Other than that, it might be nice to have some personal storage for the house, too. And here's a way we can make that work without breaking immersion: The storage in the house is just for the character who owns the house, separate from the bank. And because it's separate from the bank, you can't use it in crafting stations in towns. But because you can't access the bank in your house, you can't use bank storage in crafting stations in your house.

And just maybe, we can have a *little* NPC interaction - perhaps your crafting hirelings might stop by for a visit occasionally. They do work for you after all, so perhaps it's time to meet them in person...

Zorrashi

Things I do not want include:

Crafting stations
A potential compromise could be that perhaps included crafting stations require upkeep (via gold or crafting mats), only one type of crafting station be permitted in the home, or that the crafting stations in question is somehow inferior to their town-handled counterparts (like, reduce the chance for improvement at such stations by 5 to 8%?). Or all 3.

Bank
But a limited vault where you cannot access the stored mats/weapons/gear from the crafting station would be acceptable so long as it is somewhat limited in space.

Merchants of any sort

A Garden/farm
But if the said garden produced mats at a rate that was inferior in either quantity or quality than outside foraging, then a side garden would be fine for an 'on-the-side' feature. IMO housing gardens should only be for decoration.

Quest turn in locations

Home-Run Shops (or at least not single-player owned ones)
Most single players seldom have anything of value to sell in comparison to guilds, and permitting them to have their own little merchant will be a even bigger shopping hassle than the guild stores ever could be if they are sequestered away into player homes. But depending on how housing is implemented, certain work-around may potentially exist. Like if the housing is in instanced areas around the continent, then maybe every housing place will have one hireling lingering around the area where all of the players who bought the house in that area have their goods posted (like guild kiosks, only for buyers of that instanced plot). Or if it is an open housing system, then do a hireling raffle of some sort for another guild-store-esque system. As I said, I am sure there are plenty of work-arounds.

SeptimusDova

No Doors or first floor windows. Only way in is to climb up the scratching post outside, then across the vine lattice, then leap onto the curtain and sneak in. Pretending that you never left the house.

Athas24

P3ZZL3 wrote: »

Collins6542 wrote: »

No benefits, maybe a small storage allocation, but completely customizable!

Ok, please, someone, answer why....

Why should you have storage in a house, when you have it in the bank?

What would you actually do with the house?

Roleplay in it with their friends is my guess. Come look at this neat deer statue I have and rp playing a game of cards on my bearskin rug.... I'd actually enjoy useful elements in the home as well as cosmetic. The storage needs to be connected to your personal bank otherwise....just call your personal bank STORAGE...cuz it's what that is.

Frawr

Gidorick wrote: »

1. Guild Bank Access (@Gidorick)
2. Personal Bank Access (@Elloa)
3. Merchants(@Elloa)
4. Crafting Stations(@Elloa)
5. Undaunted Outposts(@Elloa)
6. Farms(@Elloa)
7. Writ Postings (@Farorin)
8. Mob Spawns (@WhiteCoatSyndrome)
9. Fences (@Enodoc)
10. Guards (@Enodoc)
11. Home selling (@marco.cuevas.ventob14_ESO)
12. Dye Stations (@kevlarto_ESO)

So what are some features you do NOT want to see included in the player homes of the Elder Scrolls Online?

I want housing akin to Star Wars galaxies. Housing in towns that means something. I want to b able to stock a merchant and sell my wares and have people visit my shop. I want to be able to take daily quests and access amenities including banks, crafting stations, dye stations, farms. I want to be able to employ guards to protect my town and I want enemy faction players to be able to try to raid it at certain times of day.

Once you remove the items identified in this list - what will be left ?

I do not want more solo experiences involving housing.

we play on a megaserver guys. there are thousands and thousands of people running around constantly. you are phased so that you only see a small group of them. Cities retain the guild traders and the quest givers and plenty of newer players to fill your dreams of 'full' uninteractive NPC cities.

