Towns and Villages of Cyrodiil

VilhelmValhalla4

One of the most anticipated features of this game for me was the ability to see Cyrodiil during the 2nd Era, and explore all of the towns and villages that I'd come to know and love during many years of playing Oblivion. The destroyed Imperial City should have been the first warning to me, but exploring the devastated ruins of Cheydinhall and the horrific lava-fields of Chorrol, I was further disheartened. The final blow was Hackdirt... One of the more memorable and interesting locations in the game, now reduced to a bland, lifeless husk populated by a cliche group of bandits. I understand that Cyrodiil is embroiled by war, but there is hardly anything that resembles the place I remember. None of the cities are marked, and very little regard is given for the precedent set in Oblivion in regards to design or implementation. Hopefully some of these places will be replaced in the future with more interesting, developed locations that feel somewhat habitable...

Lupus_Draco

Was also one of my first thoughts. Was definitely a shame. Not a single sense of reminiscent feeling.

RSram

I agree, I'ts almost like Cyrodiil was an after thought.

FilthyMudcrabs

I agree - I lost it when I first stumbled upon Weynon Priory. Such nostalgia. But then running into the ruined cities made me kind of depressed.


Also, does anyone happen to know where Skingrad and Anvil are?

Storm_knight22

You'll note that a number of cities and locales of cyrodil are missing Bravil, Leyawiin, Anvil Kvatch and my favorite city Skingrad are missing! The island in lake Rumare with Vilverin is missing! I also don't see Fort Greif in Niben bay! A few people have managed to escape the bounds of Cyrodil in Eso and found that some of these cities' shells are in the game they just not in game ATM so hopefully we can meet Glarthir's Great great great great great great great great great great great great great great great great great grandparents.

Gidorick

Man, it would be great if rebuilding these towns as faction resource strongholds was a mechanic of Cyrodiil.

Storm_knight22

Something else I've noticed. Cropsford wasn't finished in Oblivion! I was still being built by a family of Bretons But in ESO (800 years before Oblivion) its fully built town!

Sentinel

Jared_lindsey86_ESO wrote: »

You'll note that a number of cities and locales of cyrodil are missing Bravil, Leyawiin, Anvil Kvatch and my favorite city Skingrad are missing! The island in lake Rumare with Vilverin is missing! I also don't see Fort Greif in Niben bay! A few people have managed to escape the bounds of Cyrodil in Eso and found that some of these cities' shells are in the game they just not in game ATM so hopefully we can meet Glarthir's Great great great great great great great great great great great great great great great great great grandparents.

Well, at this given time period, such areas weren't exactly part of cyrodiil. Cyrodiil right now is basically centralized around the Imperial City forming a circle of influence. The zone layout depicts only that. Areas like Bravil, Leyawiin, Kvatch and anvil still exist, but they are in other areas of influence (for example, Leyawiin is either in Elsweyr or Black marsh depending on who is disputing it right now, the majority of the other cities are independent city states, like Anvil or Kvatch). What this means, in the future they can make more refined versions of those parts of Cyrodiil from Oblivion as new zones (such as the Gold Coast, Black Forest, Niben Basin, and West Weald).

Oddly enough though, you can walk around the island of Bravil right now from the current Cyrodiil map but not go in it. They just never finished it or refined it. Theres no pathway and the water all around it is blocked by slaughterfish. From there though, you can see the island in the middle of the lake that in Oblivion had the portal to the Shivering Isles, as well as a ship of unknown origin.

It would be great if they made Cyrodiil even more filled with life and activity outside of PvP than even now (though PvPers would hate that because PvErs are bad and would cause immense lag..). I'd personally want to see Cyodiil's map topography to be a bit more varied. More dramatic hills! In Oblivion, the land was a bowl, here it's like a shoeprint.

elias.stormneb18_ESO

Most of the Cities are marked, they just don't by default show on the Cyrodiil map. You can easily change that in the ''Show:'' options of the map.

RazielSR

Typical zos. They just rushed the zone. Its just a random environment with some dispersed,repeated and random constructions simulating cities.
No feeling. No TES. It could be in some other random mmo with other cities names and nobody would tell thats Cyrodiil.

Rex-Umbra

I really hope the add to the content in Cyrodiil It's the only zone where I actually enjoy end game PvE the large open spaces and thrill of random PvP but the zone needs ALOT more then just the current daily quests.

