Tanking now

bosmern_ESO

There is a lot of QQ going through the forums about how 'impossible' it is to tank. I'm just going to say its 'impossible' if your a bad tank (Sorry to be blunt). I and a few other people I know who are really good at tanking really enjoy it now, It shows who is truly a good tank. No longer is tanking just holding block while casting abilities and every so often taunt.

Now things like well placed damage shields, buffs and gear will make or break it for you. Tanking is 100% possible, You just can't stand there with your shield up the entire dungeon. I really hope ZoS does not change this because the QQ, there is actually a thought process for tanking now.

omfgitsbatman

Thank you. I completely agree with this sentiment. People are crying, but if they actually tried to adapt to the changes instead of mourning the loss of their old tank style, things wouldn't be so bad.
Pure tanking was boring. Most of the decent tanks I know were actually dpsing more than tanking in almost all 4 man content. Same thing for healers. I have run in many groups where the tank is pulling 10k+ dps, the healer is pulling 15k+ and the dps are pulling 20k+... This makes for 10 minute pledge runs and makes most mechanics laughable. The new tanking mechanics make block casting a little bit more difficult and mean that the tank will have to concentrate more on being an actual tank. It also means the healer is going to have to do more healing as well. I am pleased.

OtarTheMad

I agree, I don't have a tank but I do agree. It's all about adjustments and people who are willing to make them. Build got destroyed? Okay, adjust, try new things and make your build work. Perma-blocking wasn't real tanking anyway.

Some new sets that drop make tanking possible anyway, some are pretty badass.

Colosso-monstro

But how many CP do you have? Aren't console players and newer players left out to dry? I personally don't know what to think of it yet as I'm a console player. I don't like the idea but I'll figure it out.

But I still wonder if the discrepancy in CP is causing some of the disagreements on the forum as well as causing some players to be unable to tank with the changes

Turelus

I am a hold block and spam skills tank, who even uses Siphoning Strikes.

All of the above is nerfed/fixed (depending how you look at it) and I am more pumped about playing ESO than ever, I am going to fail at tanking for sure, but the game sounds much more like the tactical block/dodge/move game I wanted from the start.

Tanking was brain dead gameplay before, now it will be active and challenging.

Forestd16b14_ESO

+1

Thank you for agreeing.

Dracane

Indeed. I love this change as a tank.

Tanking is so exciting now. It's boring to just stand there and hold block to counter everything. I use a heavy melee attack here and there with stamina drain enchantment and this is more than enough to survive.

Of course, unskilled players will hate this change. As they have to think and adjust now, which they don't want to.
But I can't wait to see builds coming up soon. There are promising sets and abilities and I think, tanking will now be an indicator for how skilled a tank is.

Diamond_10

bosmern_ESO wrote: »

There is a lot of QQ going through the forums about how 'impossible' it is to tank. I'm just going to say its 'impossible' if your a bad tank (Sorry to be blunt). I and a few other people I know who are really good at tanking really enjoy it now, It shows who is truly a good tank. No longer is tanking just holding block while casting abilities and every so often taunt.

Now things like well placed damage shields, buffs and gear will make or break it for you. Tanking is 100% possible, You just can't stand there with your shield up the entire dungeon. I really hope ZoS does not change this because the QQ, there is actually a thought process for tanking now.

Ok and let me tell you theres a larger percentage of bad/mediocre players than good players. Guess what happens when you make a game to cater for only good players? It dies. Weaving has already forced a lot of mediocre players away from the game or just unable to do trials. Now do that to tanking, and youll see the effect it has on the games population.

Dracane

Sorcs have Dark Deal, DKs have this earthern heart passive. Nightblades have this siphoning stuff and Templars have this thing that drains energy from dead enemies.

Each class has awesome mechanics to restore Stamina. Combined with the stamina gain from fully charged heavy attacks, it's great. Now you will want to use these abilities. I don't see, how this can be a bad thing.
Reduce your block cost, get some nice sets (especially the new ones are promising) use your class-stamina-regain abilitiy and you're ready to go.