This list is a testament of what *should* be in the experience.

Psychobunni

@ZOS_RichLambert Housing would be a really great idea to send players a survey in-game or to connected emails to answer what they don't want/top 10 must haves.. to see in their homes.

I can't believe even for a second that the actual majority of the player base wants a non-functioning/useless thing to just decorate. It's like buying a house without a stove/refrigerator because there are restaurants in town...or a car with no engine because you can call a cab/bus/subway...there simply is no logic.

Each and every crafting station, storage space, npcs if you include them could be unlocked singularly (by gold!) allowing the players the choice of what is in their homes.

Frawr

Psychobunni wrote: »

@ZOS_RichLambert Housing would be a really great idea to send players a survey in-game or to connected emails to answer what they don't want/top 10 must haves.. to see in their homes.

I can't believe even for a second that the actual majority of the player base wants a non-functioning/useless thing to just decorate. It's like buying a house without a stove/refrigerator because there are restaurants in town...or a car with no engine because you can call a cab/bus/subway...there simply is no logic.

Each and every crafting station, storage space, npcs if you include them could be unlocked singularly (by gold!) allowing the players the choice of what is in their homes.

absolutely agree.

I would add that it would be something awesome to give guilds land to obtain in order to build towns and cities as they see fit.

WhiteCoatSyndrome

Psychobunni wrote: »

@ZOS_RichLambert Housing would be a really great idea to send players a survey in-game or to connected emails to answer what they don't want/top 10 must haves.. to see in their homes.

+1 this!

Cuyler

Gidorick wrote: »

I didn't add wayshrine to the list because I do think that it would be cool to add an actual wayshrine to our home that is "tuned" to our soul and has a cooldown of like... 240 minutes.

Go ahead and don't add crafting stations, farms or dye stations to your list either....I think it would be cool to have those too Or ya know add everything that is suggested and not just what suits your fancy....

waterfairy

I understand no bank but personal storage (per character not account) and crafting stations would be the only things that I would buy a home for. I don't care to pay for a personal trophy space and have no desire to see yours.

Audigy

stevenbennett_ESO wrote: »

Other than that, it might be nice to have some personal storage for the house, too. And here's a way we can make that work without breaking immersion: The storage in the house is just for the character who owns the house, separate from the bank. And because it's separate from the bank, you can't use it in crafting stations in towns. But because you can't access the bank in your house, you can't use bank storage in crafting stations in your house.

Yes, this is also what I had in mind with the storage.

Lets say my Breton has a small cottage somewhere, then she would store her iron there as she uses the blacksmith crafting skill. This iron then, no longer had to be stored in a towns bank where my Woodelf currently homeless resides, as she does in bows and therefore has no use for said plunder.

I think that it really is a lack of experience as I said, the experience of former housing systems that MMOs had, where having a house was seen as a good thing and not the evil itself. There seems to be some fear of people no longer going into towns which is really silly, as a town serves mostly as a quest hub and as long there are quests, as long there will be people there. Besides that, I don't think an MMO should cluster everyone or everything in a town, that's kind of a bad sign for the richness of the world in an MMO.

A mistake btw. that Blizzard did. They completely forgot about adding valuable content in their game, so that since 6 or so years, people only sit in their main cities, waiting for the dungeon queue to pop.

They had a farm system in MOP, this was a blessing, sadly they didn't enhance it with their new addon.

If ZOS implements a good housing system then it will take many months to unlock its features anyways. I certainly hope they don't make it a crown store element, but rather a DLC where we unlock its features over time by playing this game, rather than buying every piece of it with crowns.

RAGUNAnoOne

No crown store requirements

Gidorick

You surprise me @Audigy. It's pretty clear that this isn't MY list of wants. I'm not saying I want or don't want. The only thing on the list that is my don't-want is guild bank access.