Merlin13KAGL

Jared_lindsey86_ESO wrote: »

You'll note that a number of cities and locales of cyrodil are missing Bravil, Leyawiin, Anvil Kvatch and my favorite city Skingrad are missing! The island in lake Rumare with Vilverin is missing! I also don't see Fort Greif in Niben bay! A few people have managed to escape the bounds of Cyrodil in Eso and found that some of these cities' shells are in the game they just not in game ATM so hopefully we can meet Glarthir's Great great great great great great great great great great great great great great great great great grandparents.

@Jared_lindsey86_ESO , Ah, Fort Grief:

• Land of unlimited storage.
• Unescapable corral for one Unicorn. (Sounds redundant.)

CaptainObvious

Content trimmed for the performance monster. Such was the fate of the animals except for the levitating deer. Fortunately, his nemesis, the levitating monkey, is stuck in Malabal Tor.

NDwarf

Did you know Cyrodiil is suppose to be covered in jungle during the 2nd era, the time of ESO? The jungles were removed by Talos when he achieved godhead a few centuries after this game takes place.

So 1 of 2 things happed:

1. The devs did not know the lore of Elder Scrolls and made Cyrodiil appear somewhat as it does during the 3rd era post Talos.
2. Talos not only removed the jungles from Cyrodiil, he erased them from existence, past, present, and future.

I'm leaning more towards #1

BBSooner

While I share the sentiment, I also appreciate how they tried to display the cities as they probably would during the Three Banners War: war-torn and largely in ruins from siege. Non-native armies, especially in this setting, are unlikely to give the cities and populace the care and respect they would have needed to weather this conflict unaffected.

Enodoc

NDwarf wrote: »

Did you know Cyrodiil is suppose to be covered in jungle during the 2nd era, the time of ESO? The jungles were removed by Talos when he achieved godhead a few centuries after this game takes place.

So 1 of 2 things happed:

1. The devs did not know the lore of Elder Scrolls and made Cyrodiil appear somewhat as it does during the 3rd era post Talos.
2. Talos not only removed the jungles from Cyrodiil, he erased them from existence, past, present, and future.

I'm leaning more towards #1

In-game lore says #2 is more likely -> Subtropical Cyrodiil: A Speculation. Or at least, he erased them from the past at least as far back as the Alessian Empire (when White-Gold Tower transferred under the control of Man).

Gidorick

Enodoc wrote: »

NDwarf wrote: »

Did you know Cyrodiil is suppose to be covered in jungle during the 2nd era, the time of ESO? The jungles were removed by Talos when he achieved godhead a few centuries after this game takes place.

So 1 of 2 things happed:

1. The devs did not know the lore of Elder Scrolls and made Cyrodiil appear somewhat as it does during the 3rd era post Talos.
2. Talos not only removed the jungles from Cyrodiil, he erased them from existence, past, present, and future.

I'm leaning more towards #1

In-game lore says #2 is more likely -> Subtropical Cyrodiil: A Speculation. Or at least, he erased them from the past at least as far back as the Alessian Empire (when White-Gold Tower transferred under the control of Man).

Game mechanics and design justified with lore. Gotta love it!

AlnilamE

Personally, Cyrodiil reminds me a lot of Oblivion and when I first got to Chorrol I wondered what was going on and how the town had evolved over the next 1000 years to become with it is in Oblivion (same thing with Bruma). 1000 years is a long time.

Tors

Jared_lindsey86_ESO wrote: »

Something else I've noticed. Cropsford wasn't finished in Oblivion! I was still being built by a family of Bretons But in ESO (800 years before Oblivion) its fully built town!

Its 4 buildings, this is a hamlet not a town.


(im not talking sea bass here obviously)

VilhelmValhalla4

BBSooner wrote: »

While I share the sentiment, I also appreciate how they tried to display the cities as they probably would during the Three Banners War: war-torn and largely in ruins from siege. Non-native armies, especially in this setting, are unlikely to give the cities and populace the care and respect they would have needed to weather this conflict unaffected.

I can understand that some of the cities would be in ruins, but I'd imagine that the cities would provide good positions for the armies. It just seems that everywhere we go, there are always enemies in the place of interesting content. I go back to the example of Hackdirt; would you rather fight off "Black-Dagger Bandits" or come across a town strangely unaffected by the war, and initiate a quest where you delve into the town's occult history and come across some sort of entity that protects the village. A poorly worded quest, sure, but I'd rather see that than have to fight some stupid gang of cutthroats that bear no significance. I'll live with Cyrodiil in shambles, but I think the cities should be just as much an asset as forts.

