Should you be able to defect to a new alliance?

Sadishist

I'd be for it if there was a fee. Don't have time to level many characters.

Mitchblue

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

I wouldn't pay an expensive option or maybe any money. But limited, maybe twice a year.

The_Sadist

No - characters stay where they were made forever

Sounds like a coding nightmare.

Anhedonie

No - characters stay where they were made forever

no and never

dodgehopper_ESO

If they have something like this, I feel it should be something earned with a laborious and long term series of quests. I don't like the notion of things being bought in game of this nature because it kills the whole sense of accomplishment one gets in the rpg genre. Throwing money at a problem is never conducive to fun. I realize ZoS has to get paid, and I want them to (I've been on the six month sub since the start), but the point is that sometimes things should not be paid for in a game with real dollars, they should be earned. I feel this sort of option falls into the 'should be earned' variety.

ontheleftcoast

You already have a couple of ways of doing this -- play the Cadwell's Silver and Gold quests to be part of the other alliances. Or plunk down your money for an Imperial editions and play as whatever alliance you want without being limited. That's the one part that irks me. In game we see a few NPCs of the other factions mixed in thru out the story. But every player's toon must be a die hard loyalist to their faction -- no exceptions. Really? 100% of Argonians are going to side with the Dark Elves who once enslaved them? Or the Nords who think they'd make better sets of matching luggage than comrades in arms? I wish we could all choose our alliance and race independent of each other. Maybe I want to be an Argonian in the Aldmeri Dominion, why is that not allowed?

Forestd16b14_ESO

No - characters stay where they were made forever

Alliance pride for Kyne sake that's what half the game is based off of.

Blood for the Pact.

Allyhoo811

If this is ever allowed, I personally think it should only be as a one time option after you complete Cadwell's Gold...I don't think it should ever be something that is allowed frequently or for real money.

dday3six

None of the options listed are really how I view it. I think you should be able to switch and it should be an RMT feature. I would not go so far as to say it should be expensive though. Utimately I view it like a server transfer from other titles. There is concern about how to apply it though. With zones being different levels for different alliances it might be tricky.

Knootewoot

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

I say yes. I would never leave DC, but I think it would be a nice addition.

Make it expensive though. Like when you quest you gain faction points of your faction. You start with 0 of your faction and -10.000 of the other 2 fasction. The more faction points the more you belong to your faction (with a cap). Like 10k faction as cap and you gain pretty quick faction after each quest or only in PvP cyrodill after kills or keep defending/attacking.

In order to betray your faction you need to gain negative faction points. Easy to combine with justice system. Every crime gives -10 faction and murder maybe -100.

If you get less then 0 faction (like -10) you are an outlaw. No NPC's want to talk to you anymore in your faction area. Only thing for you is to leave to cyrodill for good.

In cyrodill then, you are am outlaw to. every faction can attack you, but you are now part of a 4th faction. The oulaws. they even have their own den in Cyrodill (guarded by high level guards so nobody else can enter)

The outlaws can gain faction of either faction by attacking a keep. Attacking a DC keep gives AD+EP faction for instance. Outlaws cannot take scrolls.

If you get 0 of one faction, you may talk to a guard inside the gate (so you can only enter if it's open as you may not enter and have to sneak inside). The guard is located near the temple. Be aware other players may still attack you and other NPC's. So they might camp it.

Once talked to that guard you can pledge to that faction. Than you are instead of DC an EP dude.

charlmgn

No - characters stay where they were made forever

We already play as all alliances through Cadwell's Silver and Gold quests. They're talking about allowing cross-alliance dungeoning. I would agree with allowing cross-alliance guildies to group if there's a feasible way to do it (similar to the way Cadwell cloaks the veteran player so the other alliances don't know he's different). My only reason for being in favor of this is the developers built cross-alliance guilds into the game, so cross-alliance activities should be allowed.

Enodoc

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

Allyhoo811 wrote: »

If this is ever allowed, I personally think it should only be as a one time option after you complete Cadwell's Gold...I don't think it should ever be something that is allowed frequently or for real money.

Exactly this. Once you have experienced all the alliance storylines, you should be able to choose who you really want to follow, and alliance transfer should be an option.

TheShadowScout

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

We have IC precedents.

