Do you agree with the ZoS putting a Cap on Champion Points per DLC?

flubber77

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

VoidBlue wrote: »

Rex-Umbra wrote: »

I think when they add the cap say 500 those with 1000 will only be able to spend 500 and then each season they will be able to just spend their banked points I guess at least thats the way it should be.

if they already have 1000, means they already spent 1000. so they would have to give a free champion point respec for they can only use the 500 and the other 500 be banked, and than once the next DLC comes they would just quickly use those CP to be beast again to hit cap with in 2 minutes lol

thi sis the most stupid things ever.... they do want a cap so people can catch up on them??? right???

ok lets say it will be 500 the first round. i do start playing now, and are ofc a 1 hour player a day or two. it will take me like a year or two to get those 500 cp with my speed. in between there is a new release of dlc and ofc a new cp cap. this round is set to 1000cp. at this point i only have 175 cp and it is good. but the one that did have 1000 before the cap do now have 1000 cp to use... how the f... can i reach that? play more you say??? well i dont like it but i do want this cp.... will you ask ZoS to give them to me so i can catch up? or mayby those who do have 1000cp now dont mind to not use them? or we could just punish them and take 500 cp away from them?


LEAVE THE CP SYSTEM AS IT IS.

Dont punish players that do have the time and are willing to spend time in this game. i do have 320 cp my self but i dont cry like a baby because my fella to have 1500. so be it.

WHY should a regular player that plays 4hours a week get the same stuff as one who do spend 7hours a day and working his ass for the cp?

if you want fear play, go play tetris

trimsic_ESO

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

I've posted the idea to have a cap of CP at each new season in this forum. If we have a cap of CP at each new DLC it will be great too, and I'd love it.

A new DLC would be like a new season, with new contents and a new CP cap. The CP cap would allow the combat team to keep control of the gap between those who can play a lot and those who play less or have started ESO recently. It's a win-win solution for those who have a new challenge when a new season starts and for those who want to catch up: they could be granted a long period of enlightment.

eliisra

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

Cap should have been placed way earlier. But as long as it gets done.

I dont think grinding x amount of normal NPC's for weeks, like a bot, should give you a huge advantage over other players in PvP and leaderboard PvE. Especially not v.s. players that choose to do more challenging and skill demanding activities. Why reward the most braindead playstyle in the game, with maximum character progression?

Also there new- and returning players. They shouldn't be that much behind in power, it's to discouraging, makes them leave the game.

MCMancub

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

Yes, but not because I think it's just simply unfair to have lots of them or because I'm jealous I don't have as much as another player. I legitimately think it's bad the content release of the game to not have a cap.

I've said this before and I'll say it again: what if WoW released 30 new levels with Burning Crusade, but BC only had enough content for 10 new levels? That's the current situation ESO is in. It's just a fact that MMO players will finish content faster than developers can produce it. It will always happen.

I keep hearing over and over again from players who have been around for a year or more now say something along the lines of "X fight used to be much harder" or "You used to not be able to solo that content." Not having been around that long I generally ask, "Why? Was it nerfed?" The response is, literally, always "No, champion points."

I'm not at all against the Champion System. I actually really like that ZOS has already laid the foundation for future vertical progression in ESO. What I don't like is that it's not kept in a controlled environment. This leads to huge disparities in both PvP and PvE. Then you get complaining from both types of players, those with and those without CP. Those with complain that there isn't any challenging content in the game. Those without complain that those with are much too strong.

There's simply too much power in the Champion System for it to continue on without some sort of control or leash on it.

EDIT: I would also be OK with allowing players to continue to gain CP as long as there is a cap for some of the content. Perhaps have a PvP campaign where you can play with any number of CP, but all PvE should have a CP cap, for the good of the player.

cerrudo33

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

I agree that CP can and will lead to very large power gaps but I'll use a current game as an example,

Destiny... They capped how many tokens, gold, etc. that could be earned at any one time and per week, which was my biggest peeve of the game and main part I quit.

I have about 30 total cps (console) but if I ever hit a wall and couldn't earn more "strength" while playing I'd probably stop. Who chooses what a fair number is? Will it be the same for pc and console? Will console restrict the PC transfers relatively more then those that stayed on the PC?