RedTalon

The area is meant to be a jungle during this time also, and something changed that, so stands to reason that the villages wouldn't be anything you expected from that fact and wars

TheShadowScout

748 years.
Seven... hundred... fourty... eight... years.

That's how much time will pass between ESO and Oblivion. Towns you visited in oblivion will be as completely different as the ones in ESO as towns in the gallia province of the roman empire were different from the same lands in medieval france. Towns will have been destroyed, razed to the ground, some will have been rebuilt later on, others perhaps not, some will have been rebuilt different, others may have been forgotten, and some just won't have been built yet.

Jungle... yeah, that is what the lore said. On the other hand, that is just a book we read in the other ESO games... might have been artistic license of the fictional writer of that lorebook in play, exaggeration to boost the scope of an emperors accomplishment, something like that... (yeah, I know... a feeble attempt to fix a lore inconsistency, but... it works for me)

As for the rest of oblivion cyrodil... well, I am still hoping that maybe someday they might add those provinces to ESO as well. Perhaps as mixed PvE/PvP regions? Colovian highlands to gold coast, nibenay and blackwood... of course, I kinda hope that about every single province on the map. And if ESO keeps going long enough... I might even get it... someday.

Teiji

Hackdirt has a Refugue Camp south of it, it is a location which cannot be marked on the map.

Also; the mayor of Hackdirt is just chilling, locked in the tower south of town whilst an Argonian plays music to the bandits there, you can't speak to her either.

Loads of little stories littered around Cyrodiil, lots of dead NPCs which you can E to examine, except nothing happens - you have to role play that you examine them.

RedTalon

@TheShadowScout Also is a book somewhere in the game also that explains why, between the years, the terrain shift and such, nothing will ever be the same from other games in this area. Wars and climate/terrain shifts do that So yup your right

But there are some interesting books in eso also for lore

BBSooner

VilhelmValhalla4 wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

While I share the sentiment, I also appreciate how they tried to display the cities as they probably would during the Three Banners War: war-torn and largely in ruins from siege. Non-native armies, especially in this setting, are unlikely to give the cities and populace the care and respect they would have needed to weather this conflict unaffected.

I can understand that some of the cities would be in ruins, but I'd imagine that the cities would provide good positions for the armies. It just seems that everywhere we go, there are always enemies in the place of interesting content. I go back to the example of Hackdirt; would you rather fight off "Black-Dagger Bandits" or come across a town strangely unaffected by the war, and initiate a quest where you delve into the town's occult history and come across some sort of entity that protects the village. A poorly worded quest, sure, but I'd rather see that than have to fight some stupid gang of cutthroats that bear no significance. I'll live with Cyrodiil in shambles, but I think the cities should be just as much an asset as forts.

I'd imagine that at one point the major cities did house troops from the separate armies ... up until another army found out and removed any 'value' from the location with a little effort.

Also, I do agree with you out about Hackdirt. Mystery in a point of interest is my preference as well. However, how Hackdirt is currently displayed is still believable to me - if only less 'special'.

VilhelmValhalla4

I'm not saying that the cities should be exact replicas of those in Oblivion, its just that they seem to be filler, nothing of value or interest in them, just repeatable quests. Some of these cities really don't make sense though, Cheydinhal is literally comprised of a destroyed chapel, a few burned out houses, and no castle, yet theres walls surrounding the entire place! Why would they put a wall around such an underdeveloped location, and why wouldn't the faction controlling that area put some resources into clearing out the Imperials, rebuilding the structures, and establishing a garrison there. And don't get me started on Chorrol... Same goes for all of the little villages, why would any of the invading armies tolerate bandits occupying places that potentially have resources, food, and manpower?

And the argument that Cyrodiil was once jungle so the cities would be different, if I'm understanding this correctly, then wouldn't the architecture be different as well? Why would a civilization that is surrounded by dense tropical forests build structures out of stone and brick (especially structures that resemble typical Medieval buildings)? This is sort of answered by the theory that Talos wiped the jungle from existence in all timelines, but still...