Swarog

TS, did you complete SO on PTS? How about HM?

DisgracefulMind

Swarog wrote: »

TS, did you complete SO on PTS? How about HM?

I'm curious about this as well.

bosmern_ESO

omfgitsbatman wrote: »

Thank you. I completely agree with this sentiment. People are crying, but if they actually tried to adapt to the changes instead of mourning the loss of their old tank style, things wouldn't be so bad.
Pure tanking was boring. Most of the decent tanks I know were actually dpsing more than tanking in almost all 4 man content. Same thing for healers. I have run in many groups where the tank is pulling 10k+ dps, the healer is pulling 15k+ and the dps are pulling 20k+... This makes for 10 minute pledge runs and makes most mechanics laughable. The new tanking mechanics make block casting a little bit more difficult and mean that the tank will have to concentrate more on being an actual tank. It also means the healer is going to have to do more healing as well. I am pleased.

For veteran pledges on my Templar I just got 3 DPS and casted BoL every so often, while I mainly used biting jabs (so its more like 4 dps). I remember when I used to fear Maw of the Infernal, now I let all his fire stack on me while I stand there with block and cast BoL every time I get damaged, I don't even need a healer.

Alcast

Swarog wrote: »

TS, did you complete SO on PTS? How about HM?

Get 2 tanks taking turns with each other when they are on low resources, problem solved for Trials.

Newbs will have problems as always, till they see how the HC players do it and then they will manage to do it easily aswell

bosmern_ESO

Diamond_10 wrote: »

bosmern_ESO wrote: »

There is a lot of QQ going through the forums about how 'impossible' it is to tank. I'm just going to say its 'impossible' if your a bad tank (Sorry to be blunt). I and a few other people I know who are really good at tanking really enjoy it now, It shows who is truly a good tank. No longer is tanking just holding block while casting abilities and every so often taunt.

Now things like well placed damage shields, buffs and gear will make or break it for you. Tanking is 100% possible, You just can't stand there with your shield up the entire dungeon. I really hope ZoS does not change this because the QQ, there is actually a thought process for tanking now.

Ok and let me tell you theres a larger percentage of bad/mediocre players than good players. Guess what happens when you make a game to cater for only good players? It dies. Weaving has already forced a lot of mediocre players away from the game or just unable to do trials. Now do that to tanking, and youll see the effect it has on the games population.

MMO's usually succeed most off the hardcore players, thats one of the reasons why WoW did so good. They added a ton of stuff where it would take months of grinding, and tons of mounts where they had like a .005% drop chance. When it was Vanilla and you saw someone with good gear, you knew they were a good player, so you yourself would go out and practice and eventually get good gear through hard work.

ZoS has literally been handing us stuff because 'its to hard' (Rip Veteran zones). If its 'to hard' maybe you should go spend the time to better yourself like others and conquer what you find hard, its a lot more rewarding then ZoS just baby proofing every patch they do.

actosh

bosmern_ESO wrote: »

There is a lot of QQ going through the forums about how 'impossible' it is to tank. I'm just going to say its 'impossible' if your a bad tank (Sorry to be blunt). I and a few other people I know who are really good at tanking really enjoy it now, It shows who is truly a good tank. No longer is tanking just holding block while casting abilities and every so often taunt.

Now things like well placed damage shields, buffs and gear will make or break it for you. Tanking is 100% possible, You just can't stand there with your shield up the entire dungeon. I really hope ZoS does not change this because the QQ, there is actually a thought process for tanking now.

Sign!!!!!
Tanking is so much fun right now. Dungeons are awesome, the new ones, and the whole dlc is nice.

Zos: Keep Tankin this way

Hoodster92_ESO

I agree with this post, it seems doable with the right build.

My question is do people think that "DPS Tanks" are viable now with the patch? Currently with my Magica NB Tank it looks like I will need to bite the bullet be less of a dps and more tank now (which shouldn't be a big change).

I also might need to invest in an actual tanking 5 piece set again like footman one of the new sets. Any recommendations are appreciated.