It's a catch 22 no matter what you do...don't use limits as a way to catch other people up, give them more enlightenment so when they PLAY they are rewarded

TLDR: no caps, throttle the gains up or down but don't ever put a ceiling on how many you can earn unless it's 3600

Korah_Eaglecry

All this does is tell me to avoid any content that wont gain me a CP. If I hit max on my CP Gain. Then thats it. I put the game aside until I can again gain CP.

All the while they wont be making any money from me in any fashion.

Sithisvoid

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

It only makes sense if they allow us to catch up to ppl with 6-700 cp first. If they are just locking it to a set amount per time period then it's just making things worse. The only way this brings balance is if we can catch up

MCMancub

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

All this does is tell me to avoid any content that wont gain me a CP. If I hit max on my CP Gain. Then thats it. I put the game aside until I can again gain CP.

All the while they wont be making any money from me in any fashion.

Serious question: did you stop playing other MMOs the second you hit the max level? What if content was scaled correctly to the CP cap? Would you stick around then?

nimander99

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

I feared this would happen... i need to watch the Live so I know exactly what we are talking about here

Korah_Eaglecry

MCMancub wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

All this does is tell me to avoid any content that wont gain me a CP. If I hit max on my CP Gain. Then thats it. I put the game aside until I can again gain CP.

All the while they wont be making any money from me in any fashion.

Serious question: did you stop playing other MMOs the second you hit the max level? What if content was scaled correctly to the CP cap? Would you stick around then?

Are you trying to compare a hard level cap with a cap on a system that is supposed to surpass the level cap? The whole reason they introduced this system was so that players had a reason to stick around and work on their characters long after a level cap and to replace the failed VR system.

Thejtprb18_ESO

Kinda, If you can still earn CP even-though you wont be able to always to use all of them.

UO capped skill points and it worked fine.

Any cap would have to come with compensation, and the compensation needs to be tailored to suit the people who overcap.

You could provide special mounts and special titles that can only be obtained after gaining 2x the cap of CP.
Same again at 4x.

Will that give people a reason to grind CP - yes.
Will that give them an unfair advantage - no.

Find out what the appropriate rewards for overcapping would be and you should be able to find a solution.
Perhaps certain trophies in a player housing model would be the best incentive?

Gidorick

I wanted to watch what they actually said in the Q&A before responding. They are talking about caps in conjunction with a catch-up mechanic. I still disagree with Caps because once a player reaches the Cap... what do they do? What incentive do they have to play? Any?

I still think a really aggressive catch up mechanic is the way to go.

I hope the mechanic is something like I suggested HERE where the more points the top players have the faster those with fewer CPs will earn them. If there were seasonal caps, this would be really easy to maintain without the need for my suggested dynamic method. They would just base the rate of earning off of the cap and how much CP the player currently has.

That could work... I just question the idea of a hard cap.

MCMancub

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

MCMancub wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

All this does is tell me to avoid any content that wont gain me a CP. If I hit max on my CP Gain. Then thats it. I put the game aside until I can again gain CP.

All the while they wont be making any money from me in any fashion.

Serious question: did you stop playing other MMOs the second you hit the max level? What if content was scaled correctly to the CP cap? Would you stick around then?

Are you trying to compare a hard level cap with a cap on a system that is supposed to surpass the level cap? The whole reason they introduced this system was so that players had a reason to stick around and work on their characters long after a level cap and to replace the failed VR system.

They are variations of the same basic system: vertical progression. It really and truly seems to me that ZOS wants to avoid vertical progression in the form of a gear grind like WoW does, and I really respect this. I also love that they believe vertical progression at end game is necessary for an MMO, unlike GW2.

The Champion System is our vertical progression system at end game. That's really all it is. While I realize that a cap may seem counter-intuitive, the cap doesn't necessarily have to be easily achieved so that you halt all vertical progression in your tracks. Again, let's take a look at WoW. Each expansion has a vertical progression cap: max level and max gear. How many players actually hit this cap each expansion? A very small number. The actual cap exists, but is high enough that a relatively small number of players ever have issue with reaching it.