I get chastised for trying to be inclusive with the list and not filtering it using my own desires and I get chastised for having a list that is only including ideas I agree with and using the term "we" (which I never actually did).I guess the lesson here is to ONLY include my ideas in my posts and to not try to make a collaborative community list. Right? Give me a friggn break.

If you want to know my actual thoughts on how homes should be implemented I suggest reading:
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/145287/another-housing-suggestion-a-3-phase-release-plan/p1

THAT'S how I want homes.

We shouldn't have the same crafting stations and ALL the stations we have in towns in our homes. It'll cannibalize the towns. Towns shouldn't JUST be crafting and bank hubs, but I ESO, that's what they are.

And I am adding everything to the list @Cuyler... Every serious item. I'm ignoring things like "doors"

Gidorick

And I changed the "we" so hopefully readers can focus on the topic and not the choice of pronoun used.

Dylanator30

I would LOVE if they brough aspects of hearthstone from skyrim into this game. Place home on many random countryside location gather proper materials to build and customize home, Garden for herbs-Stations Amenties areas, trophies again woyuld be amazing. Please Do THIS

IOUAT

i want a WAYSHRINE IN MY HAUSE!!! >:(

Rev Rielle

Elloa wrote: »

I think it's very important to keep the cities ad hub for players to meet others. WoW garnison eS a disaster in my opinion.

No bank
No shop
No crafting station
No undaunted quest
No farms (to replace gathering)


What could be in

Solo instancied story quest
Solo instancied pve challenge

This could be sold as DLC

Completely agree.

An example is in EQ2:
For all it's wonderful housing/guild hall development it went too far with the guild hall functionality and basically made cities deserted.

EQ2 has a great robust decorating system that is easy to use, on the flip side, RIFT whilst having similar functionality in housing has a clunking decorating system that is a pain to use. Putting the tools in place to be able to easily place house items is very important.

Sylance9 wrote: »

If its hook housing like in LOTRO ill be pissed. I hope its like SWG....

Lord of the Rings 'neighbourhood' setting was not successful in that game, they were just ghost towns for the most part. Additionally, as @Sylance9 states, the 'hook' system used within the houses was amazingly limiting. On the whole Lord of the Rings online had a very basic, token housing system. Let's hope development here keep well clear of it.

Runes of Magic has a nice little system where you could plant plants and water them daily/weekly etc etc, that would be a nice function to add. What development doesn't want to do is make any housing mechanic like this a 'chore' to do.

I don't think housing should be a 'forever' thing. If you don't pay your rent/etc. eventually you'll be locked out, thrown out and have your housing equipment stored somewhere so if you come back to the game, you'll be able to gain access to it again. The necessity of this however is hopefully negated by the mechanism of housing.

For example:
One person buying/renting a house should not limit another person from buying/renting the same one. Ideally I think housing should be instanced with multiple players being able to have a house in the same 'place', e.g. EQ2 style. It should not be like Lord of the Rings was, for example, where only you could own that particular place. Such whilst sounding good in theory (and it did to all at the time too) in practice just leads to a lot of wasted/dead space and 'ghost towns'. Having instanced housing within cities already in the game (as well as some other nice locations perhaps?) Is the way to go. It keeps players in the game in the cities and keeps that populated feel to the game evident.

Having it in a logical place is important too, it should make sense where your house is, e.g. within a city, and you should be able to see its location in the game. It should make sense. The opposite of this is like it is in RIFT.

Shimmer

If Vanguard, SWG, Rift and Archeage housing were to have a housing baby. I would hope they would have that baby in ESO.

Tholian1

What exactly will the purpose of a house be without some convenient amenities? Personally, I think some of the cities (Riften) could use a good clearing of the naked aimless elves. Let them do all that at home. LOL

Molag_Crow

I'd personally love to have my own dungeon instance where I could farm mobs (that drop barely anything and give OK XP) in peace. That way, we all have a chance to get CPs at a nice speed, maybe, I guess, I don't know!