I don't need to spam roll, but I need to roll more

Mr_Koh

I think the cool down on roll should be a little lower. Dodge roll is vital to offensive stamina builds, and I feel like the cool down is way too long. It's four seconds after the Dodge roll. I think the timer should atleast start once you start the roll, or switch it to two seconds. A two second timer punishes rollers for spamming the ability, but remains useful for those who use it properly.

Domander

If you want more defense then don't go full offense.

Alcast

Wblow spamming meta inc.
I was on the PTS yday and with all those rolldodge nerf and block nerf I guess W blow is the way to go

Mr_Koh

Domander wrote: »

If you want more defense then don't go full offense.

Who says I'm full offense? I run sustain builds with less damage. Currently using other classes and am currently using stam sorc (which is pretty good with all the changes btw, just give us some wep dmg in the passives and I'll be happy.) and the roll nerf is too severe. It doesn't feel horrible on night blades because of cloak but it's killer to every other stam build out there. Lowering the cooldown will still achieve the end of "perma rolling", but not lowering the cooldown could be the end of stam builds that aren't nightblades or tanks ofc

Wing

Alcast wrote: »

Wblow spamming meta inc.
I was on the PTS yday and with all those rolldodge nerf and block nerf I guess W blow is the way to go

hey pvp dps players are the ones for the block gutting, you cannot blame people for then all switching to damage when Eric is gutting everything else.

Farorin

I agree, I don't spam it, and I never really have as I like to be actively fighting, but I often find myself needing to use it within about 2-3 seconds even if not every time. I think even if the timer was decreased by 1 second, that would help me a lot, as I only use dodging when i need to.

whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO

Farorin wrote: »

I agree, I don't spam it, and I never really have as I like to be actively fighting, but I often find myself needing to use it within about 2-3 seconds even if not every time. I think even if the timer was decreased by 1 second, that would help me a lot, as I only use dodging when i need to.

I agree, I never consecutively dodge rolled in the past, more to just enter "cloak" so I can try to escape if necessary and maybe a attack here and there to avoid. I told myself and made a note that I need to grind more CP the last week before IC drops just to add more points into Tumbling (under the Thief - Shadow constellation) so I can lower the cost of it a bit more so I can get atleast two good rolls before it really hurts.. and I need to stock up on some Crown Repair kits so I can repair my armor quickly if needed in IC since we will be killing PvE Daedra as this will be a factor for PvP, "OMG my armor is sooo broke..." then get One-Shotted.

I also changed my Camoflaged Hunter to Evil Hunter in the Fighters Guild skill line to get more Crit' and Stamina back, I'm gonna need it there more than just a single deadly shot from stealth, or I will use Siphoning Attacks (both last 15 sec's, with the new PTS patch but Evil Hunter refreshes If I kill a Daedra, while Siphoning attacks I will have to continually cast over and over and spend some Magicka to activate for the non toggle, what a tradeoff huh....).

Joy_Division

I'm sure "tank" characters will just love ZoS for lessening the penalties for excessive dodge rolling when being told flat out by the Creative Director that 0% stam regen is here to stay.

AhPook_Is_Here

Joy_Division wrote: »

I'm sure "tank" characters will just love ZoS for lessening the penalties for excessive dodge rolling when being told flat out by the Creative Director that 0% stam regen is here to stay.

It's OK then tanks can wear medium and just dodge instead of ever blocking. DPS is going to love that moving stack! Imagine stamlar rage.

Personally as a tank with a main character I am excited for the changes, I plan to do guild runs almost exclusively, and if I ever pug anything it will be "LF 2 DPS 25k+, 1 healer 10k+ HPS, please link 'Craglorn Trials Conqueror' achievement completed for invite."

kevlarto_ESO

The question is how many rolls does it take for you to be consider a roll spammer ?

I can roll a few times on my NB but not forever, on test I can still get a few rolls, by my count I get about three rolls less, but under heavy fire and breaking free I will not be rolling much, and my build is more of a utility build, I am not to worried about It will adapt and overcome, like I have in all mmo's I have played over the past years.

Robbmrp

ZOS isn't going to change anything regarding stamina for a long time. Better get used to how things are for now. It will be a trade off, cast a DPS spell or dodge....

R0M2K

Agree, as of now its noway fair.

Either start the timer as soon as you rollclick or reduce it to 2 seconds, as OP sugested.