Legoless

I have to disagree. The nerf has completely crippled my build, so much so that I'm considering respeccing my main. Top-end players might be able to make the transition but my DK is dead in the water.

Turelus

bosmern_ESO wrote: »

Diamond_10 wrote: »

bosmern_ESO wrote: »

There is a lot of QQ going through the forums about how 'impossible' it is to tank. I'm just going to say its 'impossible' if your a bad tank (Sorry to be blunt). I and a few other people I know who are really good at tanking really enjoy it now, It shows who is truly a good tank. No longer is tanking just holding block while casting abilities and every so often taunt.

Now things like well placed damage shields, buffs and gear will make or break it for you. Tanking is 100% possible, You just can't stand there with your shield up the entire dungeon. I really hope ZoS does not change this because the QQ, there is actually a thought process for tanking now.

Ok and let me tell you theres a larger percentage of bad/mediocre players than good players. Guess what happens when you make a game to cater for only good players? It dies. Weaving has already forced a lot of mediocre players away from the game or just unable to do trials. Now do that to tanking, and youll see the effect it has on the games population.

MMO's usually succeed most off the hardcore players, thats one of the reasons why WoW did so good. They added a ton of stuff where it would take months of grinding, and tons of mounts where they had like a .005% drop chance. When it was Vanilla and you saw someone with good gear, you knew they were a good player, so you yourself would go out and practice and eventually get good gear through hard work.

ZoS has literally been handing us stuff because 'its to hard' (Rip Veteran zones). If its 'to hard' maybe you should go spend the time to better yourself like others and conquer what you find hard, its a lot more rewarding then ZoS just baby proofing every patch they do.

However I think ZOS want to keep the game very accessible to players who don't have that level of investment. You have to remember most console players picking this up are looking for a casual Skyrim with friends not a hardcore MMO.

I think these changes make the game more engaging as a tank which is a good thing, though I do feel eventually some dungeons/bosses might need some work to be accessible by a common player under these mechanics.

Dunegons should be completable by an okay group, they should be mastered by a good group. I actually envy players who don't power game or optimise their builds because the games actually still challenging for them, sadly for those who know the tactics and the builds most content is a joke. To balance around them is to stop normal players having a blast from enjoying the same content though, and as such we have the real issue plaguing ESO PVE.

actosh

Legoless wrote: »

I have to disagree. The nerf has completely crippled my build, so much so that I'm considering respeccing my main. Top-end players might be able to make the transition but my DK is dead in the water.

I have played with a template and Dps Tanks may be still possible. I enjoyed my Dk so much

Zeg0ta

I'm really excited about some new tanking gear finally. I've been using hist footmans for a long time now. I tanked some white gold tower vet mode. I didn't really have to much trouble with stamina occasionally would lose a taunt . Just going to have to adjust my play style some. I do beilve that no regen while blocking is a little harsh maybe like 25% regen while blocking seems more reasonable.

Aluapfant

bosmern_ESO wrote: »

For veteran pledges on my Templar I just got 3 DPS and casted BoL every so often, while I mainly used biting jabs (so its more like 4 dps). I remember when I used to fear Maw of the Infernal, now I let all his fire stack on me while I stand there with block and cast BoL every time I get damaged, I don't even need a healer.

Hello Bosmern,

I agree, tanking dungeons is easy. Matter of fact you don't even need a fulltime tank for them, just a good dps/healer who can take a few hits. However, arguing that tanking is easy for these is inconclusive as an umbrella assessment of PVE tanking as a whole.

Have you ever tanked Sanctum Ophidian Hard mode successfully?
Have you ever tanked Aetherian Archive Hard mode successfully?
Have you ever tanked Hel Ra Citadel Hard mode successfully?

If yes: Please try these out on the PTS and let other trial tanks know how you go. Cudos to you and Zeni if tanking the trials (especially SO) is achievable and works.

If no: I do not mean to be rude but then you are not eligible to give a comprehensive review or judgement of the tanking changes in relation to PVE content (as a whole) and if they make tanking 'impossible' or not.