Auridion, the lighthouse town by firsthold, this quest involved a orc advisor and his wife defecting to the dominion, and the player getting in the way of a covenant raiding party trying to snatch them back.

Grahtwood, you will find a camp of argonain refugees who left the pact and are hoping for asylum in dominion lands.

Several non-faction people here and there. Heck, -every- imperial character is technically a defector from cyrodil and the currently cultist-controlled remains of the "empire"

So, faction change -should- be an option... though not an casual one.

I think to avoid the mess with questlines, it would make sense to have completion of cadwells gold as prerequesite. In fact, it might even make sense to allow faction change as reward for completing cadwells! (would go over better then the blue bit of vendor bait they give out now...)
And it definitely ought to be a big questline!
Starting with a "loyalty called in question" theme, and early in the questline, a big decision - stay with your alliance and find out who framed you to prove your loyalty, or ditch them and defect to greener pastures, which will lead to a questline preparing your eventual defection, courting the faction of your choice, setting up the whole thing and then of course escaping those sent to "bring you to justice for treason".
It could be a questline that takes you over all your five faction maps, with revisiting instances used for other questlines (in new versions, enemy-wise), and culminates into your new station (either reinstitation as the hero of your original faction, or acceptance as new ally of your new one).

And then... for any who feel dissatisfied with their choice in that quest later on... there might be a very costly item in the crown store that restarts this quest again. Allowing players who stayed the first time to defect later on, of those who switched once to switch again... but it should cost enough to make any think twice or thrice.

And finally... there even could be permanent drawbacks to ever betraying your original faction. Like, say, diminished AP gains through PvP (since noone in your new faction will ever fully trust you not to be a possible double agent... as they will talk behind your back, once a traitor, what's to keep you from being a traitor again...)?

Pompeyfluff

No - characters stay where they were made forever

no - all you'll see is people changing factions so they can ensure they are in the dominant faction for their PVP home area.

For PVP to work it needs to have a good mix, and i just can't see that happening if people can change faction whenever they want.

daemonios

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

Gods, yes! I've been saying this forever. I've created toons in the "wrong" alliance before I decided I wanted to focus on only one. Some are quite a bit levelled (VR1, VR3, VR5). I also wouldn't like to "kill" them so I can remake them in the right alliance. Finally, a defection mechanic would actually be an interesting plot device.

daemonios

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

Pompeyfluff wrote: »

no - all you'll see is people changing factions so they can ensure they are in the dominant faction for their PVP home area.

For PVP to work it needs to have a good mix, and i just can't see that happening if people can change faction whenever they want.

Well, that was just one of the options in the poll... Another being limited faction changes (which I'd the option I support for the reasons you mention). To vote against any possibility of faction change "because faction hopping" when the issue is so trivially addressed makes no sense.

Pompeyfluff

No - characters stay where they were made forever

daemonios wrote: »

Pompeyfluff wrote: »

no - all you'll see is people changing factions so they can ensure they are in the dominant faction for their PVP home area.

For PVP to work it needs to have a good mix, and i just can't see that happening if people can change faction whenever they want.

Well, that was just one of the options in the poll... Another being limited faction changes (which I'd the option I support for the reasons you mention). To vote against any possibility of faction change "because faction hopping" when the issue is so trivially addressed makes no sense.

I guess it would depend on the limitation. For example if you were allowed to change your faction once..and once only to rectify any potential mistake (as you highlighted in your post) then it could make sense. However if it was just a "pay a high amount of gold" option then I would be 100% against the change.

daemonios

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

Pompeyfluff wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

Pompeyfluff wrote: »

no - all you'll see is people changing factions so they can ensure they are in the dominant faction for their PVP home area.

For PVP to work it needs to have a good mix, and i just can't see that happening if people can change faction whenever they want.

Well, that was just one of the options in the poll... Another being limited faction changes (which I'd the option I support for the reasons you mention). To vote against any possibility of faction change "because faction hopping" when the issue is so trivially addressed makes no sense.

I guess it would depend on the limitation. For example if you were allowed to change your faction once..and once only to rectify any potential mistake (as you highlighted in your post) then it could make sense. However if it was just a "pay a high amount of gold" option then I would be 100% against the change.