Zanen

Roll dodge is more than damage avoidance, it's also the counter to roots.

Roots are now a significant problem for everybody. I was never a roll spammer on live but in update 7 people spam roots because the counter has this stacking cost attached to it. This significantly reduces the skill cap for everybody.

I understand why the cooldown is what it is, there are sets that increase the avoidance time and it seems they want it to be longer than one cloak.

The cooldown should grant root immunity for its duration, and I agree that duration should be lower.

Dyride

If they wanted to keep the longer timer, reducing the cost increase to 25% would work. But I agree with OP, stamina builds that aren't Nightblades really suffer the most from the change.

Stamina DKs bring their own survivability options but the nerf to Blazing Shield makes my stamplar much weaker without being able to roll. My stamina sorc is even worse hit, because rolling to make space with Boundless Storm and Hasty Retreat was an essential part of my build.

Sometimes you have roll 3 times in a row just to escape AOE from a sweeper or a focused combo if outnumbered.

I shouldn't have to spend half my stamina bar just for 4-5 secs of mitigation.

Stalwart385

A nice tactic since this nerf is to root lock groups that come near your spawn point and let everyone fire away. They'll probably take away root lock (the only thing DK tanks have right now), but I wouldn't mind seeing the timer dropped a second instead. Even two normal dodges then the penalty kicks would be fine with me. Now if you see someone dodge two or three times to get out of a bad situation you know their doomed.

Mr_Koh

Thank you for your feedback guys. Much appreciated. Spamming roots in open world will definitely be a thing, and yeah lowering the timer won't really help that issue, but I'll take any progress i can get at this point. It's nearing the release date and I haven't even seen them mention anything about the resource management discrepancy between stam and magicka builds.

Master_Kas

Agreed. Both this change and the 0% stam regen when blocking was a big nerf for alot of builds.

Hopefully they fix it somehow, but I don't have alot of hope.

Time to go full weapondamage build, and instead of stamina regen pump points into magicka regen for cloaks/teleport shade as a nightblade.

Other classes on stam builds, dont really know as they have no cloak even.

Master_Kas

Mr_Koh wrote: »

Thank you for your feedback guys. Much appreciated. Spamming roots in open world will definitely be a thing, and yeah lowering the timer won't really help that issue, but I'll take any progress i can get at this point. It's nearing the release date and I haven't even seen them mention anything about the resource management discrepancy between stam and magicka builds.

Because all magicka builds are happy with their shieldspamming without any cost/regen penalty. Ofc they won't raise problems about stam builds when they sit on the best defensive mechanism in the game on this PTS.

Cathexis

Domander wrote: »

If you want more defense then don't go full offense.

If you want an orange popsicle do you eat the whole box?

Terrible logic.

Roll spamming was never out of control, there are still lots of counters, just like bolt escape ... People are just being lazy and don't incorporate them into their build.

The problem is builds that are able to infinitely resist death like shield spam or infinite block/heal high health buildsbuilds or cloak spam.

Its silly how people want to only nerf inconveniences and not the actual problems.

Wycks

ZOS keeps swinging the pendulum on players.

Most NB's will go magicka simply because they can cloak in pvp and for pve mobs found in pvp.

The dodge roll nerf is stupid because only a small percentage of the population was spamming it effectively and only newbs want it nerfed.

Instead of coming up with a tactic vs dodge roll they just nerf it into oblivion killing all NB stam builds, it's unreal how poorly thought out this is.

Mr_Koh

bob.ellisonb16_ESO wrote: »

ZOS keeps swinging the pendulum on players.

Most NB's will go magicka simply because they can cloak in pvp and for pve mobs found in pvp.

The dodge roll nerf is stupid because only a small percentage of the population was spamming it effectively and only newbs want it nerfed.

Instead of coming up with a tactic vs dodge roll they just nerf it into oblivion killing all NB stam builds, it's unreal how poorly thought out this is.

I believe they changed blocking, streak, and dodgeroll because players were living through situations where they should have died. Which is true, but now with the dodgeroll timer being sooooooo damn high I feel like stam builds and running out of stamina in scenarios where they should have lived. Just as their magicka counterparts would have lived.

Cuyler

My all magicka dps DK can roll dodge twice....TWICE....before being out of stamina on the pts O_o gg

Forestd16b14_ESO

So demands the fist video game furry.