Anyhow, we are gonna give the Manticora in SO a go tomorrow on the PTS. Fingers crossed that all the fears and apprehensions many DC trial tank have held are not about to come true.


Sincerely,
Larkia (smexy orc tank)

PS. using two or more tanks for one trial boss? Bluargh, if it has to be it has to be. Oh dear I hope not though.

swaggasm

I agree with the smexy orc tank

Faulgor

As someone who tried tanking only a few times and found it boring, can some of the people who successfully tank with the new mechanics share some insights into how to do it?
Namely, I'm interested in the equipment and bonus choices. Should you forego stamina entirely, or get as much as you can? Is recovery still important to recover fast when not blocking? How important is block cost reduction, for example on jewelry glyphs? Or is it better to get as much raw mitigation as possible so you can survive even if you don't block?

Aluapfant

swaggasm wrote: »

I agree with the smexy orc tank

LMAO

tyty

Diamond_10

bosmern_ESO wrote: »

Diamond_10 wrote: »

bosmern_ESO wrote: »

There is a lot of QQ going through the forums about how 'impossible' it is to tank. I'm just going to say its 'impossible' if your a bad tank (Sorry to be blunt). I and a few other people I know who are really good at tanking really enjoy it now, It shows who is truly a good tank. No longer is tanking just holding block while casting abilities and every so often taunt.

Now things like well placed damage shields, buffs and gear will make or break it for you. Tanking is 100% possible, You just can't stand there with your shield up the entire dungeon. I really hope ZoS does not change this because the QQ, there is actually a thought process for tanking now.

Ok and let me tell you theres a larger percentage of bad/mediocre players than good players. Guess what happens when you make a game to cater for only good players? It dies. Weaving has already forced a lot of mediocre players away from the game or just unable to do trials. Now do that to tanking, and youll see the effect it has on the games population.

MMO's usually succeed most off the hardcore players, thats one of the reasons why WoW did so good. They added a ton of stuff where it would take months of grinding, and tons of mounts where they had like a .005% drop chance. When it was Vanilla and you saw someone with good gear, you knew they were a good player, so you yourself would go out and practice and eventually get good gear through hard work..

Sorry but theres a difference between grinding out stuff, and skill using a keyboard and mouse.

hrothbern

Hoodster92_ESO wrote: »

I agree with this post, it seems doable with the right build.

My question is do people think that "DPS Tanks" are viable now with the patch? Currently with my Magica NB Tank it looks like I will need to bite the bullet be less of a dps and more tank now (which shouldn't be a big change).

I also might need to invest in an actual tanking 5 piece set again like footman one of the new sets. Any recommendations are appreciated.

Any recommendations....
Well.. I think that you will need Magicka very desperately...
So Seducer, Magnus set etc
Or 4 pcs Seducer and Hist (Saves Stamina from blocking)

I think only the DK Tank is able to uphold Footman

DisgracefulMind

Aluapfant wrote: »

bosmern_ESO wrote: »

For veteran pledges on my Templar I just got 3 DPS and casted BoL every so often, while I mainly used biting jabs (so its more like 4 dps). I remember when I used to fear Maw of the Infernal, now I let all his fire stack on me while I stand there with block and cast BoL every time I get damaged, I don't even need a healer.

Hello Bosmern,

I agree, tanking dungeons is easy. Matter of fact you don't even need a fulltime tank for them, just a good dps/healer who can take a few hits. However, arguing that tanking is easy for these is inconclusive as an umbrella assessment of PVE tanking as a whole.

Have you ever tanked Sanctum Ophidian Hard mode successfully?
Have you ever tanked Aetherian Archive Hard mode successfully?
Have you ever tanked Hel Ra Citadel Hard mode successfully?

If yes: Please try these out on the PTS and let other trial tanks know how you go. Cudos to you and Zeni if tanking the trials (especially SO) is achievable and works.