Agreed.

ghostwise

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

It should be an option. Much like eq2. An epically long storyline quest having you defect. Would make sense. I'm a high elf in ebonheart pact after all.

Gidorick

I 100% agree completely with @TheShadowScout.

I have an un-posted concept that suggests that once you complete Cadwell's Gold (well... Coldharbour if the questing was tweaked as outlined in my Cadwell’s Redux thread) you are given the choice to remain loyal, defect to another faction or you can choose to opt out of the faction war and support no side (don't worry PVP is still available). You then get AP buffs based on which faction you support and which faction is winning.

Loyal: AP Buffs for your faction winning
Defector: AP Buffs if your original faction is 3rd in the war
Mercenary: AP Buffs if all three factions have an equal amount of keeps (=/- 1 keep)

I was also playing around with the idea Loyalist, Defector, Mercenary world skill trees that unlock. I never really finished fleshing it out though.

@TheShadowScout's take on this though. The whole quest line to defect sounds brilliant!

CaptainObvious

What about when you show up back there during gold and silver? Additionally, would/should it reset gold and silver quests or leave them completed?

I believe this won't happen anytime soon due to the "Play any race" upgrade.

Psychobunni

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

I've always said yes, at least a "one time only" option.

However, now that they are finally coming off it and going to "start with" allowing players from any faction to dungeon together, this will become pointless.

Enodoc

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

CaptainObvious wrote: »

What about when you show up back there during gold and silver? Additionally, would/should it reset gold and silver quests or leave them completed?

Agreed, there are definite technical issues with this when considering quest progress. That's why I think Silver and Gold should already be completed - although that still leaves all the side quests which would change levels. I see it being more viable after they remove Veteran Ranks, when theoretically Cadwell's won't be V1-V10 zones, and the quest levels therefore wouldn't be affected.

Robotmafia

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

since this premise already exists why not... with the play any race in any alliance option they arleady broke that barrier...

arena25

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

I say once every month, or once every two months. If it were for free and anytime, it could be a nightmare.

Leandor

Is it just me or did others also read "defecate" in the thread title and immediately thought about AD?

SCNR

daemonios

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

arena25 wrote: »

I say once every month, or once every two months. If it were for free and anytime, it could be a nightmare.

That's far too frequent, especially the 1x/month. It would let people flip campaigns at the end of each 30-day campaign.

BBSooner

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

Sure, once you leave a faction you're unable to ever return because of the betrayal you commit.

It would also be cool if there was a questline involved, I'd love to see the look on Ayrenn's face as she's forced to let me escape lest I kill

Raz-um Dar's replacement. She discovered all too late that I let Raz die on purpose ...

... and though she hates to see me escaping with valuable troop and spy locations she can't risk me killing another high ranking member of her regime!


... but that won't happen. If we get it we'll get a token in the Cash Shop because it 1) Monetizes the system and 2) is easier than writing out a quest. Which is a shame, but even so, a one time alliance swap after Cadwells Gold is finished is fine with me.

MCMancub

No - characters stay where they were made forever

I like the idea from a lore perspective, but from a gameplay perspective this would never, ever work.

Rev Rielle

No - characters stay where they were made forever

Enodoc wrote: »

Allyhoo811 wrote: »

If this is ever allowed, I personally think it should only be as a one time option after you complete Cadwell's Gold...I don't think it should ever be something that is allowed frequently or for real money.

Exactly this. Once you have experienced all the alliance storylines, you should be able to choose who you really want to follow, and alliance transfer should be an option.

Personally I think it's a bit back-to-front to only to be able to choose after you've actually played through the content for that alliance.

If done (and I'm overly keen on the idea to start with), I would like to see it made into a quest-line where you could talk to some 'shady' character/s in the each of the main alliance capitals. Perhaps each capital could contain two such characters, one for each of the other alliances. And through working for them to the conclusion of their quest-lines your character will ultimate be welcomed into that new alliance.

mrskinskull

Yes - but make it expensive/limited

Sadishist wrote: »

I'd be for it if there was a fee. Don't have time to level many characters.

Uhmm. I kind of wonder if we can trust a guy who asks about going over to them enemies.

if it ain't red, it better be dead!

Is something I would say if I was crazy.