Conversely, not having a cap creates a scenario in which you can progress vertically, but you've already done so to an extent to which there is no more challenge and you become bored and leave.

Artis

I just hope it won't be like they put cap,say, at 500 and then whoever got more is gonna keep it and the rest will never be able to catch up.

tplink3r1

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

Please ZOS, don't dumb down progression.

MCMancub

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

Gidorick wrote: »

I wanted to watch what they actually said in the Q&A before responding. They are talking about caps in conjunction with a catch-up mechanic. I still disagree with Caps because once a player reaches the Cap... what do they do? What incentive do they have to play? Any?

I still think a really aggressive catch up mechanic is the way to go.

I hope the mechanic is something like I suggested HERE where the more points the top players have the faster those with fewer CPs will earn them. If there were seasonal caps, this would be really easy to maintain without the need for my suggested dynamic method. They would just base the rate of earning off of the cap and how much CP the player currently has.

That could work... I just question the idea of a hard cap.

I prefer this situation over not wanting to do content because it's too easy. Neither situation is desired, but we can't have our cake and eat it too. If we have to pick between cap or no cap, cap affects way less people in a negative way than no cap.

EDIT: I probably should have said "cap can potentially affect way less people." It's entirely implementation dependent.

Ysne58

Gidorick wrote: »

I wanted to watch what they actually said in the Q&A before responding. They are talking about caps in conjunction with a catch-up mechanic. I still disagree with Caps because once a player reaches the Cap... what do they do? What incentive do they have to play? Any?

I still think a really aggressive catch up mechanic is the way to go.

I hope the mechanic is something like I suggested HERE where the more points the top players have the faster those with fewer CPs will earn them. If there were seasonal caps, this would be really easy to maintain without the need for my suggested dynamic method. They would just base the rate of earning off of the cap and how much CP the player currently has.

That could work... I just question the idea of a hard cap.

I've quoted @Gidorick before. I think his system without caps makes a whole lot more sense than artificial caps. I have 43 cp, I think.

If you do put in caps, you are going to have to place it higher than the max that has already been earned just to keep those players playing.

Dagoth_Rac

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

This is not an unqualified no. I am opposed to a cap, but could get behind it being harder to earn CP after a certain point. Like maybe 800k XP per CP past 500 CP. Then up that to past 750 CP with next DLC, etc. You could still earn CP with no cap, but it would be harder to pull away.

technohic

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

Damage is already done and the limits I hear people suggesting are way too high for the casual or late players anyway. Seriously. 500? Who would that appease? Not the people whoof have a problem keeping up as is. More likely just the people who are jealous they aren't at the top.

TipsyDrow

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

CP needs to be removed from pvp period. Cap it for PVE.

Zorrashi

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

Well its not a real fix to the CP system...but I'd take this arbitrary cap over nothing at all.

nimander99

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

Ok, I watched it, they are tossing around ideas about CP seasons and a catch up mechanic, but judging by how difficult it is to remove vet ranks I'm not worried we will see these any time soon, I'm not against a catch up mechanic but the season idea.... not sure about that but it sounds like another Diablo 3 nod

Leandor

This is a very hard question, and I probably will need a couple days to wrap my head around. My initial reaction was "I do prefer a decent catch up mechanism", but that is a dangerous path.

Honestly speaking, I fear the time for caps is gone - if you put a cap at 500 it does not really help in regards to imbalances, but at the same time too many players are near or over that. The issue, I believe, is that this system was envisioned to last somewhere between 3 and 5 years. Without caps, it will last another year at most, with a not insignificant number of players reaching cap by end of this year or Q1 2016.

The only possible way to extend it time-wise are caps. Which is probably the reason why ZOS decided to talk about these instead of giving details on a catch up mechanism. Rich's lurk solidifies my personal impression that it was a kind of test to see player reactions, but that is probably my conspiracy sense speaking up. Maybe it will work out if they are quick.

The question remaining is where to put the cap. It needs to sit at a point where the overwhelming majority is short of but at the same time as low as possible to be effective and achievable for new players. Also, the cap system may be only postponing the issue a bit instead of solving it, if the system will not include "autoleveling" to previous season caps upon season change.