If no: I do not mean to be rude but then you are not eligible to give a comprehensive review or judgement of the tanking changes in relation to PVE content (as a whole) and if they make tanking 'impossible' or not.

Anyhow, we are gonna give the Manticora in SO a go tomorrow on the PTS. Fingers crossed that all the fears and apprehensions many DC trial tank have held are not about to come true.


Sincerely,
Larkia (smexy orc tank)

PS. using two or more tanks for one trial boss? Bluargh, if it has to be it has to be. Oh dear I hope not though.

Please make a post on how your Sanctum run went! Would love to hear the insight! (:

Hoodster92_ESO

hrothbern wrote: »

Hoodster92_ESO wrote: »

I agree with this post, it seems doable with the right build.

My question is do people think that "DPS Tanks" are viable now with the patch? Currently with my Magica NB Tank it looks like I will need to bite the bullet be less of a dps and more tank now (which shouldn't be a big change).

I also might need to invest in an actual tanking 5 piece set again like footman one of the new sets. Any recommendations are appreciated.

Any recommendations....
Well.. I think that you will need Magicka very desperately...
So Seducer, Magnus set etc
Or 4 pcs Seducer and Hist (Saves Stamina from blocking)

I think only the DK Tank is able to uphold Footman

Might be good for just being able to do stuff.

However my current "goal" is trying out this.

Head, Shoulder, Chest, Gloves, Boots = Black Rose (Stam Regen)

Belt, Shield, Rings = Footman (Extra health spell resist and physical resist)

Neck Random with Arcane Trait

Masters 1 Hand Sword for Weapon.

Putting CP's, Enchants, and Mundus's towards Magika so I can still use my spells. But essentially becoming more of a tank than a DPS.

shigitoshiey_ESO

bosmern_ESO wrote: »

There is a lot of QQ going through the forums about how 'impossible' it is to tank. I'm just going to say its 'impossible' if your a bad tank (Sorry to be blunt). I and a few other people I know who are really good at tanking really enjoy it now, It shows who is truly a good tank. No longer is tanking just holding block while casting abilities and every so often taunt.

Now things like well placed damage shields, buffs and gear will make or break it for you. Tanking is 100% possible, You just can't stand there with your shield up the entire dungeon. I really hope ZoS does not change this because the QQ, there is actually a thought process for tanking now.

Agreed.

ZoM_Head

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Aluapfant wrote: »

bosmern_ESO wrote: »

For veteran pledges on my Templar I just got 3 DPS and casted BoL every so often, while I mainly used biting jabs (so its more like 4 dps). I remember when I used to fear Maw of the Infernal, now I let all his fire stack on me while I stand there with block and cast BoL every time I get damaged, I don't even need a healer.

Hello Bosmern,

I agree, tanking dungeons is easy. Matter of fact you don't even need a fulltime tank for them, just a good dps/healer who can take a few hits. However, arguing that tanking is easy for these is inconclusive as an umbrella assessment of PVE tanking as a whole.

Have you ever tanked Sanctum Ophidian Hard mode successfully?
Have you ever tanked Aetherian Archive Hard mode successfully?
Have you ever tanked Hel Ra Citadel Hard mode successfully?

If yes: Please try these out on the PTS and let other trial tanks know how you go. Cudos to you and Zeni if tanking the trials (especially SO) is achievable and works.

If no: I do not mean to be rude but then you are not eligible to give a comprehensive review or judgement of the tanking changes in relation to PVE content (as a whole) and if they make tanking 'impossible' or not.

Anyhow, we are gonna give the Manticora in SO a go tomorrow on the PTS. Fingers crossed that all the fears and apprehensions many DC trial tank have held are not about to come true.


Sincerely,
Larkia (smexy orc tank)

PS. using two or more tanks for one trial boss? Bluargh, if it has to be it has to be. Oh dear I hope not though.

Please make a post on how your Sanctum run went! Would love to hear the insight! (:

+1

IxSTALKERxI

I was just using a build where I could hold block forever without running out of stamina without allies feeding me stamina. Perma blocking is still an option.