I guess I'm getting too hung up on the logistics of the whole thing, but this has been a very interesting discussion so far!

Edit: Also, is there any reason why Cyrodiilic society didn't make use of Ayleid ruins as cities, and just let them fall prey to monsters?

RedTalon

@VilhelmValhalla4 who knows why the buildings look the same to a degree, honestly that is the trouble with lore and making a game that will appeal you want somethings the same, and also different, they try to strike a balance. Just look at the location of a lot of the keeps in the area also, most of them don't make sense either .

Has for the ruins unsure, but the imperial city is basically build on the wild elves stuff the white gold tower was theres first if I recall right

Korah_Eaglecry

VilhelmValhalla4 wrote: »

One of the most anticipated features of this game for me was the ability to see Cyrodiil during the 2nd Era, and explore all of the towns and villages that I'd come to know and love during many years of playing Oblivion. The destroyed Imperial City should have been the first warning to me, but exploring the devastated ruins of Cheydinhall and the horrific lava-fields of Chorrol, I was further disheartened. The final blow was Hackdirt... One of the more memorable and interesting locations in the game, now reduced to a bland, lifeless husk populated by a cliche group of bandits. I understand that Cyrodiil is embroiled by war, but there is hardly anything that resembles the place I remember. None of the cities are marked, and very little regard is given for the precedent set in Oblivion in regards to design or implementation. Hopefully some of these places will be replaced in the future with more interesting, developed locations that feel somewhat habitable...

While I understand why youre upset.

1.) This isnt and RPG like Oblivion. An MMO sometimes needs to make sacrifices to keep it functional and still remain true to the franchise. Cyrodiil is huge, and everything that populates across that region is a burden on the server. The more that renders, the more work the server has to do. Considering this region is the PvP Hub for everyone. Its not shocking that they would make this choice.

2.) Story-wise, it makes sense that cities and towns would be abandoned and the refugees would flock to areas they felt more safe. Nearby Keeps exchange hands daily and armies descend on farms, lumbermills and mines where civilians would work and kill everything in site in an attempt to harm the enemy. In medieval times it was common practice to raze the lands around a castle, keep or stronghold in an attempt to prevent supplies from making it back to the enemies troops. Towns and villages could be wiped off the map after a raid with the men being killed, and the women and children being marched off into slavery. Word would eventually reach other towns and villages of what was happening and in an attempt to save themselves and their families they would run for safer lands. People trying to escape the horrors of war is still very much a thing all around the world today. So I wouldnt expect Cyrodiil to look exactly like it did in Oblivion.

VilhelmValhalla4

@Korah_Eaglecry Again, I never expected it to look exactly like it had in Oblivion, just some continuity. I can understand the Cyrodiliic inhabitants fleeing to a "safe place," but really nowhere is safe. The cities seem to change hands just as much as forts, but nothing is ever done with them. I can also see how land would be razed so another faction could not use the area for resources, but again, these places are hotbeds of bandit activity, which would also inconvenience the armies, raiding supply lines, harassing smaller groups of soldiers, taking unclaimed resources away from the invading armies. I think my main problem with Cyrodiil isn't the look or the layout of the cities, its the unending chaos (granted its war, but still...). Each faction has a motive to re-establish an empire, but nothing ever gets done, even after a new "emperor" is crowned. Everything remains in shambles, and there is no window of respite and reconstruction between victory and the next war.

And to the argument of game resources, yes, Cyrodiil needs to be playable, but what does replacing bandits in towns with citizens (with or without quests) detract from performance?

Edit: Also, if they wanted to improve performance by cutting back on things, why not remove those horrid blue mage lights that line the road and serve no purpose?

mrskinskull

Gidorick wrote: »

Man, it would be great if rebuilding these towns as faction resource strongholds was a mechanic of Cyrodiil.

Wow that would be fun.

BBSooner

VilhelmValhalla4 wrote: »

Edit: Also, is there any reason why Cyrodiilic society didn't make use of Ayleid ruins as cities, and just let them fall prey to monsters?

I can only speculate, since really all we know is that they decided to let them fall in to ruins.

I would say that some valid reasons could be:

- Distaste for living underground
- A strong distaste for Ayleidic culture due to the enslavement and horrible treatment caused to the early cyro-nords.
- Villages sprang up over trade or hunting that eventually enticed people to immigrate to those cities away from dwellings in the ruins