I do not know a good recommendation. Due to powerlevelling a char from V1 to V12, I made a good number of CP the last few days and with the amount I reached now {275 as of today) I see a good measure of customization/optimization of my chars. All those little bonuses come into noticeable effect range and some (like the 75 points in bastion) are really strong.

Hence I think that from a "new player, want to catch up and still be a valuable addition to group play" perspective, the cap should be somewhere around here (300 maybe). A player with 300 is a lot stronger than a player with two digit CP, but effort on the low CP player side may still be able to compensate it to a viable extent.

On the other hand, a LOT of players are already beyond that number. I don't think ZOS will get away with taking those points away (by banking them, I guess). So from this perspective, the number should be more around 600. That would capture maybe 85% of the playerbase below the cap (just a wild assumption based on my stomach feeling from reading the forums) and would be much easier to convince us players of.

Thinking of the next season, after cap is increased to the next stage, what happens then? As said above, if the system is intended to alleviate power creep, new players or those still short of the cap would need to be put at or near old cap. Depending on the frequency, this may end up accelerating the system even more than a simple catch up mechanism.

As I initially wrote: this is a hard one. Good luck in cracking it, guys. After that wall of text, I come to the conclusion that I would still prefer a catch up mechanic based on a rolling average of the champion rank for each respective server.

Celas_Dranacea

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

Cap CP and put any CP that anyone had above the cap on hold - to be fair when the next cap is released those people who had already earned the new max amount can instantly hit the cap again. This is me trying to be sympathetic to the hardcore grinder, who IMO should have never been able to earn 500+ cp by now.

Anyone who plays that much does not need a numerical advantage over players who play 1-3 hours a day since they should be more skilled from all their practice. They will already have more gold, more Ap more TV, they do not need to be able to gain a huge difference in CP.

TheBull

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

No. If that happened CPs would be something you need to grind.

TheBull

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

Rex-Umbra wrote: »

Whats the Cap? I only have 40CP and I know others have over 1000 so what happens to those over the cap?

aaah the mythical 1000 cp guy. The guy who only exist in the 3rd person on these forums.

Malediktus

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

I only haave 3 champion points but I do not agree with a cap or catch up mechanic. Long and tedious character progression in MMOs is good.

DDuke

Yes, It will allow others to catch up.

622 CPs here, and I totally agree with CP cap.

I'm curious though, what will happen if you have already exceeded the cap they intend on placing?


Regardless, character progression in my opinion should come through gear.

That way, you can have it be mostly skill based progression, rather than simply time based.

Ourorboros

No, I earned all my CP and want to use them

Imposing any kind of cap now is closing the barn door after the horses already got loose. Too bad there wasn't some foresight into seeing the disparities engendered by the current system when it was implemented. However, installing a cap now won't change the difference in CP levels that already exist. Singling out players with high CP for caps would just be wrong-they earned every CP, like it or not, and deserve to play with them. As unpleasant as it may be to be owned by players with high CP, whether you are a new player getting beat by someone with 100 CP, or 300 CP player getting kicked by a 1000 CP player is just part of the game. Why shouldn't someone who plays for hours every day be more powerful than someone who plays a few weekend hours? Why shouldn't someone here at game release be a stronger player than someone who started in June? I would not expect to be able to compete against established players were I to start playing an existing MMO that's been around. Why should expectations for ESO be different? It's too late to close the barn door without leaving the escapees out in the cold. If there has to be an equalizer for the whiners, let them pay through the nose for CP on the crown store.

Kerioko

Kinda, If you can still earn CP even-though you wont be able to always to use all of them.

Tobius wrote: »

Makes no sense to cap stuff. All it will do is push people away from the game when they hit the cap and have to wait months for new DLC.

It may push the 10% of heavy CP grinders away, but it will bring some sort of balance (or at least seem like it is) that may help keep the 90% who don't grind all day every day in game. If the game continues to reward just the 8-10 hour a day grinders, it will lose a lot more people (the ones that like to get on and play for fun when they have time but still feel somewhat competitive) in the long run.

Hardcore players may hate the game being tailored to casuals, but if you want the game to have any chance of being successful, it has to make accommodations for its largest player base, and a majority of that base (the casual to semi-hardcore) want CP limits and catch-up mechanics!